Differences in BS's pain level

[Betterthanthis13]

Wow, a lot of really interesting questions. Ill take a stab.

 

Hi, Better-

 

I posted to you in OW/OM forum, but the path of this thread really interests me. I had an A, I put myself into IC, I ended the A (my H doesn't know), I began to assert myself in my M and found my 'need' for my AP diminishing, my H saw how serious I was about my needs and got into IC himself (or I was divorcing him), and then we began MC. I am working very, very hard to understand and heal both myself and my M, and my H is now doing the same. These events cause me to reflect on marriage and cause me to scrutinize and analyze all the couples I know. I am desperate to find marital "role models," whatever that means, but it has been impossible. Why is that????

 

This leads to your topic. I am in a people related field and find people coming to me for advice on a daily basis. People trust my honesty and guidance. (Irony? Yes, but these same qualities helped me to reach for solutions in my life, even if it was a little after the fact.) Because people share with me so frequently, I am always seeing how perfectly imperfect almost everyone's relationship is! Often, they realize it. But equally often, they don't!!!

 

One guy speaks endlessly about the virtues of his wife, but at the same time, he is paying a lot of attention to other females as of late. Suggestive comments. Touchy feely. This was not who he was for the 15 years prior. When I told him of my concerns, he stated, "Jane knows I'd never cheat on her. We're great! No worries." I beg to differ. If he finds a willing female, he's done. I can tell. He's "ripe" for an A, unfortunately. (After one too many cocktails a couple months ago, he admitted as much.)

 

There is another woman I know in a deeply abusive marriage. He has hit her, but more common is the insulting, belittling, and degrading. What does she say, though? Her marriage is good and her H is "great!"

 

My own parents. Neither have cheated (to the best of my knowledge) but neither have ever been very satisfied in life either. They vent their frustrations to me, their child. (Yuck.) But their codependency has kept them tied together, mutually held back by each other's dysfunction. They tell people they are "so happy" though.

 

Here are my questions then:

 

1. If you think your marriage is perfect because of your own blinders and dysfunction, then is it perfect? Is your reality real? Or are you a Pollyana who could be destroyed at any second?

I guess it depends on the situation. If two people with severe untreatable brain disorders happen to find complementary people to love them and are truly happy then that sounds perfect to me. If two people who are unhappy and disordered but are simply too lazy to work on themselves and find a partner who will put up with their crap indefinitely, and their attachment-style "love" for each other keeps them clinging to each other.... I think that is one of the definitions of hell on earth. Your reality is always real, and it can always be destroyed at any second.

 

2. If one person thinks the marriage is great but their spouse is unhappy, is the person truly open and willing to hearing there are problems? Or do they hide from the signs and facts and cling to their false reality? And is an A often the result?

If one person thinks a marriage is great and one does not then they have a severe communication problem in their marriage that needs to be addressed. Someone that hides from signs and facts is a scaredy-cat (technical term) or possibly an ostrich. Just kidding. If someone is hiding from reality and pretending everything is ok all the time when it's really not I think that's a sign of someone with anxiety issues? I don't know but I think they need IC. Also a lot of guys are like that because they are told never to cry growing up. A is the result of a person in a relationship making a decision to break the commitment of monogamy without informing their partner. It has nothing to do with the relationship problems. In the WS mind I assume an A is a perceived solution to their problem, and maybe sometimes it is a step on the path to a new life that ultimately ends up making them happier than the marriage did if they end up falling in love with their AP and leaving the marriage, but an A is always a new marriage problem, never a solution to a marriage problem. The answer a potential WS is searching for can ALWAYS be found by a relentless pursuit of the truth. If you are in an unhappy relationship for whatever reason, exhaust ALL efforts to resolve the situation. Who cares who's job it is to make the relationship work? You want to be in it. You want to be happy. If being in the relationship and being happy is determined to be NOT possible- there is NO HOPE left- get out. Leave- then date others. Don't date others while you still have one shred of hope for your current relationship. That is what makes a MESS. Giant chaos for everyone. Take time to yourself in between relationships. Overlap is bad for your mental health.

 

3. Are the people who were truly shocked by their spouses A people who emotionally or psychologically needed their Ms, needed spouses who would 'catch them' and thus felt more devastation? Were they codependent types? Had they been using (needing) the M to fill them up instead of being self-reliant and independent selves?

Anything is possible, we are all dysfunctional in some way and nobody is perfect. Marriages aren't static, they should grow and change and get better over time- not spiral downward into codependant needy push pull dark terrible dynamics. If that is happening someone needs to step up and say HEY!!! wake up. this is not working. we need to do something right now, and every minute from now on, to change direction of this sinking ship, or I'm out. Takes two people to want to build intimacy trust and love over time. A's really don't help with that.

 

 

 

4. Are strong, healthy partners as "shocked" by As as codependent or needy partners? Are open-minded partners as shocked?

 

I think open minded partners and strong, healthy partners are not mutually exclusive. I think anyone with an open minded partner that has an A instead of suggesting swinging or polyamory is an idiot or a sociopath.

 

5. Are hurt and shock the same thing? I would be very, very hurt if my H cheated, but I would not be shocked. It happens. People cheat. So where does the shock come from? Do people feel hurt and call it shock?

 

I think lack of shock comes from a cynical outlook. Hurt comes from someone doing something to you that is painful.

 

6. When people say others thought they had a perfect M, are they just kidding themselves? Does anyone have a perfect M? Does anyone ever think anyone else does?

 

A lot of what people say is babbling for the sake of appearing better than their peers.

 

I could go on and on. I have formed some of my own answers, but I think that the honesty after a crisis does bring an authenticity, and BSs are not lying when they say that. I also believe people are often willfully naïve, but that being jaded can indicate living with more honesty which most say leads to intimacy. So for me, I prefer the marriage I am achieving now over the "perfect" one my H and others always believed we had. It's more real, even if fantasyland (of the pre-A marriage, not the A, but same concepts apply) was prettier. My H is an avoider, so he believed "prettier" was better. Until he started living "ickier but more real." Now he knows what he was missing all along, when he was telling people we had the Perfect Marriage.

[Furious]

Discovering you have been betrayed is always painful. It seems like some people are shaken to the core and totally devastated, sometimes even suicidal or homicidal, while others heal faster and are less emotionally wounded. Lots of reasons, what do you think is the main one for the differences in pain levels between BS's after DDay?

 

First thing that comes to mind for me is how shocked they are by the lies and deceit. If the BS is the type of person who is faithful, honest and genuine, and believes their spouse is faithful, honest and genuine, then the shock is so overwhelming it can cause a complete meltdown and psychotic break.

 

The more shady of a person the BS is, the less they are affected.

 

There are many betrayed spouses whose world is turned upside down by the discovery of their spouse cheating on them. I am one of those, I realize that cheating was so far from from own personal radar that it was inconceivable that my husband who I'd loved and been faithful to was even remotely capable of such a thing. The lies hurt me more than the affair itself. For those who live by their word and loyalty are those who are most devastated by infidelity.

 

Whether a betrayed spouse or wayward spouse there is no one who can claim they are perfect or without faults. Every marriage is vulnerable whether we know it or not. There is no perfect marriage, and a person needs are not always met at all times. In a sense everyone would have a reason to justify cheating if that were the case.

 

What has struck me after learning more about infidelity is how many betrayed spouses go on to have affairs. I naively thought a betrayed spouse would be the last person to do to another person what had been done to them. So yes, I agree with your premise that some betrayed spouses react differently to infidelity depending on their character. Some betrayed spouses end up having revenge affairs, some betrayed spouses see cheating as wrong only if they're being cheated on but really don't concern themselves with the broader issue of infidelity in society.

 

There are many OW/OM who at one time were betrayed spouses. I can't wrap my head around that. I guess it's a mind set of don't cheat on me but it's ok to cheat with me.

 

It's perplexing how infidelity is interpreted and how everyone affected by it sees it as more or less through their own lens.

Edited July 16, 2013 by Furious

[Betterthanthis13]

There are many OW/OM who at one time were betrayed spouses. I can't wrap my head around that. I guess it's a mind set of don't cheat on me but it's ok to cheat with me.

 

I was really surprised when I learned that fact!

[Betterthanthis13]

Why does society glamourize infidelity? All the lies involved are not glamorous. If one doesnt want a monogomous relationship, why not be honest? Find a spouse who is ok with an open M. No one should have the truth of their marriage, their life, hidden. To be hostage to a lie.

 

I wonder why the media doesn't give equal time to swingers and open marriages and polyamory. That topic is scandalous, has entertainment value, and ratings-worthy. I remember one tv show a few years back called "swing" I think, and there has been recent negative press coverage about the polygamy trials in the Northwest where they removed all those children, but that's about all that comes to mind. Compared to the relentless 24/7 infidelity messages we are bombarded with, it's nothing. I'd prefer those messages over the infidelity ones if the consensus is that people want sexually charged shocking programming at all times. At least those things don't encourage lying.

