ComingInHot Posted March 10, 2013 Posted March 10, 2013 pierre, You may/do have a point or two in your repeated posts, HOWEVER, there is a time & place for these posts and now is not the time. She needs props, encouragement and support cause Spice is doing amazing!! If you're not careful Pierre, you could find your comments (however revelent) in some uncomfortable places. 1
Pierre Posted March 10, 2013 Posted March 10, 2013 Some have. Some don't admit these issues at all, you just feel the need to assign. That's the tiring and smug part. I have no interest in engaging folks like you for confrontational remarks. Thanks
wisernow Posted March 10, 2013 Posted March 10, 2013 I have no interest in engaging folks like you for confrontational remarks. Thanks Ahh.... Sorry, we don't all agree with your armchair psychiatry. "Folks like me", indeed.
wisernow Posted March 10, 2013 Posted March 10, 2013 Sorry for the t/j Spice. How are you doing today? I hope you are feeling better. 1
Author spice4life Posted March 10, 2013 Author Posted March 10, 2013 Sorry for the t/j Spice. How are you doing today? I hope you are feeling better. No problem wisernow. I view it as comic relief which I very need right now...lol. Feeling a little better, but still confused. Will post more when my head is clear. In the meantime, I'm soothing with ice cream. 2
Author spice4life Posted March 10, 2013 Author Posted March 10, 2013 Just noticed that you mentioned me here and wanted to say that I'm glad that my post triggered something positive for you! ) Respect is a big deal in relationships, obviously. In my case, I have to have a high level of respect for anyone I interact with - or I just stop interacting with them. It doesn't mean that I don't love them, or care about them - but without the respect, it just isn't healthy. I have learned that I struggle with having too much empathy for someone - so much empathy and understanding that I sacrifice my own emotional well being at times for the sake of theirs. I'm really working at NOT doing that any longer in life. Not because they don't "deserve" empathy - but because I don't deserve to be emotionally unhealthy for the sake of others on a consistent basis. With exMM - if it had been back and forth, give and take - maybe it would have been different. But the last time I saw him face to face, my heart literally hurt. Not because I wanted to be with him, but I honestly felt so much pity for him. That cannot be an equal or healthy relationship, imo. That was the point that I decided that no matter how much I had loved him, or he me, or how much we had shared together - that it wasn't fair to me, or to him - to continue on in such an uneven partnership. I hope that you are feeling less sad/confused today. If I can help in any way, let me know. I am going to try to keep posting, but really am pretty busy with everything going on in my life - but I want to help anyone that I can. I'm not going to tell anyone that I know more about their situation than they do - I just want to share my experience in the hopes someone might see something of themselves in it and gain some insight without having to do it the hard way - you know, save them the trouble if that's possible. