Author JuneJulySeptember Posted June 10, 2013 Author Posted June 10, 2013 Your problem, it seems, is one of perception. You are creating your own hell. Why is it so dissatisfying if someone is willing to overlook your physical flaws because they like you, the human, and come to find you attractive eventually? I mean, that has apparently happened several times already in your past (I have no idea what you look like; this is based on your own assessment). So what, really, is the problem here??? Yea, that's true. That's one of the points I made earlier. I'm trying to be OK now with women having no physical attraction to me. That was the point of this thread. It's a tricky line to straddle because on one hand you are trying to view yourself as physically attractive (I try despite what some posters think) and then when somebody likes you, they admit they have no physical attraction to you (but like the other things). You can see how that could be damaging, can't you? So, might as well stick to my guns, and say I don't care about looks in myself or a partner.
PJKino Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 Women love me as a harmless friend. Absolutely want to hang out with me. So, your assumption is wrong. I don't go around in real life saying how ugly I am and whining about how bad my life is. Believe it or not, women have told me how supportive I am when they are whining to me (about assorted problems). And what's with slandering me all of the time on here? And trashing me? You're actually one of the female posters I respect here. Yeah that sums me up..Ive been called a sweetheart great guy etc but that hasnt helped me romantically at all.. Women think with their groins just as much as men do..Contrary to popular belief that men value looks way more then women its just not accurate at all..Women value looks just as much and are prnoably even more picky then men when it comes to whats attractive to them physically.. People with limited options of both genders usually find each other...Some women here make it seem like only hot women are in relationships while average women are ignored and ugly men are all dating good looking women.. Most couples are evenly matched which would make it seem that both genders value looks pretty equally..
jma500 Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 Ive learned to watch what women do not what they say in terms of attraction..Im not one of these "women love bad boys" guys at all but ive seen that being a little brash cocky and borderline arrogant will create attraction more then beign the quiet selfless humble guy.. Women want to "feel" something and the brash cocky guy makes more women feel something then the other guy.. Ridiculous. Cockyness and arrogance are pathetic. I grew up with a father who had/still has these ludicrous affectations and it disgusts me.
serial muse Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 Yea, that's true. That's one of the points I made earlier. I'm trying to be OK now with women having no physical attraction to me. That was the point of this thread. It's a tricky line to straddle because on one hand you are trying to view yourself as physically attractive (I try despite what some posters think) and then when somebody likes you, they admit they have no physical attraction to you (but like the other things). You can see how that could be damaging, can't you? So, might as well stick to my guns, and say I don't care about looks in myself or a partner. Yes, but what I'm asking - and I am asking a question - is why you are stubbornly clinging to the perception that wanting to "overlook" looks is a bad thing. Because you DON'T seem to see it as a bad thing when you do it. So I really am asking you, and it'd be great if you thought about it and answered: Why? Why isn't it bad for you to do this? You said that in your OP, completely without irony. That is why I say this is about perception. Your perception that it's hurtful if others do it, but not if you do. Can you answer why there is that dichotomy in your mind? 3
Author JuneJulySeptember Posted June 10, 2013 Author Posted June 10, 2013 Yes, but what I'm asking - and I am asking a question - is why you are stubbornly clinging to the perception that wanting to "overlook" looks is a bad thing. Because you DON'T seem to see it as a bad thing when you do it. So I really am asking you, and it'd be great if you thought about it and answered: Why? Why isn't it bad for you to do this? You said that in your OP, completely without irony. That is why I say this is about perception. Your perception that it's hurtful if others do it, but not if you do. Can you answer why there is that dichotomy in your mind? Oh. That's an easy one. Because I would NEVER tell a woman that. If I started dating someone who was of that case, I wouldn't tell them. I'd lie if I had to.
serial muse Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 Oh. That's an easy one. Because I would NEVER tell a woman that. If I started dating someone who was of that case, I wouldn't tell them. I'd lie if I had to. Uh. So what you're saying is that you don't mind if people do it, you're just upset that they were tactless enough to say so? That is a very different issue than the one you've presented in this thread, wouldn't you say? And, in fact, in many of your threads, where you constantly rail against people for being shallow. Honestly, I'm not sure if you see yourself all that clearly here. 1
Author JuneJulySeptember Posted June 10, 2013 Author Posted June 10, 2013 Uh. So what you're saying is that you don't mind if people do it, you're just upset that they were tactless enough to say so? That is a very different issue than the one you've presented in this thread, wouldn't you say? And, in fact, in many of your threads, where you constantly rail against people for being shallow. Honestly, I'm not sure if you see yourself all that clearly here. Right. I admit that I was wrong to call others shallow. I implied that in my OP. No matter what I write, people just see my avatar and start whacking away. I'm OK with people being all about looks. It's just that, that method likely won't work for me. Bolded: Yes, I guess so. But I think I might be OK with a woman telling me she had no initial physical these days. But I still wouldn't tell her that. If she asked, I'd just say I thought she was cute and then she wouldn't ask again probably.
