The 6 month "wall"

[Adele0908]

Thanks to all of you who offered support and advice to me over the past couple of days. As a sign of respect to anyone who is interested, as well as to offer a reference to anyone who might encounter a situation like this in the future, I will try to update as things progress.

 

So I went to see her tonight. She was a bit snappy with her texts before I got there. I heeded the advice of maintaining my cool, so I didn't let that get to me and just communicated the details she needed to know. She responded in a nicer way to the texts after that. When I walked up to her door, she just opened the door and turned around and walked to her room, not even acknowledging I was there. Again...kind of bratty, but I didn't respond to the behavior. We took a walk and I told her that I wanted to have a mature, calm discussion about our conflict(s) and try to work together to find solutions that we could both agree on. Again she was acting a bit pouty, but I could see the hurt in her eyes as she did it. I calmly told her that I was not there to argue, and I wasn't there to apologize either. I told her that it came to my attention that maybe I haven't been direct enough with her, and things had gotten out of hand. I told her that I was going to be a man about the situation, but I needed to know if she legitimately wanted to work things out, or if she just wanted out. She wouldn't answer either way, so I could tell she was more hurt than disgusted with me and wanting to break up.

 

Come to find out, it was indeed all stemming from her wanting to see more of me and have more one on one time. She was bothered by the fact that I didn't appear bothered and when she brought it up (her idea of bringing it up was telling me i wasn't doing enough and she was thinking about walking) that I didn't say then and there I wanted to see more of her. She got progressively less bratty the more we talked after that, and I reassured her that I did want to see her, everyday if I could, but that the way she broke it to me was not fair and not in the most mature way. She agreed. She then told me she appreciated me making an attempt to be more direct, and that in the future if I thought she was being "bitchy" then to tell her right then and there, not take it and bottle it up. I agreed that would be good.

 

We walked to dinner and slowly it seemed like I was getting my girlfriend back. We talked and laughed a little, seemed almost like old times. I can tell that she is still a bit hurt and feeling vunerable, but is more open to working things out. After dinner we had a decent walk back and parted on a positive note.

 

All in all I think we still aren't out of the woods yet, and that there is work to do, but the ultimate problem here is the way we have been communicating with each other. If we can improve that, I would hope we can get over this "wall" and move forward. We are scheduled to have dinner at my place Saturday night, so I will post another reply then for anyone who might be interested.

 

You said you can see the hurt in her eyes and that you can tell she is hurt not disgusted, but it's just an assumption. If she said, "Yes, I'm hurting right now" or "You hurt my feelings when you did XYZ", then it would be safe to say that she is hurt. But if she didn't explicitly say that, there is no way to tell that she is hurt and feeling vulnerable. Her not responding to your questions or being quiet does not mean she is hurt.

 

Honestly you haven't done anything to hurt her, from what you posted. You see each other 2 to 3 times a week. You talk on the phone for an hour every day. You make plans to see her as much as you can. There is no problem here. And you even tried to discuss it before. You asked her what was wrong on various occasions. Asked her friends, which was going too far. Most people like to keep their private life private. But I'm saying it is obvious that you are making an effort.

 

If she doesn't believe that you are strong enough to walk away from her then she won't respect you and she won't feel attracted to you. That's why she changed. She has the upper hand in the relationship and she doesn't like it.

[salparadise]

If she doesn't believe that you are strong enough to walk away from her then she won't respect you and she won't feel attracted to you. That's why she changed. She has the upper hand in the relationship and she doesn't like it.

 

^^^ True. Keep this in mind.

[Jane2011]

You said you can see the hurt in her eyes and that you can tell she is hurt not disgusted, but it's just an assumption. If she said, "Yes, I'm hurting right now" or "You hurt my feelings when you did XYZ", then it would be safe to say that she is hurt. But if she didn't explicitly say that, there is no way to tell that she is hurt and feeling vulnerable. Her not responding to your questions or being quiet does not mean she is hurt.

 

Honestly you haven't done anything to hurt her, from what you posted. You see each other 2 to 3 times a week. You talk on the phone for an hour every day. You make plans to see her as much as you can. There is no problem here. And you even tried to discuss it before. You asked her what was wrong on various occasions. Asked her friends, which was going too far. Most people like to keep their private life private. But I'm saying it is obvious that you are making an effort.

