I'm a father without kids and dating sucks...

[drew_meister]

I'm recently divorced and we have 2 kids but it's a really f'd up situation. Despite the fact that I was awarded joint custody, my ex-wife essentially decided to abduct my kids by moving to Japan last year. Japan is not a signatory of the Hague Convention international child abduction laws so in a nutshell, there isn't a goddam thing I can do about it. I made the decision to leave her and she was really hurt. She is from Japan and all her family ties are there, but spite was obviously a major factor here because you just don't deprive a father the practical ability to see his kids. Now that whole situation is incredibly painful but I'd rather not go into more in this thread. I'm pretty good at compartmentalizing that pain otherwise frankly I would not be able to function. I'm trying to move on with my dating life but emotional issues aside, it's really hard.

 

IRL I've dated a few girls but the fact that I have kids always seems to ruin any prospects of a LTR. It seems that a lot of divorced parents wind up with other divorcees. I'm like a divorcee with kids but I don't really have kids. I'm not interested in being a father to someone else's kids when I cannot be with my own.

 

So I started using OLD a couple months ago, fully disclosing I'm divorced and have kids, and had no success whatsoever. I have a divorced friend (also with kids) who uses OLD and has crazy success. He says women who are just looking to hookup don't care if you have kids and many of them are even married. But I'm not really interested in random hookups and am seeking a LTR. But it seems to me like unmarried women without kids seeking LTRs on OLD are looking for Prince Charming and being divorced with kids makes me an automatic no.

 

About a month into it, I deleted my first profile and created almost the same exact profile but this time I excluded the fact that I'm divorced (OKC doesn't even list it as an choice actually) and I lie about having kids. Suddenly I started getting many responses to messages and scored several dates. I met someone that I really liked and we clicked from the get go. I disclosed on our second date that I had kids but that my ex took them out of the country. She was a little surprised but she seemed fine with it at the time. We've now gone on about 5 dates, gotten intimate, and could definitely feel things moving towards an exclusive relationship. There was no more "asking out" the last couple times. But then this weekend she suddenly made herself unavailable and didn't return my calls. I texted her Monday evening asking what's up. She said "I don't want kids and I think you're trying to replace your family." I replied that's not the case at all and I'd never do that. She replies "I can tell you want to and hope I'll change my mind one day. Been there done that. I'm not going to be your in the meantime GF". I tried calling and she wouldn't pickup. We texted a bit more and her last text ended with "case closed". I sensed a hostility that I never felt from her before. Anyway, I'm pretty certain it's over. Back to the drawing board.

 

I don't know what to do. I'm not comfortable at ALL about lying about not having kids. But one way or another it's a huge red flag for all the women I meet. If I disclose immediately, I can't even meet a girl online. If I disclose later, even if the lie doesn't bother them, they just automatically assume I'm damaged goods because of what my ex-wife did to me by taking the kids. It's actually WORSE than just being a normal divorced dad with joint custody. I left her because I was unhappy and wanted to meet someone else. I never cheated or anything like that and thought I took the honorable route that would allow me to one day be happy. But now I feel like she's depriving me of the ability to find the one thing I was seeking when I left. And I don't have my kids now either...

Edited April 2, 2013 by drew_meister

[Crila16]

Kids or no kids...if I were interested in a guy, I would never let him go...no matter what. Yes...I would prefer a guy without children or an ex wife, but I'm not going to throw away "the one" because of that...unless it started affecting my life in a negative way. I hate to say it...but if these men/women are leaving people who are divorced with kids, it's simple...it's cause they're not that into you. She wouldn't have gone out with you again once she found out, if that were in fact the real problem. She just lost interest and is now using the fact that you have kids as the excuse.

[StarsOnFire]

Are you discussing the situation a lot? I mean, she specifically told you that you seem to be wanting to replace your family. So maybe you scared her off with the way you talked about the situation. Have you been to therapy? It might help you find ways to cope, and to talk about it with other people.

 

Side note: I am so sorry that your wife took your kids away, I can't imagine being in that situation, and I wish you all the best!

[drew_meister]

Kids or no kids...if I were interested in a guy, I would never let him go...no matter what. Yes...I would prefer a guy without children or an ex wife, but I'm not going to throw away "the one" because of that...unless it started affecting my life in a negative way. I hate to say it...but if these men/women are leaving people who are divorced with kids, it's simple...it's cause they're not that into you. She wouldn't have gone out with you again once she found out, if that were in fact the real problem. She just lost interest and is now using the fact that you have kids as the excuse.

