Debate with my husband

[Roweena]

Actually what your OP says is different than what you are saying now.

You are saying that he claims a woman's #1 asset is her looks followed by her femininity.

 

Asset: Anything tangible or intangible that is capable of being owned or controlled to produce value and that is held to have positive value is considered an asset. Simply stated, assets represent value of ownership that can be

converted into cash (although cash itself is also considered an asset)

 

In other words: part of her worth. And in directly in context: her looks followed by her femininity are the largest factors in calculating her perceived worth.

And in your case, you would be reducing your assets (in his perception) by making alterations to your appearance without checking with him. Hence, his attraction for you would dull.

 

I saw the original post the day it came up and thought, oh man this will probably be a hoarde of bashers on here in ten seconds flat. So I didn't bother at the time.

Thought I'd pop in and see if it was a bashing thread by now and saw your post, OP. Knocking the stuffing out of AT's post.....supposedly.

 

Then when I reread what you wrote... Well, goodness, that's what you wrote!

 

And after that last sentence I just read your whole thread where everyone thought you should do what you want with your hair and that keeping your partner's opinion in mind was a good thing.

 

However, his emphasis on looks among his other myriad opinions of women and their capabilities and value to him: sucks.

 

And here you are being very very rude to the people who thoughtfully posted in on your thread about their opinions and concerns.

 

Rude and/or inaccurate about:

 

The west

Bible

Feminism

 

Best of luck. I think that maritally you are in for a rather rough ride.

 

I am absolutely correct about the west and about feminism. Feminism is a western thing. Western women have been corrupted into believing that they have to be like men to be equal. It's one of the reasons why western women are so despised by the rest of the world. Why do you think you have the highest divorce rates in the world? It's because you have no clue how to keep a marriage together and no idea how to please a man. Yes, that's right, "ladies", you do have to please men, otherwise they will be repulsed by you. If you want to shake your neck and say I don't need a man, go ahead and live out your miserable lonely lives because you'll actually be doing men a favour. The reason why so many western men are leaving in droves and going to other parts of the world is because they're sick and tired of he-shes back home. Men are voting with their feet to get away from you. Feminists are a poison to society, but thankfully the world doesn't revolve around the anglosphere and its toxic "females". While non western women are getting married younger, having kids at an appropriate age, and being truly happy, western women are mostly living alone, eating microwave meals, playing with their cats, and wondering where all the good men are.

[Roweena]

This statement is frightening. Sounds just like something my Christian Fundalmentalist stepfather would have said. He also believed that women should look pretty and that they shouldn't trouble their empty little heads with anymore than what to make for dinner and how to please their husbands. I could write a book about how much of a failure he was as a husband and father but I won't bother here, suffice it to say that any woman who let him have the power was making a big mistake. You think you have and your husband are on to something new here? Sorry but most women have already been down the path of giving the men in their life the power only to learn that there is a price to be paid for that. There are a lot of women on forums who have been absolutely devastated by handing their power over to their husband/SO.

 

Secondly what your husband said about men are raised to handle power but women are not is total crap. Children model their parents, they leave home with the strengths and weaknesses that their childhood experiences and the example bestowed upon them by their parents. Children who were raised correctly by strong loving parents are going to grow up to be strong loving fair minded adults who would probably make good leaders and handle power just fine. Doesn't matter if they're male or female. Likewise children who are raised in dysfunctional homes with lousy role models for parents are going to grow up to be adults with some serious issues who would probably make a mess of things if they were given any power. Again it doesn't matter if they're male or female. Normal people do not have an agenda to raise their sons to be all powerful and to raise their daughters to be weak and dependant on the power of men. I'm sure there are parents who do that, actually I'm sure of it, because that is exactly what was done to me and it took me years to overcome it.

 

You are only 27 yrs old so I understand You just came into a fully developed adult brain a few years ago and their is still much for you to learn as an adult woman. Wait until you get into your 30's and 40's. Then you will understand what the women here are talking about.

