Author SJC2008 Posted June 9, 2013 Author Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) Agreed. There are LOTS of actual nice guys who are confident and secure. Everything he's describing (and similar complaints I've seen hither and thither in "nice guy" threads) seem to do with insecure guys who have been (or feel like they are going to be) rejected. "nice guy", "emotional tampon" "putting women on pedestals", etc just sounds like all that regurgitated PUA stuff. On a side note: It's funny (not ha ha funny) that OP is worried about her not initiating in three dates where I read another thread by a woman who was so excited that her new date had initiated ALL the contact for their first three dates, as this shows he must really be into her. I think one of the best things I've learned from reading this (and another) forum for the last couple of years is men have a lot of the same needs, insecurities, feelings, etc. that women do. I know I've had a tendency to sit back and wait for initiation, thinking that's a true sign of interest, not realizing that men could be thinking/feeling the same thing. I don't see how telling a woman that I didn't want to be a rebound and where I draw the line when it comes to multi dating is nice guy behavior. I'm pretty sure she knew where I was comming from and was afraid I was about to jump ship becuase she initiated the next date. What would of been an example of non nice guy behavior? I don't mean bad boy behavior either. Given what UMC said about it being early on in the initiating contact example I do agree that it came accross as nice a nice guy behavior now that I look at it. TBS at the time I didn't see it that way because of the way I brought it up to her. BTW I do think it's the mans job to pursue and initiate most of the contact but 3 dates in without one single text initiated by her told me she wasn't interested or was playing hard to get. Edited June 9, 2013 by SJC2008
Frogwife Posted June 9, 2013 Posted June 9, 2013 I don't see how telling a woman that I didn't want to be a rebound and where I draw the line when it comes to multi dating is nice guy behavior. I'm pretty sure she knew where I was comming from and was afraid I was about to jump ship becuase she initiated the next date. What would of been an example of non nice guy behavior? I don't mean bad boy behavior either. Given what UMC said about it being early on in the initiating contact example I do agree that it came accross as nice a nice guy behavior now that I look at it. TBS at the time I didn't see it that way because of the way I brought it up to her. BTW I do think it's the mans job to pursue and initiate most of the contact but 3 dates in without one single text initiated by her told me she wasn't interested or was playing hard to get. I'm not sure why you're determined to label this (and yourself) as "not nice guy" behavior - telling someone what you want (and what you don't want) it's not a question of being "nice" or "not nice" - it's just being honest and firm in your convictions. "Nice guy" is a term that is completely misused. As I said - from what I have gleaned from these forums - there is a tendency to use the term "we are nice guys" to soften the blow of their lack of success in relationships, when in fact the behavior they are exhibiting (and which is inhibiting success in relationships) is insecurity. 4
Bengal Tiger Posted June 9, 2013 Posted June 9, 2013 You can be nice without being a fake "nice guy". You won't get punished for initiating sex. Women seem to like it actually. I've never had a negative outcome from trying to initiate sex. The worst that has happened, was "let's wait til next time". I've never been slapped. I have mostly had negative outcomes from initiating a relationship. Telling a girl I'm dating that I love her or I want her to be my girlfriend usually gets me dumped on the spot while she spews some feminist propaganda about men want ownership of women or something like that. It's best to let her initiate the relationship part. Women like to hop into bed with me but not so interested in having a relationship for some reason. Just some food for thought.
Estate Posted June 12, 2013 Posted June 12, 2013 I do have some "nice guy" tendencies I'm still working on but looking back I realize that I'm not as much of a nice guy as I thought I was. On the 3rd date with the last woman I dated I asked her what she looked for in a relationship (In general I wasn't asking her to be in an R) and she said she wanted to date around and didn't know what she wanted and I respected her honesty. TBS as soon as she told me that I told her that I wasn't there for an ego boost (she was not too long removed from a long R) and that I was ok with dating around but sex is where I draw the line with multi dating. IMO a nice guy wouldn't have said that. We had a couple more dates than it turend into a dram fest so we stopped dating. Also, another woman I dated about a year ago had me walking on eggshells becuase she never initated contact and she ingored a text and call so a couple days later called out on it and told her I've never dated a woman where three dates in she's yet to initiate contact. About a week later we sheduled another date but there was miscommunication between us so it never happened. So like I said I'm still working on some things but I'm not as much of a nice guy that I thought I was. I also learned something else about me which will help me huge! Questions, comments, related experiences welcome. I think you just acted like a dick and tried to play games... oh you wouldn't sleep with her? Reverse psychology maybe? For the millionth time... not being overly nice doesn't mean you have to act like a dick....