 

If she doesn't believe that you are strong enough to walk away from her then she won't respect you and she won't feel attracted to you. That's why she changed. She has the upper hand in the relationship and she doesn't like it.

 

Maybe I missed something in the original post, but I don't think it was her friends he asked; it was his. I'm gonna go check in a minute, but I believe it was his friends.

 

Anyway, OP, sounds good (your update). Good that you were firm with her.

 

I agree with Adele, though, that you didn't do much to hurt her in the first place for her to react the way she did. I get that she was bothered by something, but I see your situation as one in which you were obviously giving 100% (given your distance circumstances and work schedules) and she was upset you weren't giving 115%. That's what troubles me about your girlfriend.

 

Also, I think it's great that she softened during your walk and that she even told you to set her straight if she acts bitchy again, but since I've been playing (to a degree) Devil's Advocate in this thread, I'll continue with that a bit. Watch out, because abusers know their wrong. They often even admit to it and say "sorry, sorry, I know I was wrong," but then they do it again.

 

It doesn't mean your girlfriend will do it with you, but if she does, I agree with Adele and some others that you have to show her you're prepared to walk away.

 

I understand her frustration/being upset because I've been there before. Wanting *more* from a guy (even if just more touching) but just not wanting to ask. In a relationship I was in years ago (circa 2004 to 2010), I often wanted my boyfriend to just be more "present" with me when we were around his friends. He brought me everywhere with him, but often his friends got so much more involvement when we were around all of them. I used to be snappy with him because of it. I'm with a different guy now (and that problem I mentioned above wasn't like the ONE downfall of my previous relationship or anything), but I've learned to just ask things like "Can you sit closer to me?" "I want some attention..." (with a cute face) or "I want to hear from you more." Whatever the deal is.

 

I actually have the opposite problem with my current boyfriend. He gives me time, attention, and affection in spades. But there have been just tiny incidents, like we're sitting on the couch and he's a little farther away, and I'm in the mood for some cuddling. I just pull him toward me. Or I tell him (nicely), "Sit closer to me...I wanna cuddle."

 

It's simple.

 

But just pouting because "he [you] should just know....should just intuit..." is bull****. It's five year old behavior.

 

I think your girlfriend disgusts me more than most because I've been her before, to an extent. Wish she'd get a handle on things and not have so much pride that she can't just say nicely "I need such-and-such..."

 

It's foolish pride that prevents her from just telling you what she needs. Pouting and being angry is less effacing to her than is showing some vulnerability/need of you. I would like for her to grow up, and hopefully she will.

Edited May 30, 2013 by Jane2011

[Jane2011]

OP, may I ask how old she is?

 

I don't think her behavior is specific to any age group or anything; I'm just curious as to what her age is.

 

Edit to my previous post (before this one): **know they're wrong....(I'm an English teacher; I have to correct all my mistakes, lol).

Edited May 30, 2013 by Jane2011

[Jono85]

You said you can see the hurt in her eyes and that you can tell she is hurt not disgusted, but it's just an assumption. If she said, "Yes, I'm hurting right now" or "You hurt my feelings when you did XYZ", then it would be safe to say that she is hurt. But if she didn't explicitly say that, there is no way to tell that she is hurt and feeling vulnerable. Her not responding to your questions or being quiet does not mean she is hurt.

 

Honestly you haven't done anything to hurt her, from what you posted. You see each other 2 to 3 times a week. You talk on the phone for an hour every day. You make plans to see her as much as you can. There is no problem here. And you even tried to discuss it before. You asked her what was wrong on various occasions. Asked her friends, which was going too far. Most people like to keep their private life private. But I'm saying it is obvious that you are making an effort.

 

If she doesn't believe that you are strong enough to walk away from her then she won't respect you and she won't feel attracted to you. That's why she changed. She has the upper hand in the relationship and she doesn't like it.