 

You see, that's your problem right there. You actually think that men and women are the same. If men disappeared off the face of the earth, we would be plunged into the stone age, and women would be utterly lost. If women disappeared, men would not be anywhere near as devastated as we would be if they did. Men inherently have strengths that we simply don't have. I'd rather have men as leaders than women, because we simply aren't as mentally strong, or as organised and focussed as men are.

 

I'll give you an example. I recently read a story in the paper about a woman who owned a company. She did an experiment. She hired only women to staff a particular department, he hope being that she could prove that women on their own could manage just fine. The result? Bitchiness in the office, tardiness, days off, gossip, mucking around on facebook all day, long lunches, flirting with male workers who came in to do a specific job (ie technicians, delivery people) and very little productivity. It was a complete and utter shambles.

 

Multiply that many times and that's what a society without men and their leadership would look like. Women simply don't have what it takes to make it on their own.

 

Translate that into a marriage. When a man is foolish enough to let the wife have power which she doesn't rightfully deserve, it falls apart. Women need to be guided, and it's not oppressive, that's a myth, it's just that without men's guidance in life, we're incomplete. We need men far more than they need us. Feminism is bul l****, it's just whiny women who want to be like men. Men are just not attracted to masculine women who strut around putting men down and saying that they don't need men. What man in his right mind would want to put up with that rubbish? Maybe feminists are better off with each other. After all, a high percentage of feminists are in fact bisexual, so maybe they just need to cross the line fully and be lesbians and be done with it. They're no good to men anyway.

[Roweena]

That is not what you said. You're initial statement was that your husband said that a womans appearance was her greatest asset and you agreed with him. It was about seven pages into this thread before you tried to backtrack and say you and your husband were only talking about initial attraction.

 

Athiest Scholar I love your posts. Western society does have a high rate of divorce and broken families and the problem does not stem from women not treating their men better. Finances and economics have had a huge impact on our family life. Women in the west have to work outside of the home just as hard as men do but then they are also expected to excel at keeping a perfect home, a perfect marriage and raise their children perfectly and their supposed to look damn good while they're working themselves to exhaustion. The expectations placed on western women are enormous while they are being held to an impossible ideal. There are some radical feminists out there who do see men as the enemy and who don't respect marriage and families but that is not the norm and I believe those kinds of feminist have deeper issues who unfortunately use the feminist movement to further their warped ideas. Most feminist women do not subscribe to tearing down men and families, they simply believe in equality as humans.

 

Well that's funny. There are plenty of countries that are very poor, in which the women have to work, look after a home, raise kids, look after their husbands, and guess what, they do it very well and with happiness and dignity.

 

Western women are so damn whiny. I can't believe you are talking about being expected to raise kids and all the other stuff as though it's torture. If you're not woman enough to handle that, then maybe you don't deserve a man who breaks his back every day to provide for you.

 

Do you hear men complain about all the work they have to do? No. So quit whining and get on with it.

 

Women like you make me sick, complaining about stuff that is perfectly normal and reasonable. You have washing machines, dishwashers, microwaves, the option to buy fast food and convenience meals, decent public transport and infrastructure, and yet all you do is moan and whine.

 

If you really want to see what hardship is like, take a look at this :

 

That's hardship. But do you hear them complain? No. Sure, they don't like their circumstances, and it's tough, but they do what they can with what they've got, and they're grateful for what little they do have. So don't talk to me about hardship.

 

That's the problem with you western women. You think the world owes you. It doesn't. Get some perspective. You wouldn't survive 2 minutes in the conditions shown in the above video. And you're moaning about having to raise kids, keep a clean home, and do some work outside the home? You don't deserve what you have with that attitude. You don't know how lucky you are.

 

And you know what the biggest irony is? On the one hand, feminists say that they are strong and independent, but when it comes to applying themselves in a marriage or partnership, all of a sudden they go limp and start whining.

 

Again, do you hear men complain like that? No. That should tell you something about who is really strong.

