Flashbacks and Mind Movies

[NewSouth]

I found this forum yesterday as a result of my work as a counselor and something that happened to me over the last couple of weeks. I was probably triggered by something that came up in my work, but I am not sure what.

 

In any event, I had a flashback to an affair my wife had 40 years ago. I had not even thought of it in many years. However, the flashback was as vivid as if it happened yesterday, including racing heart and nausea. For about six days now I have not been able to get it out of my mind. I'm having the mind movies that I have seen discussed here. I found a post here where a man said the flashback came over him like a tsunami, and that was exactly the thought I had when it first came back. However, 40 years seems like a record for this happening.

 

I would like to hear other people's experiences with this phenomenon, and how have they coped with it. I definitely see it as long repressed unfinished business for me. I will be happy to flesh out the story as responses warrant.

 

I have not said anything about this to anyone. I don't see that raising the issue with my wife would accomplish anything at this point, but it may come to that.

[NotCamelot]

I'm sorry to hear that happened to you......especially after 40 years.

 

It's only been just over a year for me. I hate to think I have to think about this forever!

[Spark1111]

Welcome counselor!

 

I think the affects of Infidelity closely resemble PTSD, and I wish the psychology community would embrace this concept and treat it accordingly.

 

if it would not be unusual for a veteran to wake up with wartime horror flashbacks 40 years later, why should that be considered unusual for an infidelity survivor?

 

It should NOT BE.

 

And there are some traumas you would need a lobotomy to forget or outgrow, so ease right on up on yourself.

 

Tell your spouse. no secrets ever, right?

[SmokeRat]

^

 

I'd have to say Paperangel, not many would stop having an affair.

 

One has to remember that people who have affairs, are selfish, destructive, narcissistic, poor excuses for human beings.

 

People know how destructive these actions are, they know how much pain it will cause, they know and don't care. That's key here.

 

Another example of the 'Me me me me me' generation started by the Babyboomers and expanded on by my generation of 'entitled' late 20's to early 30's.

[Furious]

My therapist encouraged me to talk about my mind movies and to let them play out and coached me through them. She emphasized that repressing them gave them power over me, that if locked them in a tiny corner of my brain and convinced myself they no longer existed was not good for me in the long run. She assured me that one day, perhaps years later they would resurface and play havoc with my emotions.

 

She encouraged me to face them head on, and repeatedly dissect them. It made a huge difference for me. The mind movies slowly lost their fierceness and the feeling of anguish that came with them.

 

Eventually, I transformed those mind movies into those silly black and white silent films with the lame piano accompaniment and my husband wearing eyeliner and the jerky over the top dramatic posturing for that close up shot.

 

I can honestly say that I've gotten past the mind movies and by facing them and dealing with them has helped me tremendously toward my healing.

[NewSouth]

Thanks for the initial replies.

 

Spark1111 - I agree that it is essentially PTSD and it has its triggers. I had a client earlier this morning experiencing triggers and mental images. A little over a year out. I've had to deal with a lot of infidelity in my practice lately and I'm sure that played a role in my own experience.

 

I'm not talking to my wife about it now, because I'm not sure there is any action to be taken. Ever since the affair, our marriage has more closely resembled a business partnership rather than a romance. Since then, it has been a marriage of convenience, which in itself is hard to face at this point in life. I was at the very beginning of a very successful career (not counseling, that just started about 4 years ago) having just moved to a new city when the affair occurred. I distinctly remember talking to a psychiatrist friend of mine and to my sister about it and deciding to "forgive." I threw myself into my work and did not really forgive, and trust was never fully restored. My wife really never "came clean." To this day I don't know the identity of the OM, nor do I know exactly how long it went on. It was at least 5-6 months.

 

Smokerat -- I absolutely agree. Awareness of potential pain cannot compete with thrill and instant gratification. And this was in the 70's. Think about our culture during that time of "free love".

 

As I indicated in the OP, I will add details as responses warrant. I am interested in this both for my own interests as well as learning how to help others better.

