Men taking control...

[joystickd]

I agree but the funny thing about is when you as a man seek out an R you never find one but when you want casual every woman you deal with wants to lock you down in an R.

I will say the tiimes I wanted an R I got the runaround with women. I know do casual and every woman I just want to sleep with has these profound deep feeling for me and they care about me so much. I'm like WTF where was this when I actually wanted an R. Then they wonder why guys want to be players lol

[MrCastle]

Most of the time men hold the cards before the relationship while women hold the cards while in the relationship.

 

I can get on board with that.

 

But I think these are very common scenarios:

 

-a woman dangling the promise of sex over a man she doesn't plan to sleep with in order to get him to do things for her

 

-a man continuously dodging and prolonging the "exclusive" talk in order to continue having unattached sex for as long as he can

 

In the first example, a woman is promising sex (her trump card)

 

In the second, a man is promising a relationship (his trump card)

 

Women control men through the penis, men control women through the heart.

[RedRobin]

That's interesting. In an Esquire article I read last month, it showed men want to settle down and start a family sooner than women now, since a lot of women now are focused on their careers much more than any other time in our history.

 

 

 

 

Totally agree.

 

 

 

I'm committed to my crafts. Acting, writing, photography. I'm committed to bettering my life so I can support myself, and more than that; do great things in this world. Women are not my be all, end all. If I happen to run into a girl that knocks me off my feet, I will make her mine. Until that time comes, I am focused on improving myself and growing as a person. Doesn't mean I fear commitment. Just means I fear committing to the wrong person.

 

 

Both genders are having problems adapting.

 

Here is a great video I saw re-mastered for a regional economic forum I attended... It's called "The Lost Generation" (the original is from Jonathan Reed)

 

Watch it forward, then backwards...

 

[SteveC80]

The problem is, too many men do not really understand what it means by 'taking control', etc. When women wistfully express a bit of retroactive nostalgia for the bygone times when men 'took the lead' it's not so much out of a desire to completely turn back the calendar and strip women of rights to equal pay or have a say in household finances.

 

It's really more of a longing for a time when men were more decisive and did not deffer to their partners to the point of passivity in even the most trivial aspects of life. Can you imagine a couple getting into a volatile argument over what to eat for dinner or what to do for entertainment every night sixty years ago? I'm sure it happened now and then but our popular conception of the world back then is one in which this was a rarity.

 

Maybe if women didnt overanayzle every godamn thing youd be better off,me asking you what you want for dinner doesnt make me a indecisive passive wimp it makes me an adult asking another adult what they want to eat.

 

I tell my kids what to eat what to do and where we go not another adult.

[joystickd]

Both genders are having problems adapting.

 

Here is a great video I saw re-mastered for a regional economic forum I attended... It's called "The Lost Generation" (the original is from Jonathan Reed)

 

Watch it forward, then backwards...

 

negativity. shame

[Woggle]

Maybe if women didnt overanayzle every godamn thing youd be better off,me asking you what you want for dinner doesnt make me a indecisive passive wimp it makes me an adult asking another adult what they want to eat.

 

I tell my kids what to eat what to do and where we go not another adult.

 

Exactly. Sometimes I just don't care where we eat. As long as I have something in stomach I am okay.

 

My ex used to make me make all the decisions because I was the man but when I made one she wasn't happy with she could blame it all on me. If I make all the decisions then she can never be wrong.

[SJC2008]

Men are told to shut up and not to ask for exclusivity because she'll be on the first train out of town once we do. My theory on this is that most people come from dysfunctional families and many people are emotionally unavailable. We have a subconscious drive to win over a member of the opposite sex and prove ourselves to them so when you ask to be exclusive, you validate her and the fire is out, she doesn't have to win you over anymore. It works both ways and I had/may still have the same problem. When I was in my mid 20's I met a girt at a bar and she really liked me! Big time! I rationalized rejecting her by thinking I wasn't attracted to her and made a bunch of other excuses. Looking back I know why I rejected her. She validated me, I didn't have to win her over; And I was afraid to get hurt. There was nothing wrong with her. She's a cute brounette with blue eyes!

[Woggle]

Men are told to shut up and not to ask for exclusivity because she'll be on the first train out of town once we do. My theory on this is that most people come from dysfunctional families and many people are emotionally unavailable. We have a subconscious drive to win over a member of the opposite sex and prove ourselves to them so when you ask to be exclusive, you validate her and the fire is out, she doesn't have to win you over anymore. It works both ways and I had/may still have the same problem. When I was in my mid 20's I met a girt at a bar and she really liked me! Big time! I rationalized rejecting her by thinking I wasn't attracted to her and made a bunch of other excuses. Looking back I know why I rejected her. She validated me, I didn't have to win her over; And I was afraid to get hurt. There was nothing wrong with her. She's a cute brounette with blue eyes!

