Confusion_Reigns Posted July 10, 2013 Posted July 10, 2013 I don’t even know how to describe what’s going on…on the surface everything seems ok…but just underneath things are bubbling....I really have no idea what’s going to happen. OM and I are not *really* talking anymore. We didn’t really talk about not talking but it’s just the way things are happening right now. I mean we still talk but not on a daily bases. I haven’t met with him…I’ve wanted to and we’ve talked about it…but haven’t actually met…to be honest I’m getting the impression that he’s pulling away, stepping back and away from me….I think that he’s worried about my well-being…or that maybe he’s just not that into me anymore….whatever this is, it’s ok...I also think that he’s worried about his own well-being and I know he’s going thru some pretty hard things right now that he’s got to go thru alone (nothing I can do to help…I actually don’t know what can be done to help him in his situation…) I may or may not have mentioned that he’s a family friend. He and my brother are very good friends. My brother lives with me. The only reason I mention this is so you have a bit clearer understanding of my situation. My husbands away on a business trip, gone two nights. It’s something he does once or twice a year. We’ve been ‘good’ for about a month. We’ve had company (our 4 yo granddaughter) for about a month. I’ve not rocked the boat for this month because I simply did not want to have these fights with her around…I played nice…so we haven’t fought/argued. She just left this weekend to go back home. And we’re starting to argue again…but something’s different, I just feel it… Well…every time we argue and I get upset…he comes back with “I’m sorry, I don’t feel good…” and it’s his head, his back, his knee, his ‘you know what’….that’s hurting and the reason why he’s crabby and he’s sorry….so I feel bad for him and have been supportive/comforting to him in the past…but you know it’s getting old. I’ve told him (countless times) to go to the dr…to go see someone for help…I’ve told him, his mom’s told him, his sisters and brothers…his dad’s told him…but he says no, that there’s no point, that the dr’s can’t do anything….so I’ve stopped being as supportive/comforting to him when he starts whining about his pains…I figure that there’s nothing I can do about it…I’m actually getting sick of hearing it (and that makes me feel guilty!)…it’s his body and his life…he needs to do something about it…and I wonder about the ‘in sickness and health-til death do us part’ …. I wonder if it’s selfish of me to not want to deal with this anymore with him because he’s not willing to do anywork to get himself feeling better…if he feels better I’d think that he’d be a happier person…if he’s a happier person then maybe he and I would argue less…and our days/nights would be more peaceful….is it wrong of me to think this way? So anyway…back to the story….so H’s away and OM comes over, both nights...and stayed until about midnight. He and my brother hang out, I hang out…we’re all having a good time.Just talking and swapping stories. It’s really, really….really….nice to just talk to adults who aren’t mean/crabby….who just want to talk and not take….who let me finish my sentences and don’t talk over me….and during that time I was feeling peace in my bones, I felt light…like there’s not a thing in the world dragging me down....this was the first time in a very long time that I've slept thru the night and woke up refreshed... Last night my husband sends me some mean text messages because I didn’t call him. Well, to be honest there’s many times when he or I have been on travel and we haven’t called…so, it’s not a huge departure from normal to not call him…but he’s being mean and crabby…so I didn’t call. I didn’t want to hear it, I didn’t want to argue or to get yelled at so I just didn’t call him. I didn’t even respond to his text’s. This morning I responded and told him that I didn’t call because I figured he was mad at me and I didn’t want to get yelled at. I expect a retaliatory text back and am prepared for this…and he sends me something I wasn’t expecting at all…he sent a good message, something happy and light and positive…I wasn’t prepared for that and it actually brought tears to my eyes…I really wasn’t expecting that goodness. Isn’t that kinda sad? That I wasn’t expecting good but preparing for bad and got blindsided by good. Crazy. So the weird thing is…I think my H is either cheating again or about to cheat again. He doesn’t know that he set up the google page to not delete history on exit…so his history is there and he’s been messaging a girl I know (one of my cousins) quite a bit over the last week or so...and yes she's one who would jump at the chance to get with him…and this knowledge really doesn’t hurt me (like it did in the past)…I’m kinda just like ‘hm,ok’ and that’s it….it’s almost like I’ve been expecting this to happen (again).Now, that’s sad, right? I don’t know what the future holds…life is full of strange crazy twists and turns…both expected and unexpected...no question but thoughts areappreciated.
underwater2010 Posted July 10, 2013 Posted July 10, 2013 So you both are having affairs? Or both have had affairs?