 

 

i agree with this sentiment. while things ended well the other night (did they even end well?? i would have expected some make up sex 100% if things ended well..), i'm not as optimistic. if my ex, who also lived an hour away, ever opened the door for me, and walked to her room without greeting me/hugging/kissing me, i would turn around and drive home. 'not reacting' to it is not being a man. that is just unnacceptable. as is the fact that she didn't answer when you asked her if she wanted to work on things or wanted out. really? wtf have you done to deserve her wanting out?? you should be the one wanting out for putting up with her ridiculous behaviour. you telling her you're going to be a man about it, seems unnecessary for the future. don't tell girls you're going to be a man about anything, just be the man. lastly, she still has all the power here, and although you've 'survived' to see another day, i don't envision this ending well. good luck nonetheless.

[Jane2011]

you telling her you're going to be a man about it, seems unnecessary for the future. don't tell girls you're going to be a man about anything, just be the man.

 

Have to admit, that made me cringe too.

 

Don't be an announcer. "I'm going to be a man about this." "I'm going to kiss you." "I'm going to be mature about this."

 

Well, some announcements work better than others, but announcing you're going to be a man in the face of her bratty passive-aggressiveness (or just plain aggressiveness) strikes me as a little weird/laughable.

 

That said, OP, I agree that your girlfriend has the power in your relationship, and even confronting her on it in the way you did doesn't change that. Even just the fact that you calmly tried to work things out with her coddles her. I'm not saying you shouldn't have done it the way you did. I actually think it was smart the way you did things, because it doesn't destroy the relationship (and you don't want to do that). I'm just saying it doesn't change that she has the power. In fact, it kind of reinforces her power to her because you're working it out with her and wanting to know her needs and how everything can be safe and comfortable for the two of you. That itself is accommodating her.

 

That being said, it's not altogether bad that she has more power than you. In any given relationship, one person has it over the other; it's to varying degrees, and in the most healthy relationships, not particularly noticeable or felt to others or to the people in question. Most of us here (and you) just don't want to see it be a huge discrepancy where she has so much power that she's disrespectful to you, or she has the kind of power that's disrespectful to you with the knowledge that you'll never do anything substantial about it.

 

The only thing, in my opinion, that would really put the power pretty even is her knowledge that you would leave her. I'm not saying you should do that (I don't recommend that to people necessarily because honestly I can understand NOT being able to leave the person, so you certainly don't want to threaten that you're going to do so, whether implicitly or explicitly, when you know damn well that you can't). I'm just saying...that's what puts things truly back into balance, power-wise.

 

My older sister has been married for 15 years and has the power in her relationship. But in her case it doesn't translate to complete disrespect of her husband, nor her being comfortable throwing her weight around with him.

 

I also have more hold over my boyfriend than he does over me, for whatever reason, but it doesn't manifest the way your and your girlfriend's dynamic is. I have a baseline level of respect for him, and I also don't feel right abusing the fact that he is so eager to please me.

 

A decent person doesn't treat someone badly even if they know they could.

[randomniceguy]

Sorry for the lack of the update, I was away all weekend and just now had the time to check back on here (I wasn't lying when I said I had a busy schedule!).

 

First off, again I appreciate all feedback and constructive criticism. The Forum Lurker, please read again. We were on a weekend trip with mutual friends, but I asked MY friend, who is married, I was in his wedding, if he'd gone through something similar with his wife when they were dating because they started out as a LDR. Given the fact that my girlfriend wasn't very talkative at the time, and I'd tried to ask her what was wrong, I still don't see the fault in asking advice of one of my best friends. However, other friends noticed her being cold and distant on the 2nd day and started asking me what was going on and I just told them I wasn't sure, but that she was obviously upset with me about something and I couldn't figure it out. Not sure how that is tacky, but ok.

 

Adele. You make very valid points. However, I know her well enough and we are close enough that I can actually see the difference between "hurt" and "anger" in her eyes. Her whole body language was different. We have been very close and have gotten to know each other quite well over the past 6 months, so while it may seem like an assumption, I know what it was. I've seen the "mad" and "frustrated" look enough lately to know the difference.

 

Jane2011, thank you so much for your attention to detail and advice. You asked about her age. She is 27. She is what you would call an "alpha" female. She can be incredibly sweet and she is very thoughtful, but at the same time she has a very dynamic personality and has trouble ever admitting she is wrong about anything. There is a lot of the pot calling the kettle black with her...but overall she is still a good person and means well.

