Author Confused48 Posted May 24, 2013 Author Posted May 24, 2013 Spark, I said: Love is blind. You said: Yes it is, but I think it is suppose to be. I agree in principle, and we could open a whole new thread. The blindness should be acceptance of imperfection. Our imperfections are evidence of our humanity. I will substitute "clueless" for blindness. I don't think we should be clueless, and I was as clueless as you can get. Even Hansel and Gretel knew the breadcrumbs had meaning. I thought blind trust. One poster here often says trust but verify. Yes, now. Maybe should have then too.
Almond_Joy Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 Spark, I said: Love is blind. You said: Yes it is, but I think it is suppose to be. I agree in principle, and we could open a whole new thread. The blindness should be acceptance of imperfection. Our imperfections are evidence of our humanity. I will substitute "clueless" for blindness. I don't think we should be clueless, and I was as clueless as you can get. Even Hansel and Gretel knew the breadcrumbs had meaning. Just my 2 cents as this concept is interesting, and sorry if I t/j. I really do think love is blind when you've never been cheated on. I really and truly did not see any of these cues in the relationship where I was cheated on. After being betrayed...I can't conceive ever being blind again, or clueless either. A lot of the clues shared in this thread my bf has done. I could easily accept them as indicators of something sinister (and honestly probably have up until recently), but I fight to make a choice not to believe something fishy's going on. If anything that just affirms to me that love is, essentially, a choice. I'm choosing to trust and there is nothing to be ashamed of in that. If the trust is abused I have nothing to feel guilty or stupid about for overlooking. I don't think I'm overlooking anything - I watch my bf like a hawk lol - but I choose to trust him regardless.
Spotme Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 Realist, for me it was when he stopped talking about her that I should have paid attention. 1
Realist3 Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 Realist, for me it was when he stopped talking about her that I should have paid attention. I'm coming at this from the opposite end you are probably. I'm the WS. Because she was on my mind constantly I could not help but mention her; totally subconscious.
Spotme Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 I'm coming at this from the opposite end you are probably. I'm the WS. Because she was on my mind constantly I could not help but mention her; totally subconscious. I know. I remember the gargantuan thread you spawned ;-) Are you still driving the bus? Anyway, yeah, in my particular case, when they were really just friends, H spoke about her very normally. When he stopped talking about her, I thought it was because they drifted apart after a big change at work (their mutual close friend who was the extrovert among them left the company). In reality, they became closer as it was just them against the evil crazy place they work and they bonded more. He started feeling guilty, so he stopped talking. That's why I said that.
Realist3 Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 I know. I remember the gargantuan thread you spawned ;-) Are you still driving the bus? There is that old saying, "Be careful what you wish for." I'm not going to TJ, but let's just say I may have driven it a little too far.
Realist3 Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 Anyway, yeah, in my particular case, when they were really just friends, H spoke about her very normally. When he stopped talking about her, I thought it was because they drifted apart after a big change at work (their mutual close friend who was the extrovert among them left the company). In reality, they became closer as it was just them against the evil crazy place they work and they bonded more. He started feeling guilty, so he stopped talking. That's why I said that. I'm not discounting what you are saying. I think that is a very good sign as well.
