The Leavers & Alleviating Their Guilt? What Happened To Commitment?

[Misadventure]

The Leavers & Alleviating Their Guilt? What Happened To Commitment?

 

Note: For those who have been members here and you are part of this category, this is not against you, please don't take it this way.

 

I have been reading on and off this week (bad flu), and so many comments that I see from people just suddenly picking up and saying "Well, I just don't feel "it" anymore, I am done, time to go. Something else will be better waiting around the corner".

 

What ever happened to commitment? (albeit this does not include cases of infidelity, addiction, abuse).

 

What ever happened to Til Death Do us Part, not until I don't feel that passion burning love anymore???

 

With over half of us in the United States ending up in divorce... what the mother effing eff?!

 

Do people in general just not realize what commitment is anymore?? or is it that it has become so easy and accepted to get a divorce that it becomes an easy out?

 

Or do people just NOT want to do the work that marriage is???

 

Do people not realize that it is not going to be sunshine and unicorns all the time and that burning passion is not always going to be there but at the heart there will be a deep love.. and commitment/companionship/friendship???

 

Why is it just so easy to throw your hands up in the air and say "Pfft well the love is not what it was...and the grass must surely be greener so I'm gonna go and get me some of that grass?"

 

It's one thing if you have been cheated on, abused, spouse had addiction etc... but for just a random "fell out of love'.. sorry but that is BS.

 

Are you always going to fall out of love?

 

It really takes work to stay "in the love"....so why not do the work.. instead of just wanting to quit...why is it just so easy?

 

And it's bullocks for someone to want to alleviate their guilt from having left someone who did not deserve it (situations above)... Why should someone not live with this guilt and have to look at the mirror everyday for the hurt they have caused, and point the finger to themselves. Then ask themselves the questions I have poised in this post.

[M30USA]

For me it was the intolerable living situation--as in "if I die tonight in my sleep I'm okay with that" type living situation. And technically I wasn't even the one who officially ended it. I did NC and my ex then filed.

[hayewils]

believe me, I don't understand it either.

people today just look at it as a boyfriend girlfriend relationship. I think that in todays society, its become acceptable to just give up and quit. at least that seems to be the way I look at it.

That's why I will not do it again. I will have relationships but as far as marriage goes, im not going to invest myself like that again. then, when they decide to leave, there wont be any filing or anything.. just leaving.

a marriage certificate isn't worth the paper its typed on and I don't need a piece of paper saying I am with this person.

[M30USA]

believe me, I don't understand it either.

people today just look at it as a boyfriend girlfriend relationship. I think that in todays society, its become acceptable to just give up and quit. at least that seems to be the way I look at it.

That's why I will not do it again. I will have relationships but as far as marriage goes, im not going to invest myself like that again. then, when they decide to leave, there wont be any filing or anything.. just leaving.

a marriage certificate isn't worth the paper its typed on and I don't need a piece of paper saying I am with this person.

 

Strangely enough, the Bible makes no mention of marriage certificates or legal marriage. What it does say is that marriage is for life. But the paper and ring are merely legalities and a separate issue altogether.

[K Os]

people today just look at it as a boyfriend girlfriend relationship.

 

I think that hits the nail on the head. It seems to have been the case with my story. When one partner is looking at it that way and the other isn't, things are almost bound to fall apart at some point. There seems to be less and less difference in people's minds between a marriage and a 'relationship'. If there's no difference, why bother formalising it at all? The only reasons then are bureaucratic ones to do with finances, assets, citizenship and visas.

 

Misadventure - your strong message gives me more hope for the future than anything I have ever read here

[central]

Commitment? Well, I can commit. But there is a time and place for divorce, as well, as I found out. Sure, some people give up too easily, but I don't think that's true of most. I see no benefit in perpetuating a mistake.

 

Life-long marriage and monogamy are flawed - yet idealized - concepts, engaged in by imperfect people. What do you expect to happen?

[Monodare1]

In my case, she ended it with me, even though we were married and living together with our son. I did the lot, lets think about this, what about our son, why don't we try a councillor, all to know avail. I lived for a week in the house in our broken up state and it was very difficult and awkward etc. I decided to spend the weekend at my dads to get my head together. She contacted me, said that she couldn't cope with the awkward situation and said she would bring clothes etc down along with a visit with my son, I've been at my dads since. That was over three months ago.