Edited June 8, 2013 by Roweena

[Roweena]

WTH are you talking about? You are losing credibility with every new post you write. You are not putting forth any kind of rational discussion, you have just disolved into a heap of nasty ugliness. A strong intelligent woman doesn't resort to insults and name calling when they are being disagreed with. Can you think of a more intelligent way to make your point without resorting to calling us all a bunch of bisexual whiny manhaters? I'm beginning to see why you believe as you do. It's because YOU lack the ability to conduct yourself in a manner that is strong, fair, and capable. YOU are overly emotional and whiny. YOU could not handle power or independance YOU need a man to get yourself through the day and provide YOU with YOUR self worth. And YOU are projecting your own low opinion of yourself as a woman onto all women. You believe that all women must be as incapable and weak as you are. If we were all like you then I would totally agree that we should all be banished to the kitchen to bake bread and not trouble our silly little minds with big thoughts, but thankfully most women are not these useless creatures that you imagine us to be because that's how you feel about yourself.

 

I never said men and women are exactly the same. Men don't need women but women couldn't survive without men? That is some seriously warped thinking you got going on there. Men and women are different, with different strengths and weaknesses. When we respect each other and are reasonable thinking adults then both sexes can benefit from the other. As for your opinion of women in the work place, that blows me away. Have you ever worked in a large corporation with succesfull women? They are every bit as capable and strong as the men. That nonsense you posted about women in the workplace being gossipy bitchy useless employees is bunk. Where did you read this study? Can you post a link here so we can all have a look. I think you made that up in attempt to further your argument but if not then please do tell us where we can read up on this fascinating experiment. I have worked all my life and I have seen lousy employees of both genders. When people are lazy and bitchy they do not get ahead in their careers. Women in powerful positions did not get there by being whiny bitches.

 

You should travel and see other cultures, and have your eyes opened. Feminism has corrupted you, so it may be too late, but it's worth a try because that way you'll see how other people in this world live and view things. The world doesn't revolve around western values. You really have no clue what you're talking about until you get some perspective. It's insulting to women of other cultures to say the things you say, because they know what it it means to be a real woman.

[Dean13]

Short hair almost never looks better on women than longer hair, unless they're older. Not necessarily really long, but at least shoulder length. Every time my wife gets a really short haircut, I hate it. I never say anything though, because she hardly ever does it, and, when she does, she inevitably hates how it looks and grows it back out. I don't know why she does it.

I know saying "never" is kind of a generalization, but that's my belief. I'll never understand why women who care about their appearance choose to cut their hair short.

 

This being said, if I told my wife she had to consult with me before getting a haircut, she'd pick the one I hate the most and keep it forever.

 

Also, do whatever you want in your free time people, but this women is obviously now just trolling people, specifically "western women", who she apparently hates like poison.

[Roweena]

You are wrong again. I raised my boys by myself because their father was a drug using cheater who couldn't keep a job or think about anyone else but himself. I wasn't complaing about having to care for my children, they were and are the greatest blessing in my life. I would lay down my life for them and be happy to do so. Most women are the backbone of their families and many children are raised by their mothers only because of deadbeat fathers who want to go through life serving nobody but themselves and who will happily walk away from even their own children. I'm not talking about all men. I have some fine men in my family who are outstanding husbands and fathers including my own sons who were raised by solely by me so I must have done something right.

 

I was simply stating the facts of the challenges families face in our current culture. Both parents have to work full time and sometimes they have to work on opposite schedules to accomadate childcare. One parent works days and the other works nights so that one of them are always home for the kids or they both work days and their children are shuttled off to daycares or babysitters. Even on weekends sometimes families cannot be together because one or both parents have to work. This is financially driven and it takes it's toll on families and marriages. Men usually crack under the pressure before women do. Most women will do whatever it takes to keep their children safe and cared for. I don't know where you live but you have a very ignorant and warped view of western women. Sounds like you have been spoon fed a lot of propaganda about western women and you have eaten it all up.

 

You call me lazy and whiny but I suspect that you have never even held a job. I see you as someone who went right from living with mommy and daddy straight to living with her husband who is now some kind of surrogate daddy to you. You have very little experience in life and therefore you think you know everything there is to know about everything and everyone. Nobody with any kind of experience could talk as you talk. You sound so unintelligent and sheltered.

 

Again you're whining. I find it so sad that people who have a lot are the ones who complain the most. There are women in this world, millions and millions of them, who have to do so much, every day, against so much hardship, and yet they don't complain anywhere near as much as western women do.

