AlexDP Posted April 8, 2013 Posted April 8, 2013 In the country I was raised in it's 18. And unless the OP is in Italy your point is moot. She's 17. The age of consent is 16 in most countries. 18 is an exception. Whether or not they should date is something else, but he's not a pederast. 1
AlexDP Posted April 8, 2013 Posted April 8, 2013 Did you say she is in the Uni with you? I think the actual age is less important that the stage of life. If she's still in high school then it's 2 different worlds. FYI in the US, a majority of states have 16 for age of consent, and many with 17 or 18 have a "close in age" exemption. Also interesting is the evolution of such laws. As you may have guessed, the ages used to be much younger. Was 19 y/o grandpa a pedo for courting 14 y/o grandma? In fact grandpa may have been ostracized for waiting, "what are you gay, boy?". If morality is universal then why was it ok then but now now? We must conclude that morality is relative if we wish to accept an older age of consent today. Therefore we cannot subject other cultures to our own sense of righteousness. Yet again, I feel Americans deserve a heavy boot to the nuts. There has been an evolution in both directions. These things change all the time. What I do not understand about the US is that you cannot drink until you're 21, but you can drive a car at 16. Both have obvious risks, yet there's this huge gap between them. Personally I do not think I would have been a very responsible driver at 16 (you have to be 18 over here), but I was a pretty responsible drinker (you can drink at 16 here). I'm not saying that this is how it would be for everyone, just that I don't understand the difference. 1
USMCHokie Posted April 8, 2013 Posted April 8, 2013 any age under 18 is off limit Ugh...this needs to be clarified once and for all. In the United States, about half the states have an age of consent of 16. The other half are split between 17 and 18. There are other special conditions like persons of authority (e.g., school teachers and administrators), but in general, the "anyone under 18 is illegal" is a widely propagated myth. 2
BetheButterfly Posted April 8, 2013 Posted April 8, 2013 Ugh...this needs to be clarified once and for all. In the United States, about half the states have an age of consent of 16. The other half are split between 17 and 18. There are other special conditions like persons of authority (e.g., school teachers and administrators), but in general, the "anyone under 18 is illegal" is a widely propagated myth. Just because someone is of the "legal" age, that does not mean she or he is emotionally mature. Some people are emotionally mature earlier than others, but the reason some states in the USA and some countries have the age of consent at 18 is to protect the youth from any form of harm. Because sex can horribly involve the violent act of rape (and statutory rape is defined as having sex with someone who is under the age of consent), it is important to take into consideration the general well-being of the youth. Most youth are not emotionally mature at the age of 16. I know I wasn't. Even though I was physically mature, I was not ready to connect with anyone on a sexual level, and I am glad that I was not taken advantage of by anyone. Sad to say, thousands of children even younger than 16 are victims of statutory rape, and thousands of youth 16-18 are also victims of rape or sexual harassment. Because of the lust of people who could care less for the emotional and psychological well-being of the youth, I agree with having the age of consent at 18. Many girls and guys however who are 14-18 are still trying to figure out who they are; their hormones are raging and many do not realize that sexual decisions they make at this time can make their lives harder. Since many youth think they are "invincible", they can tend to behave more reckless than those who are more experienced in life (older). It's important for youth under the age of 18 to concentrate on their studies and on learning about life choices before they make serious ones that drastically affect their futures. 2
AlexDP Posted April 8, 2013 Posted April 8, 2013 Just because someone is of the "legal" age, that does not mean she or he is emotionally mature. Some people are emotionally mature earlier than others, but the reason some states in the USA and some countries have the age of consent at 18 is to protect the youth from any form of harm. Because sex can horribly involve the violent act of rape (and statutory rape is defined as having sex with someone who is under the age of consent), it is important to take into consideration the general well-being of the youth. Most youth are not emotionally mature at the age of 16. I know I wasn't. Even though I was physically mature, I was not ready to connect with anyone on a sexual level, and I am glad that I was not taken advantage of by anyone. Sad to say, thousands of children even younger than 16 are victims of statutory rape, and thousands of youth 16-18 are also victims of rape or sexual harassment. Because of the lust of people who could care less for the emotional and psychological well-being of the youth, I agree with having the age of consent at 18. Many girls and guys however who are 14-18 are still trying to figure out who they are; their hormones are raging and many do not realize that sexual decisions they make at this time can make their lives harder. Since many youth think they are "invincible", they can tend to behave more reckless than those who are more experienced in life (older). It's important for youth under the age of 18 to concentrate on their studies and on learning about life choices before they make serious ones that drastically affect their futures. I'd still say you aren't mature enough to have sex. And who are you to say? I'm 100% sure there are 16 year olds out there who are mature enough to have sex.
