Sorry, gotta bring it up again. Why the bad boy?

August 22, 2013

It's hard to focus on being good and exciting at the same time.

Having boundaries is the opposite of being "exciting". It's just knowing who you are and what you will/will not tolerate, and being able to verbalize it in a constructive manner, and being able to consistently enforce them. I'm still working on the last part....

August 22, 2013

Just be a good guy.

Edited August 22, 2013 by happydate

August 22, 2013

it's not about good boy, bad boy. It's all about confidence.

No one likes an insecure wuss (unless they want to use that insecurity to treat you bad). Too many people confuse being nice as being able to be easily manipulated. Not so. You can be nice but you have to also respect yourself or you will not get the respect from someone else. Don't be a people pleaser in your relationships. It's ok to disagree. If you say yes to every one of the SO's requests, you will become boring and the SO will go for a more challenging person. Don't be afraid to say no, don't be afraid to let it be known what you will and will not tolerate. What YOU want. BE IN CONTROL OF YOURSELF, don't let yourself be defined by what others think of you, because that is apparent as much as you think it's not. Once you gain that confidence, you will notice a change.

Women also wonder the same thing, "why are men always going for the bitches??"

Same reason.

Edited August 22, 2013 by emva07

August 22, 2013

The problem I have with all this 'nice guy' stuff: Confuses niceness, lack thereof, confidence or lack thereof, pushover-ness and lack thereof, not just in the terminology but the associations so far as the combinations of the aforementioned attributes - as a result, I'm surprised if anyone had a real idea of the type of people these articles on the subject are really talking about in the first place.

[hope that made sense]

August 22, 2013

Hoenstly i dotn know many women at all who like "bad boys" the few who do are thmesvles not very good people or people you want to make partners.

Very few stable sane women want douchebags or people with no character or morals

I know plenty who do, though they are not 'bad' per say...well some are but they keep that side in check to an extent initially so the girl sees their bad combined with charisma/sexual energy side. Like my sisters and all their average personality average looks, average lifestyle friends did the bad boy phase in their 20s. Some were in gangs (not criminal just street gangs) others were in rock bands, and there were the kick boxer fighters, party druggies, barmen, motorbike rider/racers, footballers, bouncers, etc. Some turned into relationships which lasted a couple of years even, but most just started taking them for granted and or cheated on them and then split up. I saw douchbag guys get with plenty of women, but they were never a full on douche bag guy directly to the woman (to begin with anyway). Charm + being a challenge + masculinity + being something a little different from the mass of average joe nice guys was also thrown into the equation for the girl. Plus I would also say observing many women, the element that other women see the 'bad boy' guy as desirable in a way makes them want to win him over. See him as a higher status catch than their polite respectful somewhat serious 'orbiter' male friend who's an accountant.

I've known a few intelligent ambitious career women who get involved in relationships with the suit + tie bad boy equivalent and when I asked them why when they complain about getting dumped or cheated on yet again and having the guy show his true 'selfish arrogant jerk' personality, and their answers were mixture of:

* the challenge to snag him and they would feel special if they did * his confidence (arrogance is still confidence+1 in the beginning) * arrogant big ego bit of a jerk guys were seen as go getters to them.

Like you alluded to in your OP, you don't have to be a true 'bad boy', you can adopt the image to an extent which I reckon a lot of guys do. Part of the appeal (imo) for many to get tatts is for 'hey I'm a bad boy/girl too' image and not some spiritual connection to their tattoos. You could easily start with the image makeover and a bit of attitude. You wont really be able to change your personality into a 'bad boy' overnight though. I have seen 'nice respectful guy' to 'cocky douchbag' transformations though but it builds up over the years from the increasing confidence/ego from doing better with women, and they take it too far...not that they care. Like a couple of women have said a 'nice guy with a wild side' is really want most women want. Start with changing your attitude to any of those women (who you describe in your OP who came back to you after BB P&D flings) if they are still in your life.

"Too many people confuse being nice as being able to be easily manipulated." - I agree. the bad boy vs nice guy dichotomy is always taken to an extreme by both sides and they distort the majority even though they no doubt know of extreme examples which they have in their mind.

"I was through trying to impress women and didn't expect anything from them. Honestly it did sort of work but not with quality women." - A lot guys don't care as long as the savvy ones realize it, and know when to drop the attitude, when do want to get serious.

Edited August 22, 2013 by ascendotum

August 22, 2013

A good looking, well put together "nice guy" is not going to be hurting for female attention unless he is completely socially inept.

Yeah that's not exactly true.

August 22, 2013

I think a lot of women, especially when they are younger, have an extremely difficult time differentiating between the confident guy and the bad boy, because a lot of the characteristics that rev their engines (impulsive, confident, mysterious) are possessed by both. The switch gets turned on and from there, they're hooked. They look two seconds down the road, see a guy with edge and then just stop screening. That's why each group of guys has a Casanova who effortlessly entices and seduces these women and that's why a lot of guys go after the younger women. It's not necessarily manipulation, but a guy doesn't have to show much of his playbook to get a woman like this hooked. Just have one or two basic plays and boom, you're in.

