I told the BS... and this is the result.

[whichwayisup]

This is a mess. So basically he's telling his wife, affair is still going to go on and she has to accept that if she wants to stay married to him (aka open marriage) -- Though I DO wonder how HE would react if she chooses to have an OM on the side -- Hey, if he has you still, why can't she go ahead and find someone on the side as well!

 

Anyway, I hope she divorces him because this man is selfish. He isn't "loyal" or staying with her out of obligation/duty and having you because he loves you more than her -- He loves HIMSELF first and also for almost 5 years he's had two women meeting all his needs and he has no intention of giving either of you up.

 

You have a decision to make. If you want to continue on as the OW, have him part time and share him with his wife, then you and her HAVE to get together and talk, come up with something that works for both of you (that is IF she is considering staying married to him..IF I was here, I'd be packing his bags and talking to a lawyer for a divorce). Most people who are told "i'm only staying with you out of obligation and duty, I don't love you, I love my OW.." would say OK, F-U, divorce time!

 

Something feels off though, either he has exaggerated something or lied.

 

When you told her the truth, how did she react?

[WakingUp]

WWIU - yes its a big mess Ive got myself into.

 

She was angry.

 

And you are right something is off. Something big is not being acknowledged here. And I cant quite work out what it is. That's why Im here.

 

He wants BW and I to meet up. He says he has nothing to hide anymore.

 

From what he tells me, she is afraid that we have some scheme going on which will ultimately bring us together. Truth is, there is no plan.

 

I am one day at a time with this.

[WakingUp]

I thought the same when i was in a destructive relationship. Once your out and youve healed and look back.....that "more to it" isnt what sticks out. You kick yourself for the time and effort you wasted. You are settling for this. Its a world of hurt and its not worth it....and he is making his loyalties painfully obvious, and they dont lie with you OR her. Is this the qualities you want in a life partner? Because this is who he is. This is how he manages his life. Is this what you want your life to be like? Even if he "choses" you....you are getting a manchild who is more comfortable hurting those who love him, those he makes promises to, than standing up and doing right. He is always, in every aspect of his life, take the road he feels is easiest FOR.HIM. Its HIS best interest at the top of his priority list. You can get out of this, heal, and find someone who can and will give you what you put in. WHY take so much less?

 

Beany this is true. I have to say that I am very disturbed at how cruel this is to his W. (And me). He does take the easy road.

 

Ouch.

[whichwayisup]

Beany this is true. I have to say that I am very disturbed at how cruel this is to his W. (And me). He does take the easy road.

 

Ouch.

 

Just shows who he is! How he's handled this, how he's hurt her deeply with such disrespect. Cruel. Very cruel.

 

So, in the meantime you need to decide what it is YOU want. Keep in mind, the way he's treated her, the woman he said vows to 30 years ago, had children with, built a life with -- who says he's going to respect you and treat you any better?

 

DO talk to his wife, one on one without him there. Be honest with her about how you feel about him. Listen to what she has to say, respect her if she asks you to back off and give them a chance to work on their marriage.

 

Either he is bluffing, or he's truly f'ed up.

[Mount]

Oh...no, now he is so openly disrepecting you all. And he has the attitude - so what, what you gonna do now?

 

So OP, what you gonna do? Even the starting point of your relationship with MM was not normal/right, and he even does not try to make right in time....that is very wrong here.

 

WWIU - yes its a big mess Ive got myself into.

 

She was angry.

 

And you are right something is off. Something big is not being acknowledged here. And I cant quite work out what it is. That's why Im here.

 

He wants BW and I to meet up. He says he has nothing to hide anymore.

 

From what he tells me, she is afraid that we have some scheme going on which will ultimately bring us together. Truth is, there is no plan.

 

I am one day at a time with this.

[Spark1111]

WWIU - yes its a big mess Ive got myself into.

 

She was angry.

 

And you are right something is off. Something big is not being acknowledged here. And I cant quite work out what it is. That's why Im here.