 

I can't think of any mainstream, pervasive positive messages coming from the media that promote anything like commitment, honesty, or monogamy. No wonder nobody knows how to do it. We all know how to go to the doctor and ask for Viagra though. It's on TV every 5 minutes.

[road]

Discovering you have been betrayed is always painful. It seems like some people are shaken to the core and totally devastated, sometimes even suicidal or homicidal, while others heal faster and are less emotionally wounded. Lots of reasons, what do you think is the main one for the differences in pain levels between BS's after DDay?

 

First thing that comes to mind for me is how shocked they are by the lies and deceit. If the BS is the type of person who is faithful, honest and genuine, and believes their spouse is faithful, honest and genuine, then the shock is so overwhelming it can cause a complete meltdown and psychotic break.

 

The more shady of a person the BS is, the less they are affected.

 

 

There is no connection between a BS's anger on dday and the level of pain they feel.

 

There is a wide range of responses to finding out your WS has cheated on you. No response is better or worst then any other response. How they are made up as individual determines how they will respond to the news on dday.

[HopingAgain]

There are many betrayed spouses whose world is turned upside down by the discovery of their spouse cheating on them. I am one of those, I realize that cheating was so far from from own personal radar that it was inconceivable that my husband who I'd loved and been faithful to was even remotely capable of such a thing. The lies hurt me more than the affair itself. For those who live by their word and loyalty are those who are most devastated by infidelity.

 

Whether a betrayed spouse or wayward spouse there is no one who can claim they are perfect or without faults. Every marriage is vulnerable whether we know it or not. There is no perfect marriage, and a person needs are not always met at all times. In a sense everyone would have a reason to justify cheating if that were the case.

 

What has struck me after learning more about infidelity is how many betrayed spouses go on to have affairs. I naively thought a betrayed spouse would be the last person to do to another person what had been done to them. So yes, I agree with your premise that some betrayed spouses react differently to infidelity depending on their character. Some betrayed spouses end up having revenge affairs, some betrayed spouses see cheating as wrong only if they're being cheated on but really don't concern themselves with the broader issue of infidelity in society.

 

There are many OW/OM who at one time were betrayed spouses. I can't wrap my head around that. I guess it's a mind set of don't cheat on me but it's ok to cheat with me.

 

It's perplexing how infidelity is interpreted and how everyone affected by it sees it as more or less through their own lens.

 

 

I agree wholeheartedly with this. To answer to the question of how/why some BSs go on to have their own affairs and/or become OW/OM...sometimes the pain is blinding and it turns to rage or bitterness. It can become easy to desire revenge so greatly, or exact some form of twisted justice, that a BS can sink to a level that before would have been beneath them, and commit infidelity themselves. Sometimes it's to get the self worth back (ego strokes), sometimes it's to regain a sense of pride, and in almost all cases, its a way to try to ease the pain.

 

It's like trying to give a person an antidote made from the same poison that is killing them.

[findingnemo]

I was OW before getting M. Being M made me understand how devastating an A is. It made me more resolute in my views about being a OW or having As. I know a few people who are now OMs/OWs after being BS'. I think people react differently to being betrayed. Also the level of betrayal is different and can lead to the betrayed coming to different conclusions.

 

One of the OWs I know doesn't trust men. She needs men physically but she was so hurt as a BW that she actually hates them. Her xH slept with her sister. Can you blame her for suffering from so much pain her brain flipped a switch? So now she sleeps with someone else's H. I have asked her why she would do that. Simple. She doesn't want a committed R and feels safe being with a man who doesn't expect much from her. What about his W? I asked. She just shrugged her shoulders. She doesn't give a damn anymore. Callous? Yes. An innocent woman has become collateral damage. But if her own sister could do that to her, why would she care about other women?

 

So sad, so horrible but I can't imagine the level of her pain. That woman is UNHAPPY and I suppose she thinks it is okay to spread the misery.

[waterwoman]

I wil confess that there is a little bit of me that is attracted to the idea of having an A now. But that is all down to Pierre's favourite word 'validation'. When you spouse has an A, it's so hard not to feel like a discard, something that didn't quite make the grade. He tells me that it wasn't like that, that if there was a competition I'd win anyway etc etc but I still have that little empty howling space inside my heart. Having an A seems like the ideal way to fill up the space....but I know the reality is it would cause more pain and chaos, and I don't want to hurt anyone.