jphcbpa Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Soooo after reading the thread this is what you take away from it? Nothing else regarding the unbalance in the relationship? Perhaps along the lines that yes she does have the right to be upset and in fact she should assert herself more? "having a right to be upset" to me means I want to be a victim. R's ebb and flow. She can have a conversation with him about how she feels and then let it go. No pressure and not forcing him to "fix" anything. Down the road she may take a vaca with the girls when he is not able to go. Things are fluid when you detach with love. But if wanting to be upset works then go with that. I would rather be happy and happy for my SO. Life is too short to take everything so personal. 5 years from now, it is not even going to matter. What matters is how she processes this moment. This is about them working this out, not about the trip. IMO, she should keep the focus off the trip and look at the feelings this brings up. This is a chance to grow as a person and in the R. Exciting!
Els Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 IMO, she should keep the focus off the trip and look at the feelings this brings up. This is a chance to grow as a person and in the R. Exciting! Your point would be valid IF she had not thrown all her savings into keeping a relationship with this man, who not only did not support her during the transition from the job that she left FOR HIM, but is now disregarding her mention of wanting a vacation with him. To what extent do you 'keep the focus off' someone's actions or lack thereof? 1
Emilia Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 "having a right to be upset" to me means I want to be a victim. No. Being upset means you recognise something is off and you want to fix it. You are only a victim if you choose to be. R's ebb and flow. She can have a conversation with him about how she feels and then let it go. No pressure and not forcing him to "fix" anything. Down the road she may take a vaca with the girls when he is not able to go. Things are fluid when you detach with love. But if wanting to be upset works then go with that. I would rather be happy and happy for my SO. Life is too short to take everything so personal. 5 years from now, it is not even going to matter. What matters is how she processes this moment. This is about them working this out, not about the trip. IMO, she should keep the focus off the trip and look at the feelings this brings up. This is a chance to grow as a person and in the R. Exciting! So you are encouraging the poster to bury her head in the sand rather than acknowledge the imbalance in the relationship? You think a relationship should be kept at any cost? Wanting to be in a relationship trumps being treated well and asserting yourself? 1
soccerrprp Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 "having a right to be upset" to me means I want to be a victim... IMO, she should keep the focus off the trip and look at the feelings this brings up. This is a chance to grow as a person and in the R. Exciting! jphcbpa, The "right to be upset" also means that people should not try to repress their TRUE feelings and pretend like it's no big deal to them. I learned this by having your attitude and being reminded by my late-wife and exes that it's much healthier to express what/how you are genuinely feeling. This way, when the conversation ensues, it is more likely that issues will be hashed out, openly. So, if she follows your final advice, she would share her feelings within the context of the origins of those feelings, right? An opportunity to grow... 1
hoping2heal Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 We have been dating 5 months, and it's a serious relationship. No, it's not. It's been 5 months and while you both may be exclusive and you may have all intentions of a serious relationship you're more like travelling the road to one. I'm not saying that to be an a-hole either. But on the other hand I'm a little hurt that based on one phone call, he would decide to forget about all the ideas we had for a vacation This is what I'm talking about. It doesn't mean you have a bad relationship or anything like that but it's been 5 months and in one phone call he brushed off the plans you two had been talking about together.
Ninjainpajamas Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 I'd be a little careful calling any relationship "serious" after 5 months...even though I realize you may be attached to the hip and all of that, it's still the beginning of the relationship and they can ultimately come and go like the seasons in the end. First six months should pretty much be a breeze IMO. As far as the big blunder here, that's the decision you made on your part to actually be in this relationship...that's a major woe in terms of switching jobs and sacrificing your savings, I think that's way too much of a sacrifice on your part IMO that will likely cost you in the end, without really any guarantee of the future so-to-speak, I mean you're not even living together right? even so, major sacrifice on your part and I'm not really sure what you got...I guess the man for now right? Anyway, he clearly is excited to go on this vacation and being that he's been so attached to the hip with you I can understand why he wouldn't mind getting away for a little bit...there's got to be some break in between, you can't just put glued together 24/7 and then on top of it expect to take a vacation together...I think even the most co-dependent men will need a break eventually. I don't anticipate anything you saying will make much of a difference...other than cause a disagreement and he may feel guilty and try to find some way to patch it up or begrudgingly cancel the trip to satiate his guilt of "leaving you behind". After all, it sounds like you're making all the sacrifices and the one who is compassionate to all of his needs, you even notice how hard he is working and deserves this...does he care this much about you and your sacrifice? probably not, he expects it to a degree because that's what you've shown...although don't expect him to admit that to you, men will always have sugar-coated responses because they know how you will emotionally react to the plain truth. At any rate, considering the dynamic of this relationship thus far I see your best option being just to let him go...and tell him next time he has a vacation you'd like to do something together. But for now be supportive and wish him a great time, I'm sure he'll very much appreciate that. Although you are unhappy and disappointed I think you're also just a bit jealous and envious of everyone going on these trips and you not being able to do much...especially when part of that is because of the sacrifice to be with him, that is disappointing...but I think you should plan your own trip and do something else as well on your time, as you are transitioning past the six month mark of being together all of the time, it might be the break you need to transition into the next phase of this relationship...but still first and second year of a relationship as a whole, shouldn't be all that hard...still a lot of honeymoon phase involved here, so I'm sure you'll get past this no matter what happens, especially considering your sacrifice and subservient role in the relationship as you are likely one who is afraid or not good with confrontation or "rocking the boat". 1
Keenly Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 That's a pretty big deal in my opinion. He owes you. Quite literally. What a terrible mindset. He OWES her? If a girl ever acted like I owed her anything, short of oral sex in exchange for cooking me dinner or something , I would leave. The expectation mentality is exhausting.