 

He wants BW and I to meet up. He says he has nothing to hide anymore.

 

From what he tells me, she is afraid that we have some scheme going on which will ultimately bring us together. Truth is, there is no plan.

 

I am one day at a time with this.

 

SO MEET HER! Call his bluff! Do it!

 

TELL HER THERE IS NO PLAN EXCEPT you love him and wAnt an exclusive relationship with him.

 

ASK HER what she wants, what does she hope for.

 

WHY not???????????

[whichwayisup]

Doubt this will happen because his wife has 30 years of marriage and 30+ years of history with this schmuck, so chances of her telling him to go shove it up his ass and file for divorce is slim to none. She may not want to start over, be alone. Right or wrong, like it or not, it's her life/her decision -- But I HOPE she dumps him and I also hope you dump him as well Waking!

 

Wouldn't it be ironic if he ended up alone?

[2sunny]

One thing is for sure - you won't heal and find an available man to share your heart with if YOU don't end it - grieve it - and make some new room in your heart for an available guy. You're handing him all your power by staying.

 

Your heart is filled with him. It's like spring cleaning - you must get rid of the stuff taking up the space - allow the space to be review after getting rid of the crap - then be ready to find what's useful/valuable again for the empty space...

 

I hope you take the action.

 

No one else is going to look out for YOUR best interest - that's up to YOU to do that FOR yourself!

[Spark1111]

Spark - your logic totally makes sense, but it has to go with OP' s heart as well.

 

For example during the affair, I did date a few single gentlemen, the latest one was about around 3 months ago and we dated for 2 months while I was still heavily involved with MM. The guy was very interested in me and expressed every time that want to be exclusively with me, finally I rejected him via text, the reason is so obvious.

 

So the OP has to make mind, to cut MM off completely if she makes mind, then date single guys.

 

ONLY YOU can figure out why you did this. ONLY YOU can figure out why you ditched available and interested for unavailable.

 

AT some point, ONLY you can decide why crumbs from someone committed is worth more than someone else.

 

Get going on this.....

[spiderowl]

Wow! Well, he was fully in control until you told the BS. Now his cover's been blown, he's still in control. I mean is this guy actually a nice guy? I can't imagine for a minute that he would be. He betrayed his wife, messed you around, didn't meet your deadlines and when you blew the ship out of the water by telling his wife, he still stuck at it and decided he was going to have both!

 

Look at how he is treating you and his wife. His feelings come first all the time.

 

It seems that rather than leaving the situation when you could have done, when it wasn't working for you, you tried a desperate thing. It seems somewhere along the line he knew he was in control of both of you. Why would you allow him to continue to do this? Surely you deserve respect and consideration from a guy who does not treat his women like puppets he can play with?

[Mount]

Ok...I guess from OP's describing here, this MM's attitude is upsetting everyone here....:confused:

 

He should end up alone. He is cruel and selfish. Waking, you said you found his cruelity disturbing. Go with that. He has shown you some of what he is capable of and dont make the mistake of thinking you are an exception. You arent now and you wont ever be. He isnt making any moves to give you what you need and want.....he expects you to kiss your dreams and expectations good bye and remain his beck and call girl. Thats NOT love, by any stretch. Omg this guy is an incredible douche. It pissed me off this ******* has two women wondering if they should keep fighting for him....uuhhgg.....leave him in the dust where he belongs.

[whichwayisup]

Waking, what is it that you love about him? As a person, what does for others, his heart etc.. Is he a giving, kindhearted man? (so far in my mind it's no to the latter)

 

You say you love him, but why? Or is it the affair dynamic, how he makes you feel, the addictive feelings that are felt during the A, the roller coaster ride of emotions, not knowing what is going to happen etc..etc.. ?

 

You don't have to do a list here, can do it in your head or on a piece of paper but write down 10 things that you love about him.

