Divasu Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 I think everyone tells a white lie from time to time. Some tell white lies out of embarrassment, fear of being judged, etc. If there is malice behind it, not good, or not wanting to hurt the person's feelings (IE: you look a little chubby in that dress), or if it is something you are not comfortable discussing yet (IE: I wasn't in the mood because I have really bad gas). And, as an aside --> never ask a woman if you have a small penis.
Author USMCHokie Posted May 6, 2013 Author Posted May 6, 2013 What is a lie though? In some cultures direct talk and opinions are frowned upon because of the face-saving nature of that culture. It's very prevalent in parts of Asia for example. People are strongly discouraged from giving you their straight opinion to your face. Does that mean they are all liars? Well, if someone refused to answer a question or make a statement, then I wouldn't consider them liars; but it'd be enough to infer that they did not have a favorable response and cared more about what people thought of them than revealing their thoughts.
Author USMCHokie Posted May 6, 2013 Author Posted May 6, 2013 Of course, I want the truth on important things. And where is that line? That's pretty hard to define. Indeed, it's very hard to define for just one person; imagine having to define a consistent line for two people in a relationship...! 1
Eternal Sunshine Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 Indeed, it's very hard to define for just one person; imagine having to define a consistent line for two people in a relationship...! That's one of the reasons why my life is much more peaceful when I am not in a relationship
candie13 Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 But isn't this preventing open communication with a partner? What if it was a sensitive subject that actually mattered? Would you simply avoid it altogether just to avoid the short term discomfort and let it fester until it blows up one day? I don't know what to say, there's no black and white answer. It depends from people to people and from relationship to relationship. I like my men a bit more complicated, a bit more challenging. I think keeping things for one's self is most of the times a display of maturity, because you are using your judgement as to what type of information you find useful (or enriching) to share. Cannot stand those men who literally dump all of their sh*t onto their wives / gfs, expecting them to clean up their mess. I also think that, in time, people learn to trust eachother more and open up more. IMO, the issue is not "why do they tell white lies". The answer to that one is easy: "because they have dirty little secrets to hide, because they don't want to share their weaknesses, because they treasure their intimacy, because the want to protect what's intimately close to their heart or maybe because they simply love their freedom". The real issue is "why aren't they telling the truth". The answer may be "maybe their partner cannot handle the truth. Maybe there is not enough trust and intimacy. Maybe there is judgement. Maybe there is fear of getting hurt". So rather than going at their partner for hiding things, understand what made them keep that info for themselves. There lies the real measure of your relationship.
Emilia Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 Do you define one's assessments of his observations as opinions? If you asked someone what color the sky was, would his answer (blue) be his opinion? Colour is perception. There are more people than you realise who know it's blue but don't see it. There are few universally accepted answers but for the person who sees something else instead of blue, the answer is not blue. Sorry, to answer the first question: yes. I do count them as opinions.
Emilia Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 Well, if someone refused to answer a question or make a statement, then I wouldn't consider them liars; but it'd be enough to infer that they did not have a favorable response and cared more about what people thought of them than revealing their thoughts. So others' opinion always has to be convincingly high of you?
Author USMCHokie Posted May 6, 2013 Author Posted May 6, 2013 Sorry, to answer the first question: yes. I do count them as opinions. Fair enough. Whether it's facts or opinions, the terminology used doesn't really change the idea.
Author USMCHokie Posted May 6, 2013 Author Posted May 6, 2013 So others' opinion always has to be convincingly high of you? What do you mean by "convincingly high of [me]"...?
Emilia Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 Fair enough. Whether it's facts or opinions, the terminology used doesn't really change the idea. I think it does. Facts are something that usually have an impact on my life because they are unmovable. Opinions are far less relevant because they don't necessarily stop what I want to do though might require me to seek out those with favourable opinions.
Emilia Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 What do you mean by "convincingly high of [me]"...? Sorry, I meant 'convincing' AND 'high', not convincingly high.
Author USMCHokie Posted May 6, 2013 Author Posted May 6, 2013 I think it does. Facts are something that usually have an impact on my life because they are unmovable. Opinions are far less relevant because they don't necessarily stop what I want to do though might require me to seek out those with favourable opinions. Isn't love an opinion? And does it not have an impact on your life...? And are you also saying that we value more the opinions of those who have favorable opinions of us and ignore those who have unfavorable opinions?