[NewSouth]

Furious,

 

I agree that you have to let the movies play, and I have done that for the last six days. They really can't be pushed aside. I had them initially and then they were gone until now. The affair transformed our marriage into a materialistic partnership rather than anything romantic. That is still the case today, and that is sad.

[TaraMaiden]

Can you think of any incident within your counselling that has possibly triggered a revival of old memories?

It seems to me that this affair - albeit happening 4 decades ago - has not actually had any resolution.

 

You and your wife are not so much married as conveniently cohabiting; you never discovered all the facts, nor was she ever, therefore, entirely transparent or honest with you.

When something of this kind is not exhaustively worked through, with equal dedication and willingness by both parties, then the situation is not resolved, and the matter is not over.

 

It's my opinion that this has merely lain dormant.

It has been brushed under the carpet,or has even been the classic 'elephant in the room'.

 

Now, embarking on this new career, you find that the connection with the problems of other people has caused this issue to resurface.

Just as you are assisting others to communicate effectively, the glaring omission in your own situation has awoken and bitten you on the ass.

 

Do you have children?

[NewSouth]

I'm going to take a few minutes to provide more context to this discussion, however, I still want to hear about other's experiences regarding flashbacks. How vivid? How long between them? How long after the A? What did it feel like?

 

Working with infidelity for the past four years has made me acutely aware of the warning signs. Obviously, I did not have email or texting then, but there were tell tale signs. Also, in retrospect, if I had a do over, I would have probably divorced my W immediately. We married too young for all the wrong reasons. Her primary reason was to get away from her parents. The first ten years were turbulent, then we settled into what Terry Real in his book The New Rules of Marriage calls "comfortable misery."

 

Today, we respect one another, but don't love each other. My W's poor health has made caregiving a large part of my life for the past 17 years and especially the last 10. We have worked hard and achieved material success. We like each other, but the love has faded. At this point, commitment to a life-long partner trumps everything else. With her bad health, I am not going to abandon her, and really don't want to add the stress of us talking about this. If she didn't "come clean" 40 years ago, what is the likelihood she would now.

 

And the last four years have made me skeptical, and this affair may have just been the tip of the iceberg, but I have no proof of that.

[NewSouth]

TaraMaiden,

 

You are 100% on target. We lived a lie for the sake of the dollar, and new awareness awakened the sleeping monster.

 

We had two children, and yes, it could be possible that my oldest is not really "mine" biologically because of the timing.

[NewSouth]

Blondie,

 

You are right; I am ready. However, I am not going to abandon my W due to her health. I should have left when it happened. I could have left as late as 1995.

[NewSouth]

Blondie,

Thanks for clarifying. My gut tells me it will move to an attempt at discussing it at some point. Since it is an elephant in the room scenario, that time will probably come sooner than later. I am actually recalling more as each day passes, and I would like to remember as much of what I knew then as I can before I open the conversation. I'm trying to recall how I found out about it, and I may have to reconnect with an old friend that I confided in at the time. I want to be as prepared as I can.

[TaraMaiden]

Excellent post , Blondie.

[drifter777]

For the most part, your story matches mine so closely it is spooky. I don't know where to start but let me summarize my story and throw out a couple issues that have haunted me and some things I've done that make me feel better.

 

Exactly what did your wife's affair consist of? Like a regular thing with some guy causing her to lie AND cheat you simultaneously? Or maybe a ONS or series of ONS's? For me, it was my wife's selfish desire to have more sexual experiences to see if it was "better" to be single and a slut. Of course she didn't tell me she was going to do this until she was already doing it and it pretty much destroyed me. Several weeks later she begged me to come back. She said she found out how much she loved me and wanted to spend the rest of her life with me. We also had a 6 year-old boy, and I wanted to provide a "normal" secure home life for him. To top things off, she was not sorry for what she did. To her is was a good thing that saved our marriage. She wouldn't allow me to confront her about her cheating because she just fell back on the "it was important for me" bullsh|t.