[krazikat]

I'm embarrassed to say that after d-day my husband tried something like your MM. He thought he would just transition the three of us into some sort of sister wives situation. Married to me but free to date her. (oh but I was supposed to only be with him.. yeah RIGHT. If it's open it better be open on both sides mother-jumper!!)

 

She wasn't having it and once I woke up from my shock I wasn't having it.

I lost my ever loving shyte on him and he had to make a choice.

 

One of you needs to go bat shyte crazy on him and make him end this madness or walk away.

 

Yeesh, the nerve of these mm. There is no way in he!! I think if my husband had tried that I would have been done with him instantly. Ugh.

[whichwayisup]

Ugghhh. Why are they so disgusting.

 

It amazes me, what we are willing to tolerate. I mean really do you want a man that cheats and lies to begin with? You train yourself to believe it is only for you, because you are special, because your relationship is special, if you had met before he was married he would have been with you, that you are soul mates..you make excuses up in your mind to cover the fact that in reality, you are with a low life scum sucker.

 

He is callous. He is narcissistic to the maximum. He doesn't truly love either of you, he only loves himself. The both of you are simply his possessions. You are there to massage and stroke his ego, to make him feel wanted and worth while and like king of the world.

 

He will give you nothing. He doesn't want to be in a mono relationship and he doesn't truly care if it hurts you or his wife. Now he has laid his cards down. He wants his comfy home life and doesn't want that to change, so he wants to stay with the wife..and god forbid if she had her own affair no doubt. He wants you on the side as his amusement. His pretend life away from the monotony of his home life, where the majority is all play..but it's fantasy. And god forbid you dated other either. You should devote yourself to simply being the side dish.

 

Would you actually want to be the wife of this man? Really truly? He is telling you both that neither of you truly matter and should accept what he wants, and that's as many women as he wants. What happens when he meets another? Right now his wife is being forced to accept less time, lonely nights, if he met someone else once he was bored of you would you accept less again?

 

Can you actually look at him, knowing the deceit he is capable of for 4 entire years to his wife's face, and now basically telling her to deal with it..and at the same time telling you you aren't good enough to be his only..he is telling you both he deserves whatever he wants. Can you actually look at him, and respect him? Can you look at him and see a good person inside? Can you actually feel good about yourself with him?

 

Two thumbs up for this post reply!

[Summer Breeze]

WU. My situation was pretty similar to yours. The things that were different were -- he never promised me a future, we had multiple ddays, he never threw me under the bus.

 

I went into the A knowing he wasn't leaving. There was an ill child, history, obligation, and he still loved his W. I made the choice and we had an A. There were multiple ddays and she and I spoke at all of them. On the third one she told me she wasn't leaving or letting him go. He did very little to hide anything so that's why there were so many ddays.

 

I made the decision to leave the R. I loved him with all my heart and I left when things were great between us. We'd just been away on a short trip and it was amazing. I was so happy with him and all of a sudden it wasn't enough. I saw him and asked him if he'd leave, he said he couldn't, I said he wouldn't rather than couldn't, and I ended it. I still see him sitting there in shock. He was as happy as I had been and felt how great things were. Me ending it didn't even make a ding on his radar.

 

I started losing myself in the R and I made a decision. I was starting to give him my power and it wasn't good. It's He!! walking away like that but it was the right thing for me to do. I didn't want to become a shell of the woman I was. I couldn't allow it to happen and it was the only way out.

 

You're saying you feel some obligation to him now. You owe him nothing. Let me repeat -- YOU OWE HIM NOTHING. He sacrificed nothing. He didn't even tell his W, you did. If he wants to play Lifetime Movie let him find another chick to play your part. You are losing yourself and you have wasted enough time. Leaving is not something you would be doing TO him, rather it would be doing something FOR you. Don't let a false sense of obligation hold you there.