 

I would love to see you have this discussion with one of those fine women. You would look very foolish, with all your complaining.

[LittleTiger]

Crap Little Tiger, you beat me to it!

 

Great minds DOT!

[Roweena]

 

This being said, if I told my wife she had to consult with me before getting a haircut, she'd pick the one I hate the most and keep it forever.

 

I believe that. Welcome to the west.

[Dean13]

I believe that. Welcome to the west.

 

Thanks!! Glad to be here!

[LittleTiger]

Again you're whining. I find it so sad that people who have a lot are the ones who complain the most. There are women in this world, millions and millions of them, who have to do so much, every day, against so much hardship, and yet they don't complain anywhere near as much as western women do.

 

I would love to see you have this discussion with one of those fine women. You would look very foolish, with all your complaining.

 

Roweena, I'm baffled by this thread. Two things I really don't understand. Can you enlighten me please?

 

1. You named the thread 'Debate with my husband' when you apparently agree with everything he says and thinks - so what exactly is it that you were debating with him about? You did mention there were other things besides your haircut.

 

2. You are obviously not from a Western culture, and you apparently despise Western women, yet you post on a largely US forum (with a small following from AUS, UK and other European countries) to ask for 'thoughts' from the very women whose opinions you have no respect for. Why?

[Roweena]

Alexandria35, I see you're a single mum. It must be hard to juggle so much all on your own. I don't know if I could do that, which is why I'm so thankful that I have someone to take a lot of the pressure off. I can only imagine how lonely it must be, and it makes me extra grateful for what I have, and extra determined to carry on making my husband feel wanted and appreciated.

[Roweena]

Thanks!! Glad to be here!

 

Good. Just don't put a foot wrong my friend, otherwise you'll end up getting cleaned out in divorce court. Keep a stiff upper lip, and soldier on.

[LittleTiger]

I believe that. Welcome to the west.

 

You don't like living in the West?

[Els]

Roweena, I'm baffled by this thread. Two things I really don't understand. Can you enlighten me please?

 

1. You named the thread 'Debate with my husband' when you apparently agree with everything he says and thinks - so what exactly is it that you were debating with him about? You did mention there were other things besides your haircut.

 

2. You are obviously not from a Western culture, and you apparently despise Western women, yet you post on a largely US forum (with a small following from AUS, UK and other European countries) to ask for 'thoughts' from the very women whose opinions you have no respect for. Why?

 

You're not going to get an answer, LT. The OP is only interested in broadcasting and defending 'her husband's views, not in actually talking about the situation mentioned in the OP, the circumstances of 'her relationship', or 'her' history and background.

[LittleTiger]

You're not going to get an answer, LT. The OP is only interested in broadcasting and defending 'her husband's views, not in actually talking about the situation mentioned in the OP, the circumstances of 'her relationship', or 'her' history and background.

 

I know! She's ignored all my posts so far, even though they're more on-topic than her own!

 

A little too close to the bone perhaps?

[Els]

I know! She's ignored all my posts so far, even though they're more on-topic than her own!

 

A little too close to the bone perhaps?

 

It's hard to flesh out an entire separate identity when one is living under a bridge. Gotta commend her for her effort so far, though, she's garnered several pages and probably hours worth of time and effort from people.

[Dean13]

Alexandria35, I see you're a single mum. It must be hard to juggle so much all on your own. I don't know if I could do that, which is why I'm so thankful that I have someone to take a lot of the pressure off. I can only imagine how lonely it must be, and it makes me extra grateful for what I have, and extra determined to carry on making my husband feel wanted and appreciated.

 

This seems a bit passive aggressive.

[secretlady76]

Short hair almost never looks better on women than longer hair, unless they're older. Not necessarily really long, but at least shoulder length. Every time my wife gets a really short haircut, I hate it. I never say anything though, because she hardly ever does it, and, when she does, she inevitably hates how it looks and grows it back out. I don't know why she does it.

I know saying "never" is kind of a generalization, but that's my belief. I'll never understand why women who care about their appearance choose to cut their hair short.

 

This being said, if I told my wife she had to consult with me before getting a haircut, she'd pick the one I hate the most and keep it forever.

