Women giving it up soooooo easy!

[MrCastle]

hahaha, bring it on, Mr. C.

 

May I ask... did you ever have it any other way to say "nothing wrong with it?" ? juuuust askin'

 

I don't believe in relationships right now. I find them quite silly. If I met the right person and we had that spark and everything clicked, sure.

 

But I'm not gonna enter an exclusive relationship with someone I'm not completely over the moon about just because society's prude nature is to frown on anyone who sleeps with people but isn't seeing them exclusively.

 

I truly believe a lot of people (women, mostly) enter relationships to save face and not look like a "slut."

[candie13]

Apologies if I was not very clear, my question is: did you ever date a girl for a couple of weeks without having had sex with her, in that interval or time?

 

It makes a big difference. And doing this doesn't mean "you're in a relationship". It doesn't even mean you are exclusive. It only means you try to get to know her, as a person, not just her sexual preferences.

 

I totally respect your pov on relationship, everybody's different and all people should do exactly what responds best to their needs (physical, emotional, etc).

 

I also understand what you mean with your "slut" comment. I just... don't feel like excusing myself for wanting to take my time and getting to know my potential sex partner. It's a personal choice. I've done both early sex and played the waiting game. I feel better, more reassured if I know my partner likes me for my stupid jokes and taste on music, rather than exclusively for my hot looks in a short skirt.

 

I find a man's brain a lot more sexy than the smell of his skin. Cannot have one without the other. But that's just me and... it did take me a while and some self-discovery to reach that conclusion.

[KathyM]

Haha VERY untrue.

Some guys see it as a challenge while banging others on the side

 

And many guys fall off the face of the earth months down the line.

 

 

your thinking seems jaded.

SOME might see it as a challenge to continue to pursue, but most would not want to invest the time or money into the pursuit if they were only interested in sex. I'm a realist. And I've seen this played out IRL plenty of times with people that I know IRL.

[candie13]

Not when you love the person who disappears on you.

 

I believe if you enter a relationship you have enough decency to end it.

 

And isn't that bad?

 

took me nearly 4 months to feel sane again.

 

I think I understand you. The thing is.. it's not really love, if you don't know a person, you understand? It's your own projections. That's why it's so important to wait and know a person, because at the beginning, everyone only shows their nice colors. Every one, not just men.

 

And of course, absolutely everyone should have the decency to end a relationship properly. Getting closure is extremely important, especially if you've got the hots for a guy. Badly. Ever thought that maybe the guy was too scared to let you down, because he felt you were very involved?

 

I am not saying that is an excuse... I am saying that you may have been quite vulnerable when you met that guy. Early sex when you are vulnerable is bound to make you even more involved, because... you get a bit clingy. You get all excited, sex is great, which only feeds up that "high" sensation.

 

It happened to me too - betting shattered after a guy simply vanished on me. I understand better than you think.

 

But... if you were fine, if you weren't emotionally vulnerable, it wouldn't have taken you 4 months to get back on your feet.

 

Emotional vulnerability + early sex = clingy-ness, most of the times. For men and women.

 

Guess how sexy clingy-ness and co-dependency is to an average, efforts avoiding person?

[MrCastle]

Apologies if I was not very clear, my question is: did you ever date a girl for a couple of weeks without having had sex with her, in that interval or time?

 

It makes a big difference. And doing this doesn't mean "you're in a relationship". It doesn't even mean you are exclusive. It only means you try to get to know her, as a person, not just her sexual preferences.

 

I totally respect your pov on relationship, everybody's different and all people should do exactly what responds best to their needs (physical, emotional, etc).

 

I also understand what you mean with your "slut" comment. I just... don't feel like excusing myself for wanting to take my time and getting to know my potential sex partner. It's a personal choice. I've done both early sex and played the waiting game. I feel better, more reassured if I know my partner likes me for my stupid jokes and taste on music, rather than exclusively for my hot looks in a short skirt.

 

I find a man's brain a lot more sexy than the smell of his skin. Cannot have one without the other. But that's just me and... it did take me a while and some self-discovery to reach that conclusion.

 

I just view sex as part of the getting to know you process. Whether you want to admit it or not, sexual compatibility goes a long way in a relationship.