 

The mind movies began immediately and really didn't let up in frequency for 10 - 15 years. For the next 15 years they didn't hit me so often, but the intensity didn't change and hasn't to this day. There are a couple of clear, understandable triggers that get me crazy even today and others that seem to pop into my head out of nowhere and the movies start again.

 

You already summed up the major problem for me in one of your posts:

 

I definitely see it as long repressed unfinished business for me.

 

I never faced this head on and demanded that she stop her excuses and see what she did for what it was - selfish, slutty behavior with no thought to my feelings. I tortured myself for not walking away and divorcing her. I considered that to be the worst mistake of my life and the fact I was so weak to accept her cheating made me angry, sad, and full of regret.

 

After 30 years of suffering I finally decided I was not going to live this way anymore. I began demanding she admit that what she did was wrong and that she find some way to make it right. All she would do at that time was admit that it was selfish and she was sorry it hurt me. She clung to her excuse that it was ultimately a good thing for her and that I needed to just get over it. A two year battle began over this that was nearly as painful and dramatic as the incident itself. For the first time in my life I actually told the counselor I had been seeing for a few years about what my wife did. That counselor was the first and only person I have ever shared it with. I still feel embarrassed and humiliated that:

 

1) I was worthless. I was the kind of person whose wife would betray them so badly. My dad was right.

 

2) That I was so pathologically afraid to upset the family life we had that I would accept what she did and take her back.

 

It's been a long, tough battle but she now understands (truly) that all of her rationalizations were a load of crap and that she is a cheater. She is sorry she did it, she is sorry she hurt me, she is ashamed of her behavior back then. I have decided that I will not punish the person she is now for what she did 30 years ago when she was a completely different person. I haven't forgiven and know that I never will, but I have come to state of acceptance that she was a slut, she is not that person now, and I was (still are) a codependent and willing to ignore my feelings if there was any promise that my family could function normally again. My self-hatred for my horrible decision to come home is waning, but I don't think that will ever be gone.

 

As you have found, time does NOT heal all wounds. The trauma of a betrayal of this magnitude effects all people differently. It seems as though the mind movies and the re-living of the incident is more prevalent in betrayed husbands, but it's just my personal observation. Your story, and mine, should serve as a real warning of what your life will be like if you do not face infidelity head on and find a way to resolve all of the feelings a BS is feeling. This sounds like a tall order for the BS, and it is. It will probably take a few years at best. It's hard and it's painful. For many, divorce is a much better path than reconciliation.

[NewSouth]

Blondie,

 

What you said makes sense. I am trying to figure out what this all means to me. It's a complex mixture and there is a lot of denial involved. I supposedly moved on way too fast. My career made it possible to deny my hurt for a long time. I did begin the process of emotionally disengaging at that point, but that is successful only to a point.

 

The part I am trying to make sense of is that it hurt like hell when it happened, yet it disappeared from my thoughts for 40 years, and when it resurfaced, it hurt almost as bad as it did originally (classic PTSD), yet when I look at my W I have no romantic feelings nor any desire for them to develop. Her fragile health with the associated caregiving I have been obligated to do has led to resentment. So I can see how resentment feeds this as well. When everything is considered, it makes sense that it would feel the way it does.

 

Journaling would probably be helpful. Just writing on this forum today seems to have diminished the pain, but my curiosity wants to understand it.

 

The timeline would look something like this based on years married:

Years 1-5 turbulent. I was in college. No evidence of infidelity during this period, but it could have happened. Opportunity was there.

Years 6-10 This is the affair period. There could very well have been more than one. I was out of town every other week for at least three nights. If I were betting, I would bet there was at least one before the one I know about, and probably one or more after. There could have been ONS's but that would be a little out of character. Serial behavior would be more likely. By year 10 my heart was out of the marriage. All I cared about (or so I thought) was career and education.

Years 11-14 - fairly stable, but represents the beginning of convenient cohabitation. I was pursuing advanced degree and building career. No evidence of affairs, although plenty of opportunities existed because of my travel, but I wasn't looking.

Years 15-29 Convenient cohabitation. Career blossomed. Made a lot of money. No evidence of affairs, but same opportunities existed, and I wasn't looking.