Xinreeki Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 (edited) What about trying to go for shyer, geekier, nerdy girls (like myself ) as I suggested? Why post a thread on a discussion forum asking for help, if you're not even going to try and follow any of the help given?? Seriously why? I'm drawing a total blank.. Edited June 13, 2013 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Treasa Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 (edited) I failed miserably at being confident, truly loving myself, and being happy and not getting all bent for 38 years. The difference is that I fall, and then I get back up. If how you're living is making you happy, then you keep on trucking. Edited June 13, 2013 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Author JuneJulySeptember Posted June 10, 2013 Author Posted June 10, 2013 What about trying to go for shyer, geekier, nerdy girls (like myself ) as I suggested? Why post a thread on a discussion forum asking for help, if you're not even going to try and follow any of the help given?? Seriously why? I'm drawing a total blank.. The question asked for where to meet women who care less about looks, not about how I can improve my looks. A few people actually responded to THAT question and not just to 'Some thread started by JJS that is all the same' and I did take those suggestions. Yoga, Weight Watchers, the Co-Op market, activities you like, etc.
PJKino Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 I failed miserably at being confident, truly loving myself, and being happy and not getting all bent for 38 years. The difference is that I fall, and then I get back up. If how you're living is making you happy, then you keep on trucking. I prefer to live like this then set myself up for failure thinking things will magically change.. Do i take rejection way too hard? yes but it is what it is..im much more happier when im not getting rejected and just talking to friends in social settings.. 1
ThaWholigan Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 I prefer to live like this then set myself up for failure thinking things will magically change.. Do i take rejection way too hard? yes but it is what it is..im much more happier when im not getting rejected and just talking to friends in social settings.. Then you have no right to complain. Apologies, but that's the truth. As for the actual topic - there is no particular place where women who "care less about looks" dwell. You just have to move in different social circles and expand your activities. 1
Xinreeki Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 Even if i dont everyone around me thinks i do and it hasnt helped me create attraction In all seriousness I do "love myself" im just a realist and at the age 33 never have been in a relationship well i would be a bit dellusional if i wasnt a negative or had doubts about that part of my life!!!! If you fail miserably at something for so long i dont why people cant comprehend why someone wold doubt their ability in that area.. By 33 i realize i suck at pool..when i say that nbody says oh my god you hate yourself youre so negative everyone can sense it thats why you suck at pool:laugh: yet if a man admits he sucks at attracting women and sometimes gets donw about it and doubts whter he ever can its dermed he is such an overly negative bitter person who hates himself and the reason he failts at it.. That's why the made for tv love yourself cliches are annoying.. But most women are attracted to confident men, so if you expect to fail you're not confident and thus won't be attractive to most women. A horribly tragic self-fulfilling prophecy.. Why predict you're always and forever going to fail at something, and give up completely, if you are so unhappy without it? Why give up trying to be happy, trying to do what you feel will make you happy just because of a run of bad luck / bad experiences? Why waste your life stuck in a negative cycle of bitterness? If you're happy on your own, fine. That's great! If you are happy with your lot, that's awesome! But why waste your life complaining that you can't possibly reach your goals and then not even put in any more effort to try and reach them?
ThaWholigan Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 But most women are attracted to confident men, so if you expect to fail you're not confident and thus won't be attractive to most women. A horribly tragic self-fulfilling prophecy.. Why predict you're always and forever going to fail at something, and give up completely, if you are so unhappy without it? Why give up trying to be happy, trying to do what you feel will make you happy just because of a run of bad luck / bad experiences? Why waste your life stuck in a negative cycle of bitterness? If you're happy on your own, fine. That's great! If you are happy with your lot, that's awesome! But why waste your life complaining that you can't possibly reach your goals and then not even put in any more effort to try and reach them? Somedude for all his problems actually tried to be confident. The little that he did has gone a long way. So no, it wasn't the girl who magically gave him the confidence - he was at least trying to cultivate it, despite his frustrations and complaints. His next challenge will be maintaining it. 1
KathyM Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 I haven't read the whole thread, but just to respond to the OP, I think volunteering for a good cause, or groups that connect people in ways other than appearance (such as religious groups or activity groups) would be more likely to enable people to connect over things that don't involve level of attractiveness. I know at least two couples IRL that connected because of their spiritual passion, and those couples both have one partner that is substantially more attractive than the other partner, but their passion for Christ is what brought them together. Level of physical attractiveness was not so important for them. Obviously, places like bars, singles groups, and the like, are going to be a meat market where physical appearance takes the priority, so avoiding those types of venues would probably be in your best interests. 2
jma500 Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 But most women are attracted to confident men, so if you expect to fail you're not confident and thus won't be attractive to most women. A horribly tragic self-fulfilling prophecy.. Why predict you're always and forever going to fail at something, and give up completely, if you are so unhappy without it? Why give up trying to be happy, trying to do what you feel will make you happy just because of a run of bad luck / bad experiences? Why waste your life stuck in a negative cycle of bitterness? If you're happy on your own, fine. That's great! If you are happy with your lot, that's awesome! But why waste your life complaining that you can't possibly reach your goals and then not even put in any more effort to try and reach them? While your first sentence is true the problem is that most people do not know what confidence is. Rock stars we are told are the epitome of the confident man. If so, why do they go backstage and drink/drug themselves into oblivion? Some even commit suicide. This is not confidence. This is why i believe so many people have poor perceptive abilities This is also why i believe confidence/body language cannot be read except in extreme cases. 1
PJKino Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 While your first sentence is true the problem is that most people do not know what confidence is. Rock stars we are told are the epitome of the confident man. If so, why do they go backstage and drink/drug themselves into oblivion? Some even commit suicide. This is not confidence. This is why i believe so many people have poor perceptive abilities This is also why i believe confidence/body language cannot be read except in extreme cases. Its social confidence/status thats all that means..and more importnat then anything else
Author JuneJulySeptember Posted June 10, 2013 Author Posted June 10, 2013 Women who value education, how much do you think getting a doctorate would help?
salparadise Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 Of course you fail too see it, that's why it's so offensive. The same way when someone said Asian men should seek out hipsters because they are 'open minded' and are into 'alternative lifestyles'. It's like as if some people should go to a special market to be considered or accepted. Offensive. I can make the following inferences: (1) Women who value genetics (hereinafter "looks") have not learned to use their brain. (2) Women who value looks are less mature and less introspective. (3) Those who are good looking and desire good looking children do not value a good relationship partner. (4) Those who are good looking do not have good intrinsic character traits and do not know how to relate or communicate. (5) Those who are good looking do not make the world a better place for others. hokie, those are your inferences, not mine. You are shuffling the elements and drawing conclusions that are neither stated nor implied. For example, if I said some women are tall, and some tall women are smart, you cannot logically reach the conclusion that I just offended short women by saying they're dumb. I'm calling bullshyt––flawed reasoning. I actually thought you were smarter than that. Emila, it seems that you simply dislike that I had the nerve to attribute any characteristics at all, even though they were not negative, to certain types of women. Or maybe you're letting your mind play logical fallacies too?
jma500 Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 Its social confidence/status thats all that means..and more importnat then anything else If its so important people should learn what it actually is instead of assuming they know.
Xinreeki Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 While your first sentence is true the problem is that most people do not know what confidence is. Rock stars we are told are the epitome of the confident man. If so, why do they go backstage and drink/drug themselves into oblivion? Some even commit suicide. This is not confidence. This is why i believe so many people have poor perceptive abilities This is also why i believe confidence/body language cannot be read except in extreme cases. If you're a good actor of course it will be difficult for someone else to judge whether you are truly confident, when people see you only intermittently, infrequently and are never truly intimate with you. But when you are developing a relationship with someone and spend a lot of time with them, sooner of later you'll let your guard down, or you'll let something slip (I know because I've been there and done that myself and my insecurity is of course HIGHLY unattractive to others ). Its MUCH better to try and work on your inner confidence, to work on building your inner self worth and self appreciation, then to merely "put on an act" all the time... and then (as you said).. go back stage.. to your insecure inner self... to your self hating, self harming, binge drinking, illegal drug taking, suicidal ways, as many famous rock stars do. 2
KathyM Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 Women who value education, how much do you think getting a doctorate would help? Getting to a high level of education (a doctorate degree) would certainly impress women, and women who value intelligence, education and success would be more inclined to overlook more superficial things if the man demonstrated high achievement in other areas. Women are attracted to a lot of different things (personality, intelligence, achievement, spirituality, hobbies/interests, as well as appearance). The more you have going for you, the more successful you will be with women.
jma500 Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 If you're a good actor of course it will be difficult for someone else to judge whether you are truly confident, when people see you only intermittently, infrequently and are never truly intimate with you. But when you are developing a relationship with someone and spend a lot of time with them, sooner of later you'll let your guard down, or you'll let something slip (I know because I've been there and done that myself and my insecurity is of course HIGHLY unattractive to others ). Its MUCH better to try and work on your inner confidence, to work on building your inner self worth and self appreciation, then to merely "put on an act" all the time... and then (as you said).. go back stage.. to your insecure inner self... to your self hating, self harming, binge drinking, illegal drug taking, suicidal ways, as many famous rock stars do. I agree. Its the posters who make it seem that they can read anyone at anytime that i disbelieve. I know i can't be read correctly irl.
ThaWholigan Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 I agree. Its the posters who make it seem that they can read anyone at anytime that i disbelieve. I know i can't be read correctly irl. A lot of people are easily read. You'd be surprised. 1
jma500 Posted June 10, 2013 Posted June 10, 2013 A lot of people are easily read. You'd be surprised. I probably would be surprised. Now read correctly is a different story.
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