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Are all opposite sex friendships EA's if you are in a relationship?

Betterthanthis13

By Betterthanthis13
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Betterthanthis13 Established Member

Betterthanthis13

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I've always had both male and female friends, and when I was in my 20's I used to get really mad when my SO would question my opposite sex friendships. I would get offended because in my mind, they were just friends. I never hid anything or did anything that I thought would be detrimental to my relationship with my bf. Id have contempt for my bf for being a "jealous guy" and yep.... As you may have guessed, my stubborn attitude caused friction in more than one relationship in my life.

 

Sometimes a guy friend would get out of line and hit on me or say something stupid. I would tell him it was inappropriate, I have a bf and if you are going to act dumb like that, we probably can't be friends. This happened more than once and it got annoying to me so I started having mostly female friendships instead. I even reduced contact with guys who had never acted out of line, and who i genuinely missed being closer friends with. The whole topic of opposite sex friendships while in a relationship started to get on my nerves. I assumed I was wrong and guys and girls just aren't supposed to be friends. But I never felt right about that either.

 

So am I a serial EA offender? :)

 

Today my opinion is that I was wrong with both earlier opinions. I think its totally fine to have friends of the opposite sex and be in a relationship, but not because I think its fine for ME because I am trustworthy.

That is where I went wrong with my thinking.

 

It's not wrong because there is nothing objectively wrong with having an opposite sex friend. However, a friendship like that has the potential to develop into an EA or PA if certain conditions exist. Therefore, it's the responsibility of the people in the friendship to make 100% certain that the SO feels comfortable with it at all times, as long as the SO is being reasonable and not just beig jealous and insecure for no good reason. But it is reasonable to question your spouse's opposite sex friendships because they do always have that potential. So I was being a self righteous jerkface when I was younger. Oops. Sorry, ex-exbf.

 

Any opinions?

janedoe67 Established Member

janedoe67

Posted
Posted

It depends on which forum you are on and how myopically legalistic the poster you are asking happens to be ;)

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Realist3 Established Member

Realist3

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Are all opposite sex friendships EA's if you are in a relationship?

 

No, not by any stretch.

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Betterthanthis13 Established Member

Betterthanthis13

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It depends on which forum you are on and how myopically legalistic the poster you are asking happens to be ;)

 

:) sometimes I forget this is a support and advice forum and I treat it like Loveshack Court lol

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Betterthanthis13 Established Member

Betterthanthis13

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I remember as a little kid complaining to my mom over percieved injustices in my life she would get fed up with my whining and ask me "Well, what do you want more? Do you want to be "right" or do you want to be happy? Maybe you should just let it go..."

 

I'd always answer "That's bad advice and also a stupid question- I want both"

Maybe I should try to learn something from that lol- what does that make me? A narcissist?

Spotme Established Member

Spotme

Posted
Posted

It doesn't always become an EA, but if you (general you) are a person with poor boundaries, I would guess any good friendship with a person of the sex that attracts you could be a slippery slope. I trusted my H, thought he had good boundaries because he was never the flirtatious type. Turns out I was wrong. He had poor boundaries and I way underestimated his self esteem issues. So yeah, poor boundaries, a need for validation, and already positive feelings for a friend make a breeding ground for EAs.

 

I had always suspected that one other female friend of his had feelings for him (but again, I trusted him). After DDay, I found out exactly how hard she had tried to engage him in inappropriate behavior (through old emails). He, with a combination of poor boundaries, need for validation, and a lack of reciprocal interest, allowed her to say all kinds of things to him but neither responded in-kind nor shut her down. I've seen women do something very similar with guy friends who try to cross the line.

 

So now, yeah, he's working on boundary and validation issues in IC, but also, he found it helped his very concrete engineer mind when I laid it out for him regarding even the most casual of female friends: "if you wouldn't say it to her or do it in front of me, don't say it, if you wouldn't write it if I was looking over your shoulder, don't write it. If she wouldn't say, do or write it if I was looking, shut her down and back off." That's his mantra for now because he feels like it helps him know the boundaries in a very clear cut way.

 

Having said all that, I did read an article about some study that showed a fairly high percentage of the guys surveyed for the study felt attracted to their female platonic friends and had at least vague hopes of something more. The numbers were much lower for the women.

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underwater2010 Established Member

underwater2010

Posted
Posted

It is a case by case basis. And it depends on what your boundaries are.

 

I can have male friends, because when they cross a line the friendship is over. Also, I don't keep up friendships that my husband does not feel comfortable with.

 

I also expect that he drop his friendship if I feel uncomfortable with them....and he has.

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Betterthanthis13 Established Member

Betterthanthis13

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Having said all that, I did read an article about some study that showed a fairly high percentage of the guys surveyed for the study felt attracted to their female platonic friends and had at least vague hopes of something more. The numbers were much lower for the women.

