maidai Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 (edited) The back story is here http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/other-man-woman/415737-how-protect-yourself-becoming-ow and yesterday I contributed to this thread here..http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/other-man-woman/415279-texts-affairs-4.html Pierre commented the following yesterday...You were not at fault for the demise of your relationship. The OM loved you intensely, however his love was within the context of the EMR. OM lived in two compartments and the day the divorce was final the marriage compartment collapsed. His love for you was real, but the moment OM had to live in just one compartment the whole thing collapsed. I see this syndrome over and over again in the forum. OM loves you, but the circumstances are not right. Since then I have tried to do some searches but can not find anything on the concept of having two compartments and what makes them fall back into the one that could be classified as misery. Is there MM's here who have gone back to their unhappy marriages and left OW they were happy with or OW who truly believe they have had this happen and gleamed an understanding why? When its not a fresh start and is picking up where left off what truly convinces people it will work and only the early good will be picked up not the bad? As said over the 18mnths our relationship was open. His wife never wanted him back, I did not think he wanted to return and I do not believe he has now returned for his child. She had a happy time through it a happy Mum and a happy Dad and I loved her dearly and she had a great relationship with me. She is only 5. At Christmas we bought her joint presents her Mum bought presents for me from her. Knowing how her Mum operated I believe she truly had to be non plused that he was with someone else for her to behave so well through it. I feel she will be more confused now by me disappearing and Mummy and Daddy again sharing a bed and may end up more unhappy. That leaves me to believe that he must had truly loved her and gone back to her for *her* even though she treated him so badly and left him so broken to begin with. A couple of days after it happened me still believing he was thinking about me asking him to be truthful and having had no contact I was notified simply with a text saying. I am back with my wife she is the only woman I love and my best friend to be honest she always has been. Now I know that is simply not true, their marriage nearly killed him it was that bad. I dont even think it sounded like him texting from 18mnths of us being together. The only other contact I have had was a nasty call from her telling me to make sure I never contact him again. I am no contact, will stay non contact because I dont believe I will ever get the truth from him but am trying to make some sense of it in my own head and having no previous experience am struggling. I am desperate to learn and grow from this and never risk it happening again because its so hard so the more insight I can gleam the better. I did not at any point deem him to be emotionally unavailable. Edited August 13, 2013 by maidai
Pierre Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 The back story is here http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/other-man-woman/415737-how-protect-yourself-becoming-ow and yesterday I contributed to this thread here..http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/other-man-woman/415279-texts-affairs-4.html Pierre commented the following yesterday...You were not at fault for the demise of your relationship. The OM loved you intensely, however his love was within the context of the EMR. OM lived in two compartments and the day the divorce was final the marriage compartment collapsed. His love for you was real, but the moment OM had to live in just one compartment the whole thing collapsed. I see this syndrome over and over again in the forum. OM loves you, but the circumstances are not right. Since then I have tried to do some searches but can not find anything on the concept of having two compartments and what makes them fall back into the one that could be classified as misery. Is there MM's here who have gone back to their unhappy marriages and left OW they were happy with or OW who truly believe they have had this happen and gleamed an understanding why? When its not a fresh start and is picking up where left off what truly convinces people it will work and only the early good will be picked up not the bad? As said over the 18mnths or relationship was open. His wife never wanted him back, I did not think he wanted to return and I do not believe he has now returned for his child. She had a happy time through it a happy Mum and a happy Dad and I loved her dearly and she had a great relationship with me. She is only 5. At Christmas we bought her joint presents her Mum bought presents for me from her. Knowing how her Mum operated I believe she truly had to be non plused that he was with someone else for her to behave so well through it. I feel she will be more confused now by me disappearing and Mummy and Daddy again sharing a bed and may end up more unhappy. That leaves me to believe that he must had truly loved her and gone back to her for *her* even though she treated him so badly and left him so broken to begin with. A couple of days after it happened and having had no contact I was notified simply with a text saying. I am back with my wife she is the only woman I love and my best friend to be honest she always has been. Now I know that is simply not true and dont even think it sounded like him texting from 18mnths of us being together. I am no contact, will stay non contact because I dont believe I will ever get the truth from him but am trying to make some sense of it in my own head and having no previous experience am struggling. I am sorry you are in pain. A good example that is common in every day life is dating someone that just ended a long term relationship. Generally these relationships don't work and the other party is often called "the rebound". Counselors will say" "You don't want to be the rebound person that dates someone that ended a long term relationship". This guy loved you, but he also loves his wife. The love for you was NEW and romantic. The love for the wife is old and not that romantic. It is called long term attachment love. NEW romantic love is much more exciting than long term calm love. However, when the chips are down it is easier to give up the NEW love than the OLD love.
