gone down the road as far as I can go...

[native7two]

Sorry if this is just pure rambling vent. I am entirely new to this forum. I wish I had come here a bit earlier in the saga of my wife's affair and our attempted recovery. I am sorry for everyone on here who is dealing with this rather FML-grade situation.

 

It has been a good 18 months since the initial discovery -- I surveilled her and found out about a sexual encounter she had with a co-worker. After months of her trying to explain it away as a one-off one-night deal -- constantly trying to reassure me that nothing else happened -- while my gut was telling me otherwise, I eventually decided to lie about getting phone records from the TelCo -- she freaks out, goes blank with that deer-in-the-headlights look, and turned silent -- only to have her a few hours later admit to a longer betrayal which spanned many more months. It was a full year after the initial discovery before she came clean under the pressure of my manipulation for the truth. The hardest part for me has been the follow-up lie, and the distant cold unremorseful way she went about it -- she was so afraid of my getting upset, that I would get angry (who wouldn't?) that she stood across the room and didn't even bother to even say sorry -- she simply assumed her disclosure would end the marriage so it felt like she didn't bother to factor in my feelings. I can fess up to my own issues -- some verbal anger management, namely, but I have never been physically abusive, I just have a very intense way of using words which is hurtful, I own that part of myself 100%, but I'm not the classic "abuser" -- and I went to work on those things even while the wife was secretly engaged in her affair. I did these things at the for the benefit our two very young children as much as for my marriage. I still continue on that work, initially in the hopes of trying to be a better partner to my wife, and now simply to be a better father and a better person. My wife still feels "stuck" to me -- I have forgiven her in a deep part of my heart (really, in a deeply unconditional way, because otherwise my heart would eat itself alive) and allowed her to leave her job and stay home with the kids, we go to counseling, I do anger management groups, I have truly mellowed out, and yet...it's just not working.

 

I am now realizing that I've been the one from the very beginning wearing the Rally Cap, leading the way, having to cue my wife fully through our recovery. Every time I try and ask my wife for reassurances when I am on the "yo-yo", she gets silent or defensive -- "I am not hurting you anymore! Nothing is happening!" -- and tries to pin everything back on me -- how my standards are too high, how I'm a perfectionist, and now because some counselor pinned me as having a borderline personality disorder (BPD), she refuses to read up on affair recovery and instead reads up on my supposed BPD problems. I would admit that I have some of the BPD traits, and can humbly accept those things, I feel no acceptance from my wife about any of her work around my current emotional state. She's put me back in the same box where I was when she was betraying me. And now she appears to be the one with the anger problem, constantly becoming irritable and verbally abusive herself. She has even lobbed the "other people would have gotten over it by now" bomb a couple of times. I have tried and tried and tried to invest myself emotionally in my role in the affair and have taken concrete steps to change myself and to work to change the marital dynamic, but it seems like my wife is really not doing half the work. I never thought I would complain about having an "emotionally unavailable" wife -- sure, she is a very sexual being and that was fun for a time, but the liability is becoming just too much given the track record.

 

I'm becoming emotionally divested in a way that is neither angry nor anguished -- it just feels natural. I no longer react to my wife's reactions. I guess this is where the pavement ends. At times I feel like a complete chump, or like a completely failed person, or like I simply complain too much -- that maybe my wife is right. But in my gut, you just know when you are a fundamentally good person and when it's time to call it a day. My children adore me and I adore them -- I stuck it out and built a peaceful kingdom by forgiving somebody who wounded me, it's an empowering thing to take on and my kids like the kinder gentler me, I like the kinder gentler me -- it worked really well for a while for my marriage too. But I'm tired of pulling the bulk of the weight all of the time, of always being the one to come to the rescue.

 

Thanks for any support, sympatico, shared experiences on here.

[leonine]

Reconciliation is tough. I'm sorry that you had to go through all that, and that in the end, your wife wasn't able or willing to do the work necessary to reconcile. At least you'll be able to walk away knowing that you did your best. Keep working on yourself and when you're ready, you'll attract a partner worthy of you. Best of luck.

[drifter777]

Reading your story makes me angry. For her to blame you for so much of her decision to screw another man is unconscionable. For her to say things like "normal person would be over this already" is callus and cruel. It's called gaslighting and a common trick of a cheater. You say you have forgiven her so that you would feel better and you characterize it as "forgiving somebody who wounded me" as if it's a badge of courage. This is not forgiveness because your wife has done nothing to earn your forgiveness. What you have done is called "cheap forgiveness" and you did it in an attempt to compartmentalize the trauma of her betrayal and stuff it into the dark reaches of your mind. You hope that "time heals all wounds" so you are hoping for a miracle. You need individual counseling in order to even begin to heal and taking care of your personal recovery is more important than trying to repair your marriage because you can't really do one without the other.

