D-Day...maybe

[So happy together]

Of course we want to know the truth. But it's not a game. Odds are that this man just said nothing to his wife and she will now be gaslighted over some damn shirt.

 

If the BS is being gaslighted, it is not the fault of OP, it is the fault of MM. She just put return to sender and stuck it in the mail. As far as I am concerned, this makes it HIS fault, not hers. He is the one cheating.

[So happy together]

 

I don't always advocate telling the wife.

 

A true honest OW should simply walk away without causing mayhem at home.

 

I accept affairs as a natural part of life. IN this instance sending the package with the love letters from the cheating man was a cruel act and furthermore it was done with the intention to create chaos.

 

If the cheating man ends the affair and returns full bals to his marriage there is no need to stick a dagger in the chest of the wife. And lets not forget that most of the time the OW tells the wife because the OW is scorned. Thyere is no altruistic motive here.

 

 

I see a pattern of people putting all the blame on OW. It should be on MM. You say not to create mayhem at home? Who created the mayhem? The MM! He is the one that cheated, if he chooses to stay, he can deal with the consequences, and OP sending the package back was, in my opinion, the right thing to do. It takes her out of the situation, no need for confrontation, and the BS can deal with her wandering husband. After all, he is the one that made vows with her, and he is the one who betrayed her. I'm not saying OW/OM don't have culpability, I'm just saying, it is their marriage, if OP is out of it now, let them deal with the crap xMM put his wife through. Stop blaming OP.

[lynn1954]

Yes, when there is a messy, ugly situation there is always plenty of blame to go around.

 

I agree that we should offer comfort and support to the OP "Goodbye" because she is the member of this forum and she posted a message here for help and support.

 

No need to further judge and debate whether she was right or wrong. Give "Goodbye" a little peace of mind.

[ThatJustHappened]

 

 

I see a pattern of people putting all the blame on OW. It should be on MM. You say not to create mayhem at home? Who created the mayhem? The MM! He is the one that cheated, if he chooses to stay, he can deal with the consequences, and OP sending the package back was, in my opinion, the right thing to do. It takes her out of the situation, no need for confrontation, and the BS can deal with her wandering husband. After all, he is the one that made vows with her, and he is the one who betrayed her. I'm not saying OW/OM don't have culpability, I'm just saying, it is their marriage, if OP is out of it now, let them deal with the crap xMM put his wife through. Stop blaming OP.

 

Actually the blame should be on both of them. They both did something wrong.

[So happy together]

Right and wrong are subjective. She broke no laws, she broke no vows. HE did. Whatever she feels, whether it is guilt, relief, love, hate, it is hers to feel. I don't feel guilty at all over my EMR. We are not in an affair anymore, but I didn't feel guilty then, and I don't now, and nothing you say will make me feel guilt. You are not the morality police.

[ThatJustHappened]

Right and wrong are subjective. She broke no laws, she broke no vows. HE did. Whatever she feels, whether it is guilt, relief, love, hate, it is hers to feel. I don't feel guilty at all over my EMR. We are not in an affair anymore, but I didn't feel guilty then, and I don't now, and nothing you say will make me feel guilt. You are not the morality police.

 

Blah blah blah. Keep justifying.

[So happy together]

Blah blah blah. Keep justifying.

 

Really? I'm not justifying anything. I don't need to. I am happy in my R. We are out of the affair now. What I am saying is, it is the responsibility of the person who betrayed the BS... that would be the MM. If he had a ONS would you blame the ONS? It is on him. OM/OW have no interest in the marriage, the MM/MW does. Get over your judgement, and try to be helpful, would you?

[ThatJustHappened]

Really? I'm not justifying anything. I don't need to. I am happy in my R. We are out of the affair now. What I am saying is, it is the responsibility of the person who betrayed the BS... that would be the MM. If he had a ONS would you blame the ONS? It is on him. OM/OW have no interest in the marriage, the MM/MW does. Get over your judgement, and try to be helpful, would you?

 

Cool..introduce me to your husband. I'll have sex with him and then I'll rinse off and you and I can grab a drink afterwards and compare notes about his sexual prowess! Sound like a plan?