A lot of younger women (and not just ones with daddy issues) have a sh*t-tier screening process and can't tell the difference until it's too late and they are attached. And then those are the ones that complain about how they "can't find any nice guys", which annoys the hell out of the men around them.

However, most of these women grow out of this with age and experience. Some don't, but most do. They get a better idea of the difference between confidence and douchebaggery and start to choose wiser. And they also learn to expand their horizons a bit and not be as unforgiving with their standards. They realize their "type" kind of sucks and tweak it a little bit to exclude the douchebags and include more of the "nice" guys.

But even then, the "nice guys" that spend their time pining and moping and hoping and don't bring any masculinity to the table are still going to lose out. So basically, always be assertive and always bring it like you have a pair. You don't have to be a jerk to do this. And even though being a jerk can be beneficial, "nice guys" that go out of their way to be jerks are usually outed pretty easily because they don't bring the confidence, just the crappy behavior.

August 22, 2013

A lot of younger women (and not just ones with daddy issues) have a sh*t-tier screening process and can't tell the difference until it's too late and they are attached. And then those are the ones that complain about how they "can't find any nice guys", which annoys the hell out of the men around them.

However, most of these women grow out of this with age and experience. Some don't, but most do. They get a better idea of the difference between confidence and douchebaggery and start to choose wiser. And they also learn to expand their horizons a bit and not be as unforgiving with their standards. They realize their "type" kind of sucks and tweak it a little bit to exclude the douchebags and include more of the "nice" guys.

But even then, the "nice guys" that spend their time pining and moping and hoping and don't bring any masculinity to the table are still going to lose out. So basically, always be assertive and always bring it like you have a pair. You don't have to be a jerk to do this. And even though being a jerk can be beneficial, "nice guys" that go out of their way to be jerks are usually outed pretty easily because they don't bring the confidence, just the crappy behavior.

I wish I had posted earlier. I lost a good one just for the reasons you mention. I gave her walking papers on the rebound and now she is married to a 'good', boring guy after dating basically the Hell's Angels Activity Coordinator.

That is why I posted. It was painful for me to lose the last one this way, and I just could not understand the 180. How could someone think like that? Why chase A, if you want B? I'm sure her now 'good guy' husband didn't witness her whore herself over a married player like I did.

To me a women who gives $100 to the local soup kitchen is far more deep and mysterious then one who spends it tatting her ass with some Buddhist mantra.

August 22, 2013

Why do men like high maintenance drama queens?

Some people for whatever reason like a challenge. This crazy person or bad boy gets their heart pumping which is confused with love.

I cant say I know many women who are into bad boys.

August 22, 2013

My "bad boy" was so sweet and nice at the beginning, so I got into the relationship BECAUSE he was nice.

Turns out he was a "bad boy" but I got hooked. Spent couple of years trying to force him into changing. Never changed, now I'm single and back in the market for a good guy.

Even in High School, I wasn't into the "bad boys". I knew it meant getting played, possibly getting knocked up and a life full of self esteem issues later on in my grown-up life. I just focused on getting good grades, get to college and then find a guy on the same level as me. Where are the girls that were always into the bad guys? In abusive relationships with a ton of kids, while getting cheated on (not always this dramatic). Notice how this is always the motto of every movie with a high school reunion scene: the popular girls are always with a drunk, cheater while pregnant while the "nerds" are making that money and in meaningful relationships.

August 22, 2013

My "bad boy" was so sweet and nice at the beginning, so I got into the relationship BECAUSE he was nice.

Turns out he was a "bad boy" but I got hooked. Spent couple of years trying to force him into changing. Never changed, now I'm single and back in the market for a good guy.

Even in High School, I wasn't into the "bad boys". I knew it meant getting played, possibly getting knocked up and a life full of self esteem issues later on in my grown-up life. I just focused on getting good grades, get to college and then find a guy on the same level as me. Where are the girls that were always into the bad guys? In abusive relationships with a ton of kids, while getting cheated on (not always this dramatic). Notice how this is always the motto of every movie with a high school reunion scene: the popular girls are always with a drunk, cheater while pregnant while the "nerds" are making that money and in meaningful relationships.

So, I'm curious. What do you think is the moral to the story for all this?

What would you tell you're daughter if she came home with a guy that you knew was a user and she just couldn't see it?

August 22, 2013

So, I'm curious. What do you think is the moral to the story for all this?
What would you tell you're daughter if she came home with a guy that you knew was a user and she just couldn't see it?

Well, I think you start by raising your kids right and showing them what REAL love is so they don't go looking for it in all the wrong places from all the wrong people.

As a father of two girls, that's what I always try to focus on.