 

I was willing to stumble on for the sake of my son, but she wasn't and I wasn't prepared to stay where I was not wanted. So divorce it was, and now we are trying to get my name off our joint mortgage in prep for the big d.

 

Sometimes you just don't have a choice.

[Monodare1]

I must add, that I really did try to reason with her for the sake of our son, but she was having none of it, and I draw the line at begging and pleading especially as there was no cheating or improper conduct going on on my part, I worked hard to provide for my family, I did everything I could for my son and for the upkeep of our house, but she just didn't want it, what do you do in my position?

[K Os]

Life-long marriage and monogamy are flawed - yet idealized - concepts, engaged in by imperfect people.

 

Some people believe this, other people believe otherwise. Personally I'm a fan of monogamy, and I don't see it as a flawed concept. I was monogamous in my marriage. Of course people are imperfect - that doesn't mean that all attempts at monogamy or lifelong commitment are doomed to failure. My brother's wife died of cancer 3 years ago, and they'd been together 25 years when she did. My parents have been married since 1965 and are still together happily. Where's the flawed concept in these examples?

 

It does surprise me, though, that people who struggle with the ideas of fidelity and commitment even try to marry. That seems like self-inflicted suffering.

 

But there is a time and place for divorce, as well, as I found out.

 

Yes, I believe this too. I just don't think - as Misadventure puts it - that it should be from a lack of unicorns.

[dumped2013]

She ended it with me too. Was sitting out back listening to music and she came out and said I think we need to get divorced. 20 years together. I looked at her and said I'm willing to do marriage consoling and she just said she does not know what she wants. She moves out Saturday. Ours was final 11 days ago. Funny thing is we hung out at the pool this weekend. I think we actually get a long better. Reality will set in for me Saturday

[Misadventure]

Dumped, I am very sorry about that. Please post when you need to vent and unload, it helps.

 

... what do you do in my position?

 

But you are not the one who left first.. when you have someone who just checks out.. and you are the one left holding the big bag of steaming poop. You had to deal with the ripple effect of her leaving and wanting out first...

 

Commitment? Well, I can commit. But there is a time and place for divorce, as well, as I found out. Sure, some people give up too easily, but I don't think that's true of most. I see no benefit in perpetuating a mistake.

 

Life-long marriage and monogamy are flawed - yet idealized - concepts, engaged in by imperfect people. What do you expect to happen?

 

There is a time and place for divorce..but it should be for valid reasons. Not just waking up one day and saying "Gee..this isn't really what I envisioned of my life... I am not feeling like I did on day one or even day 365...I should get out and start over.. I want "that feeling" back...".

 

Marriage and commitment is not just about that feeling.. it's about initially having so many feelings that you have found that one person to marry and commit to that you start a life with.. and then you do. It's going through the bad, and the good.. and the in between... some days you may feel so in love.. and some days you may want to strangle them slurping their freaking coffee or crunching their chips!" But you take a good look and remember why you made this commitment...what you have.. and you keep on working at it.. and keep bringing back feelings.. and creating new ones.

 

You bring up a good statement.. idealized concept of monogamy... I actually wish we had gone through the Catholic engagement retreat about marriage before we got married (I am not really religious and neither is he but was requested of us and we decided on another Church)..because it would have discussed and brought reality of what marriage really is to someone who had a unicorn ridden fantasy of it (the stbx) and how it should always be.

 

It's about the grit..and granted, it does take away the mystery of the other person..but that is what you signed up for.. the daily release of obnoxious gas from the other side of the room, the annoying habits that sound like nails on a chalkboard...and then the moments of levity where the other person does something that makes you smile because you remembered why it all started to begin with.

 

That is what should be fought for...not because you want to see butterflies, unicorns and sprites in everyday married life and feel that tingle.

 

We are all imperfect people... so what should be expected is an imperfect marriage...so when someone all of a sudden checks out and says "Shucks, this isn't like I thought it would be, time for me to go.."..... slap yourself. Slap yourself for truly having your head up your arse the majority of your marriage and not fighting for something that you committed yourself too and working at it.