 

That is one of the arguments that made me change my opinion initially. Because I am female, it doesn't matter if I always set good boundaries, aren't looking for validation, etc---guys are guys. It made me doubt my male friends- Are they friends with me because they really like my friendship, or because they are hoping ill dump my bf and go out with them?

 

But then later I decided, so what? So what if a male friend is secretly attracted to me. Or if one of my male friends is good looking. who cares? Should I also not be friends with lesbians? What if I was bisexual? Then I'm not supposed to have any friends? Everyone is a potential EA? It just doesn't compute.

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Betterthanthis13 Established Member

Betterthanthis13

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It is a case by case basis. And it depends on what your boundaries are.

 

I can have male friends, because when they cross a line the friendship is over. Also, I don't keep up friendships that my husband does not feel comfortable with.

 

I also expect that he drop his friendship if I feel uncomfortable with them....and he has.

 

I like this opinion and strategy a lot.

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Betterthanthis13 Established Member

Betterthanthis13

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So now, yeah, he's working on boundary and validation issues in IC, but also, he found it helped his very concrete engineer mind when I laid it out for him regarding even the most casual of female friends: "if you wouldn't say it to her or do it in front of me, don't say it, if you wouldn't write it if I was looking over your shoulder, don't write it. If she wouldn't say, do or write it if I was looking, shut her down and back off." That's his mantra for now because he feels like it helps him know the boundaries in a very clear cut way.

 

.

 

I also like this strategy an opinion a lot. I used to think that was common sense and everyone thought that way. I was wrong.

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ChooseTruth Established Member

ChooseTruth

Posted
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I think it's fine to have friends, but yeah there should be boundaries. Like you shouldn't go out of your way to be alone with this person for an extended amount of time. Being in a group is fine. My ex used to hang out with a stay at home Dad and I never had any problems with it because they were getting together to let our girls play together. After she had an affair with someone from her dojo (different person) and I found she was meeting this SAHD without our daughter...THEN I objected. Definitely you should never stay the night with someone of the opposite sex. Another example of inappropriate would be hanging out alone at night for ages talking in someone's car. My ex did this after a seminar once and that's the reason we don't know whole the father of the child that she miscarried. There's general safety rules and there's also what "looks bad". I think both matter. Even if nothing happens, if it "looks bad" it can dishonor your partner or be a slippery slope.

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Spotme Established Member

Spotme

Posted
Posted
That is one of the arguments that made me change my opinion initially. Because I am female, it doesn't matter if I always set good boundaries, aren't looking for validation, etc---guys are guys. It made me doubt my male friends- Are they friends with me because they really like my friendship, or because they are hoping ill dump my bf and go out with them?

 

But then later I decided, so what? So what if a male friend is secretly attracted to me. Or if one of my male friends is good looking. who cares? Should I also not be friends with lesbians? What if I was bisexual? Then I'm not supposed to have any friends? Everyone is a potential EA? It just doesn't compute.

 

It sounds like you have good boundaries, so in your case, I wouldn't let worries about secret crushes get in the way of friendship unless and until they behaved inappropriately or otherwise indicated they couldn't handle just friendship. You can't cut yourself off from all human contact, lol, so you just gotta have those boundaries!

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tbf Established Member

tbf

Posted
Posted

No, not all opposite sex friendships are or become EAs.

 

As someone who grew up with male and female friends, it's pretty easy for me to maintain boundaries since friendships with men are primarily focused on common interests with a minor degree of sibling-like emotional tamponism on both sides. :laugh:

Spotme Established Member

Spotme

Posted
Posted
I also like this strategy an opinion a lot. I used to think that was common sense and everyone thought that way. I was wrong.

 

I was really surprised when H reacted with such relief to hearing these guidelines spelled out. Like he felt he finally had been given parameters that made sense on how to appropriately interact, meanwhile I'm sitting there thinking "Really? This doesn't just naturally occur to you?" I guess that's what counseling's all about - bringing these things out into the open so we can understand ourselves and each other and negotiate solutions/how to move forward together.

waterwoman Established Member

waterwoman

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No. Having had both the difference is stark. It is easy for one to become the other without understanding of good boundaries.

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Betterthanthis13 Established Member

Betterthanthis13

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I was really surprised when H reacted with such relief to hearing these guidelines spelled out. Like he felt he finally had been given parameters that made sense on how to appropriately interact, meanwhile I'm sitting there thinking "Really? This doesn't just naturally occur to you?" I guess that's what counseling's all about - bringing these things out into the open so we can understand ourselves and each other and negotiate solutions/how to move forward together.

 

That's a lesson I am learning too. Assuming anything is a bad idea- always best to clarify. Your husband sounds like my brother- engineer extraordinaire :) I used to have to explain the stupidest things to him about girls when we were teenagers. He was always relieved to have a "solution" to things that seemed quite obvious to me. His brain is like a computer

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TheGuard13 Established Member

TheGuard13

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An opposite sex friendship is only really an emotional affair when it replaces or cheapens the intimacy and emotional components of the actual relationship.