Spotme Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 I know. Actually, each of us speaking from personal experience and having opposite experiences illustrates how hard it can be to spot the warning signs in the moment. It probably really is only in hindsight that these things become obvious. I wish the healing process didn't have to include periods of time where one's mind inexorably goes back and traces over these things again and again, trying to sort out how the whole thing could have been stopped earlier and some of the pain prevented. 3
Realist3 Posted May 25, 2013 Posted May 25, 2013 I know. Actually, each of us speaking from personal experience and having opposite experiences illustrates how hard it can be to spot the warning signs in the moment. It probably really is only in hindsight that these things become obvious. I wish the healing process didn't have to include periods of time where one's mind inexorably goes back and traces over these things again and again, trying to sort out how the whole thing could have been stopped earlier and some of the pain prevented. One of the best statements I have ever read on this board. 2
merrmeade Posted May 26, 2013 Posted May 26, 2013 I knew right from the start of the EA. My H changed and I could feel it. His phone, his anxiety, everything. I questioned him relentlessly. He denied, denied, denied. Convinced me I had GAD. I even sought help for my own anxiety and trust issues because I couldn't believe my loving H when I had no evidence! Even with all this going on I sat him down one day and made him watch a full Oprah show where she had guests that discovered the spouse's A and were talking about how they had missed the signs and chosen not to follow their gut feelings and believe the A was happening. I talked to my H after the show. I said I know that will be me. The truth will come out later and I will have confirmation that you were having an A this whole time. And lied to me and denied it. And I will be saying "see I was right all along, I always knew it". Yet I still stayed and tried to believe my H. I knew better - but I chose to trust him more than myself. And now here I am. A 3 yr A went on under my nose and I stayed and let it happen. I think we are suppose to try beyond all reason to trust our spouses. I was being an excellent W while my H was being a sh** head. It would NEVER happen again. Live and learn . That is really amazing - that he kept lying through your suspicions even when you'd nailed it. Of course, once a BS uncovers all the details of the duplicity, pieces the stories together - both the story of the A and the story of the cover-up - it's hard to believe that we could have been so naive and easily manipulated. During my investigations to try and understand how I missed the cues, I went through a period of reading about how people lie. I found videos and articles online from wikiHow to at least 5 on TED talks. I'm not sure that it made me a better lie detector, but it DID validate my "intuition." In fact, we all do this but more so with a life partner whose habits and expressions we know intimately. When they're lying, we pick up on it. We just don't expect outright treachery, however, and can't conceive of something we wouldn't do ourselves. But we do "know" and see it; we just don't have the training to say exactly what it is we saw or heard. It also amazes me that it's possible to have gone through all this - duplicity, sabotage, treachery, betrayal by a partner - and speak of it so matter-of-factly. A good thing. 2
krazikat Posted May 27, 2013 Posted May 27, 2013 I know. Actually, each of us speaking from personal experience and having opposite experiences illustrates how hard it can be to spot the warning signs in the moment. It probably really is only in hindsight that these things become obvious. I wish the healing process didn't have to include periods of time where one's mind inexorably goes back and traces over these things again and again, trying to sort out how the whole thing could have been stopped earlier and some of the pain prevented. So very true...sometimes I feel like I had my head in the sand, wanting to ignore obvious signs of betrayal...but with my fwh being an alcoholic who suffered depression the reality is I really thought that was the problem, not that he was having an affair. He was the stay at home parent while I worked full time and went to school. He also went to school part time. Our child has health issues and after trying daycare, just realized it didnt work for us as it seemed we could not find childcare where there was true understanding of her illness, leading to long hospital stays, etc. Because my job paid a bit more and had the better benefits, I continued working while he stayed home. Society still does not view stay at home dads as the norm, so he felt the stigma of people assuming he was a deadbeat. When he started looking for work again once our child started school, we found that even potential employers seemed to look down on him being the stay at home parent. He really struggled finding a decent job. It was a very hard time for him...for us. So his behavior seemed to be due to the combination of depression and alcoholism. Add that to the fact we were fighting alot, and yikes it was not good and our relationship suffered greatly. I hated his drinking and "poor me" attitude. He still resented me for my prior r with om before we were married. Oh, a recipe for.disaster. But yes, warning signs were there, but I thought it was caused by other things. Ah, life. The twists and turns that leads us to where we are today. But I will say that at this time, our relationship is better than it has been in years, like a reset button was pushed and our love is strong. So while I still fight feeling incredibly dense for not realizing what was going on, I also realize that it isnt my fault and I will not beat myself up about it. At least not too badly. 1
xJonnyBlakex Posted May 28, 2013 Posted May 28, 2013 I've missed alot of signs now that I look back on everything and still to this day even though it's been almost a year since my STBXW's first affair I find myself putting pieces of a puzzle together. Like that fact that she never wanted me to have a FB because she was friends with alot of guys from her job and she didn't want me to act all jealous. How she would always have to suddenly go to her office in the evenings because she forget something. Her phone was always face down no matter what. I would find amusement park tickets and certain receipts in her car and she would claim it must have tell out a friends purse or something. The history on our computer was always empty, mostly because when she used it she would use the private browsing feature. She also was so eager to loose more weight and groom herself alot better. And the most who obvious clue that I choose to ignore and believe her lies was when a sexy pair of fishnets she brought to wear for me and a toy came up missing one night when she was supposed to be working. It's way too many things to keep on going
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