Titania22 Posted June 12, 2013 Posted June 12, 2013 (edited) I don't see how your examples are things a nice guy wouldn't do. To me they seem like things any well adjusted adult would do. They didn't seem rude or mean at all. Ok I read further, you meant 'door mat' not 'nice guy'. I wish men stopped equating those 2 phrases, they are NOT equivalent. (Being nice doesn't mean being weak.) Lol no not becasue I want sex. I'll try to clarify... I had a thread recently where I said I was tired of looking at myself. It's good to look at yourself and see what you need to work on but sooner or later it will make you subconscious about everything which was happening to me. Anyway, looking back, while I do have some nice guy tendencies that need improving, I realize I'm not as much of a nice guy as I thought. My examples were that I don't think a "nice guy" would of told the woman in the first example (this was in person on the date) that he wasn't there for an ego boost and layed down boundaries regarding multi-dating. The second example was basically that I told her we weren't on the same page with the way the courship was going (in other words) given we were three dates in and she had yet to initiate contact. Great response btw! Edited June 12, 2013 by Titania22 ammendment
Author SJC2008 Posted June 12, 2013 Author Posted June 12, 2013 I think you just acted like a dick and tried to play games... oh you wouldn't sleep with her? Reverse psychology maybe? For the millionth time... not being overly nice doesn't mean you have to act like a dick.... We had sex... Regardless of what I was/wasn't I should of walked away after the 3rd date when I found out we had different goals. In the end I think it was a blessing in disguise as we wouldn't of been compatible anyway even if she did want an R. I learned a lot from the exp in how to spot someone who's rebounding and how to spot certain types of women.
Author SJC2008 Posted June 12, 2013 Author Posted June 12, 2013 I don't see how your examples are things a nice guy wouldn't do. To me they seem like things any well adjusted adult would do. They didn't seem rude or mean at all. Ok I read further, you meant 'door mat' not 'nice guy'. I wish men stopped equating those 2 phrases, they are NOT equivalent. (Being nice doesn't mean being weak.) I appreciate that. I definately don't want to change my good nature or my personality but I do need to be more assertive with women becuase I seem to only attract controlling women and that's not what I want. I don't need to controll a relationship but I surely don't want to be controlled, I want balance and it seems like balance is very hard to find.
Titania22 Posted June 12, 2013 Posted June 12, 2013 I appreciate that. I definately don't want to change my good nature or my personality but I do need to be more assertive with women becuase I seem to only attract controlling women and that's not what I want. I don't need to controll a relationship but I surely don't want to be controlled, I want balance and it seems like balance is very hard to find. That's a noble and worthy goal, and yes, difficult to find. I personally never found it in romance, but at least since I have grown more balanced, I have more balanced relationships and friendships. I would say it's well worth the effort, I happier now than ever before (with or without sex).
Mumbles Posted June 12, 2013 Posted June 12, 2013 BTW I do think it's the mans job to pursue and initiate most of the contact but 3 dates in without one single text initiated by her told me she wasn't interested or was playing hard to get. This might be no more than just her personality. I admit I find it a bit strange as girls I get to know usually text me more than I can handle - I've been told off (if you like) a few times by ladies for not answering ... quickly enough .. or not initiating the whole texting thing. On the other hand, you've been on three dates and no sex with this girl ... perhaps she thinks you're not that interested? Everyones speed is different, of course, but sex is most definitely a bonding activity, once I've had sex with a girl things ramp up in a relationship considerably. I'm older than you and the whole texting culture is something I've had to learn. Now I have it seems to be more of a case of "I'm thinking of you" than anything else. Given this, yes, I agree with you, she may not be all that interested.
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