Years 30 to present--Illnesses and caregiving begin. Career unraveled and had to reinvent self. Probably no infidelity; this was the beginning of her being dependent on me.

 

By staying with her after the affair I learned of, I reinforced the behavior, especially since she did not tell everything, or much of anything. I essentially taught her there were no consequences to her behavior. However, if there were other affairs before or after it does not matter; it was the affair that started this thread that ripped my heart out.

 

Thanks for letting me ramble; it is helpful to get it in writing. I'll have to print the thread out and hide it in my office until I know what I want to do.

[NewSouth]

Drifter

 

Amazing post. Thank you. I had to print your post so I can adequately respond.

 

The affair was fully sexual and went on for several months. I think someone saw them at a members only bar and it got back to me somehow. I confronted and she basically threw it in my face. I never got the identity of the OM, but I know she met him at work. I think it may have been a sales rep that called on her workplace. I got no details, nothing but yes there was an affair. I doubt it ended at that point, although she said it had already ended. There was no remorse.

 

I beat myself up as being weak for not standing up to her. However, I am with you. I will not punish her today for what she was 40 years ago. She did change. She was an excellent mother and still is. She has been very successful in her career. I have not forgiven and certainly can't forget.

 

It's interesting you bring up the slut aspect. My mother tried to talk me out of marrying her, but hell no, I would not listen. She had the reputation for being an easy mark in high school, not sleeping with everybody, but having sexual relations with a series of boyfriends throughout the high school years. I think she behaved herself in the early years of our marriage. However, when we moved away when I graduated from college to a major city, I would bet my retirement account that she started having affairs. I think she is one of those women whose self-esteem is based on their looks and sexuality, and that without sex, life is meaningless.

 

Maybe we can interact some more on this.

[TaraMaiden]

NewSouth, I'm betting you're wishing this had all come up and resurfaced earlier.... But you've found us now.

Take your time.

You're receiving some amazing input.....

 

I'm following the thread, and feel anyone could learn a great deal from you, and your situation.

Be well, take it easy, and above all, be good to yourself.

[NewSouth]

TaraMaiden

 

Yes, if these flashbacks had surfaced in the 80's, I would have left. But at that time this demon was in chains in the dark recesses of my mind.

 

As I responded to Blondie1, this has essentially turned into journaling for me. Today, I can feel the cloud lifting and things getting into a better perspective.

 

Much like Drifter, I can be at peace with acceptance, but even that is a tall order. Acceptance assumes the absence of resentment, and I still have plenty of that. But I can see a day where I can accept. I have no desire for a genuine reconciliation, because that requires both forgiveness and repentance. I don't believe I will be able to truly forgive, and I don't expect there to be repentance, because as Drifter also alluded to in his story, my W never showed any remorse.

 

I agree. The input has been great. I plan to stay around after my crisis passes. This is a great forum, and I am willing to stay with this thread as long as people are interested.

[drifter777]

I decided not to punish my wife now for who she was and what she did back then because she finally opened up and helped me work through some issues. They were painful for her and terribly uncomfortable, but that's the price she had to pay. Even today when I have a trigger and need to ask questions or just express how I feel she understands she has to talk about things and be completely present. No "that's in the past, can't we just move on?". She knows where that got us.

 

You say you haven't brought this up with your wife - right? Well, maybe it's time. You can keep living with the shame, anger, and sadness over her betrayal or choose to finally face it and resolve whatever you can resolve. I told my wife that she either open up and help me resolve some things or I was leaving her. Period.

 

Are you in counseling? Marriage counseling?

[drifter777]

I don't believe I will be able to truly forgive, and I don't expect there to be repentance, because as Drifter also alluded to in his story, my W never showed any remorse.

 

This is your chance to get tough with her. Make her face what she did and understand how much she hurt you. If she is not willing to find true remorse then I don't know how you can continue to live with her. Oh, and you'll know true remorse when you see it.