 

I am not a particularly judgmental person, and I'm not an OW hater, but knowingly sleeping with someone else's husband is wrong. I'm not blaming the other woman completely. I blame both of them. I don't find that judgmental.

 

If a married man had a one night stand with a woman who knew he was married, yeah, I would blame her right along with him. If she didn't know he was married then no, of course it's not her fault.

[So happy together]

Cool..introduce me to your husband. I'll have sex with him and then I'll rinse off and you and I can grab a drink afterwards and compare notes about his sexual prowess! Sound like a plan?

 

I am not a particularly judgmental person, and I'm not an OW hater, but knowingly sleeping with someone else's husband is wrong. I'm not blaming the other woman completely. I blame both of them. I don't find that judgmental.

 

If a married man had a one night stand with a woman who knew he was married, yeah, I would blame her right along with him. If she didn't know he was married then no, of course it's not her fault.

 

 

Wow. Guess what? I am not married, but I guarantee my boyfriend will not stray because I know what he needs. Unlike the BS (in my case only, I don't know the situations of all the other women) I am not a drunk, who ignores him, who won't have sex with him, who won't do anything fun with him, who leaves him alone, and lonely. So say what you want, if you were in my position six months ago (he's left and we are together now), you would not need to rinse off, she would have no idea because she has not touched him for 12 years.

 

You do not know what my boyfriend has been through. He's been through a lot for us to be together. Religiously, socially, emotionally. His life was so empty that he was willing to give up a lot (as have I) to be together. Sometimes there is just someone who is better suited to address the needs of MM. And to make him no longer be MM. Say what you will, judge me, as I am sure you will, but you know nothing. If you are BS, your man cheated for one of two reasons: One: He is a serial cheater. No thanks... not interested. Two: He was neglected and unloved. Which is why he loves me, because I know how to take care of, and love him.

 

Say what you will. I won't believe a word of it. You talk about OW justifying, but that is what BS's do. ALL DAY LONG.

[waterwoman]

If you are BS, your man cheated for one of two reasons: One: He is a serial cheater. No thanks... not interested. Two: He was neglected and unloved. Which is why he loves me, because I know how to take care of, and love him.

 

Say what you will. I won't believe a word of it. You talk about OW justifying, but that is what BS's do. ALL DAY LONG.

 

Hmm.... it really isn't that simple in most cases. I am not married to a serial cheat, and H was not neglected and unloved. I will concede there were issues but not just mine - do you really think it only takes one spouse to spoil a marriage? If what you say is true it was only a question of which is us cheated first as we were both feeling a little lonely and disatisfied with our relationship.

 

But FWIW I don't beleive you are at fault for your man breaking his marriage vows. That was his to own. And I don't beleive you 'owed' his BS anything, but if you don't mind me saying you do seem a bit lacking in empathy towards her. It's one of the worst experiences in my life, the realisation that my H was involved in an EA, truly horrible, I felt worthless, ugly, hopeless, at times suicidal. Will it make you happy to know I beat myself up for months for being a bad wife? It must have been my fault after all. It has taken me 9 months to realise that no, it wasn't ME it was him, the issues that needed add addressing were far better addressed by him NOT having an affair. And we are now doing so.

 

So, I disagree that affairs happen just for your 2 simple reasons.

 

Sorry for t/j.

[ComingInHot]

Sohappy wrote, " but I guarantee my boyfriend will not stray because I know what he needs. "

 

I thought the EXACT same thing!

H Still cheated w/all his needs being met...

He wanted wanted more than he needed. He wanted what he Wanted due to sense of entitlement, ego and flat out selfishness.

He got exactly what he wanted at the time and has regretted it since.

But that's just my experience & I know it can be different for some*

 

So happy, I cannot begin to imagine the internal conflict, your bf must struggle w/denying his family, faith and M. Has he turned his back on all of it to this day? Do you offer any support to him Re-embracing his family & faith, or do you encourage his renunciation of these things so you two will have a better chance at staying together?

 

I'm just curious.

[So happy together]

Sohappy wrote, " but I guarantee my boyfriend will not stray because I know what he needs. "

 

I thought the EXACT same thing!

H Still cheated w/all his needs being met...

He wanted wanted more than he needed. He wanted what he Wanted due to sense of entitlement, ego and flat out selfishness.