 

As an update.. I went to see her Friday and before I left she texted me and told me to "pack a toothbrush" meaning she wanted me to stay for the weekend. When I got there I was quick to learn that it was not the best time of the month for her patience, but we had a decent time Friday night. Saturday we were lazy and cuddled and watched movies all day. That night, some friends (mutual friends) kind of pressured us to join them for dinner. We went and had a good time. By the end of the dinner she had her hand on my leg and was being as sweet as ever and thanking me for dinner. We headed back to her place and I thought all was well. She went to her room to change, so I turned the TV on in the living room. A few minutes later she stormed into the living room and was upset that I had turned the tv on and took it as a sign that I didn't want to talk to her anymore. We got into again. I got up to leave and she told me she'd rather that I'd stay because it was so late and she'd worry if I drove that late...again mixed signals.

 

The next morning we had it out again and I finally asked her if she thought we were just wasting time with our relationship, because lately she was acting like nothing was right and she wasn't ever happy. This didn't set well with her and she acted as though that thought had never crossed her mind. She again said she was upset because I "hung her out to dry" when she'd told me weeks ago that she just wanted to see each other more, and that it wouldn't even be a problem now if I had listened to her then. She said she was still having trouble trusting me because she wasn't sure if I was really sincere that I wanted to see her more and wanted to grow more together, or if I was just reacting because things weren't going so well anymore. She told me that if I called she would answer but that she wasn't going to call me anymore because she was "tired of being the one doing all the work" I found this odd because I called her basically every day on my way home from work over the past 3 months. Sometimes she was busy and would call me back later, but I generally called first. But I digress.

 

After this conversation I left quite unhappily. She stopped me at the door and hugged me and told me to let her know when I got home safely. Later on that day she sent me a text saying "I hope you aren't stressing yourself out more. I think we are going to be ok. We just need some time."

 

Since then there have been no more arguments, but we haven't talked much either aside from a few texts, a brief phone call, and a couple of emails. However, over 2 days I guess that is still decent communication. She did suggest that we try to read a book together to give us something new to tackle together and something fun to talk about. So the fact that she would suggest something like that I would think means she still wants things to get better.

 

She is about to be very busy traveling with work for the next 3 weeks and I will be somewhat busy as well. Looking back, she did say before we started fighting that "I guess I will see you in July...We're not going to see each other at all in June" I thought she was talking about a few of my obligations. This is another case of her expecting me to pick up hints and clues that she was going to be traveling all over the place when she never flat out told me.

 

Anyway....sorry for the long update, but just typing this out has been good therapy. Again I thank you all for your responses, well wishes, and criticisms. Will update again if there are new developments. Right now I'm hoping she's right and with time we will be ok.

[randomniceguy]

Also in response to Jane2011... You really hit something with your comment about friends getting more attention. The first real "fight" we had was over that at a wedding. She gets REALLY upset and part of her problems she has voiced lately also included that she felt like she didn't need to be there when I was with my friends. Looking back, I could have sat closer to her, talked to her a little bit more. I think I made an error in judgement because she prides herself on being independent and is a very tough minded woman, who claims that she doesn't need a man to be happy or have a good time. Based on that, I tried not to be too clingy in public, when in fact she wanted more attention. It's like she wants to put up the front that she's tough and independent, and will even still claim that is the case, but deep down she wants attention. It's like she is scared of being too vunerable or something. It would make my life so much easier if she would say or do things like you do. I hope she gets there soon. But until then. What would you recommend when/if we are out with groups of friends again? Just stand and sit closer to her, try to involve her in my conversations with friends more? I'd like to do that but also don't want to force the issue.

[SJC2008]

You're in a relationship with a controlling woman. She has, wants, and NEEDS the power in the relationship. I don't understand why you like her so much? How can you flourish in a relationship with somene who is never wrong, is always the victim and couln't care less about your needs?? There are real women out there who beleive in balance or that the man should lead (not in a controlling way) or women like Jane2011 who know they have the power in the R but don't abuse it.

[Geiss]

I can't believe you sent her flowers after she was the bitch. She should have sent you flowers. Well maybe not flowers but an apology or something. This doesn't sound good to me. If she is that disrespectful even in front of your friends and they agree that she is a cold bitch there is something wrong. I would cut her loose. I don't think you are going to do that so you better start fighting back and telling her when she is being a bitch and tell her to shut the **** up once and a while. She is completely unreasonable and irrational and disrespectful. Not good qualities.