 

Exactly. We have a generation of people from broken families who have no clue whatsoever to relate in healthy ways to the opposite sex. I include myself in this but at least I know it and try to improve myself even though it is a struggle. Many people on the other hand can never admit that circumstances screwed them. I admit I am a mess but I can admit it which is more than most people can say.

[SJC2008]

Exactly. Sometimes I just don't care where we eat. As long as I have something in stomach I am okay.

 

My ex used to make me make all the decisions because I was the man but when I made one she wasn't happy with she could blame it all on me. If I make all the decisions then she can never be wrong.

 

Ahh indecivieness, one of upteenth turnoffs to a woman lol.

 

Most of the time I know what I want to do, eat etc whatevs. I can make snap decisions if neccessary. A couple weeks ago I was taking my boat out with some of my frineds and we planned to go to x spot. Well it was too windy so I said we're going to go to x spot instead becase the area is more protectd from wind... TBS there are times where I don't care what to eat or what movie to see or what to do and and my hypothetical gf should be able to throw HER hat into the ring and come up with some ideas and not look down on me as some indecisive man.

[RedRobin]

You think that is what masculinity is equated to these days. Bitterness is a horrible thing. I hope you do realize every man is not after ONS. Why have so much negativity towards men if you can also say they are capable of more? Why with your attitude towards men would a man even show you he was capable of more?

 

I see you took the 'pimp' label off of your signature line... That is an improvement.

 

No, *I* don't think masculinity is equated to that. I HAVE good male role models.

 

Didn't know that choosing Ghandi and Martin Luther King as appropriate male role models was considered 'negative'.

 

No, I don't think men who hurt, abandon, or use women are appropriate role models. Clint Eastwood is an *sshole. Both in his movies and in real life.

[Woggle]

Ahh indecivieness, one of upteenth turnoffs to a woman lol.

 

Most of the time I know what I want to do, eat etc whatevs. I can make snap decisions if neccessary. A couple weeks ago I was taking my boat out with some of my frineds and we planned to go to x spot. Well it was too windy so I said we're going to go to x spot instead becase the area is more protectd from wind... TBS there are times where I don't care what to eat or what movie to see or what to do and and my hypothetical gf should be able to throw HER hat into the ring and come up with some ideas and not look down on me as some indecisive man.

 

Well it's a turnoff to me as well. It's funny how for so long women said they wanted equal partners now men are wrong for wanting to be equal partners.

[Woggle]

I see you took the 'pimp' label off of your signature line... That is an improvement.

 

No, *I* don't think masculinity is equated to that. I HAVE good male role models.

 

Didn't know that choosing Ghandi and Martin Luther King as appropriate male role models was considered 'negative'.

 

No, I don't think men who hurt, abandon, or use women are appropriate role models. Clint Eastwood is an *sshole. Both in his movies and in real life.

 

As great as MLK he was a cheater. He has his imperfections as well.

[RedRobin]

negativity. shame

 

Did you even watch it? It is hopeful... not negative or shaming...

 

You have to watch it backwards to get it...

[shexy]

I like being told what to do in the bedroom, but that's the only place.

[Drseussgrrl]

Well it's a turnoff to me as well. It's funny how for so long women said they wanted equal partners now men are wrong for wanting to be equal partners.

 

That's the disconnect though, Woggle. I don't want total "equality" in my relationship. I want my female energy to complement his masculine energy. They are different and beautiful in their own ways, none greater than the other.

 

In the workplace, it's completely different.

[Woggle]

That's the disconnect though, Woggle. I don't want total "equality" in my relationship. I want my female energy to complement his masculine energy. They are different and beautiful in their own ways, none greater than the other.

 

In the workplace, it's completely different.

 

You can have that and still be equals. Do you really think it is fair for a man to have to make all the decisions and then when he happens to make one not to her liking she treats him like the enemy?

[joystickd]

I see you took the 'pimp' label off of your signature line... That is an improvement.

 

No, *I* don't think masculinity is equated to that. I HAVE good male role models.

 

Didn't know that choosing Ghandi and Martin Luther King as appropriate male role models was considered 'negative'.

 

No, I don't think men who hurt, abandon, or use women are appropriate role models. Clint Eastwood is an *sshole. Both in his movies and in real life.

IF you actually had some good role models you wouldn't be bitter. When I took the pimp label it wasn't an improvement. Pimps are more in control than the average man. The pimp game I'm talking about the women enter it by choice not by force, but when you haven't been exposed to that life you will never understand it and think the depictions of "B**tch betta have my money are commonplace". Ghandi wouldn't be a good role model for me because he didn't really like Black people. If MLK really knew that he wouldn't have held him in such high regard.

[JustAReformedGirl]

Okay I'm gonna bite. I'm going to be as careful with my words as I can be.

 

Two things, in my opinion, are the reason for the indecisiveness of men.

