When is enough enough?

[ReadyforLife]

This is somewhat similar to another thread. Why do we stay in unhealthy relationships? Why do we not move on for our own good? I know one of my answers is fear of never finding love. Another is, how can I handle the idea of the father of my kids moving on with another woman and likely treating her much better than he ever did me in 15 years?

 

Another issue is that, speaking for myself, I doubt myself. How much of the wrong is my fault? For example, a huge issue I have is what I feel is lack of consideration for my feelings. My husband is an EXTREME hunter. I am talking every weekend during turkey season, then bow season, then gun season. Then you have the scouting, the practice, the shopping, the viewing of hunting shows, the taking the animal to the butcher an hour away, the helping friends scount, helping friends drag out the deer, the list goes on and on. We have 3 chidlren, and this has absorbed his life for 10 years. I tried talking to him about coming up with a balance, but he gets angry and says I am trying to control him.

 

Then, he says hunting is the only thing he likes to do in life. This is not true. He kayaks, goes fishing, visits friends, goes to movies, and other things that he likes. I have told him that I am glad he has an outside life, because I do as well. I just don't think he balances it. Also, it is on his time. He just goes and does it when he wants to.

 

The last straw came this week. We have been seeing a counselor (for the 4th try). After counseling, he told me he wanted a divorce and was bitterly mean to me for 3 days, every time we spoke. He talked down to me, telling me how bad I am, how miserable I make his life, how I waste his time. Well, on the 4th day, he says, we need to work this out so we can handle these kids (we have 1 that is a teenager who has been a challenge since he was under 2). So, we come up with an agreement that he will write down what he thinks he needs for hunting and hobbies, and we can look at it together. HA, that was a joke. The very next night, he gets a call and says, oh, I was going to go hunting Saturday morning, is that ok? Of course I said yes, it was a trap .

 

Feeling so lost......

[ReadyforLife]

After reviewing the 5 stages of grief when ending a relationship, I think I have struggled with 3 and 4 lately. I seem to move between the 2. I have been trying to negotiate, then become depressed when I feel it's no use.

 

Does anyone have any words of advice or thoughts for me? I am questioning myself, what to do and where to go from here .

[trippi1432]

This is somewhat similar to another thread. Why do we stay in unhealthy relationships? Why do we not move on for our own good? I know one of my answers is fear of never finding love. Another is, how can I handle the idea of the father of my kids moving on with another woman and likely treating her much better than he ever did me in 15 years?

 

 

How about a question, in bold above, why do you think he would?

[Yasuandio]

Back away, and stop the pursueing.

 

If he says something bad about you, respond "believe what you want to believe." (don't react - it a trap, like you said).

 

If he "asks" you to go hunting or whatever, respond by saying something like:

 

Smart A$$ Version: Do adults need to ask permission when they want to do their hunting hobby?

 

Nice Versions: "That is completely up to you."

 

or

 

"Please, can you make that decison -I need to get the laundry done." (or whatever home task needs doing).

 

Totally back off - and DEFLECT all of his "inquiries." Every word out of his mouth is intended to push your buttons. If you can't think of something to say, then say, "huh?" or "uh-ha." or "ok, I think." or "emm." And nod yor head in acknowledgement. Or stare at him like a zombie - don't look in his eyes, look directly between his eyes, that will throw him off a bit.

 

Then think about how great you did in controling the situation. You must be on gaurd 24/7. His button-pushing will esculate. Remember, the key pharse:

 

"Believe what you want to believe." (that will shut him up fast).

 

Here is something that will really confuse him further - keep saying the same thing every time - but with just different wording:

 

"If you need to believe that, it is ok with me."

 

"If that is how you feel, that is how you feel."

 

"I'm not sure about that, but I believe what you are saying if you do."

 

Now - do you get the idea?

 

Basically, if he says bad stuff, either confirm it, agree, or make a circular sentence that doesn't really mean anything - just to be nice.

 

Hope this suggestion helps in the communications, Yas

Edited May 19, 2013 by Yasuandio

[ReadyforLife]

Trippi,

 

I can only assume he would.

 

Yas,

 

Thanks. I have tried almost everything. I feel defeated .

[Yasuandio]

Trippi,

 

I can only assume he would.

 

Yas,

 

Thanks. I have tried almost everything. I feel defeated .

 

This is exactly what you your problem is. YOU MUST STOP TRYING. STOP ENGAGING. DROP THE ROPE. DEFLECT HIS COMMENTS. If you have to agree to get him to stop - then agree, and walk away. No more discussions that will only hurt you.