 

Also, do whatever you want in your free time people, but this women is obviously now just trolling people, specifically "western women", who she apparently hates like poison.

 

Right, I'm going to get the claws out now about women and hair. Only the most facially attractive women can pull off a short hair cut. Some women have really beautiful long hair but a really manky face. It's like, if it wasn't for the hair then they would be ugly. It's almost like natures way of compensating for the nasty face by giving them lovely hair.

 

On the flip side, a woman of a certain age shouldn't really have long hair, because a) the condition changes after the menopause and b) there is nothing more scary than seeing a woman from the back with really long hair...and then they turn round and it's like 'Ewwwww'.

 

If I knew my husband preferred a certain style then I would consider having that style (if it was decent) and if I ask him what he prefers then he would tell me. If on the other hand he suggested a style (especially after I had just had it cut), then he'd probably get a slap!!!!

 

I've only had really long hair once, and it looked crap. Then when I had it all cut off everyone said 'God, that looks soooo much better'. Evidently I have a really pretty face (hahahahahaha)

[Els]

This thread isn't really about hair.

 

It really isn't.

 

It's an even funnier read when you actually grew up in one of 'those other countries' that the OP is talking about. Half the men there would have laughed the OP's face off for his petulant complaining and poor disguise as a woman (yes, it's a he, let's make no bones about it), and the other half would have tried to beat him up.

[Dean13]

This thread isn't really about hair.

 

No, but it should be, because arguing with the OP is futile.

[secretlady76]

Alexandria35, I see you're a single mum. It must be hard to juggle so much all on your own. I don't know if I could do that, which is why I'm so thankful that I have someone to take a lot of the pressure off. I can only imagine how lonely it must be, and it makes me extra grateful for what I have, and extra determined to carry on making my husband feel wanted and appreciated.

 

Are you for real?! Trust me, there are plenty of single mothers who are maybe lonely but the lonliness is a dam sight more preferable than staying with the loser husband!!!

[dreamingoftigers]

I am absolutely correct about the west and about feminism. Feminism is a western thing. Western women have been corrupted into believing that they have to be like men to be equal. It's one of the reasons why western women are so despised by the rest of the world.

 

You better fact-check with your husband and see if you got that right. You wouldn't want to be getting things wrong around him. He doesn't seem like the type to tolerate much independent thought or expression.

 

Why do you think you have the highest divorce rates in the world? It's because you have no clue how to keep a marriage together and no idea how to please a man. Yes, that's right, "ladies", you do have to please men, otherwise they will be repulsed by you. If you want to shake your neck and say I don't need a man, go ahead and live out your miserable lonely lives because you'll actually be doing men a favour. The reason why so many western men are leaving in droves and going to other parts of the world is because they're sick and tired of he-shes back home. Men are voting with their feet to get away from you. Feminists are a poison to society, but thankfully the world doesn't revolve around the anglosphere and its toxic "females". While non western women are getting married younger, having kids at an appropriate age, and being truly happy, western women are mostly living alone, eating microwave meals, playing with their cats, and wondering where all the good men are.

 

LOL, I am not in a nation that has the "highest divorce rate in the world." And I don't own a microwave for health reasons.

 

And frankly "sweetie" I've kept my marriage together despite virtually-insurmountable odds. You can't cut your own hair without having to "debate" whether or not you've lost value to your own husband! I'm more worried about your marriage than mine.

 

ROFL. That is the worst and funniest drivel I have heard at the same time. Where do you get your data? Askmen.com? PUA forums LOL

 

Sweetie: I'm 31, I've had my kids. I met my husband at 22, married at 23. And yes I did it in the 'right order.' I didn't have to deal with pressure to marry.My father who had exceedingly poor judgment didn't 'choose for me' whom to marry. (Thank GOD) I also got to decide when it was the right time for my body to bear a child. My husband and I made decisions we were both happy with together. He actually respects and asks for my insights and opinions. Often when we share together (instead of him acting as though I couldn't figure things out for myself) We collaborate to form better ideas. Idea that we both like better.