Author maidai Posted August 13, 2013 Author Posted August 13, 2013 I am sorry you are in pain. A good example that is common in every day life is dating someone that just ended a long term relationship. Generally these relationships don't work and the other party is often called "the rebound". Counselors will say" "You don't want to be the rebound person that dates someone that ended a long term relationship". This guy loved you, but he also loves his wife. The love for you was NEW and romantic. The love for the wife is old and not that romantic. It is called long term attachment love. NEW romantic love is much more exciting than long term calm love. However, when the chips are down it is easier to give up the NEW love than the OLD love. Thanks Pierre. To a degree yes I can understand that but... I was in a long term relationship 11 years where we were everything but married on paper. We have now been split for two years and I will always love him/have love for him but that is due to the fact that the relationship was a good one not a bad experience and it just died out. We are still good friends but do not go out of our way to socialise together. It does not mean I feel the need to run back to it. I know though had the relationship been bad and abusive like this one was even if I had love for that person surely common sense would dictate you would not go back to controlled poisonous misery?
hermione08 Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 I don't think he went back because his wife represents old love, etc. He probably went back because she's a bad addiction like drugs and he evidently likes being miserable. There are people like this, people who like being abused and controlled.
Pierre Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 Thanks Pierre. To a degree yes I can understand that but... I was in a long term relationship 11 years where we were everything but married on paper. We have now been split for two years and I will always love him/have love for him but that is due to the fact that the relationship was a good one not a bad experience and it just died out. We are still good friends but do not go out of our way to socialise together. It does not mean I feel the need to run back to it. I know though had the relationship been bad and abusive like this one was even if I had love for that person surely common sense would dictate you would not go back to controlled poisonous misery? For some any form of love is very addictive. We see this in the forum everyday. Some people text thousands of times 24/7. Surprisingly, long term attachment is also addictive to some. It is not always easy to end a relationship as you did. I am curious: Why did you end your relationship if everything was so good?
hermione08 Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 Well, you can be in a good relationship but you are like brother and sister. Which for me means it's over.
Author maidai Posted August 13, 2013 Author Posted August 13, 2013 I don't think he went back because his wife represents old love, etc. He probably went back because she's a bad addiction like drugs and he evidently likes being miserable. There are people like this, people who like being abused and controlled. I think that is possibly the saddest and most confusing thing to me Hermione and I think if there is a close to the truth we may come then that might be it. Not so much that he liked the misery but the not needing to think/plan or build for himself. I have been thinking back through our relationship and we did so much together ie theme parks, holidays, date nights, concerts, walking BUT I was the one who arranged it all, not in a controlling way I hasten to add but in a I did all the ground work if that makes sense. I am not saying that he did not want to do them he most certainly did and he has had so much fun and happiness but I do feel that had it been left to him to think/arrange not alot would have happened and we may have spent our time together sitting in front of the tv. I am also starting to realise now that he was exceptionally needy in an emotional sense. He definately needed alot of ego stroking and reassurance that I loved him, he was good for me, I was happy with him etc, non of this I had a problem giving as I am a very loving and giving person naturally. He struggled to give it back verbally but always made an effort to show me in his actions, ie being there for me when family members passed or helping out with things he knew I needed help with, putting himself out etc. There was also an element of drama queen involved ie I am ill equated to I am dying etc and again reassurance was needed. He knew with me I would laugh it off and give him a there there then tell him to man up. All of this now I am starting to see is contributed from low self esteem and the damage done by the wife. In the last few months it was stopping, he was needing less reassurance, he was getting emotionally and physically stronger and just happier and happier. This is what I can not understand regaining your strength then running back to the thing that broke you down in the first place. It seems bizarre and self destructive.