 

He is not only pushing you buttons, he installed them. Stop trying, and only do and think about yourself (like he does). If he has something to remark about it -- just mimick hao he responds, or try some of the sample responses I provided. Surely you have not implimented all these.

 

Engagement is DRAINING. That is why you feel deflated. You need sleep, food, water, air, shelter to live. In fact, you don't even technically need to live - it is instinct to WANT to live and survive.

 

These are facts: You do not need him. You desire him. You want him.

 

Perhaps try on a new mentality. I know it is easier said than done. But I tell you it can be done. STOP WANTING HIM. Always remind yourself you don't have to have him to live - you do not need him for hapiness. Look at yourself - does this guy look like someone who makes people happy?

 

It is hard to see and find. And everyone is going to say it -- and, you will read it. Nut, when you are in self-pity mode, and hysterical, and in pain - you are not going to do the things that make you happy. If you force yourself to do things to make yourself happy (or at least get your mind off the issue), the door will be open for other more positive "happy" feelings to come in.

 

Rest, eat a good meal. Don't try - DO. Yas

[Deerhunter]

He will not treat anyone any different than he treated you. Let him have the kids every other weekend. Screw up his hunting and fishing. Just get all the child support you can and alimony if possible. Don't doubt yourself. Get out there and have fun. Reconnect with old friends. Don't be a stepping stone for him and let him walk all over you.

[imtooconfused]

Why do we stay in unhealthy relationships? Why do we not move on for our own good?

 

I can add one reason... Fear of demonstrating failure at something that everyone with whom one is acquainted has succeeded in. How does one move through that mental block?

[2sunny]

Go to counseling on your own - so you can begin to believe you can be happy on your own.

 

His new gal will get the same selfish, self centered one you've had.

 

Your username says it all...it's time to get busy living - a life where a man doesn't drag you down. When you let go of the weight of him - life will seem brighter, easier to be happy.

 

That's what I've experienced. Time to let go of his mean, verbally abusive self.

 

But find help in believing in yourself!

[trippi1432]

This is somewhat similar to another thread. Why do we stay in unhealthy relationships? Why do we not move on for our own good? I know one of my answers is fear of never finding love. Another is, how can I handle the idea of the father of my kids moving on with another woman and likely treating her much better than he ever did me in 15 years?

 

Another issue is that, speaking for myself, I doubt myself. How much of the wrong is my fault? For example, a huge issue I have is what I feel is lack of consideration for my feelings. My husband is an EXTREME hunter. I am talking every weekend during turkey season, then bow season, then gun season. Then you have the scouting, the practice, the shopping, the viewing of hunting shows, the taking the animal to the butcher an hour away, the helping friends scount, helping friends drag out the deer, the list goes on and on. We have 3 chidlren, and this has absorbed his life for 10 years. I tried talking to him about coming up with a balance, but he gets angry and says I am trying to control him.

 

Then, he says hunting is the only thing he likes to do in life. This is not true. He kayaks, goes fishing, visits friends, goes to movies, and other things that he likes. I have told him that I am glad he has an outside life, because I do as well. I just don't think he balances it. Also, it is on his time. He just goes and does it when he wants to.

 

The last straw came this week. We have been seeing a counselor (for the 4th try). After counseling, he told me he wanted a divorce and was bitterly mean to me for 3 days, every time we spoke. He talked down to me, telling me how bad I am, how miserable I make his life, how I waste his time. Well, on the 4th day, he says, we need to work this out so we can handle these kids (we have 1 that is a teenager who has been a challenge since he was under 2). So, we come up with an agreement that he will write down what he thinks he needs for hunting and hobbies, and we can look at it together. HA, that was a joke. The very next night, he gets a call and says, oh, I was going to go hunting Saturday morning, is that ok? Of course I said yes, it was a trap .

 

Feeling so lost......

 

I'm going to stick right here to your original post....you have some balance in the relationship. You know he needs an outside life just as you have, it's where the two of you come together that is the problem?

 

Yes, he was probably upset after one of those sessions because he had to come to terms with you seeking that balance...and it's okay to assert yourself and ask for that from your husband. He has to be the mature partner and see that things are getting off balance and be able to meet your needs as much as you meet his.

 

Until you give us more information, I see this simply as he didn't meet with the agreement and asked you (like a child) if he could go do his thing this weekend, because he knows now that it is an issue. If you comply, it's permission and will continue. But you have to be willing to comply as well to your own things that he might disagree with. I bet those came up in therapy too didn't they?

[2sunny]

My friends H hunts and fishes a LOT! They made compromises together.

 

She knew when she married him he would never cheat - but he would hunt and fish a lot.