 

It's great to have a man actually respect me instead of viewing me like some cardboard cut-out that is only a mirror to his own wants. A living, breathing monument to his narcissism. How degrading.

 

I also have a faith that I chose when I was 20 (Christian denomination). I wasn't forced or pressured to assume the beliefs of my father. Or even my husband. I by rights have the choice to see and make up my own mind what to believe instead of being "indoctrinated" by the people who are supposed to love me the most. Sadly women around the world often miss that experience.

 

Feminism gave me the right to choose and openly live a faith different than my father's. My parents had a traditional-based marriage as well. They've been together for 40 years. There's no "power and outrage this" etc.

 

If all you have is that man to depend on, the one with the belief that women can't make their own personal choices about appearance etc., not your own skill set, and you are depending on your looks to keep him satisfied: You won't see 40 years with him. AND you may end up in your own cramped apartment with your cat. As for the microwave, nah, I'm sure that you cook your own meals. Is that the make-it-or-break-it difference?

 

There's a vast gap between considering your partner and having to have their voice booming in the back of your head all day like a North Korean loud-speaker telling you that if you don't fall in line "X" way that you are disposable.

 

Most men here, including many posters on this thread don't want that garbage. They actually want partners that want to be with them for other reasons than subversion and underlying threat.

 

It's a very short-term view. Have you had your kids yet? You haven't mentioned it and you're 27.

 

And as for "so many Western men leaving." What a joke. I can name one that I know that went to get a girl internationally. And guess what? She got to learn the hard way that people here will often dispose of relationships that become "inconvenient."

 

She was his third marriage in his 50 and he met her over the internet. She had sisters that married internationally and he basically "purchased" her. He married her in Ireland, they honeymooned in Spain. He "tried to get her into Canada" a couple times and then he accused her of cheating and divorced her. He returned his mail-order bride to sender. He took her virtue, (like many men will do) he used it up and shipped her home.

 

I've read of a couple of cases on here too of the same thing. You want the guys that "vote with their feet?" Because they "can't find a woman out of 50 million available ones on this continent alone?" That right there should be a bit of a red flag if you weren't so obtuse about the situation. Take them. Enjoy. See how that works out. See if pleasing someone that can't find 1 woman in 50 million to be a reasonable mate really realistic. See if they are going to find that answer with a "geographical cure" in a culture that they don't understand with family and community ties that most men of that ilk have not sustained in their own countries. That's why they are spouse-hunting in yours.

 

Great for you that you like your insulated from the scary, scary world life, but to think that you can just blade the Hell out of people for living a different way than you do and not get served some of it back is naive. As well, you might want to check out relationship dynamics in the Western world instead of swallowing your husband's quaint version whole. You should know that often what men here complain about is how often they are left. 2/3 of divorces initiated by women. Why is that?

 

Maybe because for thousands of years they didn't have to worry about having mutual relationships. We were property, after all. Then when industrialization happened we started shifting roles in society overall. Proving that we were just as (and in some areas better) on average capable as the average male. So we've come to expect mutual-respect in relationships.

 

That being the case, expecting respect has come into conflict with the male-established entitlement of having that reproductive vessel/cardboard cutout wife that has historically been desired.

 

We want better for ourselves. If our men can't provide us the basic tenets of respecting our ability to make our own decisions, we leave them. Just as they are free to leave us if they feel the same way. We don't have to suffer adultery, abuse, or addiction from our male spouses anymore. We have that choice.

 

Many, many men have come forward and learned a different way of being better husbands and fathers. No longer do they use physical force with us to deal with conflict or anger (unless they wish to be criminally charged, thanks Feminism). No longer are we restricted to enjoying the scraps of what a man has to offer us, braying like dogs underneath his dinnertable. We can go and get what we want ourselves. And we leave men that try to stop us. Because they aren't the men that we want. We want relationships where we can please one another. That doesn't mean "being like a man." (Laughable).

 

And there's more to life than manipulating oneself to beg for the affections of someone who isn't interested in who you actually are.

 

At least you don't have to microwave you supper.

[dreamingoftigers]

LOL, I read the thread really late last night.

 

If this isn't a guy, just effing wow. :lmao::lmao:

 

Really? I just....