Author maidai Posted August 13, 2013 Author Posted August 13, 2013 I am curious: Why did you end your relationship if everything was so good? I ended my 11 year relationship because although we were happy and able to live together that was all we were doing. I loved him but not in the way I should have loved him. The physical side was all but gone and I did not want intimacy with him any longer although we worked hard for 2 years to try and put that back, I did not love him in that way. I felt we both deserved better and to have a *full* love and be happy in every aspect. The fact we can remain friends and be supportitive of each other and it did not get to the point where we ended up disrespecting and lying and cheating on each other to me says I made the right decission. 1
hermione08 Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 In the same way as we do not understand a sane person wanting to go back to injecting heroin. But they do. It's up to him to free himself from this bad addiction, if he cannot find the strength or the will, there's nothing you can (or should) do.
Author maidai Posted August 13, 2013 Author Posted August 13, 2013 In the same way as we do not understand a sane person wanting to go back to injecting heroin. But they do. It's up to him to free himself from this bad addiction, if he cannot find the strength or the will, there's nothing you can (or should) do. You are right. Its just so very hard and sad to go on a journey with someone with much happiness and lots of love and then see them hit self destruct again. I have never experienced this before and seeing someone you love deeply stop bleeding and then cut themselves again hurts like hell because you can do nothing to help them stop this time. I still feel sick to the stomach to think he will be cut again and again over and over after 3 years self repair. 1
Pierre Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 I think that is possibly the saddest and most confusing thing to me Hermione and I think if there is a close to the truth we may come then that might be it. Not so much that he liked the misery but the not needing to think/plan or build for himself. I have been thinking back through our relationship and we did so much together ie theme parks, holidays, date nights, concerts, walking BUT I was the one who arranged it all, not in a controlling way I hasten to add but in a I did all the ground work if that makes sense. I am not saying that he did not want to do them he most certainly did and he has had so much fun and happiness but I do feel that had it been left to him to think/arrange not alot would have happened and we may have spent our time together sitting in front of the tv. I am also starting to realise now that he was exceptionally needy in an emotional sense. He definately needed alot of ego stroking and reassurance that I loved him, he was good for me, I was happy with him etc, non of this I had a problem giving as I am a very loving and giving person naturally. He struggled to give it back verbally but always made an effort to show me in his actions, ie being there for me when family members passed or helping out with things he knew I needed help with, putting himself out etc. There was also an element of drama queen involved ie I am ill equated to I am dying etc and again reassurance was needed. He knew with me I would laugh it off and give him a there there then tell him to man up. All of this now I am starting to see is contributed from low self esteem and the damage done by the wife. In the last few months it was stopping, he was needing less reassurance, he was getting emotionally and physically stronger and just happier and happier. This is what I can not understand regaining your strength then running back to the thing that broke you down in the first place. It seems bizarre and self destructive. As much as you know the wife, you will. never know the entire dynamic of their relationship. The possibilities are endless. Maybe the wife started to date someone new and he make very jealous and went back to her. You will never know what truly goes on between them, it is impossible. Secondly, you describe a man that is a black hole for external validation. People like this tend to be very responsive to courting and this may seem gratifying for whomever is romancing them. His responsiveness made a lot of difference to you, but in the end you do not want a man with a MRI magnet for external validation. No one can provide validation to another person 24/7. I suspect breaking up with this guy is the best thing that could happen to you. You may not agree, but you were saved from a lot of future heartache. The big question is why did you think a needy man with low self esteem was attractive?
Pierre Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 I ended my 11 year relationship because although we were happy and able to live together that was all we were doing. I loved him but not in the way I should have loved him. The physical side was all but gone and I did not want intimacy with him any longer although we worked hard for 2 years to try and put that back, I did not love him in that way. I felt we both deserved better and to have a *full* love and be happy in every aspect. The fact we can remain friends and be supportitive of each other and it did not get to the point where we ended up disrespecting and lying and cheating on each other to me says I made the right decission. OK, I see it. Some folks in marriages become like siblings. It happens to many. However, there are others that maintain the romance. I think it is possible for some and impossible for others.
Author maidai Posted August 13, 2013 Author Posted August 13, 2013 The big question is why did you think a needy man with low self esteem was attractive? It was not like that at first and I think I sort of fell into it and did not see it then in the same way as on reflection and alot of thinking back I am seeing it now. At first it was fun fun fun. We have known each other for 20 plus years and always had fun together and laughed together. The self validation was not needed at first and began gradually I suppose as the relationship grew I never had a problem telling him I loved him, had fun, appreciated him etc because well it was the truth I think the it became from hearing it that he needed it validated more. I think the fact that his wife never gave it or offered it over the course of the 7 years he enjoyed hearing it although he would always add that he knew always anyway with me.
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