 

He works hard.

 

The thing is - when he's home - he makes HER his priority! He connects with her! He makes sure she knows she is his everything. But don't take away the hunting and fishing or he will be a man without his purpose.

 

She knows he loves her - he'd do anything for her - except give up what he loves.

 

They are well suited. They have grown and compromised... Because they have respect for each other and would never want to live without each other.

[trippi1432]

My friends H hunts and fishes a LOT! They made compromises together.

 

She knew when she married him he would never cheat - but he would hunt and fish a lot.

 

He works hard.

 

The thing is - when he's home - he makes HER his priority! He connects with her! He makes sure she knows she is his everything. But don't take away the hunting and fishing or he will be a man without his purpose.

 

She knows he loves her - he'd do anything for her - except give up what he loves.

 

They are well suited. They have grown and compromised... Because they have respect for each other and would never want to live without each other.

 

I think you just explained my mother and step-father there 2Sunny.

 

On Mother's Day my step dad told me he wished my mom would just be happy with 4-wheeling and give up on the horses (she's 65 and broke her leg in three places last year after being thrown by a new horse she bought when her regular horse went lame).

 

I laughed later when my mom rolled up on the 4-wheeler that day riding with her grandson and she said..this is the only horse power I really need these days.

 

At the end of it all, it's about respect within the relationship. There are truly trivial reasons to lose it and there are real ones. We all pick our battles don't we?

[ReadyforLife]

Thank you for the comments. Unfortunately, there is so much more. He did not hunt when we met. I did not grow up with hunters. I had no idea of the time that is invested. I had no idea what I was getting myself into. He started when our youngest was 2 months old. I was left with a 2month old, an 18 month old and a 5 year old by myself every weekend for 2 1/2 months the year he started. During the same time, he also worked full time and went to apprentice school 2 nights per week. I also worked outside of the home full time. Then, 3 years later, I learned that during one of these adventures he cheated on me with a hunting buddies wife's friend . I was the nagging wife who wanted him home, so he sought solace in another woman.

 

Fast forward to now.....I wasn't going to ask him not to go Saturday when he asked because I feel like he is a grown man and can make the decision on his own. We have talked about the issue, and I figured his immediate reaction of, well I will go hunt and see what she says said it all. I have hobbies, but do not take them to the extreme. We had this family together. Why is it ok for 1 person to check out for long periods of time for at least 25% of the year because they have a hobby? That might sound selfish of ME, but I feel like I have relationship and family values that I put above my hobbies, he does not.

[2sunny]

I get the feeling you just intend to be mad at him.

 

If that's the case - and nothing's gonna change - it's better to raise kids in an environment without all that negative energy in the home.

 

Animosity never allows room for love. It looks like it's from both sides of your marriage.

[trippi1432]

Then, 3 years later, I learned that during one of these adventures he cheated on me with a hunting buddies wife's friend . I was the nagging wife who wanted him home, so he sought solace in another woman.

 

Fast forward to now.....I wasn't going to ask him not to go Saturday when he asked because I feel like he is a grown man and can make the decision on his own. We have talked about the issue, and I figured his immediate reaction of, well I will go hunt and see what she says said it all. I have hobbies, but do not take them to the extreme. We had this family together. Why is it ok for 1 person to check out for long periods of time for at least 25% of the year because they have a hobby? That might sound selfish of ME, but I feel like I have relationship and family values that I put above my hobbies, he does not.

 

Is he still cheating, or is it what you suspect? 15 year relationship..the hunting came later and 3 years ago he cheated. I think if you want real help you need to unload the whole story.

 

From what you are giving here, it sounds like he is only going hunting to see what the OW said and all "I figured his immediate reaction of, well I will go hunt and see what she said and all"...is SHE the issue or is it the hobby?

[trippi1432]

I get the feeling you just intend to be mad at him.

 

If that's the case - and nothing's gonna change - it's better to raise kids in an environment without all that negative energy in the home.

 

Animosity never allows room for love. It looks like it's from both sides of your marriage.

 

Going to requote this because if this is your unhappiness, nothing is going to change.

[Mr. Lucky]

I know one of my answers is fear of never finding love.

Doesn't it seem sadly ironic that, out of fear of never finding love, you'd stay in relationship that doesn't meet your needs in terms of feeling loved?

 

You and your H seem like a tough mix, both in terms of lifestyle and ability to compromise. And neither of you seem very happy or fulfilled. Sounds like you have some decisions to make and, based on your husband's statements regarding divorce, he may be ahead of you in this regard...

 

Mr. Lucky