Still hurting but trying to move on

[Rainy1030]

This is long, lol. Sorry!

 

My fiance and I were friends for a year before we got together. We did everything together. After I got divorced (nothing at all to do with him, it was a miserable failure of a marriage, my ex never had anything to do with me, he was a complete a$$, etc), we started talking about trying things out between us. After several months, he moved in. All went well...I know often moving in so quickly doesn't work out well, but for us it did.

 

Fast forward a year. Our first year had been just fine, no fighting, no real arguing, just discussions and the like. Everything was good. I had gotten pregnant early on by accident, but we were both excited. I had our little girl almost exactly a year into the relationship. He sent pics to everyone in his phone, including a former gf I knew about. And thus started our problems.

 

It turned out she was going through a hard divorce, so he started chatting with her. No problem with me, I trusted him and wasn't worried about it...I knew they'd been friends as well. After about a week of them chatting, I came across an email saying "I love you" from her. I told him NO. NOT COOL. He said he was sorry and would stop talking to her immediately (and did). The next day, I was on his computer and it had restarted, opening Skype. She said hey to him, and their entire previous convo history was on there...so I read it. The whole thing. LOTS of lovey dovey crap back and forth, him saying he wanted to marry her, have kids, buy a house, blah blah. Basically lots of fantasy stuff, no hows or whys or reality to it, just...yeah, fantasy.

 

He stopped talking to her for the time being, the only time I saw anything between them were two very brief convos over the next couple of years, one of them saying hi, hows it going, other one saying fine, that was it. I wasn't happy about the contact but at least it wasn't bad. Then, last year, they started it up again, again within days of contact. This time he quit it on his own, I found out after the fact.

 

Anyway, she was really our only issue in the four years we were together. Still almost no fighting, a few very minor things but nothing that lasted more than a few minutes. I moved out to his hometown last year, we lived with his parents for a bit, and he got this horrid job. He started getting depressed (he told me after the fact that he liked to contact her when he was down because it made him feel better), and apparently started talking to her again in November. We rented a house together in December, after he'd bought me a wedding ring, we bought all the stuff for the house together, he was genuinely excited. But still, he was getting more depressed. Then at the beginning of January, he told me he wanted to go hunting with a friend a few weeks out. I said ok, no problem. He went, didn't contact me and stayed a lot longer than he said he would. I was upset, obviously. He came home and acted odd.... After that he was VERY depressed, wouldn't do much of anything besides work, I never once saw him smile, he was just...not himself. I knew there was a strong possibility he'd been down to see her but I was in denial too I think. He left the house to "isolate" and started cutting his arm up horribly. He started drinking constantly.

 

He then disappeared for a day, no one knew where he was. I went over to his parents the next morning, not knowing where he was still. I was worried! Finally, he called his mom and talked to me...at this point he told me he was indeed with her, that he was leaving me for her, he was in love, she was the one and was always the one, that he loved me but more like a best friend, but she makes a fire burn inside of him. I freaked, because I really didn't see it coming, at all. I know he'd had these talks before, but it'd been a year since I'd last seen him talk to her, and he SEEMED so ok with us!! I mean he bought me a ring ffs!

 

Anyway, he came back that night and changed his story, saying it was a trial between them and she knew this (I doubted that from the start). He said he still loved me again-kept saying it the entire week and a half he was still up here-and that he didn't really know who he wanted, what he was doing etc. He seemed genuinely sorry he was doing all of this. We still hung out, took care of things that needed to be taken care of, and we talked, a lot. Sometimes he'd even get teary eyed (he's a manly man, crying doesnt happen!). He insisted from day one, even on the phone, that he'd be taking care of the finances, that I needed to get a job but he'd cover the extra (I was a stay at home mom for the last 7 years, getting a job that paid enough for the bills just wasnt going to happen).