 

If you want to play the game and see an honest reaction do this. Draw up things to discuss with him. You expect he will be available for your family functions and he will attend at your side. You want his home number and expect you can call it whenever you need to. You want to have arrangements for your participation in his retirement package and either him to put your name on the deeds to his house or to start paying for yours and half the expenses. Start demanding your cut of his future and see what he does. I would suggest walking away without doing this but rattle him. Let him know what you're giving up by not having him in your life full time. Let him know what he's missing by not being with you and let him know that you're dating again and that is not part of your life just like his W is part of his and not yours. Like I said it's best to walk away but if he starts to get under your skin use these things to negotiate and see his reaction to that.

 

For you, I hope you're able to walk away. If you need to talk and prefer PM you're welcome to message me.

[Mount]

Exactly...too many women or OWs are giving..keep giving with no purpose no outcome...

 

Until one day the woman here should request MM - I need you be mine solely, I need your time with me all the time...I need you invest time or money in our relationship..... See what the MM reacts, if he truly love you he will take action and stick with it. Otherwise they balk.

 

 

WU. My situation was pretty similar to yours. The things that were different were -- he never promised me a future, we had multiple ddays, he never threw me under the bus.

 

I went into the A knowing he wasn't leaving. There was an ill child, history, obligation, and he still loved his W. I made the choice and we had an A. There were multiple ddays and she and I spoke at all of them. On the third one she told me she wasn't leaving or letting him go. He did very little to hide anything so that's why there were so many ddays.

 

I made the decision to leave the R. I loved him with all my heart and I left when things were great between us. We'd just been away on a short trip and it was amazing. I was so happy with him and all of a sudden it wasn't enough. I saw him and asked him if he'd leave, he said he couldn't, I said he wouldn't rather than couldn't, and I ended it. I still see him sitting there in shock. He was as happy as I had been and felt how great things were. Me ending it didn't even make a ding on his radar.

 

I started losing myself in the R and I made a decision. I was starting to give him my power and it wasn't good. It's He!! walking away like that but it was the right thing for me to do. I didn't want to become a shell of the woman I was. I couldn't allow it to happen and it was the only way out.

 

You're saying you feel some obligation to him now. You owe him nothing. Let me repeat -- YOU OWE HIM NOTHING. He sacrificed nothing. He didn't even tell his W, you did. If he wants to play Lifetime Movie let him find another chick to play your part. You are losing yourself and you have wasted enough time. Leaving is not something you would be doing TO him, rather it would be doing something FOR you. Don't let a false sense of obligation hold you there.

 

If you want to play the game and see an honest reaction do this. Draw up things to discuss with him. You expect he will be available for your family functions and he will attend at your side. You want his home number and expect you can call it whenever you need to. You want to have arrangements for your participation in his retirement package and either him to put your name on the deeds to his house or to start paying for yours and half the expenses. Start demanding your cut of his future and see what he does. I would suggest walking away without doing this but rattle him. Let him know what you're giving up by not having him in your life full time. Let him know what he's missing by not being with you and let him know that you're dating again and that is not part of your life just like his W is part of his and not yours. Like I said it's best to walk away but if he starts to get under your skin use these things to negotiate and see his reaction to that.

 

For you, I hope you're able to walk away. If you need to talk and prefer PM you're welcome to message me.

[WakingUp]

Thank you to everyone who has taken the time to read and post. I really do need to hear this stuff, and process it. I plan to read this thread over and over.

 

I had to go out for a few hours and now I have to go and cook dinner, etc. etc., you know how it goes. So I haven't left, just had to do things. And its the middle of the night over there...

 

I really do appreciate hearing your thoughts on this. I have felt so alone with no one to talk to about it. And it is a big mess. However just in the few hours today I have really gathered some strength and insight that I didn't have before.

 

Thank you!