Art_Critic Posted April 8, 2013 Posted April 8, 2013 In my state age of consent is 16 and I'm not in some backwards state. The whole "18!!!" thing is such a myth, it's based on where you live. Actually it isn't.... In FLA for example.. the age of consent is 18, the law does permit close in age exemptions... and in FLA this little jewel kicks in.... Unlawful sexual activity with certain minors.-- (1) A person 24 years of age or older who engages in sexual activity with a person 16 or 17 years of age commits a felony of the second degree, To the OP, you're 20, she is 17.. still a teenager.. while your age isn't horribly older than hers she might be a bit young for you, she is starting to figure out who she is and you have been doing that for a couple of more years than her. Do you really need to be dating someone that young ? what would he parents think ? 2
GorillaTheater Posted April 8, 2013 Posted April 8, 2013 what would he parents think ? Speaking as the dad of a 17-year-old girl, not much. If her dad's anything like me, OP, count on him getting in your grill hard and fast. 3
Art_Critic Posted April 8, 2013 Posted April 8, 2013 Speaking as the dad of a 17-year-old girl, not much. If her dad's anything like me, OP, count on him getting in your grill hard and fast. Yeah.. that is kinda what I was trying to get him to think about... We have to make decisions every day on if something is right or wrong and most of the time the wrong decision isn't against the law. 1
RogerWallace111 Posted April 8, 2013 Posted April 8, 2013 (edited) It's fine. She's probably significantly less mature than you, as 3 years is a notable gap in young adulthood. That's the only worry. She may be a pain in the ass, or just kind of dumb. Edited April 8, 2013 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
RogerWallace111 Posted April 8, 2013 Posted April 8, 2013 (edited) Yeah.. that is kinda what I was trying to get him to think about... We have to make decisions every day on if something is right or wrong and most of the time the wrong decision isn't against the law. He's a kid, like her. Yes, I suppose as a father, a 17 year old dating your 17 year old is preferable, and comes across as more tame. But it's 3 years. just make sure the kids not a f*ck up. Edited April 8, 2013 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
GorillaTheater Posted April 8, 2013 Posted April 8, 2013 (edited) He's a kid, like her. Yes, I suppose as a father, a 17 year old dating your 17 year old is preferable, and comes across as more tame. But it's 3 years. , just make sure the kids not a f*ck up. A guy who's almost 21 wanting to "date" my underage daughter is a f*ck up by definition. Edited April 8, 2013 by a LoveShack.org Moderator 2
carhill Posted April 8, 2013 Posted April 8, 2013 OP, if you can look her father in the eye as you shake his hand when meeting him, and that encounter goes well, she's not too young to date you. She is of the age of sexual consent and you have shown that you can prosecute the relationship potential as a man. Was the nightclub serving alcohol? In the UK, there are restrictions on the serving of alcohol to persons under age 18. If she was drinking underage, and that's a habit, that's another factor to consider if choosing to date her. As an adult, you could have issues surrounding 'service', in addition to the age difference. I'd suggest caution, along with sensitivity to the sensibilities of her family. Good luck. 2
RogerWallace111 Posted April 8, 2013 Posted April 8, 2013 A guy who's almost 21 wanting to "date" my underage daughter is a f*ck up by definition. We're not talking about your daughter, Mr "It's All About Me!" The girl in question is of age. A 20 year old and a 17 year old having a completely legal relationship is crazy to some people..? Really? At both of those ages kids are immature as f*ck. You really think "Oh, he's three years older, he must be a real man now, and he's going to use that three years of great wisdom to coldly & calculatedly take advantage of this infinitely different, innocent 17 year old." 2
RogerWallace111 Posted April 8, 2013 Posted April 8, 2013 And I say all that with very clear acknowledgement that it's not an optimal, splendid set up. But if there's mutual interest, intentions are good, and there are no legal issues, I don't think it's wrong.