 

I would be crushed if I "got to know" a girl for months, loved everything about her, but then when sex came, it was awful. Because she refused to do this position or that, or she's lazy or selfish in bed, or just not very good. Then I look like a dick if I leave her.

 

I don't like chicks who use sex as some sort of reward for getting to know them. Sex is a natural, beautiful thing between two people who are attracted to each other.

[candie13]

Oh... Than your post here is a bit confusing, given that we were talking about early sex and people leaving immediately or shortly after that.

[KathyM]

Of course there are. There are women like that, too, though.

Most women are not into the pump and dump. Not on the scale that men are.

I've dumped nearly every guy I've dated for the past two years, even if I had sex with him. After a month or two it became clear to me that there was no long-term potential, so I would break it off. The sex, either good or bad, played no part in my decision.

Wouldn't it have been nice to know that they guy had no long term potential BEFORE having sex with him? Being so intimate with a bunch of loser frogs would not appeal to me. I'd rather weed those out as soon as possible without being physically intimate with them.

[CryForNoOne]

I believe it says "God's protection."

 

 

I'm going to have disagree with this.

 

I've known many guys over the years (some were boyfriends but most were just guy friends) who have point-blank TOLD me that a woman who will have sex with them on the first date (or second date) is NOT a woman they look at as girlfriend or wife material. Hell, my ex-husband flat out told me months after we'd started dating that he was secretly glad I wasn't "easy" when we first started seeing each other because "the easy ones are the ones you have fun with but you don't have a relationship with them."

 

Double standard or not, there are obviously still a lot of guys to this day who STILL have that mindset because we're seeing it being posted here, over and over and over and over again.

 

OK so take the analysis a step further - is a person who is that judgmental good BF/GF material? "The difficult ones are the ones you have one date with and you don't have a relationship with them." Ironic he's your ex husband. Maybe you could have both saved yourselves a ton of heartache by sleeping with him right away...

[candie13]

I just view sex as part of the getting to know you process. Whether you want to admit it or not, sexual compatibility goes a long way in a relationship

.

 

I totally agree with that. Unfortunately it messes with my head. The saying "if you want to make a girl fall inlove with you, give her a few mind blowing orgasms" doesn't exist for nothing. During an orgasm, a woman's body secrets the same hormones as when she is inlove. And it's not love, it's just sexual compatibility. Which is very important, but later on. If I like the guy. If he is not a flake. If he is not a horrible self centered, conceited person.

 

Sexual compatibility is a huge must, but... later on.

 

I would be crushed if I "got to know" a girl for months, loved everything about her, but then when sex came, it was awful. Because she refused to do this position or that, or she's lazy or selfish in bed, or just not very good. Then I look like a dick if I leave her.

 

Hey, you wouldn't be crushed, trust me. Mainly because you cannot possibly like everything about a person, secondl because you don't just "fall purely inlove" with her. I think you may just be afraid of that happening. It's fine, you will survive! She will survive as well. And if sex isn't satisfactory, well, you will just have to deal with it. She is in bed with you, think she won't notice it? Mind you, on the average, women are used to get good sex, otherwise they leave. Most men are just happy to get laid.

 

Getting to know a person, interacting with her emotionally allows you to know yourself a lot better. Maybe even evolve. You wouldn't be "crushed", it's only fear of the unknown talking.

 

I don't like chicks who use sex as some sort of reward for getting to know them. Sex is a natural, beautiful thing between two people who are attracted to each other.

 

Of course sex is not a reward. But it must happen naturally. To me, getting naked in front of a guy I've met three times in my life isn't a natural thing to do. I need to feel sexy and confident & feel him sexy and confident. Reassuring. Bottom line, for me, as a woman: sex screws with my head. If it's good, I am a lot more likely to fall like a teenage girl, for him, instead of keeping it all together.

 

Think texting. When I date a guy, I am more reserved, I like to understand if he likes to be in touch often or seldom. After sex, if it was good, I feel - falsely - a lot closer to the guy. I want to know if he liked it, where he is, if he wants it again ... hence I tend to reach out more. But, if I know the guy isn't crazy about texts, I would know he is not keeping it to a minimum because he doesn't like me, but because it's how he is. I wouldn't freat, because I would know - more pe less - how he usually reacts. How often he calls. And this would help me read his signals easier. With a lot less drama. Both partners win.