[KathyM]

Well, first off, good for you for telling the wife and getting this out in the open where everyone can deal with the reality of the situation. It's also good that you realize that sharing this guy is not a good deal for you. I don't know why any woman would want that. But I have to ask, why are you so weak when it comes to getting rid of this guy from your life? You've wasted 4 years on him. That was a huge gamble that you took in keeping him around and hoping he'll leave his wife. A gamble that very rarely pans out for the OW. Now that this guy is finally forced to choose, he has finally had to level with you and be honest with you, that he has no intention of leaving his wife, and he intends to keep both of you. Don't waste more of your life on this loser. He's not worth it. He's a cheater who doesn't believe in monogamy, and doesn't want to limit himself to one woman. He has shown you, through his actions, and now told you through his words, that he is not leaving his wife. It's time to take your life back and leave this dead end relationship. You've wasted four years on this guy. Don't waste any more of your time on him. He is not worth it.

[WakingUp]

I feel like crawling under the nearest rock.

 

And staying there.

[egalew]

These men want to have their cake and eat it too, and a lot of times women, out of their need and longing, allow the ride.

 

Ideal situation would be if both of you dumped his ass and he'd be alone.

 

Not gonna happen, but be nice.

[findingnemo]

I've read this thread in amazement. I do think he is being extremely selfish but let me give you another perspective.

 

Coming from a country where some men have two wives, I can assure you that it is a very complicated arrangement. One which requires a lot of discussion and agreement before it works. The women that I know in such arrangements initially wanted to have the man exclusively but agreed based on certain factors. In most cases, the first wife and MM have little to no sex but still love each other. The first wife wants to maintain the marriage and all that comes along with it. It isn't a selfish position to take but rather a practical one.

 

The second W is recognized by everybody. There is no hiding, no A (usually starts as an A until D-day No. 20 or so). What does she gain? The MM pays for things and contributes to the second home just like a H would do. Legally their union will result in inheritance, etc. The MM/H attends as many family functions of the second W as possible. Kids are born and carry his last name. Sometimes both Ws get along. Other times, they simply ignore each other. Tradition ensures that the children from both women are recognized and treated equally. They interact together and are brought up knowing that they are from a two-woman home.

 

I'm amazed that a man in the West would try to pull something like two Ws off. It seems to me that your MM doesn't really know what that entails. If it is going to work, both you and his W have to be happy. This means you both get what you want. The only people in this triangle who can determine the way forward is you and his W. Meet her. Talk to her. Understand things from her point of view. It may help you resolve to leave him. It may work out that you can both live with this arrangement on certain conditions.

 

Don't let this man determine the A-Z of your lives. Get together with the W and talk things out. The two of you need to deal with this otherwise MM will keep getting what he wants while giving next to nothing in return.

[Goodbye]

I know it is so hard, especially after investing 4 years. But you can see that he is a selfish man. Please respect yourself and detox yourself from him. I know my situation would have played out in a similar fashion. I walked and it is hard, but staying and not feeling good enough to be number 1 was harder.

[ComingInHot]

Waking Up, You wrote that You Hate what this is doing to MM (you & his W)...

 

WHY?!?! What is "THIS" doing to MM?!!? That is So bad?

He's swappng juices w/two women openly w/ZERO consequences!

 

I can read you are "frustrated" w/the new scenario/reality, but I actually don't read where you hate what "this" is doing to His Wife. If you REALLY "hated" it, You wouldn't be having it.

 

As for You hating what "this" is doing to You (and preventing you from doing) You would Not be having it either.

 

So you haven't Spoken w/His Wife yet?

Why not?

Do you think it may be time to make that call?

 

Waking, look in the mirror. The person staring back you Is better than what she is considering settling for*

[Summer Breeze]

How you doing WU? Did you take your laptop under the rock with you?

[Calcmag]

So MM really does now get to have his cake and eat it too.

Two women fawning over him, two women vying for his attention.

Wants them to meet too! How sweet. Or perhaps he's thinking 'threesome'...

BS knows about the affair, so no need for all that secrecy which can be so exhausting .

What a perfect set up this is for him.

 

OP, please, please don't put up with this.