 

Reconciliation requires a truly remorseful cheater who is willing to do anything to repair the damage they have done. Your wife hasn't demonstrated that she meets this criteria. And remember, at best reconciliation after an affair is long, hard work and may lead to divorce in the end anyway. With her attitude toward the affair and your feelings it would be a waste of time.

[native7two]

Gaslighting indeed. What is particularly infuriating is that it often feels like our marriage counselor often feeds the behavior. In fact, just today he even told me that "You don't even know what you need and that we should move on from the affair and not talk about it anymore." Pretty much a cue for my wife to figure her work is over.

[Bryanp]

If the roles were reversed I bet your wife would not have this attitude. The question is why do you remain with her and are afraid to move on? She does not respect you in the least and is a chronic liar and cheater. If you do not respect yourself then who will?

[Holyoak]

Hell, my wife told me:

 

"Grow up and get over it"

 

Plus she said if I were a better husband, she would not have done "it" (never has used the word affair, cheating, etc), plus a million other ways to blame me for her affair... So like your WW, mine is a heartless coward, lacking any empathy, blame shifting, gaslighting, skilled liar. Good luck to you, and keep believing in yourself.

[Artie Lang]

your wife is blameshifting, bro. your marital issues had nothing to with her bedding another man.

 

it takes at least 2-5 years to get over an affair. if she thinks just because you've forgiven her for cheating, things go back the way they were, she's sadly mistaken. do not let her rugsweep this affair.

 

have you informed this OM's wife? she needs to know about her husband's philandering.

[native7two]

The OM doesn't have a wife or kids -- good that only one family was wrecked by this, right? Honestly, I just want to end blaming and hating, as much on my end as hers. I just want to be done with the whole damn thing and move on. It feels good to be clear on that finally. The key quote tattooed on my forehead now is: The Only Way To Win Is Not To Play The Game

 

Thanks everybody, for back-up on being in a place where I was feeling some self-doubt before.

[drifter777]

The OM doesn't have a wife or kids -- good that only one family was wrecked by this, right? Honestly, I just want to end blaming and hating, as much on my end as hers. I just want to be done with the whole damn thing and move on. It feels good to be clear on that finally. The key quote tattooed on my forehead now is: The Only Way To Win Is Not To Play The Game

 

Thanks everybody, for back-up on being in a place where I was feeling some self-doubt before.

 

We all understand that you want this to be done and be able to move on. The problem is that this is not possible. You deal with it now or suffer longer and stronger later. Find a counselor for yourself. Don't waste any more time or energy going to see that lame marriage counselor. If your wife gives you sh$t about quitting MC then just pack some things and leave. It would do you good to be by yourself for a while and make some of these decisions away from her manipulation. It also might scare the hell our your cheating wife if you show her you can walk out and start over if you need to.

[BetrayedH]

Read the thread pinned at the top of this forum, Thing That Every WS Needs To Know. It will give you a clue what true remorse looks like. Artie is right that it takes 2-5 years. Perhaps more importantly, you cannot go around an affair; you must go through it. You cannot rugsweep it. Doesn't work.

 

What does work is your wife attending individual counseling to determine why she had this affair. It has rained destruction on her family and she would probably say it's against her own ethical standards. People who voilate their own standards as part of their coping mechanism are broken. She is either severely conflict avoidant, has an excessive need for external validation, or an overdeveloped sense of entitlement - probably a combination. IF she had a struggling marriage, her obligation was to fix it or leave. An affair fixes nothing. It's illogical, unethical, destructive, and an unhealthy choice against her own standards. Why would she do that? Guess what? The answer lies within her. This foolish coping mechanism probably goes back to her family of origin/childhood. It has little, if anything, to do with you or the state of the marriage. It is something broken within her. If she is introspective enough, she might be able to recognize this pattern of behavior and avoid the use of this stupid coping mechanism in the future. And if you see that introspection happening with her, you may also start to have some faith that you won't suffer a repeat performance. She has to dig deep and THAT is how true reconciliation occurs. The initial answers barely scratch the surface of her true "why." I recommend at least six degrees of why.

 

Why did you cheat?

"I don't know why. It just happened. My husband didn't meet my needs"

Why do you think it happened?