Emilia Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 Isn't love an opinion? And does it not have an impact on your life...? Emotion is an opinion so I seek those out that love me rather than hate me. And - just as importantly - those that love me in the right way. And are you also saying that we value more the opinions of those who have favorable opinions of us and ignore those who have unfavorable opinions? I think that you want a balance because if you only value those that are yes-sayers you are likely to go off the rails unless you are a particularly strong self-aware person. However, most of us will prefer like minded people and hopefully will be healthy enough not to surround ourselves with unfavourable opinions. This is a bit simplistic though because I think that good people who positively contribute to your growth as a person will largely have favourable opinions of you but will occasionally criticise.
Author USMCHokie Posted May 6, 2013 Author Posted May 6, 2013 I think that you want a balance because if you only value those that are yes-sayers you are likely to go off the rails unless you are a particularly strong self-aware person. However, most of us will prefer like minded people and hopefully will be healthy enough not to surround ourselves with unfavourable opinions. Well of course a balance is what we all strive for...so without going too far down the rabbit hole, I guess the question I posed is to which end of the spectrum you find yourself? Do you prefer those who tend to disclose more or less to you? And do you tend to disclose more or less to others? Do we expect from others what we expect from ourselves?
pcplod Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 Hey, you can confuse the f**k out of anyone with just the simple, plain boring truth. Why venture into the uncertain territory of la-la land? With the truth you can always elaborate, with lying you only get caught out and get you ass burnt.
carhill Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 Interesting topic. Reading, the thought occurred that I should become more creative with the truth to be more interesting. It's been awhile since I dated but I'm chagrined to share that I can't think of one white lie I told the two ladies I dated while separated. Unknown whether the reverse held true but past experiences support the trend of path of least resistance lubrication, hence I'd say I'm used to hearing white and not so white lies but their existence is generally only known later so is unknown in the present; I don't particularly 'like' it, but am 'used to' it. Life goes on.
serial muse Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 There's a sort of idea buried in here that telling the truth necessarily involves saying something bad. That being honest = being negative, even if pleasantly so. We could all be more honest about positive things, too; but since they don't bother us, we don't think of not saying them as omitting the truth, nor do we consider downplaying those truths (for whatever reasons) as white lies. I suspect that many, many, many people would be more OK with hearing uncomfortable truths if they were also given the opportunity to hear the pleasant truths more often. People tend to be stingy with those, though, and they never seem to be the subject of debate like this. 2
FitChick Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 What was the name of that film where the main character always had to tell the truth. A rather unpleasant person to be around I would think. Be careful what you wish for!
BoneyHadger Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 Good motto for me seems to be: Just because something is true, doesn't mean you have to say it. I tend to avoid issues I consider both counterproductive and unpleasant at once, no matter the truth. If someone keeps drilling for them in magical "conquest for truth", that has little meaning in practice, I tend to get pressured, then pissed off with them. Might include telling a lie to shut them up, but I'd rather they just stop in time.
FitChick Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 A lie is an untruth. There is no disputing that, no matter who's perspective you look at it from. So if the man you adored said, "My friends can't stand you because you are so stupid" you'd be okay with that? You slave over a hot stove to cook dinner for him and he takes one bite and says, "This is inedible. Never cook for me again" you'd be okay? "You could learn a lot from my last girlfriend when it comes to sex" is fine with you? Hey, he's just being honest, right? Be careful what you wish for.
FitChick Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 Just because something is true, doesn't mean you have to say it. I tend to avoid issues I consider both counterproductive and unpleasant at once, no matter the truth. If someone keeps drilling for them in magical "conquest for truth", that has little meaning in practice, I tend to get pressured, then pissed off with them. Might include telling a lie to shut them up, but I'd rather they just stop in time. I totally agree with this. Some people just like being miserable or making others miserable. "But it's the truth!" 2
FitChick Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 I'd like to ask all the Truth Tellers how much money they make.
SensitiveTJ Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 What was the name of that film where the main character always had to tell the truth. A rather unpleasant person to be around I would think. Be careful what you wish for! Are you thinking of "Liar Liar" with Jim Carrey? I love that movie.
carhill Posted May 6, 2013 Posted May 6, 2013 I'd like to ask all the Truth Tellers how much money they make. Very little, but enough to eat. Yeah, that movie was Liar, Liar with Jim Carrey. Funny as all get out. I think it just played this weekend on DTV.
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