Author Confusion_Reigns Posted July 10, 2013 Author Posted July 10, 2013 He's had at least two physical affairs that I know of...he had an emotional affair...and I'm fairly sure he's had on night stands in the past. I've never had a physical affair but...it seems...I am either in an emotional affair now or maybe it really is just a very good friendship that's forming.
underwater2010 Posted July 10, 2013 Posted July 10, 2013 Either way it sounds like you both need to step back from any other people and take a good look at what your marriage truly consists of. Either you both want to be married or you don't. An affair on either part will just destroy what is left. Tit-for-Tat is a child's game....not a mature married person's game. Please both sit down and have a conversation. Stay in the marriage or leave, but DO NOT engage in scummy behavior.
Author Confusion_Reigns Posted July 10, 2013 Author Posted July 10, 2013 Ok...well, I do have a back story that's posted in other threads, I didn't want to rehash but will do so (and you can take a look, too if you'd like to get a fuller understanding)... We've had a rocky relationship forever, there has been addiction issues and abuse...and lots of love and good times, too. We're at a point now where, I think, it's either do or die for us...it's time we either **** of get off the pot. I'm at this point now. We've talked, I guess, and I put it all out there for him. Told him exactly how I felt and that I was/am just about done. So, yes, we've talked....sort of....he basically says I'm at fault for all of our issues that that I need to change...he said that he will not go to marriage counseling or individual counseling...there's more if you want to read the back story... We've been down this road before....things tend to get better and then fall apart again...he's been great and slowly has faded into the mean spirited ******* he can be at times...I really don't know what to do anymore (the reason I want to go to counseling)....I am just at a loss as to how to proceed.
underwater2010 Posted July 10, 2013 Posted July 10, 2013 If he is not willing to own his issues also, then there is nothing to salvage. But having an affair makes you no better than him. What about an open marriage? Could that work for the two of you? I just don't see why being in an unhappy marriage and playing tit-for-tat makes life worth it. I would rather be free to have a true marriage than carry on with some else while still married.
Author Confusion_Reigns Posted July 10, 2013 Author Posted July 10, 2013 I'm not trying to better or worse than anyone else. I'm not trying to have an affair. Our marriage isn't completely unhappy/hateful...when it's good it's great...when it's bad it's awful....history and kids make pulling the trigger very hard...and I'm trying to figure out why I am the way I am, why my life is the way it is, why my husband is the way he is...I guess *hope* is what keeps me from walking away...well, that's what it feels like today anyway. He would *never* accept an open marriage...I don't believe in open marriages either...but him? OMG, I think he would literally kill me if I suggested such a thing...
underwater2010 Posted July 10, 2013 Posted July 10, 2013 I understand that....I have been cheated on with 3 kids and 14 yrs of marriage. But I have a husband that would go to the end of the world to salvage our marriage. I have also taken credit for my part leading up to all this. But we both have to work together to keep the marriage and family. It does not sound like he is willing to go that far for you. Why is that? What has he asked you to work on? Are you willing to own up to what he needs too? I need more information than he cheated and now I am cheating and he refuses MC. Marriage is not all about great and worse...it is about what is in between. The normal, routine and everyday life. It is sometimes the straight line of comfort and knowing that makes life easy.