"I was lonely and liked the attention from the OM."

Why did you like the attention?

"Because I've never felt loved, even by my husband."

Why have you never felt loved?

"Because my Dad..."

 

Drifter is right that you are offering cheap forgiveness. You have to see true remorse first, even though you desperately want to put this behind you. You CAN'T and it's because you have the cart before the horse.

 

Your therapist, like many, clearly does not have a clue how to handle infidelity. Fire them. It's that simple. Standard advice is to try a counselor for three sessions and if you don't both have a connection, move on. Your therapist wants to rugsweep and is doing your marriage more harm than good.

 

Like you, my wife chose to "trickle-truth" instead of coming fully clean. I found the truth 8 months into a bull**** reconciliation where she was lying about her new-found honesty. As we see too many times here, trickle-truth kills more marriages than affairs. By the way, I ended up divorcing (thank goodness). You sound like you're ready to throw in the towel as well. Frankly, it's for good reason.

 

Good luck.

[native7two]

Thanks BetrayedH for sage words and advice-- glad you are in a place where you are putting everything behind you. I actually emailed the "Thing That Every WS Needs To Know" thread to my wife yesterday. I read through it and felt that it would be a good test to see if she even would make the effort to even read it. I know already that she won't.

 

Of course, she is in full blameshifting-mode now, along with being trapped inside a lot of her own issues, namely abandonment. She was, quite literally, abandoned by her mother, born to an absentee dad, and spent her childhood being lied to and shifted around -- that her grandparents were her birth parents, that her birth mom was an aunt, and so on. Her entire childhood/family experience was one giant rugsweep. Any wonder. She's so consumed with her own insecurities that she can't even begin to comprehend mine, as much as she is trying. I know she feels remorse but she is too overwhelmed to convert it into re-conciliatory action. Of course, I feel compassion for her pain and issues, obviously. But given the actions she *did* take, however, yeah...I'm suiting up for the fire after the frying pan (divorce).

[BetrayedH]

Thanks BetrayedH for sage words and advice-- glad you are in a place where you are putting everything behind you. I actually emailed the "Thing That Every WS Needs To Know" thread to my wife yesterday. I read through it and felt that it would be a good test to see if she even would make the effort to even read it. I know already that she won't.

 

Of course, she is in full blameshifting-mode now, along with being trapped inside a lot of her own issues, namely abandonment. She was, quite literally, abandoned by her mother, born to an absentee dad, and spent her childhood being lied to and shifted around -- that her grandparents were her birth parents, that her birth mom was an aunt, and so on. Her entire childhood/family experience was one giant rugsweep. Any wonder. She's so consumed with her own insecurities that she can't even begin to comprehend mine, as much as she is trying. I know she feels remorse but she is too overwhelmed to convert it into re-conciliatory action. Of course, I feel compassion for her pain and issues, obviously. But given the actions she *did* take, however, yeah...I'm suiting up for the fire after the frying pan (divorce).

 

Sometimes hitting them with divorce papers serves as a wake-up call. The good news is that you can always halt divorce proceedings should you see something from her that gives you pause.

 

Reconciling after infidelity is ridiculously difficult and there's no doubt that it takes two. The initial heavy lifting is almost entirely on her to show true remorse and rebuild trust. Once that happens, then the burden shifts to you to try to forgive. No matter how much you try, you can't do the second part before the first.

 

For what it's worth, I think you're on the right path. If divorce papers don't make her see what she is sacrificing with her stubbornness, then you're on the way to the divorce you need.

[2sunny]

There's nothing to build upon since she's not doing everything possible to earn your trust back!

 

That counselor needs to be reported - and fired!!!

[Darren Steez]

Thanks BetrayedH for sage words and advice-- glad you are in a place where you are putting everything behind you. I actually emailed the "Thing That Every WS Needs To Know" thread to my wife yesterday. I read through it and felt that it would be a good test to see if she even would make the effort to even read it. I know already that she won't.

 

Of course, she is in full blameshifting-mode now, along with being trapped inside a lot of her own issues, namely abandonment. She was, quite literally, abandoned by her mother, born to an absentee dad, and spent her childhood being lied to and shifted around -- that her grandparents were her birth parents, that her birth mom was an aunt, and so on. Her entire childhood/family experience was one giant rugsweep. Any wonder. She's so consumed with her own insecurities that she can't even begin to comprehend mine, as much as she is trying. I know she feels remorse but she is too overwhelmed to convert it into re-conciliatory action. Of course, I feel compassion for her pain and issues, obviously. But given the actions she *did* take, however, yeah...I'm suiting up for the fire after the frying pan (divorce).

 

I call bull on that.

 

You make choices in life and you learn from them. As a child you were near a fire and saw a red glowy thing and you picked it up, the pain you felt from them ember made you drop it quick, you learned from that day not to pick up embers or anything hot.

 

She choose to cheat, to lie. That was her choice. She's a grown woman, so you can stop making excuses for her. What's she's doing now has nothing to do with abandonment or coping with her insecurities. She wasn't remorseful from the beginning, choosing to lie and omit things. Only when you dug further did she fess up. She's not remorseful now. Instead she sees you working on yourself and trying to repair this marriage after her betrayal and she resents it? Why? She cheated on you for a reason. That reason is still valid now.

 

You can only move forward TOGETHER if she owns up to what she did. She's not doing that. She got away with it and now you're the one breaking your back to make things right...she's barely lifted a finger. There also must be some resentment on your part when you see she's not putting in the effort you are, you're trying to smile sucking on that lemon and can't help make a face..you get what I'm saying? Even though you're trying your damnedest, her lack of effort means you fire off a quip or you snipe at each other.

 

Maybe it's time to put your cards on the table. Make this all real for her and stop her coasting through this. Show her what she has to lose and that you're willing to walk away. Only so many times you can get punched in the gut.

[LeGenDary_Man]

Gaslighting indeed. What is particularly infuriating is that it often feels like our marriage counselor often feeds the behavior. In fact, just today he even told me that "You don't even know what you need and that we should move on from the affair and not talk about it anymore." Pretty much a cue for my wife to figure her work is over.

Time to consider another counselor then.

[native7two]

I contacted another counselor and outlined very reasonable rationale around it -- that we need more "tactical" counseling, how to do deal with stuff day-to-day versus our current guy who is a Buddhist Marin County type and is mostly about spiritual things, it's like we're barely treading water in the shallow end and this guy throws us into deep philosophical stuff, and in the end it is basically facilitating my wife's dodge and my own self-flagellation. It's a smokescreen for accountability to skip to the "acceptance" stage so early on. But, alas, the wife has dug in her heels yet again and is making this about ME, about my resistance, about how I'm never satisfied, etc etc etc. In the end, she simply won't budge on seeing a new counselor. In the end, action is simply too difficult for her, and she puts everything on me. I'm the one who has to mold myself around her. I'm not allowed to be angry because I have an "anger problem", and I'm not allowed to be depressed and questioning and to expect reassurance because she feels she's doing a great job and my high standards are the problem.

 

I can't paint my wife with a single brushstroke. I sometimes have too much dyed-in-the-wool left coast upbringing in my blood. We're all complicated and have our own issues. Very clear to me now, she needs me to basically forsake my needs in order for me to provide her the necessary safety for her to then return that safety to me, passing through her, digested to her satisfaction, and then returned to me with a fresh coat of paint. It's an emotional transaction that is a scam, an interpersonal ponzi scheme, where she is not adding sufficient value to the investment I'm putting in against the risk that I'm taking, day after day. She is blind to my risks and the pain of my sacrifice, and only feels fear. She left her job where the OM worked with her, because I took on winning the bread exclusively and she started taking of the kids more. She initially expressed a lot of remorse and was very effusive and loving -- but it was like a courtship phase all over again, we were just in the moment of our relationship being new again in some ways because our history had been blown to bits. But all this time -- all that time I was doing the heavy lifting and providing her the strong unconditionally accepting man that she needed, she was still withholding and lying while I was pleading with her to help resolve my gut fears which eventually proved true. Her fear and needs simply override the necessary sacrifice and work -- and I can feel compassion for that, but only as somebody who is a co-parent and maybe an old friend, but certainly not a partner.

 

I'm no longer in mourning over the affair. It's now mourning the wreck of my marriage, and looking ahead to trying to keep my children happy and whole and safe. Thanks to every poster here again for support and some added clarity.

[BetrayedH]

You summarized very well what happened in my own failed/false reconciliation.

 

You will begin to heal once you have your own place and start building a life that is yours (without her). Some of it is very liberating. Better days are coming.

[2sunny]

If she's not owning her part in it - and doing everything possible to change it - the M will never work.

 

There's nothing to work on if she cheated - and blames you for it!