 

I've experienced that before but I don't think that is the case here. She contacted me on OKC and I'm her "type". When I said we've been intimate, we've been sleeping together since the third date. Both of us were pretty clear that we're not after casual sex - so I think it's significant. We were starting to really open up emotionally the last time we saw each other. She's a sweet natured girl and the tone of her texts and the hostility are frankly out of character. It feels like an emotional response. I mean if she were not that interested why not just do the slow fade.

[drew_meister]

Are you discussing the situation a lot? I mean, she specifically told you that you seem to be wanting to replace your family. So maybe you scared her off with the way you talked about the situation. Have you been to therapy? It might help you find ways to cope, and to talk about it with other people.

 

Side note: I am so sorry that your wife took your kids away, I can't imagine being in that situation, and I wish you all the best!

Actually I NEVER bring it up with any woman other than matter-of-factly disclosing it early on. Last time we got together she spent the night at my place. I've got pictures of my kids etc so she asked about them. I think it's obvious though that I'm a family oriented guy at heart and love kids. She doesn't want any. I told her I was fine with that because I already have them. But it's pretty clear that once my kids had names and faces it was too real and she ran for the hills. At least that's my read...

[amaysngrace]

She sounds incredibly weak to just bail on you like that.

 

Unless she is actually strong and you are the one who is weakened, which is completely understandable given the details of your current situation.

 

Are you feeling depressed or mourning the loss of your children at all or have you already addressed that?

[cdt76]

Welcome to dating in your 40's my friend. Let me tell you there is only one rule in dating now days. EVERYONE IS SELFISH. Take that bit of advice and just tattoo it on your forehead. You can date but it doesn't mean anything. People cheat, lie and stab you in the back. Mostly, if you are talking about the female persuasion, they just stop talking to you altogether for no reason. The reason is they are talking with someone else. I've yet to meet anyone on a dating site and have it last longer than 2 dates. I've been single since 2007. I've been on every dating site there is and they are all the same. 95% of the people on there should not be anywhere NEAR a dating site becuase they are so emotionally jacked up they aren't ready for a relationship. the 5% that are, are overwhelmed by emails that they soon get off the site altogether.

 

Now, about communication. People will not tell you the truth about their intentions at this age because the majority of them have NO IDEA what they are doing in the first place when it comes to dating. So they tell you what you want to hear. They lie. And then when stuff gets serious or an issue arises, they bolt. No reason, they are just gone. I wish there was another way to meet people because online dating is terrible. Good luck my friend. All you can do is be honest. You can't change who you are so don't hide it. Embrace it.

[drew_meister]

She sounds incredibly weak to just bail on you like that.

 

Unless she is actually strong and you are the one who is weakened, which is completely understandable given the details of your current situation.

 

Are you feeling depressed or mourning the loss of your children at all or have you already addressed that?

 

I'm not interested in seeing her anymore considering how she handled this, but it's tough being alone right now. I think I'm strong emotionally but this situation is really trying. I wasn't happy anymore in our marriage so I ended it. I decided I'd rather risk being alone, than stay feeling trapped. But now I'm having a very hard time, not with being alone, but coping with the loss of my kids. I get sad when I'm alone, so getting out a lot and dating certainly helps me cope.

[Crila16]

Maybe there's a situation that has absolutely nothing to do with you that came up. She may have had someone for her past walk back into her life, which caused her to jump ship with you. She used the kids as just an excuse to alleviate her guilt. I have to say, it's bizarre that she was totally into one minute...and then completely changed her mind the next.

[waiting4u]

There's a lot going on here and you bring up a lot of issues. First of all, I'm really sorry about your situation. I feel for you - that really sucks.

 

Regarding the girl - I find it hard to believe a woman would dump you because you have kids who live halfway across the world. There must be something else going on unless you lied to her for a long time about their existence. As I single mother, I've also experienced being dismissed because of the fact I'm a parent and it's lame. Dating online makes it seem like you have a lot of options, and a lot of people would just rather date people without kids when given the choice. They don't understand that having children doesn't necessarily mean 'damaged.' I understand the impulse to omit these facts in an online profile, but I wouldn't flat out lie. Imagine if you had to explain to your children that you lied and said they didn't exist. I would tell someone you have children when they ask about it. But definitely BEFORE you have sex with them.