He got exactly what he wanted at the time and has regretted it since.

But that's just my experience & I know it can be different for some*

 

So happy, I cannot begin to imagine the internal conflict, your bf must struggle w/denying his family, faith and M. Has he turned his back on all of it to this day? Do you offer any support to him Re-embracing his family & faith, or do you encourage his renunciation of these things so you two will have a better chance at staying together?

 

I'm just curious.

 

I'm glad you asked this. I just want to quickly point out that I do not hold my bf's stbxw completely to blame. He was complacent. He stopped reaching out to her, stopped trying. I'm not saying he didn't play his part. He readily admits that it wasn't just her, it was just a relationship that failed. He feels they were never really compatible, and so stayed long enough to raise their daughter, who is now an adult and on her own.

 

To answer your question, I absolutely have NOT encouraged him to renounce anything. I have encouraged him to mend things with his daughter, which he has, and with his faith, there isn't much I can do. I encourage him to do what feels right for him, and I tell him I will support him. You see, that is my job. To support him, to understand where he is coming from.

 

Also, I really do have empathy for his stbxw. I know she is going through a lot. But she does some really stupid things, like sending him drunk texts at two a.m. I know that I haven't really explained his situation, and I don't feel I need to, but suffice it to say that there were many, many nights where she would be so drunk she would vomit, then fall asleep sitting on the toilet. She refused to get help, would not go to therapy, would not work on the marriage, and now that he's left (we do not live together, my bf has an apartment and we are working toward living together, but not until he is divorced, etc.), she's trying to do all of the things she should have been doing for the last twelve years, but it is too late. So, while I feel sorry for her, feel bad that she is suffering, I also have a bit of not feeling sorry too, because she should have been doing things to keep the marriage together for years, and did not care. She is feeling now, abandoned and lonely, what he's felt for the last twelve years. So, I have no guilt. I am glad he is finally doing things that make him happy. He deserves to be happy, and be loved.

 

And frankly, all she is worried about is his money disappearing from her life. Sorry, but it's true.

[Goodbye]

I'm glad you asked this. I just want to quickly point out that I do not hold my bf's stbxw completely to blame. He was complacent. He stopped reaching out to her, stopped trying. I'm not saying he didn't play his part. He readily admits that it wasn't just her, it was just a relationship that failed. He feels they were never really compatible, and so stayed long enough to raise their daughter, who is now an adult and on her own.

 

To answer your question, I absolutely have NOT encouraged him to renounce anything. I have encouraged him to mend things with his daughter, which he has, and with his faith, there isn't much I can do. I encourage him to do what feels right for him, and I tell him I will support him. You see, that is my job. To support him, to understand where he is coming from.

 

Also, I really do have empathy for his stbxw. I know she is going through a lot. But she does some really stupid things, like sending him drunk texts at two a.m. I know that I haven't really explained his situation, and I don't feel I need to, but suffice it to say that there were many, many nights where she would be so drunk she would vomit, then fall asleep sitting on the toilet. She refused to get help, would not go to therapy, would not work on the marriage, and now that he's left (we do not live together, my bf has an apartment and we are working toward living together, but not until he is divorced, etc.), she's trying to do all of the things she should have been doing for the last twelve years, but it is too late. So, while I feel sorry for her, feel bad that she is suffering, I also have a bit of not feeling sorry too, because she should have been doing things to keep the marriage together for years, and did not care. She is feeling now, abandoned and lonely, what he's felt for the last twelve years. So, I have no guilt. I am glad he is finally doing things that make him happy. He deserves to be happy, and be loved.

 

And frankly, all she is worried about is his money disappearing from her life. Sorry, but it's true.

 

This is a very sad story all around.

[So happy together]

I agree that it is sad, but he's moved on with his life. I'm happy for him. Even if we didn't end up together (we will) I am happy that he is doing what is best for him for the first time in his life.

 

Our affair was not a decision we made lightly. We just realized, after nearly 20 years of denying it, that we were compatible... and we have a connection that we've never felt with anyone else. So, here we are. I don't regret it.

[So happy together]

 

 

If it is their marriage then why do other women insert themselves into it?

 

Of course. You think I chased him? Put myself between them? Get over yourself. I didn't insert myself. He sought me out because he was lonely and miserable. There you go, blaming the OW, rather than the people who should be blamed for their marriage ending, THEM. Not me. Them. However, I'm glad it ended. He deserves better.

[So happy together]

Again...unless the poster is a mind reader she has no clue what all goes through someone else's mind. As a child of an alcoholic I am more than aware of drinking people passing out in their own vomit....I stand by my post.

 

Stand by it all you like. The fact is, people don't have to live with someone like that if they choose not to. I'm glad he chose not to. I would never stay with someone who did that.

[Goodbye]

I agree that it is sad, but he's moved on with his life. I'm happy for him. Even if we didn't end up together (we will) I am happy that he is doing what is best for him for the first time in his life.

 

Our affair was not a decision we made lightly. We just realized, after nearly 20 years of denying it, that we were compatible... and we have a connection that we've never felt with anyone else. So, here we are. I don't regret it.

How did you meet? How did the affair start? What was the D-day? When did your AP chose you?

[So happy together]

I don't dispute that someone should have to stay with a person like that. I completely agree that someone should walk away. I dispute your claim to know that the only thing she is worried about is money...of which I stated when I posted.

 

Okay, let's talk about it. In the last four months, every single text she has sent has had to do with the fact that she will be broke (she won't). She never says she loves him, that she misses him, that she wants to be better. She says (and I've seen the texts) "You need to stop this and come home. We will go broke if you stay away", and "How do you expect me to live on just my salary", or "She only wants your money" (speaking of me). Just so we're clear, I make a good living and have never taken money from him. Ever. So, I may be guessing, but it is an educated guess.

[Goodbye]

Well when someone drinks themselves to the point that they sleep on the toliet periodically and won't get help sounds like they aren't deserving of a lot of empathy. Looks like she's shown exactly what she cares about.

 

If you have a problem get help, if you don't.. oh well, then the repercussions of that are on you.

 

If you can't give up the bottle to save your marriage, despite being asked to over and over then you've made the choice to give up your marriage. You can whine about it all you want later, but you made your choice.

 

 

Having battled and won the battle with substance abuse during my own AWFUL marriage, I can tell you this is a vastly oversimplified view of what this woman is dealing with. Addiction can make you look selfish, complacent, bad...but it isn't what the person is. It is a mask of the pain and it isn't easily addressed. I hope she finds the help she needs.

[Goodbye]

Yes, well my point is that we have no idea if she IS fighting or not. It isn't an easy fight. It may not always look to outsiders like the person in the throws of addiction is trying. But...whatever. Doesn't really matter in this case.

[Goodbye]

Okay, let's talk about it. In the last four months, every single text she has sent has had to do with the fact that she will be broke (she won't). She never says she loves him, that she misses him, that she wants to be better. She says (and I've seen the texts) "You need to stop this and come home. We will go broke if you stay away", and "How do you expect me to live on just my salary", or "She only wants your money" (speaking of me). Just so we're clear, I make a good living and have never taken money from him. Ever. So, I may be guessing, but it is an educated guess.

 

 

Has he filed for divorce yet?

[So happy together]

Having battled and won the battle with substance abuse during my own AWFUL marriage, I can tell you this is a vastly oversimplified view of what this woman is dealing with. Addiction can make you look selfish, complacent, bad...but it isn't what the person is. It is a mask of the pain and it isn't easily addressed. I hope she finds the help she needs.

 

That is the point. She is not dealing with it. Refuses help. Now, she wants him to go back to her, but she is unwilling to change anything. She doesn't want to be better, she wants to have things back the way they were, when she didn't have to worry about anything. As things are, she will have to go back to work full time. This just doesn't leave time for her drinking schedule.

 

The simple fact is, he does not love her. So, it would be worse for him to go back and continue to pretend.

 

And that is on them, not me. I did not insinuate myself into their marriage. It was broken long before I came along.

[So happy together]

Has he filed for divorce yet?

 

Yes. He's had enough. It is over. She knows it.

[So happy together]

I am going by what I see. Which is what we all do in this life.

[Goodbye]

Yes. He's had enough. It is over. She knows it.

 

Yes, I'd assume if he has filed for divorce, and she has been served, she would know it.