[native7two]

I am finding this extremely hard, all the same. I am sitting here waiting for my wife to come home so we can have a "scheduled chat". We've been fighting non-stop for the past few days, she's been distant and combative. I know what is coming now: the talk from the WS where she expresses her ambivalence about the marriage, all her doubts, all her hopelessness about how we can't change, about how she feels unsafe, etc etc while I sit by and wonder if she even sees who is transcending doubt and hopelessness and who is also feeling unsafe. It seems so easy for people to just wind back their hearts to pre-D-Day as if the BS is invisible. Today will be one of the harder days among many hard days. I need to remember to own my own happiness more than her unhappiness.

[drifter777]

I am finding this extremely hard, all the same. I am sitting here waiting for my wife to come home so we can have a "scheduled chat". We've been fighting non-stop for the past few days, she's been distant and combative. I know what is coming now: the talk from the WS where she expresses her ambivalence about the marriage, all her doubts, all her hopelessness about how we can't change, about how she feels unsafe, etc etc while I sit by and wonder if she even sees who is transcending doubt and hopelessness and who is also feeling unsafe. It seems so easy for people to just wind back their hearts to pre-D-Day as if the BS is invisible. Today will be one of the harder days among many hard days. I need to remember to own my own happiness more than her unhappiness.

 

Dig in, emotionally, and remember that your recovery is more important than your marriage at this point.

[BetrayedH]

Dig in, emotionally, and remember that your recovery is more important than your marriage at this point.

 

I agree. You've made the noble effort even though it was her place to do the heavy lifting. If she can't reciprocate after that, you need to start being concerned about yourself first and you need to steel your resolve.

[native7two]

Well, it's official now. She apparently already withdrew a handsome inheritance she got recently out of our joint account and is finding her own place with her own money. Ya-hoo! She was gearing up for this as much as I was. She point blank refused the simply request to go to ONE counseling session with another therapy. Put all on that it would be a waste of time because of a million reasons that were my fault -- I would fire this one, too, I wouldn't change etc. I even put it in the stark terms of this one simply step being all that I needed to feel hope on my end that we could rebuild our family -- young kids on the line, etc etc etc. Nope, nada. Game over. Relief, grief, relief, grief, relief. If I ever choose to go back to this woman, you are welcome to slap me in the face, hard.

[BetrayedH]

It'll be hard for you to see it this way for a while but I think you just got a Get Out Of Jail Free card.

 

By the way, half of that inheritance is yours. It's a marital asset, my friend. Make sure you document that withdrawl as well as every penny you spend for a while.

 

I know it's tough, believe me. My wife divorced me after her cheating as well. It's a double-whammy to the ego. But the reality is that your new life starts today. The issues were about her. Do your best to look forward as you deal with extricating yourself from this mess behind you. Before you know it, you get to focus on setting up your new bachelor pad.

[Try]

Gaslighting indeed. What is particularly infuriating is that it often feels like our marriage counselor often feeds the behavior. In fact, just today he even told me that "You don't even know what you need and that we should move on from the affair and not talk about it anymore." Pretty much a cue for my wife to figure her work is over.

Why do you even still see this idiot MC? First he takes the heat off of your wife by saying that you have "borderline personality disorder (BPD)", and now you are suppose to stop talking about the affair even though you wife has been lying to both you and the MC about the extent of the affair.

 

Without telling your wife, find a therapist at a major university and get a second opinion about your so called BPD. Do not tell this new therapist that you were diagnosed by another doctor with having BPD, since many do not want to second guess others in their profession. Instead tell him that your wife has been saying that you have it and that you want to get their professional opinion. If the new therapist says that you do not have BPD, you have your easy out from using the current MC. If you do have BPD, switch MC anyway, as he is still a quack.

[native7two]

I was later told -- two days back -- from the same MC to drop the BPD issue. He changed his mind. A real loser, this one. He pulled out the frikkin DSM book and said sorry, there was only one or two symptoms of BPD that I exhibited, and he proceed to read some passage verbatim. Unbelievable. But now my wife -- soon be ex-wife -- is all hung up on externalizing around my so-called disorder, that's why I'm all needy and angry around the affair. If only I had a pill, it would all magically disappear!

 

It's clear we're heading into divorce now. I actually feel bad for my wife in that she's really stuck on this guy as her ongoing individual counselor, as he's going in a direction that's facilitating a lot of her delusions.

 

I've been seeing another men's anger expert guy for many months now individually and he's been my reality check on the whole BPD thing. Bitchy Partner Disorder? Perhaps.

 

Thanks again to all fellow posters.