 

Two days before he left, he was drunk and got really sweet and tried to sleep with me. I said no. I didn't like cheating, even if it was on someone else and with me. We talked again, and he kept loving on me (kisses, hugs, etc-stuff he hadnt been doing) Then the next night, I went off and got drunk-I was depressed over his leaving and was trying to drown the sorrow, I guess. I lost my sense of morals that night and slept with him one more time. I still feel bad about it

 

Anyway, he left-its now been 7 weeks. I've told him I was happy for him, and I'm moving on, that I hope he continues to be happy, and he (after much harassment, since he started to say it and stopped himself initially) explained that he's actually a trainwreck, he's still depressed, he misses our daughter, and he still has feelings both ways. I tried to get him to talk to me about things, but he refuses. He pretty much tries to avoid me. I finally lost my temper about 2 weeks ago, briefly (his gf posted a pic of our daughter to her FB and it got to me). I apologized immediately and thought we were good, but he was still all sorts of pissy when he came over to drop off our daughter on Saturday and took the TV and shotgun with him. :/ I told him the next day I was going no contact to try to heal, that I was sorry again (I know, I shouldn't have to say that, but I don't want pissiness), and that I hoped someday he'd be himself again, because right now he's a stranger. He hasn't helped me with rent, I'm facing eviction-NO ONE can believe that he's doing that, no one! Its just not him! Same with the taking things, and getting so mad at me over everything.

 

Anyway, anything negative about her is overlooked, or ignored. He always has an excuse. For instance, she came outside TWO WEEKS after he left me, while I was picking up our daughter. I'd only been out there maybe two minutes, she had no reason to come outside, but there she was, sauntering out with a little smirk on her face, looking me up and down repeatedly. Apparently she was "just trying to be nice and letting you meet the woman caring for our daughter." Uh huh. Right. She flat out refuses to move up here, but its ok for him to leave his daughter. They've both cheated-she cheated on her first husband with him physically, and her second husband with the 2nd long distance affair. He cheated on her years ago when they were dating (I should add, they were FOURTEEN when they dated and she moved away), and again with me just before he moved down there. She doesn't know that last part though. They moved in together after 3 days together in total. They have no common interests from what I gather-she hates guns, she hates motorcycles, she's not really into cars, her kids play baseball which he's always said was the lamest sport ever (lol).

 

He's ditched ALL his old friends, and adopted hers. But here's part of the problem-he uses his friends as a support system, he talks to them about his feelings and such, not whoever he's with. I know that's kinda messed up, but that's how it is. Now he has zero friends of his own, a girl he isn't being honest with about his feelings, let alone talking about all of this on top of it, and he's already depressed. He seems to keep getting worse and for obvious reasons. Yet, they both post all this junk on FB about how in love they are, back and forth, gag. (Yes, I defriended him, but I was curious and looked first, lol). He PM'd me out of the blue at 1:30 in the morning two days ago, asking if I was awake. I wasn't, told him just that in the morning, and never heard a word back. I have a feeling he's starting to doubt things (or worried that I'm really moving on, ha) but regretted it in the morning.

 

Anyway, point being-myself, everyone we know, and my own psychologists (I started seeing someone once this started) all feel he's infatuated, deeply. He's shown it in soooo many ways, I've already made this long enough so I won't go into it all, but really, everyone who's heard all of it says they have no doubt. Perhaps its grass is greener syndrome too, I don't know. Suffice it to say, I have very little doubt they'll fail. I know I can't do anything from here, but I'm worried about what will happen to him when they do (assuming I'm right). With how depressed he is already, I'm scared for him. I can't help caring, its just how I am. I'm pushing for myself, for healing, for letting go and moving on, and I'm doing pretty good. I do want them to split up, because I want him back up here, I don't want our daughter to go through this long distance visitation crap forever. But as far as us, I really have no desire to be with him, he's like a stranger to me now, he's nothing like the person I knew for so long Its scary! I would like to think someday he'll be himself again but right now...wow. No one recognizes this person. Maybe its depression, maybe its guilt, maybe its regret, maybe its the whole infatuation/only caring about her thing (he's said that himself), I don't know. But it makes me sad, seeing who he's become. How does someone who naturally cares about people try to forget that he's like that? How do I completely move on, knowing he might hurt himself? If they split up and he wants to talk to me, what do I do? Stay supportive without saying I'll take him back or something? I just don't know how to help him in the event that it happens, while protecting myself as well.

 

ETA: I realized I didn't put how old we are. I'm 31, he just turned 26. The other girl is 25. (I should add, I dont LOOK 31, at all...and his parents loved me because I was so much more mature than his prior girlfriends, and, in their words "the first non-crazy gf he's had." She's self described crazy so...maybe that's why he wanted her. Haha.)

Edited April 7, 2013 by Rainy1030

[Cogee]

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Anyway, she was really our only issue in the four years we were together. Still almost no fighting, a few very minor things but nothing that lasted more than a few minutes. I moved out to his hometown last year, we lived with his parents for a bit, and he got this horrid job. He started getting depressed (he told me after the fact that he liked to contact her when he was down because it made him feel better), and apparently started talking to her again in November.