 

Extreme feminism, and the media's attack on the heterosexual man.

 

Yes, exactly! Have you seen the newest Pro-Glide commercial? The one where the women like their men hairless? Wtf is that ****? I hate that commercial, and I'd never go out of my way to make a man feel like having body hair is wrong; b*itches be shallow.

 

 

 

Extreme Feminism: I don't think anyone would disagree that feminism

needed to happen. Civil rights are a big deal. We are all human beings. We

deserve equal rights. So as far as getting women the right to vote, and equal

pay in the work place, and other social changes like that -- yes. Kudos to the

brave women who fought tirelessly for those things, as it needed to happen. But,

with everything, extremists of any kind can spoil a good thing.

Fully agreed, Mr. Castle. I've actually had some of those femi-nazis call me a traitor, just because I didn't agree with their extremist bullsh*t.

 

So, there are two types of feminism. The open minded, fair women who just want

equal treatment to men, and the misandrists. The bitter ones who wanted men to

pay for their unfair treatment of women. You can't fight misogyny with misandry.

Two wrongs don't make a right.

 

Also agreed. Just like most other demographics with chips in their shoulders, they have this extreme sense of entitlement-against men who have never once oppressed any women, and for a crime that they never suffered at the hands of.

 

 

Suddenly now you have women saying "Hey don't pull my chair out for me! What do

you think, I'm not capable of doing it myself?! I'm a woman!"

 

Yup, plenty of those. If a guy opens the door or pulls out my chair, I have the good grace to say "thank you", rather than throwing a tantrum about it like an insolent brat. Likewise though, I like to open doors for guys, too.

 

You have men now, not sure when to be dominant and when to let her take the

lead. Especially since not every woman feels the same. Some women want to be

totally in charge, others want the old system of dating where the man was the

lead in everything, and then you have those that are in between.

 

I'm an in-between gal, myself. I like a healthy balance. But yes, it's understandable why men are so unsure how to act, or who they are, in fact.

 

Well, this confuses men as a whole, because they do not want to come across as

creepy, or perverted, or overbearing, or overly macho, etc.

 

And you can pretty much guarantee that some woman out there would accuse them of all of the above.

 

So now you have men like "Well, should I call her first? What if she is one of

those chicks who likes to initiate convo first? Should I wait for her? Do I ask

her if she wants to have sex or will I seem like a pervert? Will she tell me

outright when she wants it? What happens if I smack her butt in bed, will she be

offended? Is that misogynistic?

 

The media has really done a great job of making men question their every move. Of course, they've made everyone question every move they make, but that's a whole other thread.

 

 

 

The Media's Destruction Of The Modern Heterosexual Man: I actually did

a report on this for my Problems In Media class. Take a look at how most men are

represented in today's television and movies.

Say no more, Castle. I'm reading you loud and clear. I think I drive my husband crazy with my rants every time I pick up on one of those commercials. Contrary to popular belief, not every woman wants all men clean shaven. I likes me some facial hair.

 

-the virgin who doesn't know how to talk to women (big bang theory, among

others)

 

I love that show, but yes, that's a good example.

 

 

 

Where is the suave, dominant, confident, interesting man? Not the horny married

guy who has to beg his wife for sex, who can only get it by doing things like

doing dishes first, or maybe even hatching schemes to get her to sleep with him.

Or maybe he finds ways to avoid spending time with his children, but alas, his

scheme is always thwarted by his much smarter wife.

 

That's always irritated me, too. Why do they insist on portraying every woman as smarter than her spouse, and without sexual desire? I can think of many men that outsmart me (which wounds my ego beyond belief).

 

 

There was an article published by CNN titled "Why Are Men So Stupid?" -- it was

about the Tiger Woods and John Edwards of the world who have been caught in

public affairs. If I wrote an article titled "Why Are Women So Stupid?" -- I

would have to release a public apology and clean out my desk.

 

Apparently double standards that work in favour of women are the new "black". I've been noticing it everywhere. I despise double standards in general, but it really is getting ridiculous how men are being treated.

 

In today's media world -- ethnicities are off limits, women are off limits, the

disabled are off limits, religions are off limits, homosexuals and transgendered

are off limits -- but the straight man? Screw it! Make him an idiot, make him a

nerdy virgin, make him a slacker, make him a sex starved lunatic. It's all good.

 

I love to make fun of all those things; and clearly so does Seth MacFarlane. I love that man; he must get so much hate mail...

 

Of course, men cannot complain about it because then they look like a whiney

bitch. So they just have to sort of grin and laugh it off even though everywhere

you turn in the media is another slap in the face to the straight man.

I hear you on this. With one hand they give, and they expect men to be in touch with their emotions; as soon as they do that, out comes the other hand, belittling them for it, taking away any self-esteem they could have had.