 

What might be going on - just reading between the lines - is that women are rejecting you because you seem so unhappy in your situation. Nobody wants to share someone else's misery from the get-go. Maybe try and come to terms with your situation and hold off on the dating for a while.

[drew_meister]

Regarding the girl - I find it hard to believe a woman would dump you because you have kids who live halfway across the world. There must be something else going on unless you lied to her for a long time about their existence. As I single mother, I've also experienced being dismissed because of the fact I'm a parent and it's lame. Dating online makes it seem like you have a lot of options, and a lot of people would just rather date people without kids when given the choice. They don't understand that having children doesn't necessarily mean 'damaged.' I understand the impulse to omit these facts in an online profile, but I wouldn't flat out lie. Imagine if you had to explain to your children that you lied and said they didn't exist. I would tell someone you have children when they ask about it. But definitely BEFORE you have sex with them.

 

What might be going on - just reading between the lines - is that women are rejecting you because you seem so unhappy in your situation. Nobody wants to share someone else's misery from the get-go. Maybe try and come to terms with your situation and hold off on the dating for a while.

 

I told her on our second date before we had sex. I would never withhold until after that. I'm pretty certain I'm not projecting unhappiness. I was not happy the last few years of my marriage but was pretty good at masking that. My wife was stunned which is perhaps why she reacted so emotionally.

 

I think part of the problem is I'm seeking out highly desirable women. I mean the whole reason I left is that I felt I settled. I live an active lifestyle and have a good career. I had a lot of options before I was married. I never liked the game playing then, and it's one of the reasons I dated many foreigners and eventually married one - they don't play games like American women do.

[waiting4u]

You certainly deserve 'highly desirable' women. Don't sell yourself short! What you consider 'highly desirable,' however, may be something more like 'high maintenance.' If she really left you because you have children, then she wasn't worth it anyway. I wouldn't make generalizations about how women will treat you in the future according to this one's behavior. About the unhappiness thing -as long as you don't spend time complaining (although I could see why you would want to), then you probably aren't giving out that vibe. Are you still married? That would be a dealbreaker for me.

[amaysngrace]

But now I'm having a very hard time, not with being alone, but coping with the loss of my kids. I get sad when I'm alone, so getting out a lot and dating certainly helps me cope.

 

So are you saying that you're basically sad and are using dating to take your mind off of how sad and alone you feel?

 

That can't be much fun to be dating you.

[drew_meister]

You certainly deserve 'highly desirable' women. Don't sell yourself short! What you consider 'highly desirable,' however, may be something more like 'high maintenance.' If she really left you because you have children, then she wasn't worth it anyway. I wouldn't make generalizations about how women will treat you in the future according to this one's behavior. About the unhappiness thing -as long as you don't spend time complaining (although I could see why you would want to), then you probably aren't giving out that vibe. Are you still married? That would be a dealbreaker for me.

 

Divorced already.

 

And I actually equate "highly desirable" with "high maintenance". It's the whole reason I kinda avoided attractive American women in the first place. I mean it's a huge generalization, and I hate to make it, but I'm experiencing it all over again. And now that I have "baggage", it seems like it's worse than my first go around...

[drew_meister]

So are you saying that you're basically sad and are using dating to take your mind off of how sad and alone you feel?

 

That can't be much fun to be dating you.

 

That's not how I planned it but the thought has crossed my mind. I started dating again right as the divorce was being finalized. I was actually in a very good state of mind then, but right before the school year started, she took the kids to Japan. Since then I can basically say I do ANYTHING to take my mind off the kids - whether it be working, hobbies, socializing, or dating. I avoid excessive alone time.

[amaysngrace]

That's not how I planned it but the thought has crossed my mind. I started dating again right as the divorce was being finalized. I was actually in a very good state of mind then, but right before the school year started, she took the kids to Japan. Since then I can basically say I do ANYTHING to take my mind off the kids - whether it be working, hobbies, socializing, or dating. I avoid excessive alone time.

 

Do you have any way that you can change this situation with your children being in Japan? What rights do you have as their father? Do you get visitation?

 

What was the custody agreement in the divorce settlement? Can she be charged with kidnapping?

 

What does your divorce lawyer say? Have you been to Japan? Do you know where she stays? Can you go get your children? Or at least see them?

 

What does your divorce lawyer say?

[FitChick]

One reason the woman you dated reacted with open hostility seemingly out of the blue was because she might have spoken with her family or girlfriends who persuaded her that no mother would leave the country, taking their kids against the court order, unless the man was abusive in various ways. Just a possibility.