 

Yes, I have a failed marriage now under my belt. It bloody sucks and I am culpable because I trusted too damn much and sacrificed too much of myself... but otherwise...he is the mothereffing effing effer who thought there should be butterflies and unicorns every damn moment. After 8 yrs together and 5 yrs married....the only thing I can say about this is that he is emotionally immature, 6 yrs younger than me, and I am partly to blame because I apparently picked him up at kinder care. Live and learn. He hurt and broke me in so many ways from this...but I am putting myself back together.. and hell, I quite like who I am, and finding out who I am again..without him.

 

I won't give up on love or let this taint my future...there are many wonderful people on this planet and he is only one of them..and a sorry excuse for one..I want to be happy again...I worry about it..but one day I think this will all make sense and I will be better off for it.

 

 

Misadventure - your strong message gives me more hope for the future than anything I have ever read here

 

TY, anytime I can lend some colorful words, lemme know lol.

[M30USA]

Maybe we should go back to hangings in the town square HA!! or Scarlett letters.

Society won't rest until it's ruined every part of a good life.

 

Maybe those old, superstitious, dark age religious folk in the days of the Scarlet Letter really knew a few things. Maybe they got that way because they previously saw a culture like ours. Maybe they wanted to end the cycle. Then along come these "enlightened" people who criticize their narrow minded and--worst of all--intolerant views, seeing no purpose in them and not realizing what happens when you DON'T have such enforcement. We are that generation now and we are reaping the consequences for it.

[hayewils]

Bunch of mother effing effers!

Lol.. I love these new words..

Do i find the definition under the word "quitter",

Or would it be under "weakness"?

[Misadventure]

Bunch of mother effing effers!

Lol.. I love these new words..

Do i find the definition under the word "quitter",

Or would it be under "weakness"?

 

Quitter, coward, douchebags, low life s/c/u/m, bottom feeders, etc and there will be a picture of mt stbx.. and many of others' stbx's or exes from here too.

 

[PoopHappens]

Commitment?

 

Life-long marriage and monogamy are flawed - yet idealized - concepts, engaged in by imperfect people. What do you expect to happen?

 

This is one of many of the lines my wife used when making excuses to why she was in an affair. Many years before this she insisted we get married to make our relationship that much more solid and because "it is important to me". I already made a life long commitment to her with a simple vow one night so getting married was a natural thing to do. But as one person mentioned here, I will never marry again. I really, honestly got married for life. Just like a slick warranty, lifetime doesn't mean until your dead. It just means "what a comparable product would last given average use".

[M30USA]

Quitter, coward, douchebags, low life s/c/u/m, bottom feeders, etc and there will be a picture of mt stbx.. and many of others' stbx's or exes from here too.

 

 

I would be cautious of what you call anyone. We tend to become the very things which we speak about other people. Thus the abused become abusers themselves. I am praying daily that I don't follow this pattern myself. I hope you can do the same.

[Frank13]

Here we go again with the argument that you should live a life of unhappiness in the name of commitment.

 

So if you are single it is on to be happy, but if you are married you must stay if you are unhappy?

 

This is like saying a person who signed up for the army and is taken prisoner by the enemy should endure torture and not escape if given the chance because after all, they signed up for the army and sometimes you become a prisoner and get tortured.

 

Life is too short to live a good portion of it unhappy. There is no prize on your deathbed for being a martyer. Even the Constitution says people should have the right to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Nowhere does it say "except in marriage".

 

The problem is with marriage itself. It hasn't kept up with the times. We now have gay marriage, but we still don't have renewable marriage licenses. You get married for say 5 years and then renew the license if you want to stay married.

 

The people who start these threads are usually the ones that have been left in a relationship. They aren't the ones who aren't happy and want out.

 

Marriage is not a piece of paper. It's in your heart and in your mind. When it isn't, it's no longer a marriage.

Edited October 2, 2013 by Frank13

[hayewils]

Here we go again with the argument that you should live a life of unhappiness in the name of commitment.

 

So if you are single it is on to be happy, but if you are married you must stay if you are unhappy?