Emilia Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 What a terrible mindset. He OWES her? If a girl ever acted like I owed her anything, short of oral sex in exchange for cooking me dinner or something , I would leave. The expectation mentality is exhausting. Are you even aware of what the post is reference to?
jphcbpa Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Your point would be valid IF she had not thrown all her savings into keeping a relationship with this man, who not only did not support her during the transition from the job that she left FOR HIM, but is now disregarding her mention of wanting a vacation with him. To what extent do you 'keep the focus off' someone's actions or lack thereof? she is an adult and made a choice regarding her savings.
jphcbpa Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 No. Being upset means you recognise something is off and you want to fix it. You are only a victim if you choose to be. So you are encouraging the poster to bury her head in the sand rather than acknowledge the imbalance in the relationship? You think a relationship should be kept at any cost? Wanting to be in a relationship trumps being treated well and asserting yourself? Like I said, she should share her feelings, then let it go with out asking him to "fix" her or the situation. Is this really about the trip or is there something deeper coming up?
Emilia Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Like I said, she should share her feelings, then let it go with out asking him to "fix" her or the situation. Is this really about the trip or is there something deeper coming up? It's like Groundhog Day or something ... or is it Forest Gump? Yes there is something deeper coming up, I thought that's what we have been discussing.
soccerrprp Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Let's get something clear here...don't tell the OP that she's not in a serious relationship b/c it's only been 5-months. She moved and changed jobs for the guy and the guy accepted the responsibilities that came along with that. He is VERY clear, or should be, as to what such sacrifice entails and signifies. Those were serious movies, sacrifices and all signs would have clearly indicated that the relationship had become serious. The OP and BF had made other plans and those plans were dismissed. She being left alone b/c she is unable to provide for herself financially, she is feeling a little upset about this, all legitimate feelings, concerns, issues to contemplate. Perhaps not to wallow in, but legitimate never the less. OP, just have the talk and share what you are feeling. He'll decide for himself what is best. But, your concerns are fine. You are entitled to feel this way considering....
Keenly Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Are you even aware of what the post is reference to? Yeah I am. SHE made the choice to start dating him. SHE made the choice to switch jobs. SHE lost all of her savings. And now you say that he owes her. No.... just no. That's a lack of personal responsibility for the choices she made if she feels like he owes her. He doesn't owe her anything but respect and attention . 1
jphcbpa Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 It's like Groundhog Day or something ... or is it Forest Gump? Yes there is something deeper coming up, I thought that's what we have been discussing. Something deeper having nothing to do with the trip or savings. 1
Emilia Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Yeah I am. SHE made the choice to start dating him. SHE made the choice to switch jobs. SHE lost all of her savings. And now you say that he owes her. No.... just no. That's a lack of personal responsibility for the choices she made if she feels like he owes her. He doesn't owe her anything but respect and attention . Really? So you think it's absolutely fine to take from another person and not contribute 50%? Let that be financial or otherwise? I bet you are one of those posters who would scream blue murder if the shoe was on the other foot. As if. 1
soccerrprp Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 He doesn't owe her anything but respect and attention . Keenly, I am certain you feel that the guy owes her the same, yes?
Ninjainpajamas Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 (edited) Really? So you think it's absolutely fine to take from another person and not contribute 50%? Let that be financial or otherwise? I bet you are one of those posters who would scream blue murder if the shoe was on the other foot. As if. She did ultimately make the choice to make those sacrifices to be in this relationship, let's not pretend this was all for him or them as a couple, she wanted this for herself as well...If she was willing to sacrifice that much to be with him then I very much doubt he had to twist her arm...that's a choice someone makes on their own personal feelings. I don't believe in the tradition of "I did this for you or gave this to you, now I expect X in return". That's now how it works, as an adult who's been in this world far before she ever met this guy, she alone has the responsibility to make her decisions that are best for her....if he took advantage or didn't respect what she "sacrificed" for the relationship he doesn't owe her that...in theory if you are assuming he shares the same thoughts, feelings and opinion of that then of course he would reciprocate, but he is not forced nor should anyone be forced to do something that isn't genuine and that they do not truly feel, he should not be made to feel guilty because of the sacrifices she made to be with him...as if that was entirely on his shoulders. You have to ask yourself, did he really take this from her, or did she give or sacrifice willingly for what she saw as worth the investment? That was her choice, like people are saying...she's a grown adult, and adults take responsibility for their actions and decisions, do they not? or should some man or SO always be conditioning or reciprocating to your choices as an individual lest they be called a user and abuser? Edited July 20, 2013 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Keenly Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Really? So you think it's absolutely fine to take from another person and not contribute 50%? Let that be financial or otherwise? I bet you are one of those posters who would scream blue murder if the shoe was on the other foot. As if. I'd like to know what he took from her. I'd LOVE to hear it actually. Or is she not responsible for the choices SHE makes. You are trying to blame her financial problems on him, when it was her decision. She needs to live with the consequences of her decisions, which it seems like she is. She even knows that its not his fault she is in that situation. I don't know where you get this idea that if one person needs to make a sacrifice so that a relationship can start, that the other person then OWES them something. If I skip a business sales meeting, one that could make a lot of money, to go on a first date with a girl, that girl OWES me sex on that date right ? I mean, I made a sacrifice to see her, and in your mind, she now owes me. I don't live like that, its extremely unhealthy to keep some kind of tab on the sacrifices you make to try and make YOURSELF happy.