 

I mean, it's just me & my reactions. Some women can separate sex & emotions perfectly. If sex is good, I'm toasted , so I need to watch out.

[sickpuppy]

I just view sex as part of the getting to know you process. Whether you want to admit it or not, sexual compatibility goes a long way in a relationship.

 

I would be crushed if I "got to know" a girl for months, loved everything about her, but then when sex came, it was awful. Because she refused to do this position or that, or she's lazy or selfish in bed, or just not very good. Then I look like a dick if I leave her.

 

I don't like chicks who use sex as some sort of reward for getting to know them. Sex is a natural, beautiful thing between two people who are attracted to each other.

 

LMAO at the bold. That's some throw away PUA line! Hahaha How many people does one need to sleep with for "beautiful" to mean the same the word "love" is used these days? Might as well make "beautiful" with 150 women or women make "beautiful" with 150 different men. I'm sure they'd all feel soo "special"!

 

I agree though that girls who hold off on sex as some sort of way to snag a guy aren't worth it in the end. It's a manipulation tool. The power of the P.

 

As for the sex that suks so bad after you've waited a while you should have communicated and got to know one another more in that time before you started having bad sex and would be able to discuss it and work things out..no?

[candie13]

After this last incident, I simply can't commit to a r'ship if that part isn't awesome, too. So no, I'm not going to wait until he's ready to call me his gf. I don't want to be in an exclusive r'ship with someone if the sex isn't off the charts. Never again.

 

Oh, totally, sex must rock. Who said anything about exclusivity if you're not sleeping together? Multi dating actually is a must. If u only see one guy and you're not sleeping with him, you're bound to think about him. A lot. No no no. Multi date. Compare and contrast. I never go physical when I multi date. I am simply trying to get to know a person. His friends. His life. His taste in music. His reaction when he is under pressure. His communication style. How hard he tries to please me or get to know me. If he is an easy going guy with little interest in me and what I like or think... How will he be in bed ?

 

I find that a huge turn off. I just read people, I don't simply "wait". And I'd better have a great time doing this, otherwise why the hell meet them, if there's no chemistry? Truth is, most of the times, if we wait let's say a month (more than 6-8 dates),we get to know almost everything we need to know about a person, in order to judge if they are a good "partner". Then we have sex and we forget it all, for another month or so...

 

To me, it's all clear in the first three months. Then it's the six months threshold.

[CryForNoOne]

Oh please. Sleeping with him right away wouldn't have solved anything. We were both simply way too young to withstand the pressures of being married at 18 and 21. But thanks for playing.

 

And he's only one of MANY men who have told me the same thing over the years - my brother being one of them.

 

I personally don't care if it's 'judgmental' or not. It's how they FEEL.

 

My point exactly - it wouldn't have solved anything. Nor does it fix anything. It different in every case - and men (or women) who have such silly hard/fast rules are WAY too judgmental for me.

[candie13]

I 100% agree with this. Waiting for sex guarantees nothing. If you can't handle a relationship not working out because you had sex with the dude, then be upfront about that. Nothing wrong with waiting if it aligns with your values, just don't use it as some sort of point-reward system. Men sometimes feel you are being manipulative and perhaps don't like sex all that much.

 

I'm glad I had sex early with the last guy... because after a month his ED reared its ugly head. He even had a scrip for Cialis he just never bothered to fill, so it became clear to me that he wasn't interested in fulfilling my needs.

 

I'm glad I was able to be honest with myself and break up with him, knowing he couldn't make me happy in the long run. Sexual compatibility is right up there with honesty, shared values and communication. At the top.

 

Girl, u think a guy can be all about knowing you, meeting ur emotional needs and a selfish, uninterested in pleasing his partner in bed ? I don't. I think such a guy would fake his interest in me. And if I date him longer, I would find his lack of interest in me and my life sufficiently unattractive to not have to sleep with him and realize he's only interested in himself.

 

There are other ways of excluding a potential date, than having sex immediately with him. I am not judging you and lord knows than even with fantastic sex, relationships can - and will - fail. I am just saying automatically having sex when dating a guy is not the only option of axing a guy...

 

Poor men...