 

This is like saying a person who signed up for the army and is taken prisoner by the enemy should endure torture and not escape if given the chance because after all, they signed up for the army and sometimes you become a prisoner and get tortured.

 

Life is too short to live a good portion of it unhappy. There is no prize on your deathbed for being a martyer. Even the Constitution says people should have the right to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Nowhere does it say "except in marriage".

 

The problem is with marriage itself. It hasn't kept up with the times. We now have gay marriage, but we still don't have renewable marriage licenses. You get married for say 5 years and then renew the license if you want to stay married.

 

The people who start these threads are usually the ones that have been left in a relationship. They aren't the ones who aren't happy and want out.

 

Marriage is not a piece of paper. It's in your heart and in your mind. When it isn't, it's no longer a marriage.

I agree that no one should have to live unhappy, but there is a effort that should be put forth to make a marriage work from BOTH sides.

Some agree to get married thinking its gonna be a good thing but dont realize that at some point there will have to be some work to make things better. This is where they would rather bail than put in the effort.

The wedding vows mean nothing to these quitter types. Its easier to run than to put in the work. For better for worse, richer, poorer.. Means nothing to these quitters. So to find happiness for their own selfishness, they cheat, they lie, make excuses and leave. My stbx supported me with things at the time, but when things became to much for her, she turned everything around and made it my fault so she wouldnt look like the bad guy with her family and friends. That alone is wrong and piss poor excuses to leave. If people agree to get marrried, they need the understanding that at some point work and effort will be needed. If you cant handle it, know yourself before hand and dont get married. Most of us were all in long term relationships before agreeing to marriage so the other side knew what they were getting. There were no hidden secrets.

[PoopHappens]

Here we go again with the argument that you should live a life of unhappiness in the name of commitment.

 

So if you are single it is on to be happy, but if you are married you must stay if you are unhappy?

 

This is like saying a person who signed up for the army and is taken prisoner by the enemy should endure torture and not escape if given the chance because after all, they signed up for the army and sometimes you become a prisoner and get tortured.

 

Life is too short to live a good portion of it unhappy. There is no prize on your deathbed for being a martyer. Even the Constitution says people should have the right to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Nowhere does it say "except in marriage".

 

The problem is with marriage itself. It hasn't kept up with the times. We now have gay marriage, but we still don't have renewable marriage licenses. You get married for say 5 years and then renew the license if you want to stay married.

 

The people who start these threads are usually the ones that have been left in a relationship. They aren't the ones who aren't happy and want out.

 

Marriage is not a piece of paper. It's in your heart and in your mind. When it isn't, it's no longer a marriage.

 

Marriage involves a lot of long term plans and commitments. The idea of a 5 year term starts sounding too much like politics with the major parties starting to campaign in the last year or two of the term.

[hayewils]

It just goes to show that we never truely know anybody.

Even if its a LTR before marriage you never know everything, therfore you have to watch for red flags. My ex told me that she moved out of her parents home at 16.. Obviously cause she couldnt handle gettin into trouble or whatever. That shouldve been a red flag to me that she was a runner when things got tough.

[M30USA]

It just goes to show that we never truely know anybody.

Even if its a LTR before marriage you never know everything, therfore you have to watch for red flags. My ex told me that she moved out of her parents home at 16.. Obviously cause she couldnt handle gettin into trouble or whatever. That shouldve been a red flag to me that she was a runner when things got tough.

 

Same here. My ex moved out around junior/senior year of high school after getting into huge argument with her parents. She lived with her then boyfriend. Another time she lived with her aunt while she and her parents were at odds. I should have recognized this unstable personality. Love is blind and we fool ourselves. What can I say?

Edited October 2, 2013 by M30USA

[RedHawk08]

Marriage is a throwaway concept now. I've clearly been wrong about it being sacred. 5 years married.

 

"It's been a slow decline the last two years" she said.

Really? Why didn't you tell me. I was still your soul mate a month ago.

 

"I need you to make more of an effort" she said.

My one warning. Issued two days before the loss of a grandparent. My childhood hero.

 

"I'm not happy" she says a month later.

I got four whole days to turn it all around before....

"It's over. My feelings have changed".