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He's ditched ALL his old friends, and adopted hers. But here's part of the problem-he uses his friends as a support system, he talks to them about his feelings and such, not whoever he's with. I know that's kinda messed up, but that's how it is.

 

There is something in your story about your ex that I want to specifically comment on because it is extremely dangerous. That girl wasn't the only issue you had, you had something MUCH bigger than her as a problem. Deep down, I think you even know it to be true but maybe rationalized it away at some point rather than face it for what it was.

 

This is not what someone looking to build a family should ever be doing. By having a child, you are saying that you two are committing to be there for each other, to become one in life, through ups and downs, and share your lives together until death. That includes all of your feelings. It is unacceptable to be talking to others about his feelings instead of you because it is denying you the true level of intimacy required for a lasting relationship.

 

By accepting "that's how it is" you gave him the freedom to do something so destructive that it would eventually destroy your marriage. This is a ticking time bomb that is going to go off eventually no matter what. Eventually, he will get attached to someone else because by sharing feelings with them he is effectively bonding with them. His history with the ex just accelerated the process, but this could have happened at any time in the future.

 

It's not your fault that this happens, and in fact it's not the fault of anyone who gets cheated on or left for someone else. The cheaters (and yes, this IS emotional cheating) choose to act in this way and there's nothing you can do. In the future, do not accept behaviour like this. I can tell by your post that you are a very loving, caring, and thoughtful mother. I'm so sorry that you have to go through this pain.

 

Until he fixes this part of himself, he will never have a successful relationship. He can get stuck in the honeymoon phase but once that ends he will be back to himself. Don't be surprised if he emotionally and physically cheats with others, going from one train wreck to another.

[Rainy1030]

There is something in your story about your ex that I want to specifically comment on because it is extremely dangerous. That girl wasn't the only issue you had, you had something MUCH bigger than her as a problem. Deep down, I think you even know it to be true but maybe rationalized it away at some point rather than face it for what it was.

 

This is not what someone looking to build a family should ever be doing. By having a child, you are saying that you two are committing to be there for each other, to become one in life, through ups and downs, and share your lives together until death. That includes all of your feelings. It is unacceptable to be talking to others about his feelings instead of you because it is denying you the true level of intimacy required for a lasting relationship.

 

By accepting "that's how it is" you gave him the freedom to do something so destructive that it would eventually destroy your marriage. This is a ticking time bomb that is going to go off eventually no matter what. Eventually, he will get attached to someone else because by sharing feelings with them he is effectively bonding with them. His history with the ex just accelerated the process, but this could have happened at any time in the future.

 

It's not your fault that this happens, and in fact it's not the fault of anyone who gets cheated on or left for someone else. The cheaters (and yes, this IS emotional cheating) choose to act in this way and there's nothing you can do. In the future, do not accept behaviour like this. I can tell by your post that you are a very loving, caring, and thoughtful mother. I'm so sorry that you have to go through this pain.

 

Until he fixes this part of himself, he will never have a successful relationship. He can get stuck in the honeymoon phase but once that ends he will be back to himself. Don't be surprised if he emotionally and physically cheats with others, going from one train wreck to another.

 

Oh no, I agree. It is something he needs to change. I was simply saying I knew from the beginning this is how he tends to be. He did talk to me about his feelings, just nothing he thought would hurt me-which is obviously a problem. He's been the same way with every girl (and yes, when we were friends, he was more open and honest about things he knew might upset me). He's the same with this girl, by his own admission-she has no clue he still loves me and that he's depressed.

 

As for our problems, no, that really was our only problem. I get that the way he talks to friends about certain things that he avoided talking to me about was a problem, but I also didn't feel it was a problem at the time. You are right about that. As for bonding with someone else, no, it was all guys he was talking to, minus one woman who I also know/am friends with, and who he never even got close to cheating with. Every other friend he had was male. But yes, it is something he needs to work on. Just not with me, because it'd take some miracles for me to take him back again...ugh. Don't get me wrong, I of course miss us together, what we had before all of this, but I also know it would never be the same, the chance of reconciliation after all of this is just...it seems pretty danged impossible. Right now I want to get over him and move on with my life. He's lost his mind and isn't anything like the person I knew for the last 5 years. Sigh.

[Rainy1030]

I just read your reply again and something occurred to me. I'm not even sure if this is something you were thinking or not, but when I say he talked to her when he was depressed, he WASN'T sharing problems/emotions/whatever with her. While I agree, he cheated twice in the past, emotional affairs, it was never about us or even how he was really feeling, it was all lovey dovey stuff between them, about them. Wrong, I know. I was incredibly hurt by it.