[StanMusial]

Sometimes you meet a girl and skip right ahead to dessert.

 

Other times, you enjoy the full meal.

 

It doesn't take much practice to separate which girls go on which plate.

[CryForNoOne]

Actually - he was all of those things. I met his family, he called me his gf, heck he even helped my gf move one weekend. Was very generous, affectionate, took interest in my life. Even went away with me on a company retreat one weekend and met all of my coworkers.

 

The guy has severe ADD, however, and wouldn't take his meds consistently. I don't know if that had anything to do with his ED, but it became a big issue. I could literally feel him going soft inside of me. It was so frustrating, and my self-esteem would take a hit.

 

I am glad that I knew this within the first few months. I liked him as a person just fine, but that was a dealbreaker, especially when he had a solution but was too scatterbrained to even realize how it affected me and didn't take control of the problem.

 

People are bad lovers for all kinds of reasons. Waiting might screen out selfish lovers but it won't screen out guys with ED. So it depends on how important sex is to you. If it's a deal breaker you should have sex BEFORE you become too emotionally attached...

[candie13]

Oh, girl, such a pity !!! Honestly, I almost wish he were a selfish bastard... People come with so many baggages, there simply is no way if knowing what's right and what's wrong. The only thing, for me, is to protect myself and my heart in the dating process.

 

Having sex is an important threshold. But even without the ED, his not attending his ADD would have affected you, because it impacts his life. He may be in denial about his ADD just like he is with his ED. There simply is no way of knowing beforehand.

 

I mean, let's take mr C. option: he is great, you like him, he likes you... he doesn't have the ED, but his bedroom skills don't do it for you. Yeah, u wasted some time, but what's the other option ? Sleeping with all guys u see just to make sure that issue is out of the way?

 

I dunno, it's just not right for me, that's all. It may be right for other people, though.

 

 

And ... I am 33, and I do want family and kids and I absolutely not want to waste any time. I'd just rather be safe than sorry, it's my heart I'm protecting.

[HappyLove]

Actually - he was all of those things. I met his family, he called me his gf, heck he even helped my gf move one weekend. Was very generous, affectionate, took interest in my life. Even went away with me on a company retreat one weekend and met all of my coworkers.

 

The guy has severe ADD, however, and wouldn't take his meds consistently. I don't know if that had anything to do with his ED, but it became a big issue. I could literally feel him going soft inside of me. It was so frustrating, and my self-esteem would take a hit.

 

I am glad that I knew this within the first few months. I liked him as a person just fine, but that was a dealbreaker, especially when he had a solution but was too scatterbrained to even realize how it affected me and didn't take control of the problem.

 

 

Your situation is completely different you actually took the time to get to know the guy, have him around your coworkers, have him around your family, even found out about his ADD. We are talking about the ones who go on 2 dates knows none of this, sleeps with him and wonder which way did he go, why did he disappear. When you've gotten a chance to get to know someone like you did here you're able to make a well informed and logical decision for yourself and your future it's hard to do that when you give it up after seeing a guy twice in your whole life. Who KNOWS what meds he's on! And given that you knew about his meds and how he is around friends you were able to come to the conclusion that is was all too much. Hard to do that with 1 or 2 dates.

[candie13]

Yeah - well like I said, everyone does what works for them. And I don't sleep with every single dude I date - just the ones I see potential with (a year ago this wasn't the case LOL).

 

I'm 34 and want a family as well - which is why I'm so quick to end things when I see red flags crop up, sexual or otherwise. Don't want to waste anyone's time.

 

At this point - I'm not looking to date at all. I'm just not really ready after the last disappointment. And I won't be having casual sex, either. I just need some time alone.

 

Totally there for you. Take your time and lick your wounds, girl. As much as we try to intellectualize it and make theories - when it's best to have sex, who is most fitted men, moment to have sex, there is that chance element that always eludes us.

 

Sometimes, if the guy is right for you, irrelevant of what you do and how you do it, things simply work out. It's simply a matter of having that luck and meeting that person. Terrible thing to say, at 33 !

[KathyM]

People are bad lovers for all kinds of reasons. Waiting might screen out selfish lovers but it won't screen out guys with ED. So it depends on how important sex is to you. If it's a deal breaker you should have sex BEFORE you become too emotionally attached...