 

Second chances are hard won. You would have thought after turning my life around since then would be enough.

 

I'm not getting one it seems.

[Misadventure]

Frank,

 

When is marriage about happiness 100% all the time? It isn't. It is about making a commitment through the good and the bad to the person that you love. And to try and invalidate this trhead and the importance of it by saying it's usually someone who has been left who makes these threads.. it doesn't make this thread any less significant or valid. It means we come from two different schools of thoughts, beliefs, and humane and decent ways of treating supposed people we love.

 

Now like I said, if there are cases of infidelity, abuse, etc that is different. But if it's just because "Gee, I don't want to work at marriage anymore.. I don't see effing unicorns and sunshine every effing morning when I wake up"... then it is bullsh/i/t.

 

You don't have to agree with me but it comes down to a fundamental belief in what commitment is all about....I am probably a deal younger than you but I am from the view of "you made a commitment"... not "married until I just don't get goosebumps when I look at you".

[agent.006]

Frank,

 

When is marriage about happiness 100% all the time? It isn't. It is about making a commitment through the good and the bad to the person that you love. And to try and invalidate this trhead and the importance of it by saying it's usually someone who has been left who makes these threads.. it doesn't make this thread any less significant or valid. It means we come from two different schools of thoughts, beliefs, and humane and decent ways of treating supposed people we love.

 

Now like I said, if there are cases of infidelity, abuse, etc that is different. But if it's just because "Gee, I don't want to work at marriage anymore.. I don't see effing unicorns and sunshine every effing morning when I wake up"... then it is bullsh/i/t.

 

You don't have to agree with me but it comes down to a fundamental belief in what commitment is all about....I am probably a deal younger than you but I am from the view of "you made a commitment"... not "married until I just don't get goosebumps when I look at you".

 

Agreed, for the most part. However, if your significant other is of the "'til death do us part" school, but doesn't want to put in the work to make things better for you (instead choosing to ignore any suggestions for how things can improve around the house", then what? There is no abuse, infidelity, etc., just a total lack of cooperation by the spouse? Is my wife to stay with me if I am constantly not trying to improve things (or vice-versa)?

 

At some level, commitment is not necessarily "stay, even if you're not happy or filled with butterflies", but "stay, even if your life is miserable". Our parents and grandparents certainly did that - stay married even if it meant not really talking to each other or enjoying each other's company anymore. But my question is whether that is the right thing to do?

[K Os]

It takes two to tango, and only one to bust things up for whatever reason.

 

It's not easy for two people to stay 'on the same page' for decades, that's for sure. They may start out feeling as though they believe the same things, but life may prove them wrong. Having an affair, whether deviously planned or just fallen into, can certainly throw spanners into the mindset of both the betrayer and the betrayed. I think it can be impossible to anticipate these states if they've never been experienced before marriage. Yes, we all make choices, but emotions are powerful things. It's hard when you're young to really foresee what it might be like when your spouse gets cancer, has a car crash, becomes incapable of sex, meets someone else or gets dementia and no longer recognises you. When we get betrothed do we really foresee *all* the possible things that might happen in the marriage and in the future? I doubt that. We can vilify our betraying spouses all we like, but I think the split usually comes down to a simple difference, whether that's a difference in moral codes, spiritual beliefs, strength in adversity, expectations of a marriage or individual sex drives. It's incredibly hard to come to terms with when it happens to you out of the blue, but in reality we can't eradicate those differences in the person who walks out on us just by wishing it wasn't so. It is so.

 

Probably the most useful thing I've read about my situation was this: If you're not together right now, that's because it didn't work.

 

This is a very simple view and it really brought it home to me that it doesn't change the fact of our separation that I didn't want it to happen. My wife did want it to happen, and that's why it happened. So it didn't work. It couldn't work, given that fact. No matter how much I kicked against it. If one partner doesn't want it to work any more, it won't.

 

We will naturally hurl at our betrayers our thoughts about how they 'should' behave and what they 'should' believe, i.e. the same as we do. This won't make it so either. All we can do is behave more like this ourselves. Stick closer to what we believe and behave accordingly. Let them go their own way. They will get what their behaviour and beliefs generate, and so will we.