That being said, there is just so much you can do with your kids. It's a tough balancing act. You want to guide them in the right direction, but if you get too controlling, they will rebel.

What would *I* do if one of my daughters came home with someone I was obviously wary of? I would sit her down and tell her exactly how I felt. But I wouldn't force her to do anything unless I had proof that he was treating her bad. Then I would definitely get involved...I've seen and heard too much about the abuse women go through to sit back and let it happen.

But, like I said, I think it all starts with showing them what real love is.

August 22, 2013

Bad boys aren't people pleasers, as they only please themselves. They are authentic in a way that they call what they see. But bad boys have somewhat of an insecurity issue. Their attitude of being a bully or a menace hide their true insecurity. Bad boys are attractive compared to the nice guys because they've got a spine. The weak point of a bad boy is that their confidence only last as far as their own comfort zone or territory. Bring them out of their comfort zone and you'll peel into his insecure persona. Law enforcement agencies had for years practise a certain method of female rescue of girls or women who has been under the grips of these bad boys on the behest of their parents. The rescue is successful most of the time. Bad boys are manipulators only to manipulate the victim to have a lower self-esteem than the manipulator.

Nice guys are extreme people pleasers. They have a hard time saying no, because they don't want to hear any negatism from friends and lovers. So they manipulate their behaviour and actions to reflect the nice guy persona. They can't do no wrong to make everybody happy. But this is unrealistic because no one can make everyone happy. They lack the spine to defend themselves. In the North American culture of women being dominant and confident and to a certain extent a bully, nice guys get treated like a doormat. Nice guys are manipulators only to manipulate the victim into thinking they are nice guys without a spine.

Bad boys and nice guys attract the same kind of women; women who are manipulative and dominating/controlling.

Good guys is different from bad or nice guys. This guy is truly authentic and isn't afraid of telling the truth and absolving the outcome. He does not control the outcome. He faces the outcome like a man whether it's bad or good. He does not fear backstabbing or bullying as he has no fear at all for them to exploit in it. He lacks the fear because he grew it from years of dating and relationships with dominating and manipulative people and had lots of time healing and reflecting. That as long as he faces these people with grace, the dominating and manipulative people will bow to his confidence and grace. He does not need to manipulate others to respect him. People respect him because he's got a spine and confidence without fear even when facing important tasks that may lead to failure.

Good guys attracts good girls who are equally secure, non-dominating but sensual in a feminine way without acting like a boss / bully.

There are very few naturally born good guys. Most of them come from the pool of bad boys or nice guys and when they give up their manipulative behaviors is when they will start attracting good girls who equally don't need to manipulate their men in doing what they want.

I know a number of these good girls and men and they all have the same traits.

August 22, 2013

Bad boys attract emotionally unstable trainwrecks. No thanks no matter how hot they are. They are fun to play with when you are just not in a relationship mood but nothing beyond that.

Yeah a buddy of mine is a 'bad boy' (really just a self-obsessed narcissist) and his dating stories are always fun. Personally don't believe in the good-bad stuff either I think it is more about people with defective personalities/accomplished liars than anything else.

August 22, 2013

Why do men like high maintenance drama queens?

Some people for whatever reason like a challenge. This crazy person or bad boy gets their heart pumping which is confused with love.

I cant say I know many women who are into bad boys.

Probably because they are hot. Most men think with the little head instead of the big head. Personally, I hate high maintenance women and drop them almost immediately.

You don't see many unattractive drama queens with men.

August 22, 2013

Men who are attracted to drama queens and women who are attracted to bad boys let their libidos override all common sense. A woman can look like Megan Fox crossed with Mila Kunis and I would say no if she were a drama queen. Putting up with all that is too big a price to pay for something nice to look at.

August 22, 2013

Men who are attracted to drama queens and women who are attracted to bad boys let their libidos override all common sense. A woman can look like Megan Fox crossed with Mila Kunis and I would say no if she were a drama queen. Putting up with all that is too big a price to pay for something nice to look at.

Exactly, not only is drama annoying and potentially harmful, but it is a symptom of an immature and selfish spirit. They might be pretty on the outside, but ugly on the inside.

But, I know many guys who think the exact opposite. Hot bods provide better sex and an image boost via a 'trophy' catch. It seems obvious, a long term, prosperous relationship cannot exist solely on such features. So, for me it is an all or nothing deal when it comes to integrity, that is, honesty, respect, compassion.

I can see women choosing bad boys as toys; for that they are perfect. But, I got confused when they got hurt and didn't know why? They fail to see the value of a virtuous spirit. I have seen some that do, but can't get by a pretty face (works for guys too) and end up in a rollercoaster of good sex with no love, respect or support. They walk around totally confiicted, unhappy and frazeled until finally the sex, as good as it might be, just simply isn't enough.

Edited August 22, 2013 by bob the brave

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Sorry, gotta bring it up again. Why the bad boy?

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