 

:lmao::lmao::lmao:

 

Everything is just so disjointed.

 

"Western women blah blah"

"feminism blah blah"

"can't handle themselves blah blah"

"not mentally organized blah blah"

 

So, um, how'd that hair thing work out?

 

You see, that's your problem right there. You actually think that men and women are the same. If men disappeared off the face of the earth, we would be plunged into the stone age, and women would be utterly lost. If women disappeared, men would not be anywhere near as devastated as we would be if they did. Men inherently have strengths that we simply don't have. I'd rather have men as leaders than women, because we simply aren't as mentally strong, or as organised and focussed as men are.

 

I'll give you an example. I recently read a story in the paper about a woman who owned a company. She did an experiment. She hired only women to staff a particular department, he hope being that she could prove that women on their own could manage just fine. The result? Bitchiness in the office, tardiness, days off, gossip, mucking around on facebook all day, long lunches, flirting with male workers who came in to do a specific job (ie technicians, delivery people) and very little productivity. It was a complete and utter shambles.

 

Multiply that many times and that's what a society without men and their leadership would look like. Women simply don't have what it takes to make it on their own.

 

Translate that into a marriage. When a man is foolish enough to let the wife have power which she doesn't rightfully deserve, it falls apart. Women need to be guided, and it's not oppressive, that's a myth, it's just that without men's guidance in life, we're incomplete. We need men far more than they need us. Feminism is bul l****, it's just whiny women who want to be like men. Men are just not attracted to masculine women who strut around putting men down and saying that they don't need men. What man in his right mind would want to put up with that rubbish? Maybe feminists are better off with each other. After all, a high percentage of feminists are in fact bisexual, so maybe they just need to cross the line fully and be lesbians and be done with it. They're no good to men anyway.

 

You should travel and see other cultures, and have your eyes opened. Feminism has corrupted you, so it may be too late, but it's worth a try because that way you'll see how other people in this world live and view things. The world doesn't revolve around western values. You really have no clue what you're talking about until you get some perspective. It's insulting to women of other cultures to say the things you say, because they know what it it means to be a real woman.

[dreamingoftigers]

As others posted, so I won't repaste, you DID quote your husband as saying "most important", "chief asset", etc. You quoted him as adamant that outside of sexual attraction there would be no need to couple.

 

So really, stop trying to back peddle and claim I'm unfit to talk on the topic. If anything, I perhaps disturb you because I'm not easy to pin as an "angry western feminist".

 

Considering your background, you ARE the most qualified to make the comparison.

 

Your life speaks volumes.

 

Personally I don't think a traditional vs modern way of looking at femininity is the issue anyway. There's nothing wrong in and of itself for choosing a traditional role.

 

BUT one should be able to make the choice instead of being pigeon-holed into an unfulfilled life.

 

Respect in either set up is important. If a man openly believes and tells his wife that she isn't "mentally organized enough to handle her own life and had better focus on pleasing him" that's not respectful. It's degrading. No one deserves that. Cripes. Even if they sign up for it.

[Roweena]

You better fact-check with your husband and see if you got that right. You wouldn't want to be getting things wrong around him. He doesn't seem like the type to tolerate much independent thought or expression.

 

 

 

LOL, I am not in a nation that has the "highest divorce rate in the world." And I don't own a microwave for health reasons.

 

And frankly "sweetie" I've kept my marriage together despite virtually-insurmountable odds. You can't cut your own hair without having to "debate" whether or not you've lost value to your own husband! I'm more worried about your marriage than mine.

 

ROFL. That is the worst and funniest drivel I have heard at the same time. Where do you get your data? Askmen.com? PUA forums LOL

 

Sweetie: I'm 31, I've had my kids. I met my husband at 22, married at 23. And yes I did it in the 'right order.' I didn't have to deal with pressure to marry.My father who had exceedingly poor judgment didn't 'choose for me' whom to marry. (Thank GOD) I also got to decide when it was the right time for my body to bear a child. My husband and I made decisions we were both happy with together. He actually respects and asks for my insights and opinions. Often when we share together (instead of him acting as though I couldn't figure things out for myself) We collaborate to form better ideas. Idea that we both like better.