 

Let this be a lesson to some of the men on this site who talk about getting an Asian bride, as if that would solve all of their problems.

Edited April 2, 2013 by FitChick

[amaysngrace]

One reason the woman you dated reacted with open hostility seemingly out of the blue was because she might have spoken with her family or girlfriends who persuaded her that no mother would leave the country, taking their kids against the court order, unless the man was abusive in various ways. Just a possibility.

 

Let this be a lesson to some of the men on this site who talk about getting an Asian bride, as if that would solve all of their problems.

 

That is so not true though. Anyone with half a brain would realize that children being kidnapped to Japan is a common occurrence due to their governments lack of cooperation regarding custody arrangements made here in the states.

 

And it's the dads who get screwed primarily.

 

Some even become suicidal due to the huge loss they experience.

 

It's really sad.

[kaylan]

OP...you gotta be able to take this to Congress or the Japanese authorities. See if they can say something at all.

 

If they refuse to help, go to Japan and find your children. Id risk imprisonment if some chick did this to me with my kids.

 

Check out this article too. Japan to join child abduction treaty - The Japan Times

 

Is Japan close to fixing this issue?

[Noproblem]

Go to your kids and see them, as Mitt Romney would phrase it" borrow money from your parents if you have to."

Fix things with your ex, be friends and then start all over again

[RedRobin]

Divorced already.

 

And I actually equate "highly desirable" with "high maintenance". It's the whole reason I kinda avoided attractive American women in the first place. I mean it's a huge generalization, and I hate to make it, but I'm experiencing it all over again. And now that I have "baggage", it seems like it's worse than my first go around...

 

Hmm...

 

Well, OP, wherever you go... there you are...

 

You sound like the high maintenance one. You marry someone from another country hoping to avoid your personal issues.

 

Now you feel entitled to previously unmarried women without kids??

 

And you lie about your life.

 

I'd say men like you on OLD are par for the course.

 

(ladies, pay attention. Don't sleep with a guy until you can verify someones background)

[kaylan]

Look whos talking about maintenance xD

[RedRobin]

Look whos talking about maintenance xD

 

Unlike the OP, I don't ask for things I can't deliver myself...

 

Women aren't obliged to be fixer uppers... nor should they be looked down upon because they want someone with a similar background.

 

I find it rather amusing that so many guys feel they are still entitled to the cream of the crop after they have royally f*cked up their own lives...

[mesmerized]

Unlike the OP, I don't ask for things I can't deliver myself...

 

Women aren't obliged to be fixer uppers... nor should they be looked down upon because they want someone with a similar background.

 

I find it rather amusing that so many guys feel they are still entitled to the cream of the crop after they have royally f*cked up their own lives...

 

Have to agree with this one...

 

He didn't want to date american women (probably because less of those were giving him a chance), went for a foreign woman and STILL felt like he settled and got a divorce, even though he probably knew that means not seeing his kids again. That makes me question his quality as a father too. And nothing is more of a turn off for a wise woman than a man who is a bad father.

 

Sorry OP, but I just don't see how you are a catch for a "highly desirable" women.

[zebracolors]

I must respectfully agree with Mezmerized. I mean without hearing her side, we really have to take what you say at face value that what you're telling us is true about how she took the kids, and why. So OP you've got to expect some questioning.

 

I'm not interested in seeing her anymore considering how she handled this, but it's tough being alone right now. I think I'm strong emotionally but this situation is really trying. I wasn't happy anymore in our marriage so I ended it. I decided I'd rather risk being alone, than stay feeling trapped. But now I'm having a very hard time, not with being alone, but coping with the loss of my kids. I get sad when I'm alone, so getting out a lot and dating certainly helps me cope.

 

To your credit, you at least were honest in how you felt. A really F*ed up situation all around. I read the article Kaylan shared, I guess you're just going to have to wait and see if Japan joins in the treaty. I don't know much about it, maybe if she has duel citizenship, couldn't she be subject to US laws regarding kidnapping?

 

Anyway Until then I'd strongly recommend you not be concerned with dating just now. I know you feel lonely and I understand why, but are you sure you're not using these women you date as a kind of surrogate company to make up for not being able to be with your kids? You think that meeting up with these women will make you feel better, but you really should reevaluate what it is you want in a relationship and don't generalize all women from one nationality. And don't just tell yourself you deserve to be a father to the kids, when you were not even sure about committing to one person in a marriage.