WhoreyBull Posted April 8, 2013 Posted April 8, 2013 If morality is universal then why was it ok then but now now? Morality is not universal. However, standard of living has everything to do with when people get married and have children People in the past died young. In the past 50 years life expectancy for north americans has gone up about ten. I am not sure about you but my family were prairie people, coming to Canada before the country had a name. You had to start having children young in order to further the species. If you were't on the fast track to family life there would be no one to run the farm and take care of you when you were old. 15 would not have been odd to be married and on your own homestead with a baby on the way (if not a second). Today we have the luxury of thinking of someone as a young adult, keep in mind it wasn't until almost the 1940s that child labor was outlawed in America. There is a period these days from about 12-17 where a person isn't considered a child, but they aren't expected to do anything an adult would. This was not the case 50 years ago. The idea of what children and young people can mentally handle was very different. Not to mention no one cared about women's opinions on the matter, they were property. An additional argument is that before the advances in sanitation we know today it was extremely common to lose both the mother and child. Even if you weren't on the farm (where you might be slightly better off being seen by a midwife if there were no complications... doctors in hospitals used to put their hands in multiple women, no gloves, no washing). So Grandpa being chastised for waiting so long is in case grandma dies and we need a new one. Then Grandpa will be 20 years old and too old to find an other wife.
WhoreyBull Posted April 8, 2013 Posted April 8, 2013 (edited) 17 i was with a girl who was 15... See, I think the issue here is (imo) the only outcome of dating from ages 20 and lower is getting penetrated and causing emotional problems. And from personal experience anyone I have met who is dating someone 3 years younger than them during their teens (male or female) was socially or emotionally stunted. Not even saying that is a bad thing, I have one person I still know from high school who we laugh about what a loser he was dating a 16 year old when he graduated. He eventually admitted he liked the attention. That this dumb girl who knew nothing of the world fawning over him made him feel like the "man" he was supposed to be, when in reality it was emphasizing to everyone else what a boy he was. In this day and age I think the difference between 15 and 18 is absolutely too great. (In my other post about how the past used to be I forgot to mention that Grandma would stop going to school before Grandpa and stay home to learn to be a wife. Therefore a 15 year old girl would already be in the mindset of having children and a family since she was born. Grandpa gets maybe up to grade 6 and then he is a man. People used to be raised to be adults. How much distance in maturity do you think they had... Not much I'll tell ya) Edited April 8, 2013 by WhoreyBull 1
SincereOnlineGuy Posted April 9, 2013 Posted April 9, 2013 Legally, it depends on the state. You should look up the statute of limitation for your state before pursuing this. Yeah, right!! He can potentially rape some young lady and then hope he need only outrun the long arm of the law for X number of years, instead of forever. Note to self: If ever planning to commit a felony, have an escape plan mapped-out, and enough food and supplies to last only that many years until the statute of limitations runs out.