hippetyhop Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Unless I missed it, how long is this trip? Is it a full week or a weekend?
Keenly Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Keenly, I am certain you feel that the guy owes her the same, yes? That's what that quote says.
Emilia Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 I don't live like that, its extremely unhealthy to keep some kind of tab on the sacrifices you make to try and make YOURSELF happy. If you don't know how to keep a relationship balanced where both partners are roughly equally share the cost and benefit then one person will be exploited. And that is an unhealthy relationship. Balance matters and he isn't acknowledging what a person (the OP) in a financially inferior position sacrificed.
dasein Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Oh, also wanted to address this idea of you two having an abridged or smaller vacation later on... This is, AGAIN, is or would be a compromise(sacrifice) on your part. With everything you have already sacrificed, if he takes this full vacation to be with his buddy w/o you, you again are taking the table scraps of his time and consideration. Ugh, don't want to sound negative about a relationship you feel so good about, but you asked. Just my worthless 2-cents, anyway. Now this thread is turning into needless BF bashing. We do not know all the financial or other dynamics of this relationship, and even if we did, this thread is about a simple topic related to a couple's vacation plans, not "who has sacrificed more for the relationship generally, and how that should be accounted." 1. a couple, A and B, 5 months in, talked about vacationing together. 2. Later, B was invited to a different vacation plan that would prevent any plans discussed in "1." 3. B asks A whether it would be OK to go, and states that they really want to go. 4. A is disappointed and seeks advice here. That's really it. Some of the other things posters are attempting to bring in are irrelevant. I don't see any villains here, and agree with some good advice given about A stating her disappointment and wishes to B, and seeing what can be worked out. But disagree thoroughly with attempts to paint B as some kind of inconsiderate bad guy or user. Every scenario people post to LS is not an example of bad behavior, why are we trying to manufacture a blame event here in a matter of fact type of situation that many people experience and work past? I feel like several posts here are seeking to encourage OP to make this a bigger deal than it is in actuality.
Keenly Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 If you don't know how to keep a relationship balanced where both partners are roughly equally share the cost and benefit then one person will be exploited. And that is an unhealthy relationship. Balance matters and he isn't acknowledging what a person (the OP) in a financially inferior position sacrificed. Again, If I was her boyfriend, I am not responsible for the sacrifices she chooses to make. It's HER choice. It's not on me. Will I appreciate the sacrifice? Absolutely. But I do not OWE her for it. Big difference. OP, sometimes guys just want to get away with their guy friends and be guys. You guys may be getting serious, I don't know, but you should not take this personally. I know you guys were making some loose plans but did you ever really make any solid set in stone plans? Or was this just pillow talk?
Author Mycteria Posted July 19, 2013 Author Posted July 19, 2013 (edited) Wow, thanks for all the responses guys! However I think I need to clear up some things. 1) I am not able to go on the skiing trip because its an all boys thing, it has nothing to do with finances. By January I should be back on my feet financially for sure. His friends are very segregated as far as gender goes (we are from the south and his circle is very traditional). 2) Yes, me switching jobs was my choice and I don't blame him for it. It was a huge sacrifice on my part for sure, as I loved my old job. And he has offered to help me out financially but I have refused because it was my choice, and I will never let a man help me out financially if I can at all help it. He's been helping out by paying for more of our dates but that's about it. 3) I'm not worried about him cheating in the trip, as someone else mentioned. Again, very traditional background (waiting till marriage). 4) There is no possibility of taking two trips or even an extended weekend. He gets two days off a week, not in a row. He can occasionally request to have his days off be consecutive, but he has to reserve that for special occasions (weddings mostly). Therefore we have never been on any kind of trip together. 5) Our plans were extremely tentative. We've been trying to find time to get him scuba certified and we were talking about taking a scuba trip together. We had discussed a cruise or a beach trip, but nothing firm. Mainly because I wouldn't be able to go until winter. Edited July 19, 2013 by Mycteria
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