 

It's great to have a man actually respect me instead of viewing me like some cardboard cut-out that is only a mirror to his own wants. A living, breathing monument to his narcissism. How degrading.

 

I also have a faith that I chose when I was 20 (Christian denomination). I wasn't forced or pressured to assume the beliefs of my father. Or even my husband. I by rights have the choice to see and make up my own mind what to believe instead of being "indoctrinated" by the people who are supposed to love me the most. Sadly women around the world often miss that experience.

 

Feminism gave me the right to choose and openly live a faith different than my father's. My parents had a traditional-based marriage as well. They've been together for 40 years. There's no "power and outrage this" etc.

 

If all you have is that man to depend on, the one with the belief that women can't make their own personal choices about appearance etc., not your own skill set, and you are depending on your looks to keep him satisfied: You won't see 40 years with him. AND you may end up in your own cramped apartment with your cat. As for the microwave, nah, I'm sure that you cook your own meals. Is that the make-it-or-break-it difference?

 

There's a vast gap between considering your partner and having to have their voice booming in the back of your head all day like a North Korean loud-speaker telling you that if you don't fall in line "X" way that you are disposable.

 

Most men here, including many posters on this thread don't want that garbage. They actually want partners that want to be with them for other reasons than subversion and underlying threat.

 

It's a very short-term view. Have you had your kids yet? You haven't mentioned it and you're 27.

 

And as for "so many Western men leaving." What a joke. I can name one that I know that went to get a girl internationally. And guess what? She got to learn the hard way that people here will often dispose of relationships that become "inconvenient."

 

She was his third marriage in his 50 and he met her over the internet. She had sisters that married internationally and he basically "purchased" her. He married her in Ireland, they honeymooned in Spain. He "tried to get her into Canada" a couple times and then he accused her of cheating and divorced her. He returned his mail-order bride to sender. He took her virtue, (like many men will do) he used it up and shipped her home.

 

I've read of a couple of cases on here too of the same thing. You want the guys that "vote with their feet?" Because they "can't find a woman out of 50 million available ones on this continent alone?" That right there should be a bit of a red flag if you weren't so obtuse about the situation. Take them. Enjoy. See how that works out. See if pleasing someone that can't find 1 woman in 50 million to be a reasonable mate really realistic. See if they are going to find that answer with a "geographical cure" in a culture that they don't understand with family and community ties that most men of that ilk have not sustained in their own countries. That's why they are spouse-hunting in yours.

 

Great for you that you like your insulated from the scary, scary world life, but to think that you can just blade the Hell out of people for living a different way than you do and not get served some of it back is naive. As well, you might want to check out relationship dynamics in the Western world instead of swallowing your husband's quaint version whole. You should know that often what men here complain about is how often they are left. 2/3 of divorces initiated by women. Why is that?

 

Maybe because for thousands of years they didn't have to worry about having mutual relationships. We were property, after all. Then when industrialization happened we started shifting roles in society overall. Proving that we were just as (and in some areas better) on average capable as the average male. So we've come to expect mutual-respect in relationships.

 

That being the case, expecting respect has come into conflict with the male-established entitlement of having that reproductive vessel/cardboard cutout wife that has historically been desired.

 

We want better for ourselves. If our men can't provide us the basic tenets of respecting our ability to make our own decisions, we leave them. Just as they are free to leave us if they feel the same way. We don't have to suffer adultery, abuse, or addiction from our male spouses anymore. We have that choice.

 

Many, many men have come forward and learned a different way of being better husbands and fathers. No longer do they use physical force with us to deal with conflict or anger (unless they wish to be criminally charged, thanks Feminism). No longer are we restricted to enjoying the scraps of what a man has to offer us, braying like dogs underneath his dinnertable. We can go and get what we want ourselves. And we leave men that try to stop us. Because they aren't the men that we want. We want relationships where we can please one another. That doesn't mean "being like a man." (Laughable).

 

And there's more to life than manipulating oneself to beg for the affections of someone who isn't interested in who you actually are.

 

At least you don't have to microwave you supper.

 

Why do you think so many western men are turning away from western woman and going elsewhere?