 

The other times he'd talk to her, it was friendly, no inappropriate stuff. But he said it didn't matter, just talking to her was enough to make him feel less depressed (I've had two psychologists-mine and my sons, who had wanted to know the whole story, explain that its due to his infatuation, that talking to her even in a friendly manner still caused those chemical surges and would make him feel temporarily better). I had told him years ago to stop talking to her, ever, because it'd make it impossible to move on. Guess I was right -_-

 

 

But hey, I'm ok, once I get money figured out, I'll be fine, and I'm quite happy knowing how well I can do by myself!

[Cogee]

I understand, and it does change my response to you. I guess part of my point does remain though, if he is only comfortable talking to the guys about his issues, and a girl makes him temporarily feel good, then what role exactly did he want with you in his life during the relationship? Those are pretty key things to want to share with a partner.

 

I'm glad you are moving on, as it must be very difficult to go through. My initial response was admittedly based on several of my own experiences and things I have witnessed in other relationships. Generally, when a partner is sharing a lot of themselves (emotional, support, or otherwise) with others on things that can be with their partner, it's a very good indicator that it will only go downhill from there.

 

Obviously not every single thing in life can be shared between two partners, and to expect that they do would be asking for the impossible. Friends are extremely important in keeping a balance in life and also a support outside of a relationship, but when it becomes the main source it begs the question, why not with the partner?

[Rainy1030]

I understand, and it does change my response to you. I guess part of my point does remain though, if he is only comfortable talking to the guys about his issues, and a girl makes him temporarily feel good, then what role exactly did he want with you in his life during the relationship? Those are pretty key things to want to share with a partner.

 

I'm glad you are moving on, as it must be very difficult to go through. My initial response was admittedly based on several of my own experiences and things I have witnessed in other relationships. Generally, when a partner is sharing a lot of themselves (emotional, support, or otherwise) with others on things that can be with their partner, it's a very good indicator that it will only go downhill from there.

 

Obviously not every single thing in life can be shared between two partners, and to expect that they do would be asking for the impossible. Friends are extremely important in keeping a balance in life and also a support outside of a relationship, but when it becomes the main source it begs the question, why not with the partner?

 

Well, he definitely shared the vast majority of things with me. Just, yes, certain things he really SHOULD HAVE talked to me about, he didn't, because of fear of hurting me. I really do believe he loved me, he showed it daily, even up until he went to see her (one big thing was, he'd get home super late each night and he'd give me a kiss, even though he almost always thought I was asleep. He really had no clue I always woke up when he'd get home-he was quite surprised when I told him that. Why would one do that if they didn't care still? There was no proving anything to me since he didn't even know I was aware...). But now, he's just...not himself, at all. Its so scary seeing someone you knew for FIVE YEARS and having them be like a stranger!

 

Anyway, I have talked to one of his former friends and found out what all it was he'd talk about (I wasn't actually aiming to find this out, I was trying to find someone who was still talking to him who would keep an eye out for anything worrisome and try to get him to talk to them if that happened-I'm not trying to be involved in it, just concerned) and it really wasn't a ton of stuff. Just, like I said, a few things that might have upset me. But, its still something he needs to change regardless of who he's with. This girl he's with has no idea he's depressed, no idea he's still got feelings for me, no idea he slept with me after they were together (yeah, erm, not my best moment...), and no clue he said he still might come back up here. That's not right either!

 

I absolutely agree that not being 95% open with your partner (as you said, not EVERYTHING has to be shared, lol) is a recipe for disaster. I wish he'd told me the few things he didn't, but I do think he was close to that 95%-just the 5% he didn't share was the wrong 5%.

 

Anyway, I am definitely trying to move on, the pain is too much, and his getting angry at me over any little thing, it gets to me even though I understand why (guilt mainly-its easier to be angry than to feel that guilt), I can't deal with it right now. So...no contact is helping me a lot, I don't have to worry about it, I don't have to see them together (gag), and I can let go. I do still love the guy I was with, I really do...but he's so gone right now. I do wonder if people have successfully reconciled after stuff like this, but I've been trying very hard to push that out of my mind-I need to focus on me and on moving past this, not what to do if he comes back up here and wants a second chance. I'll worry about that when the time comes (although like I said, I highly doubt it'd happen anyway. So many issues now )