Author Confusion_Reigns Posted July 10, 2013 Author Posted July 10, 2013 (edited) Well…have you read any of my other posts? I don’t know what else you’d want or need to know...first you gotta understand that I’m ago-with-the-flow type of person, I’m happy and can be happy in mostly any situation…I’m all about finding the silver linings…so even when it’s bad (what some would say is intolerable) it’s really not *that* bad…I mean, really ,things could always get worse. I’m also an in-the-moment type of person, livingin the ‘now’ and trying to not hold onto the past or become attached to the (possible) future. I’m also impatient, a bit moody (sometimes), I withdraw when very upset, and apparently don’t pay enough attention to details (according to my husband- what he means I really don’t know as he won’t elaborate…or wouldn’t at that time). So years ago my H cheated on me, I was pretty young at the time and honestly it didn’t really hurt…I mean yes it hurt but not like the second time he cheated. I was more angry and had a wounded ego. I accepted him back into my life as my boyfriend. At the time I figured he and I didn’t really have a future and we were just spending time together…wrong, we went on to have two children , move several times, and another 14 yrs went by and he cheated again. I tell you I was blindsided…I had no idea…I believed him when he said he’d never cheat again. This second time he told me himself, to my face, and all hell broke loose in our lives…he left the house, was in an open relationship with her, I filed for divorce…had reschedule several times because he kept missing the dates and the judge threw it out after the third time said I had to re-file…meanwhile, he’s gone but not really gone…oh, long story shorter…he decided he wanted to try again, I think it over…thinking of everything…and agree…and we’ve been good for a very long time. Stress in our lives, taking care of his granddaughter (shelived with us from abt 1 yr to abt 3 yrs of age)...I got promotion at work…I was in online college (and must finish by x date as part of the promotion or lose my job)…health issues (his/mine)…our own teenage kid issues…his daughters drama issues (granddaughters mom – who is better now, thankfully)…his emotional affair (which I told him exactly what was happening and he didn’t believe me until she made the move)….and just a lot of stuff…. And here we are today. I’m done with college, the granddaughters back with her mama…seems like everything should be good again…but it’s not and I don’t know why. Things just started getting like they were before he cheated last time…he even commented on this “I feel like I should just run away…I’m feeling like I did before we broke up…” My college degree is in Behavioral Sciences…I learned a lotfrom these courses…I’ve also been on the quest for happiness (studying someBuddha type of teachings), which has evolved into the quest for peace (becauseI’ve found my happiness within me), and I’m just really working towards being abetter person, a better me…I want him to do the work, too, for himself. I’veasked him, we’ve talked, and it’s always “I can’t” but I think it’s that he won’t. In a nut shell. Edited July 10, 2013 by Confusion_Reigns
TaraMaiden Posted July 10, 2013 Posted July 10, 2013 ..."Studying someBuddha type of teachings...." Try studying proper Buddhism instead of pseudo-intellectual bytes of supposed philosophy..... This whole matter will become a stunning revelation to you.
Author Confusion_Reigns Posted July 10, 2013 Author Posted July 10, 2013 (edited) His Holiness the Dalai Lama, Tara Brach and Thich Nhat Hanh are the three main ones I’ve been looking into,along with my own spiritual teachings (which are closely related to the Buddha type of teachings). All of this has helped me to…well, to open up my eyes to this reality that I’m living…and to see that it’s in my hands to seek the life I want. ADDING...interestingly enough I've been having a new thought creep into my mind...I think that living in the 'now' is an important step in finding a way to clear one's mind and to decrees their attachments to exterior...but I also think that one can get stuck living in the 'now' and let go of the past/future...but it also makes it easy for time to really slip away...years have gone by with me living in the 'now' and being happy with the present moment...and...well....now years have gone by and this 'now' is much like it's always been...not better/worse...much the same...but what we had years ago wasn't the best either... Arrrgggghhhhh......(sigh)....confusion.... Edited July 10, 2013 by Confusion_Reigns
underwater2010 Posted July 10, 2013 Posted July 10, 2013 I don't think that your marriage is salvageable. You both gave it a go a few times. It is not working sorry. Time for you to move on. Quick response sorry.