Art_Critic Posted April 9, 2013 Posted April 9, 2013 And I say all that with very clear acknowledgement that it's not an optimal, splendid set up. But if there's mutual interest, intentions are good, and there are no legal issues, I don't think it's wrong. That was my point, the age gap at 17 of 3-4 yrs makes it hard to have mutual interests as they are in a very different place in their lives.. most likely... She is young, not mature and beginning her life as a young girl trying to figure out who she is while he is already moving forward with the direction in his life. 17 is a teenager... 20-21 is not and has quite the age gap.. at 30, 3-4 years in maturing isn't anything but at 17 it is a bunch. I totally agree with Gorilla and echo his sentiment. 1
Radu Posted April 9, 2013 Posted April 9, 2013 (edited) She's 17. The age of consent is 16 in most countries. 18 is an exception. Whether or not they should date is something else, but he's not a pederast. Ummm, considering that pederasty means homosexual relationships between an adult male and an underage male ... probably not because you know, this is about a heterosexual relationship. Edited April 9, 2013 by Radu
BetheButterfly Posted April 9, 2013 Posted April 9, 2013 I'd still say you aren't mature enough to have sex. Aww A total stranger doesn't think I'm mature enough to have sex. So amusing, that is. My husband and I beg to differ. We're both 35 years old, though he's 5 days younger than me. Tell me, am I robbing the cradle? And who are you to say?A citizen who happens to want the world to be a better and safer place for all people I'm 100% sure there are 16 year olds out there who are mature enough to have sex.Agreed. I didn't say that all 16 years olds aren't mature enough to have sex, now did I? I did say I wasn't emotionally mature enough to have sex though at that age, and many other teens aren't either. My Mamaw and Papaw though were "mature enough".. they were married when they were 16 years old; they started working in factories when they were 12. They had to mature fast, since their families basically depended on them, especially my Papaw's family. (His Dad was an alcoholic that beat his Mom and his brothers.) This was around 60 years ago though, and most teens nowadays don't financially support their families, but rather thankfully go to school. When I've asked my Papaw if he regrets having to work as a kid, he says that he never even thought about it. It just had to be done, but he does wish that his Dad had been responsible and mature and instead of getting hooked on alcohol, had instead been caring to/for his family and had supported his sons in their education.
BetheButterfly Posted April 9, 2013 Posted April 9, 2013 Speaking as the dad of a 17-year-old girl, not much. If her dad's anything like me, OP, count on him getting in your grill hard and fast. I admire so much your love for your kids!!! It's so sad how in some countries even today, some parents basically "sell" their daughters (under the age of 17) in marriage. I wish that weren't the case, but it is so sad that this happens even today. Some are married off to old men, while others to men in their 20s. Regardless, the age differences is just one of the many factors that spell out terror and hard lives for the child brides.
BetheButterfly Posted April 9, 2013 Posted April 9, 2013 In this day and age I think the difference between 15 and 18 is absolutely too great. (In my other post about how the past used to be I forgot to mention that Grandma would stop going to school before Grandpa and stay home to learn to be a wife. Therefore a 15 year old girl would already be in the mindset of having children and a family since she was born. Grandpa gets maybe up to grade 6 and then he is a man. People used to be raised to be adults. How much distance in maturity do you think they had... Not much I'll tell ya) Yeah, so true.
chex Posted April 9, 2013 Posted April 9, 2013 You guys are failing to note the great achievements of the young people today. Responsibility and (real) maturity are quite invisible traits honestly. I think nowadays kids have to grow up fast as well, to have hope later in life. Athletes start their careers at 11, 12, even earlier. There are so many examples of teen prodigies like madeon or Justin Bieber, or the 16 year olds on american idol. Canadian hockey stars are selected at an incredibly young age. The divorce rate has increased, meaning more children living with only one parent. There's a world of temptation, in the form of drugs and alcohol, at their fingertips. In order for someone to be successful, they have to grow up, and grow up fast. Really, the only calamity I see with today's youth is the immense victim culture. So many youth feel like they can't change their circumstances, sometimes using this to not even take responsibility for their own actions, and rather than fixing it they just bitch and moan about it. But the successful ones don't. The successful ones find a solution and apply it. 1
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