She could have screened him out for having ADD and refusing to take his meds. That alone would have/could have been a deal breaker, and shown her he is not the type of guy that deals with his issues.

[candie13]

She could have screened him out for having ADD and refusing to take his meds. That alone would have/could have been a deal breaker, and shown her he is not the type of guy that deals with his issues.

 

would have, could have, should have. You don't know what she could have done because you are not her. There are feelings, people do change or change their minds, you never know. I am sure she thought that if he would have taken his ED meds, they could have saved their relationship.

 

Love does do crazy things and sometimes being inlove is about believing in your partner, even if there are no tangible proves that support that belief. Then comes reality that hits hard.

 

It's so easy to judge... of course, ideally, all women should be rational and look at facts, but life hits hard enough without coming on this board and reaching out for support and getting people to judge you for having chosen to believe in your partner, because you thought he was a better person.

[candie13]

If you knew her history... It's no surprise. Not very long ago she met some couple in a bar and and banged them.

 

Hard to flip the switch from a LONG LONG history of bad choices and a decade in the "bad" boy phase.

 

good for her! or you prefer to burn a A scarlet letter on her forehead, to repent for her sins?

 

Everyone has a chance to start all over again, with every new person they meet. Be happy. Make it right, whether it's sex at first date or after some time, whatever rocks their boat, whatever they think maximizes their chance of having a good time and minimizes their chance of hurting.

 

But coming here and gloating over what someone should have done, judging them for their past, that is just mean and pitiful. I'd even say it sounds a bit envious.

[StanMusial]

If you knew her history... It's no surprise. Not very long ago she met some couple in a bar and and banged them.

 

Hard to flip the switch from a LONG LONG history of bad choices and a decade in the "bad" boy phase.

 

Oh Christ.

 

I don't know which one you're talking about and don't want to know.

 

OP, I think your point is valid and supported. It is more readily accepted from a female that is for sure.

[KathyM]

would have, could have, should have. You don't know what she could have done because you are not her. There are feelings, people do change or change their minds, you never know. I am sure she thought that if he would have taken his ED meds, they could have saved their relationship.

 

Love does do crazy things and sometimes being inlove is about believing in your partner, even if there are no tangible proves that support that belief. Then comes reality that hits hard.

 

It's so easy to judge... of course, ideally, all women should be rational and look at facts, but life hits hard enough without coming on this board and reaching out for support and getting people to judge you for having chosen to believe in your partner, because you thought he was a better person.

I'm countering a point she made. She stated that, without having sex with the guy, she would not have known he had ED issues. While that may be true, his ED was because he was in denial about his issues, and was reluctant to treat them. This is the exact same reason he is not taking his ADD meds. Because he is in denial that he has ADD, and therefore reluctant to treat it. By seeing this pattern/tendency in him, she saw he was not relationship material. His response to the one (ADD) was carried over into his dealing (or lack thereof) with his ED. Same pattern. He's in denial that he has issues, and therefore refuses to treat them properly. The poster I responded to was not reaching out for support in this thread, she was responding to the OP's statement. So was I. Not meant to be an attack, just saying that people can find out a lot about a person which can carry over into how good of a lover they will be, by observing their behaviors/choices in other aspects. Just like a man who is very self-centered and always wants his own way is not likely to be a very considerate lover. I'm suggesting reasons to be self protective, and making choices that will ultimately be in a person's favor. That's not judgementalism, unless you want to consider my judging men for pumping and dumping. I'll accept I'm judgmental about men who pump and dump.

[Phantom888]

It's not a matter of fault.

 

Generally speaking, a woman is going to be hurt more if a guy loses interest after sex. She's more likely to feel "used", whereas he's more likely to feel that at least he had sex. So it's smart for the woman to be more cautious.

 

Women have more to risk than a man in a sexual relationship. Women can get pregnant, and a lot more vulnerable to STDs. Plus the emotional aspects. Women are more emotionally bonded after sex... That's the way it is. It's an evolutionary adaptation, hard-coded into the DNA.

[Revolver]

The problem with threads like this is that it implies(wrongly)that sex is something women don't really like... They just give it to men in exchange for relationships and if your not getting a relationship your being "used"