TaraMaiden Posted July 10, 2013 Posted July 10, 2013 ADDING...interestingly enough I've been having a new thought creep into my mind...I think that living in the 'now' is an important step in finding a way to clear one's mind and to decrees their attachments to exterior...but I also think that one can get stuck living in the 'now' and let go of the past/future...but it also makes it easy for time to really slip away...years have gone by with me living in the 'now' and being happy with the present moment...and...well....now years have gone by and this 'now' is much like it's always been...not better/worse...much the same...but what we had years ago wasn't the best either... Arrrgggghhhhh......(sigh)....confusion.... You misunderstand the concept of 'living in the Now'. The whole point of living in the 'Now' - and we come to realise that Life is a series of 'Now's' - is that every 'Now' is not an isolated instance, but a building block, a moment supported by every other moment. The whole point of Living in the Now, is to make this 'Now' a good one. And the only way to do that is to not repeat the pattern of previous instances when we could have been living - BEING - in a better way. This is an indication that contrary to your assertion that you have been Living in the Now, you've merely being existing, without making the right choices to transform Exiting, into Living, into Being.
Author Confusion_Reigns Posted July 11, 2013 Author Posted July 11, 2013 You misunderstand the concept of 'living in the Now'. The whole point of living in the 'Now' - and we come to realise that Life is a series of 'Now's' - is that every 'Now' is not an isolated instance, but a building block, a moment supported by every other moment. The whole point of Living in the Now, is to make this 'Now' a good one. And the only way to do that is to not repeat the pattern of previous instances when we could have been living - BEING - in a better way. This is an indication that contrary to your assertion that you have been Living in the Now, you've merely being existing, without making the right choices to transform Exiting, into Living, into Being. Thank you for this. I'm going to have to think on this for a while...Yes, I think you're probably right....now, what to do about it...
TaraMaiden Posted July 11, 2013 Posted July 11, 2013 Change what you do. It's that simple, truly. If you know that repeating a pattern is going to bring about the same result, change the pattern. Choose. But wisely.
Author Confusion_Reigns Posted July 11, 2013 Author Posted July 11, 2013 Do I know the patterns? I’m sure I do but for some reason at the moment I have no idea…Can I change my patterns…change what I do…? I bet I could, but at the moment I have no idea how…or what to do differently. My friend (OM) says that one just needs to live an honest life, speak the truth, and to understand that sometimes one must endure some discomfort in order to…well, to make things right in their life….he says I just need to put my foot down with my husband…speak my truth and see what happens. I think it’s the ‘discomfort’ part that I have a hard time with….Of course no one likes to be uncomfortable…I know I don’t like it when it’s me that’s causing the discomfort…yea, I’m finding out that I’m a ‘people pleaser’ and I never thought I was but I am…and I’m realizing that I think I have some co-dependency issues…and I don’t like when we try to talk and he doesn’t really say anything…I mean there’s a whole lot of words coming out of his mouth but when it’s all said and done I really don’t know what’s going on in his mind….I don’t like getting yelled at, I can take it (I have taken it) but why? When it produces nothing in the long run. So then I think why bother… …and crazy silly me is still on the fence of *wanting* to end this marriage and *wanting* to save this marriage…and sometimes I think that it’s really not my choice whether this marriage will continue or not....I don’t know if I want to ask him again to go to marriage counseling…I don’t know if I want to go thru all the effort to try to make this work for both of us…and end up with nothing changing…and at the same time I *feel* like I should, at the very least, try one more time…
TaraMaiden Posted July 11, 2013 Posted July 11, 2013 I think it’s the ‘discomfort’ part that I have a hard time with….Of course no one likes to be uncomfortable…I know I don’t like it when it’s me that’s causing the discomfort…yea, I’m finding out that I’m a ‘people pleaser’ and I never thought I was but I am…and I’m realizing that I think I have some co-dependency issues…and I don’t like when we try to talk and he doesn’t really say anything…I mean there’s a whole lot of words coming out of his mouth but when it’s all said and done I really don’t know what’s going on in his mind….I don’t like getting yelled at, I can take it (I have taken it) but why? When it produces nothing in the long run. So then I think why bother… …and crazy silly me is still on the fence of *wanting* to end this marriage and *wanting* to save this marriage…and sometimes I think that it’s really not my choice whether this marriage will continue or not....I don’t know if I want to ask him again to go to marriage counseling…I don’t know if I want to go thru all the effort to try to make this work for both of us…and end up with nothing changing…and at the same time I *feel* like I should, at the very least, try one more time… Being a people pleaser would indicate that you'd like to believe you're a person with Compassion. Which is good. However, it's important to differentiate between 'Idiot Compassion' and Wise Compassion'. Idiot Compassion has an agenda. It is there because in your mind, you wish to be seen as loving, accommodating, considerate, altruistic and to an extent, self-sacrificing. It's an image you seek to cultivate, in order to at least put yourself in some form of 'good light' in the eyes of others. You want to be thanked, appreciated or simply noticed for having 'made the gesture'. You wish to be seen as reliable, giving, and generous with your time and consideration. And it can keep you stuck in the quagmire of always 'putting out', but never 'getting back'. Yet, you persist, because you hope, that maybe at one small moment, this trend will change..... Wise Compassion Enables, without losing anything of yourself. It is not always gentle, kind, silent and partisan. It is impartial, non-judgemental and completely altruistic - but also discriminating and considerate, and evaluates the most favourable method of supporting both the giver and the receiver, without any visible detriment to either. Wise Compassion enables the giver to remain untainted by the choices of another, because Wise Compassion leads the way with the benefit of all in mind; but if not all choose to abide by its Principles, then they have nobody to blame for their collapse, but themselves. Wise Compassion considers the well-being, mental safety and emotional stability of the primary giver, first and foremost. Wise Compassion starts with ourselves. (Please note, when I use the term 'you' it is in a Generic sense, not specific. I don't mean you, I mean, "you".... )
Author Confusion_Reigns Posted July 11, 2013 Author Posted July 11, 2013 Thank you again, Tara, for sharing these thoughts with me. I do appreciate it. Wise vs. Idiot...well, I'd like to think I'm more wise than idiot...but realistically I think it's a good mixture of both...with one or the other being stronger at different points along the way. Make sense? ...I just got some very bad news and will be away from the board until at least Monday...my favorite uncle just passed...
TaraMaiden Posted July 11, 2013 Posted July 11, 2013 I'm so sorry, C_R.... Go where you're needed. Be well. Talk soon.
Author Confusion_Reigns Posted July 16, 2013 Author Posted July 16, 2013 Thank you Tara, I'm back with another update. We talked (argued) again the other night. Lot's was said...I'm being very honest as to how I feel and why I feel as I do...he's upset and (as usual) focusing on himself and how he feels what he wants etc. BUT he did agree to go to marriage counseling...which is good, I think....but won't really know until we go and experience it...I'm not going into the counseling sessions as a way for "them" to save us (the counselor) or to give us the answers but as a way for us to try to discover a way to get us from this point to the next point. I'm not sure where the next point is...maybe separation maybe not. He keeps asking me if I want him to move out. I don't want that. What I want is for us to find a way to make this marriage work for both of us. However, if he asks me again if I want him to move out I'm to tell him yes. As I don't want or like to keep running over the same ground. He talked about a separation, I told him if we do that we need a deadline for that as I don't like limbo. In one breath he says that he wants to work this out AND that this is impossible to work out. But at the very least we're moving forward and not spinning our wheels in the same spot.
TaraMaiden Posted July 16, 2013 Posted July 16, 2013 Hello, C_R, I hope everything is ok with your family. I'm sorry for the loss of your uncle; I hope everyone will be able to face this with fortitude.... I agree on the response you intend to give him, if he asks if you want him to move out... Time to change what you've always done so far.... I hope counselling brings you to a new and better level of communication. When is your first session?
Author Confusion_Reigns Posted July 16, 2013 Author Posted July 16, 2013 I don't know yet, I still need to investigate, select and set up an appointment. One worry I have, now after coming to LS, is that if he's an abuser (which I think he is but doesn't know it or accept it) that marriage counseling could make our situation worse...but I'm still going to move forward with this and see where it takes us. Thank you about my Uncle, yes, we're all good...sad but good.
Recommended Posts