 

Despite all of this -- the man is still largely expected to be the provider,

leader, and protector. He is supposed to still live up to his stereotype of

being stoic and macho.

 

Not in my world. I like the idea of being as equal as physically possible. I know we all have some physical limitations-but most of those we place upon ourselves, thanks to media brain-washing. I like the idea of working together as a cohesive unit.

 

How many men who wear their emotions on their sleeve get laid? None. Most of

them get friend zoned. I have had more than one woman tell me "He's cute but

he's such a pussy! He is TOO nice! That's why I can't date him!"

 

Those women tick me off to no end. But then again, how do you define "friend-zoning"? Literally as in these women are interested, but based on one or two things to do with the guy, never take it a step further? In that case, yes, that is pretty irritating. Some of the people who say they've been friend-zoned fail to realize it's not the case; that the woman just isn't attracted to them, period. After all, we can't control who we're not attracted to, anymore than we can control who we are attracted to.

 

But where in the media do we see James Dean, Clint Eastwood, other popular male,

macho figures that defined classic masculinity.

 

I love Clint. Oh my god, if he was still however old he was in "The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly", I'd do him in a heart beat.

 

You don't.

 

*Wistful sigh* If only!

 

You see the married guy who hides the cable bill from his wife because he ordered porn.

 

Lmao! Which is rather silly, because most wives/partners should already know, anyway, and shouldn't be angered by it.

 

I applaud this post, Castle. I saw no reason for you to not say this, but then again, there are some pretty butt-hurt people out there, so your hesitation is understandable. If I could like this post 100 times, I would.

[joystickd]

You can have that and still be equals. Do you really think it is fair for a man to have to make all the decisions and then when he happens to make one not to her liking she treats him like the enemy?

That's her problem not yours. If she wants a man's leadership then she has to accept every decision made.

[crude]

That's the disconnect though, Woggle. I don't want total "equality" in my relationship. I want my female energy to complement his masculine energy. They are different and beautiful in their own ways, none greater than the other.

 

In the workplace, it's completely different.

 

But there are so many men who don't like the stereotypes and become bitter and angry or opt out totally. Won't you for a second consider that men aren't that different from women and really want equality, not the stereotypes of hunter, sex maniac, provider, and dolt?

[RedRobin]

As great as MLK he was a cheater. He has his imperfections as well.

 

I didn't know that. Let's assume you are right... I can come up with more...

 

Jimmy Carter. He might not have been the best president, but he's done a great deal for the world. He hasn't cheated. In fact, a lot of the things he predicted ultimately came true. He tried to institute a renewable energy policy during the oil crisis that ended up getting shot down by the oil lobbies... He was ahead of his time if you ask me.

 

Lots of people consider him a 'wimp', but he was an officer in the Navy and did make it all the way to highest office. You don't get there by being a 'wimp', that is for sure.

 

He is a good example of strength + warmth in a man.

 

Nelson Mandela? He's in the news a lot recently. Another man of commitment.

[joystickd]

Did you even watch it? It is hopeful... not negative or shaming...

 

You have to watch it backwards to get it...

How about actually answering the questions I asked? I have noticed something with you. You seem to avoid certain questions that pertain to your bitterness and negativity towards men. I never mentioned Ghandi or MLK in my statement so answer this: Why have so much negativity towards men if you can also say they are capable of more? Why with your attitude towards men would a man even show you he was capable of more?

[Drseussgrrl]

You can have that and still be equals. Do you really think it is fair for a man to have to make all the decisions and then when he happens to make one not to her liking she treats him like the enemy?

 

I'm not really sure what you're talking about here, honestly.

 

If a man plans a fun date, and she doesn't like it, she treats him like crap?

 

Sorry- I've never seen this happen.

 

No, men don't need to "make all the decisions". Take some initiative and implement some thoughtfulness and creativity, yes. LOVE that.

 

Why does this amount to some sort of "control" and "making all the decisions"?

 

That's not what I have EVER conveyed at all.

[SJC2008]

You can have that and still be equals. Do you really think it is fair for a man to have to make all the decisions and then when he happens to make one not to her liking she treats him like the enemy?

 

I certainly don't. I like planning dates and want to meet a woman who wants to follow my lead but in a healthy way. I don't want to be some controlling dictator who calls all the shots nor do I want a scenario in your above quote. The way I see it is if I plan a date and she doesn't like it for whatever reason I'm 100% ok with it but then it's time for her to put her big girl panties on and make a suggestion. I'm not going to salvo options to her until I hit on somethings.

[joystickd]

But there are so many men who don't like the stereotypes and become bitter and angry or opt out totally. Won't you for a second consider that men aren't that different from women and really want equality, not the stereotypes of hunter, sex maniac, provider, and dolt?

I actually like the hunter and sex maniac roles. Hell I actually got more attention from women when I took them lol:lmao: