M30USA Posted April 22, 2013 Posted April 22, 2013 Jesus was able to walk on water, walk through walls/doors, and perform other physical miracles. There is one miracle, however, that I just found which I had been reading right past for years. If you read the following paragraph, it is clear that Jesus transported his boat and all the disciples 3-4 miles instantly, as if he was capable of teleportation: "When evening came, his disciples went down to the sea, got into a boat, and started across the sea to Capernaum. It was now dark, and Jesus had not yet come to them. The sea became rough because a strong wind was blowing. When they had rowed about three or four miles, they saw Jesus walking on the sea and coming near the boat, and they were frightened. But he said to them, "It is I; do not be afraid." Then they were glad to take him into the boat, and immediately the boat was at the land to which they were going." (John 6:16-21 ESV)
KatZee Posted April 22, 2013 Posted April 22, 2013 Maybe I'm reading wrong? But doesn't it say his disciples got into their boat and rowed the 3-4 miles themselves. Around the 4th mile they saw Jesus walking on the water towards the boat. He gets in the boat, and once he's in the boat they hit land. My interpretation of that doesn't point to teleportation. 1
pureinheart Posted April 22, 2013 Posted April 22, 2013 Jesus was able to walk on water, walk through walls/doors, and perform other physical miracles. There is one miracle, however, that I just found which I had been reading right past for years. If you read the following paragraph, it is clear that Jesus transported his boat and all the disciples 3-4 miles instantly, as if he was capable of teleportation: "When evening came, his disciples went down to the sea, got into a boat, and started across the sea to Capernaum. It was now dark, and Jesus had not yet come to them. The sea became rough because a strong wind was blowing. When they had rowed about three or four miles, they saw Jesus walking on the sea and coming near the boat, and they were frightened. But he said to them, "It is I; do not be afraid." Then they were glad to take him into the boat, and immediately the boat was at the land to which they were going." (John 6:16-21 ESV) Wow- excellent find..and I don't think I've ever heard anyone speak or teach on this...awesome dude!
Author M30USA Posted April 22, 2013 Author Posted April 22, 2013 Well considering that Jesus spontaneously appeared inside a disciples house when all the doors were locked, I think teleporting 3 miles isn't inconsistent with the Gospel accounts. Even with that aside, the description is pretty unequivocal and there shouldn't be any question as to what it says.
Author M30USA Posted April 22, 2013 Author Posted April 22, 2013 Nah, Jesus is just really good at rowing. Lol! Yea, rowing in the 4th dimension. 2
dreamingoftigers Posted April 22, 2013 Posted April 22, 2013 I say this respectfully, does it matter at all? I am a believer but when it gets down to nitpicky oddities like this, I'll put together a very small segment of testimony. A year ago on Christmas, my life was very very blessed and centered. I was also going through sheer Hell at the time but knowing my Heavenly Father was guiding and leading and that I could see the path in front of me spared me a lot of unnecessary anguish. That being said, one day particularly blessed, I was given somewhat of an odd sign. This may make others doubt my sanity or scoff. Whatever. We all believe things, and not all of them make sense to others, religious/spiritual or not. I was given a sandwich by really wonderful believing people as a gift, and in his name. They allowed my husband and I into their restaurant, invited us to sit etc. They made us a lunch and brought it to us, even though they were actually CLOSED. Here's the weird part. I am pretty specific about my favorite stuff. And it's usually a weird combination too. They made me my favorite sandwich. I didn't even ask for a sandwich or tell them what I wanted etc. And my favorite sandwich is particular and well, weird. I've never seen anyone else eat a combo like that. Ever. They brought us out our lunches and there it was..... I was actually caught off-guard. The owner just said something along the lines of "being provided for/faith etc." all the usual stuff I don't remember now, but I remember the sandwich. It was like someone knew a little something about me that they whispered to someone else. It was just a small thing, but sometimes small things lead to greater testimonies. I thought about it afterward. In theory, I believe in a creator that designed the whole universe, everything in it and the physical processes that brothh about the Sun, followed by liquid water on Earth, followed by life on Earth etc etc etc. (I truly find it weird when religious people discount scientific evidence of the physical abd chemical processes of creation. Every time I hear more about the "how and why" we are here, it amazes me even more.) It really wasn't any big thing for the Creator of the Universe to have my favorite sandwich made. So in a sense: teleportation or no? Does it matter? You do realize there's a whole universe out there? So in a sense, how much do those 4 or so miles matter? 6
Author M30USA Posted April 22, 2013 Author Posted April 22, 2013 If it's included in Scripture, it matters. Otherwise the Gospels would read as follows: "A really nice man named Jesus loved people a lot." The reason I am interested in these things is because we are now coming to a point in our science where such things are at least becoming seriously considered. We know that on a subatomic level, electrons literally teleport from one location to another.
Feelin Frisky Posted April 22, 2013 Posted April 22, 2013 I got a question. Since the world is round and rotates, where did Jesus "ascend" to when he allegedly rose from the dead? If you believe in a flat world that is stationary, the answer is probably heaven. But if you observe the truth that the world constantly spins and reorients any point on the surface to a different point in infinite space, where did he ascend to? Is he still floating around in the stratosphere? Or is the whole thing "flat world" mythology? 3
BetheButterfly Posted April 22, 2013 Posted April 22, 2013 A year ago on Christmas, my life was very very blessed and centered. I was also going through sheer Hell at the time but knowing my Heavenly Father was guiding and leading and that I could see the path in front of me spared me a lot of unnecessary anguish. That being said, one day particularly blessed, I was given somewhat of an odd sign. This may make others doubt my sanity or scoff. Whatever. We all believe things, and not all of them make sense to others, religious/spiritual or not. I was given a sandwich by really wonderful believing people as a gift, and in his name. They allowed my husband and I into their restaurant, invited us to sit etc. They made us a lunch and brought it to us, even though they were actually CLOSED. Here's the weird part. I am pretty specific about my favorite stuff. And it's usually a weird combination too. They made me my favorite sandwich. I didn't even ask for a sandwich or tell them what I wanted etc. And my favorite sandwich is particular and well, weird. I've never seen anyone else eat a combo like that. Ever. They brought us out our lunches and there it was..... I was actually caught off-guard. The owner just said something along the lines of "being provided for/faith etc." all the usual stuff I don't remember now, but I remember the sandwich. It was like someone knew a little something about me that they whispered to someone else. It was just a small thing, but sometimes small things lead to greater testimonies. I thought about it afterward. In theory, I believe in a creator that designed the whole universe, everything in it and the physical processes that brothh about the Sun, followed by liquid water on Earth, followed by life on Earth etc etc etc. (I truly find it weird when religious people discount scientific evidence of the physical abd chemical processes of creation. Every time I hear more about the "how and why" we are here, it amazes me even more.) It really wasn't any big thing for the Creator of the Universe to have my favorite sandwich made. That's beautiful. I pray someday God uses me like that: to bless someone I don't know. it's so cool how God often chooses to show His love by the kindness of other people!!! 3
BetheButterfly Posted April 22, 2013 Posted April 22, 2013 I got a question. Since the world is round and rotates, where did Jesus "ascend" to when he allegedly rose from the dead? If you believe in a flat world that is stationary, the answer is probably heaven. But if you observe the truth that the world constantly spins and reorients any point on the surface to a different point in infinite space, where did he ascend to? Is he still floating around in the stratosphere? Or is the whole thing "flat world" mythology? The apostles shared what they saw. They saw him going up into the sky and believe he went to Heaven, as the angels (2 men in white garments) said: Acts 1 NIV - Jesus Taken Up Into Heaven - In my - Bible Gateway (I boldened some.) 6 Then they gathered around him and asked him, “Lord, are you at this time going to restore the kingdom to Israel?” 7 He said to them: “It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own authority. 8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth.” 9 After he said this, he was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight. 10 They were looking intently up into the sky as he was going, when suddenly two men dressed in white stood beside them. 11 “Men of Galilee,” they said, “why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven.” The apostles (with the exception of Judas Iscariot who was replaced by Matthias accounted in the first chapter of Acts) were convinced, based on their experiences, that Jesus was alive after his death. While some people today like to mock what they sincerely believed, for other people like me, we believe the testimonies preserved through the ages concerning Jesus by his followers who walked and talked with him. People can of course not believe. That is their right too, same as it is the right of others to believe. 3
Author M30USA Posted April 22, 2013 Author Posted April 22, 2013 This is something that is decided in your mind. You will never be able to decipher if that's what it actually means when anything in the bible can be interpreted however you wish. You are a person who believes Jesus, God and The Holy Spirit can do whatever it is they see fit. Although I think even the writers of that part could have described teleporting a bit more definitively. In the end it says what it says and the teleporting part is only your interpretation. All one can ever do is merely state what the Bible says. Did Jesus actually teleport 3 miles? We can never prove this. But what we can do is decipher what the TEXT of the Bible says. We can also compare it to see if it's internally consistent with the rest of Scripture. In this case, we ask, "Are there other accounts of similar miracles by Jesus and would this seem to line up with them?" The answer is a definite yes. Additionally, the mere phrasing of the language in this particular case is undeniable. I bet you could ask any 4th grader and they would interpret it the same. They may not believe it. But they would interpret what the TEXT says the same.
wuggle Posted April 22, 2013 Posted April 22, 2013 I thought Jesus was God ? , God is omnipotent and omnipresent. He didn't teleport, he wouldn't need to, he is always in all places at all times. Teleporting is for losers. Come on, get with the programme 1
Author M30USA Posted April 22, 2013 Author Posted April 22, 2013 I thought Jesus was God ? , God is omnipotent and omnipresent. He didn't teleport, he wouldn't need to, he is always in all places at all times. Come on, get with the programme Yes, he is omnipotent and omnipresent. Thus he is able to enter into the world of man, within the constrictions of physics and biology. Why do you put such a limitation on God? 2
Mme. Chaucer Posted April 22, 2013 Posted April 22, 2013 Yes, he is omnipotent and omnipresent. Thus he is able to enter into the world of man, within the constrictions of physics and biology. Why do you put such a limitation on God? With respect (really) I have to ask you why your Christianity seems to hinge so much on conjectures such as this one, the UFO's, etc. Don't you think that YOU are "putting a limitation on God" by constantly claiming to be able to interpret and speak for this deity? The words are there. It's not the place of any one person or group of people to tell the others what they mean. Why not just get out there and DO something for others, in real life? Isn't that the essence of Christianity? 1
wuggle Posted April 22, 2013 Posted April 22, 2013 Yes, he is omnipotent and omnipresent. Thus he is able to enter into the world of man, within the constrictions of physics and biology. Why do you put such a limitation on God? I'm not putting any limits at all on your god, that's my whole point. Why are you putting words in my mouth ? My point was that it is you who is being inconsistent in putting limits on your god. Why put forward the idea that he teleported ? he would have no need as he is in all places at all times. 1
Author M30USA Posted April 22, 2013 Author Posted April 22, 2013 (edited) With respect (really) I have to ask you why your Christianity seems to hinge so much on conjectures such as this one, the UFO's, etc. Don't you think that YOU are "putting a limitation on God" by constantly claiming to be able to interpret and speak for this deity? The words are there. It's not the place of any one person or group of people to tell the others what they mean. Why not just get out there and DO something for others, in real life? Isn't that the essence of Christianity? Christianity is dead. It's a carcass and the Bible unfortunately has become nothing more than a bunch of bedtime stories, mythologies, and get-rich-quick verses. I merely have discovered it's REAL. I believe it's so real that most people would literally soil their pants if they knew. Additionally, I post much about UFOs here because--unfortunately--the subject has been relegated to the area of fringe quackery and I can't discuss it at work or in most social situations. So I post it here where, in general, there is no social reputation and people (hopefully) can reason better. UFOs are not some peripheral, unimportant issue. When Jesus returns, he will be attacked as an invading alien human. Laugh if you want. It will happen. How people can read the Bible and not see this blows my mind. What's even more important is that HE will be the good guy and WE will be the bad ones. Nobody would ever suspect that WE are the bad guys in an angelic invasion. But scripture fortells it. Edited April 22, 2013 by M30USA
Author M30USA Posted April 22, 2013 Author Posted April 22, 2013 Yeah but you start to get into too many variables here. First off if you were going to decipher anything you would need to go to the earliest known source. Not something that has been altered or translated in anyway. Ive also never heard this teleport theory before so unless I have missed something for as long as the bible has been around nobody else has come to this conclusion, including you until recently. All Im saying is if you think like that then there is nothing that Jesus couldn't do in your eyes. So whatever possibilities your dream of in your mind are possible. I still think the authors of the bible would have better described teleportation in more detail than what was written. Then again it could all have said something different in its original text. BlackG, The authenticity and accuracy of Scripture is only questionable to those who haven't researched it. I encourage you to read Paul Little's book called "Know Why You Believe". It's very concise and gives the main points supporting the authenticity of Scripture. I've read both sides of the debate. I hope you do the same. 1
Author M30USA Posted April 22, 2013 Author Posted April 22, 2013 I beg to differ there. If there is only one true version of the Bible we wouldn't have so many branches of the same book. We have the originals in Greek for the New Testsmant--from which we get all modern translations. Any question in translation merely references the original Greek. If you read the book by Paul Little you would see that the New Testament is the most authenticated ancient book by a factor of 500 compared to the second place runner up. 1
dreamingoftigers Posted April 22, 2013 Posted April 22, 2013 Christianity is dead. It's a carcass and the Bible unfortunately has become nothing more than a bunch of bedtime stories, mythologies, and get-rich-quick verses. I merely have discovered it's REAL. I believe it's so real that most people would literally soil their pants if they knew. Additionally, I post much about UFOs here because--unfortunately--the subject has been relegated to the area of fringe quackery and I can't discuss it at work or in most social situations. So I post it here where, in general, there is no social reputation and people (hopefully) can reason better. UFOs are not some peripheral, unimportant issue. When Jesus returns, he will be attacked as an invading alien human. Laugh if you want. It will happen. How people can read the Bible and not see this blows my mind. What's even more important is that HE will be the good guy and WE will be the bad ones. Nobody would ever suspect that WE are the bad guys in an angelic invasion. But scripture fortells it. I no longer feel nuts for thinking that my little sandwich was a little blessing from God. 1
Author M30USA Posted April 22, 2013 Author Posted April 22, 2013 I no longer feel nuts for thinking that my little sandwich was a little blessing from God. LOL what?