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compulsivedancer Established Member

compulsivedancer

Posted
Posted

I think, too, you have to be careful to consider the other person's feelings, probably especially if you're a man. My H has a sorta-ex (online buddy/gf from before we dated). Recently he contacted her and her reaction made it clear that she was in or wanted to be in an EA with him at an earlier point in our M, but he never thought of it that way. He just thought of them as friends. But clearly she had pretty considerable feelings for him. I don't think he thought he was participating in an EA; I think he just didn't take her feelings into account and maybe strung her along a little as a result.

MissBee Established Member

MissBee

Posted
Posted (edited)

No.

 

There are several questions you can ask yourself to know if it's an EA.

 

One of which is: if your SO overhears this conversation, reads it, or sees you interacting, would they be upset and if they were doing what you were would you be?

 

An EA is building up intimacy with romantic undertones in a supposed friendship, where the type of intimacy you have with your "friend" is more akin to that of a significant other than a friend. I think we all know the difference between how we relate to someone we're in a relationship with or have romantic feelings for versus platonic friends.

 

I met a married guy some years ago in my school's library. I was instantly attracted to him. He was my type in every way. We were hanging out at the library laughing and joking and didn't get any work done. His wife was in medical school in another country. The chemistry was clear. He gave me his card and we also added each other on FB. I was so worried about it and how I'd have to turn down the friendship. Fortunately, he was the one who told me that he liked me, and for that reason we couldn't be friends, he thought we could but he likes talking to me way too much and is attracted to me and knows it would be very easy for us to cross the line. I respected that, was sad to see him go, but agreed. We would have immediately been in an EA because an attraction existed which would color everything and shape the friendship.

Edited by MissBee
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coffeebean201 Established Member

coffeebean201

Posted
Posted
It doesn't always become an EA, but if you (general you) are a person with poor boundaries, I would guess any good friendship with a person of the sex that attracts you could be a slippery slope. I trusted my H, thought he had good boundaries because he was never the flirtatious type. Turns out I was wrong. He had poor boundaries and I way underestimated his self esteem issues. So yeah, poor boundaries, a need for validation, and already positive feelings for a friend make a breeding ground for EAs.

 

I had always suspected that one other female friend of his had feelings for him (but again, I trusted him). After DDay, I found out exactly how hard she had tried to engage him in inappropriate behavior (through old emails). He, with a combination of poor boundaries, need for validation, and a lack of reciprocal interest, allowed her to say all kinds of things to him but neither responded in-kind nor shut her down. I've seen women do something very similar with guy friends who try to cross the line.

 

So now, yeah, he's working on boundary and validation issues in IC, but also, he found it helped his very concrete engineer mind when I laid it out for him regarding even the most casual of female friends: "if you wouldn't say it to her or do it in front of me, don't say it, if you wouldn't write it if I was looking over your shoulder, don't write it. If she wouldn't say, do or write it if I was looking, shut her down and back off." That's his mantra for now because he feels like it helps him know the boundaries in a very clear cut way.

 

Having said all that, I did read an article about some study that showed a fairly high percentage of the guys surveyed for the study felt attracted to their female platonic friends and had at least vague hopes of something more. The numbers were much lower for the women.

 

This is really well said and put together. Thank you:)

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Betterthanthis13 Established Member

Betterthanthis13

Posted
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Posted
No.

 

There are several questions you can ask yourself to know if it's an EA.

 

One of which is: if your SO overhears this conversation, reads it, or sees you interacting, would they be upset and if they were doing what you were would you be?

 

An EA is building up intimacy with romantic undertones in a supposed friendship, where the type of intimacy you have with your "friend" is more akin to that of a significant other than a friend. I think we all know the difference between how we relate to someone we're in a relationship with or have romantic feelings for versus platonic friends.

 

I met a married guy some years ago in my school's library. I was instantly attracted to him. He was my type in every way. We were hanging out at the library laughing and joking and didn't get any work done. His wife was in medical school in another country. The chemistry was clear. He gave me his card and we also added each other on FB. I was so worried about it and how I'd have to turn down the friendship. Fortunately, he was the one who told me that he liked me, and for that reason we couldn't be friends, he thought we could but he likes talking to me way too much and is attracted to me and knows it would be very easy for us to cross the line. I respected that, was sad to see him go, but agreed. We would have immediately been in an EA because an attraction existed which would color everything and shape the friendship.

 

Sounds like you and library guy had good boundaries in that situation. I (naively) thought that good boundaries were standard procedure when I was younger. If you are in a relationship then of course that is who you want to be with, not some random stranger. If you had romantic feelings and attraction for a friend more than your boyfriend, why wouldn't you just dump your boyfriend be in a relationship with the friend? Duh.

 

Similar to the idea that after you use the toilet you wash your hands. Common sense. I also came to discover there are many people who completely ignore that rule too.... :)

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