 

I agree. The input has been great. I plan to stay around after my crisis passes. This is a great forum, and I am willing to stay with this thread as long as people are interested.

 

You came here because you are in pain and you want to feel better. Nobody on here with any experience as a BS will tell you anything like "it's been so long you have to let go". For the most part the people on here have been BS's less than 5 years and many think they are successfully reconciled. I hope they are, but they'll have to see how they feel as they mature and begin to examine their own lives more closely. Anyway, you need to start taking some action if you truly want to feel better. Pick a path and start walking.

[NewSouth]

Drifter

 

I am not currently in counseling, but I very well may pursue that avenue. I might even try a certified hypnotherapist, because that is what it might take to dig the crap out of my head. The irony is that I am a counselor, and do a lot of marriage counseling. I am pretty sure it is a composite of stories I have heard in the past few weeks that pulled the trigger, although there was not a single story real close to mine. Your experience is the closest I've heard to what I have experienced.

 

I am not opposed to confronting my wife, but I want it to be well thought out. I would like for the mind movies to subside, and I want to have a reasonable expectation that it will help me. There is some fear here. This affair extinguished every spark in our relationship, but if I were to confront her now, and out of guilt she decided to confess to multiple affairs (which I believe happened), I'm not sure what the hell I would do with that information. It would certainly reinforce my view of who she was. She might come "fairly clean" on the affair in question, but conceal some other things. She is a master of secrets. There were a few markers before and after the affair in question that lead me to believe there was quite a lot of activity for about 6 years. But this is all conjecture, but our minds certainly fill in blanks with worst case scenarios based on what information we do have.

 

Given all the circumstances we will probably continue to share a house until one of us dies or goes into a nursing home. Not a pretty picture, but that is reality. Just the financial disruption that a divorce would create would be staggering. She has already experienced multiple life threatening illnesses, starting 17 years ago.

[NewSouth]

Blondie1

 

Well said. My focus is on choosing the path that helps me heal.

[NewSouth]

For the most part the people on here have been BS's less than 5 years and many think they are successfully reconciled.

 

I knew I was not reconciled, but I thought I had found a workable life. I also hope those only a few years out are reconciled, but as you and I know, that may not be the case. I would love to know what proportion of cases are truly reconciled and how many appear to the outside world to be reconciled?

 

When I find the path, I will start walking. Thanksl.

[TaraMaiden]

Blondie1

 

Well said. My focus is on choosing the path that helps me heal.

 

Don't forget the famous phrase:

 

'Forgiveness isn't meant to let 'them' off the hook; forgiveness is meant to let YOU off the hook.'

[drifter777]

I am not opposed to confronting my wife, but I want it to be well thought out. I would like for the mind movies to subside, and I want to have a reasonable expectation that it will help me. There is some fear here. This affair extinguished every spark in our relationship, but if I were to confront her now, and out of guilt she decided to confess to multiple affairs (which I believe happened), I'm not sure what the hell I would do with that information. It would certainly reinforce my view of who she was. She might come "fairly clean" on the affair in question, but conceal some other things. She is a master of secrets. There were a few markers before and after the affair in question that lead me to believe there was quite a lot of activity for about 6 years. But this is all conjecture, but our minds certainly fill in blanks with worst case scenarios based on what information we do have.

 

How ironic for me; I get to advise a counselor to get out of your head and start working on your feelings. Sound familiar? If a patient came to you with your story and truly needed your advice as to how to proceed, what would you tell him? If your best friend came to you with this story, how much empathy and compassion would you show him? Try to give yourself the same loving treatment that you would show others.

 

Given all the circumstances we will probably continue to share a house until one of us dies or goes into a nursing home. Not a pretty picture, but that is reality. Just the financial disruption that a divorce would create would be staggering. She has already experienced multiple life threatening illnesses, starting 17 years ago.

If it comes to this reality then so be it. Your right about the financial problems - I've looked into this - so the answer is not to divorce. You can lead separate lives living under the same roof. This is the winter of your life and I feel that you want to take care of some unfinished business. Don't let the small stuff you refer to stop you from taking care of your life.