todreaminblue Posted April 22, 2013 Posted April 22, 2013 Jesus was able to walk on water, walk through walls/doors, and perform other physical miracles. There is one miracle, however, that I just found which I had been reading right past for years. If you read the following paragraph, it is clear that Jesus transported his boat and all the disciples 3-4 miles instantly, as if he was capable of teleportation: "When evening came, his disciples went down to the sea, got into a boat, and started across the sea to Capernaum. It was now dark, and Jesus had not yet come to them. The sea became rough because a strong wind was blowing. When they had rowed about three or four miles, they saw Jesus walking on the sea and coming near the boat, and they were frightened. But he said to them, "It is I; do not be afraid." Then they were glad to take him into the boat, and immediately the boat was at the land to which they were going." (John 6:16-21 ESV) teleporting normally involves a portal or two portals......he didnt need them seeing jesus did bleed from every pore and survived i think getting from point a to point b instantly isnt much of a stretch for the son of god, who created the earth in under a week and made a woman from a rib of a man..if jesus could cast out demons with the laying on of hands and sickness that deformed and maimed sufferers...............read the hearts of men with out a manual he would to me.....be able to go from a to b....without effort.........deb
Author M30USA Posted April 22, 2013 Author Posted April 22, 2013 So you are saying that the New Testament is perfect and anything else is completely not to be trusted? Edit: Hold on I missed something here. The OT was written in Hebrew, was it not? Then Aramaic became more popular. Isnt that the language that Jesus spoke? Then the NT was written in Greek. Im pretty sure there is plenty of mistranslation in that span. You specifically mentioned Scripture about Christ, which is the NT and all written in Greek. Correct. And if you know anything about Greek, it's one of the most technical and detailed language. Languages like this translate the best since there is minimal ambiguity. 1
Author M30USA Posted April 22, 2013 Author Posted April 22, 2013 (edited) BlackG, One reason why this "boat teleport" verse caught my attention is because, interestingly enough, the same thing happened to colonialist John Winthrop in the late 1700s. He was in a boat with fellow lawyers, they saw a blinding light pulsating in sky for 2-3 hours as they drifted downstream, then suddenly he and his associates were instantly transported back upstream where they started (2-3 hours earlier). None of them knew what happemed and John Winthrop is documented as a "sober" man. You can look this up. John Winthrop was an icon in Massachussetts at that time--a prominent lawyer and political figure. He documented this in his journal. Edited April 22, 2013 by M30USA 1
Author M30USA Posted April 22, 2013 Author Posted April 22, 2013 I'm not questioning that it was documented. I'm also not questioning what they believe happened to them. Can we say definitively that is was happened, they were teleported by some weird phenomenon? Nope, we cant. My point was that their story specifically says teleportation or transfer of some kind. I could easily come and say it was due to massive time warp that actually sucked them in and placed them back where they started with no loss of time to them. In fact I could come up with whatever I wanted and try to connect my own dots, but the story says what it says. I could make a case for that very easily by connecting what I want to connect and making it seem what I want it to. In the end that is still my interpretation. That's what you did with the writings of Christ. You connected the dots the way you wanted to and came to your own conclusion when its says nothing like that. You find connections where you need to in order to fulfill your own conclusions. I connected the dots for you regarding the writings about Christ (New Testament). To date we have 2,500 original manuscripts in Greek that are all identical to the copies we have today. (Just as a reference point Plato's Republic, I believe, has only 6 to 8.) If you wanted to get into a discussion of OLD TESTAMENT authenticity, that is another issue which I don't see as pertinent here since we are talking about Christ. Even if you exclude all the prophetic references in the NT from the OT, you still have more than enough information about Christ to form solid arguments.
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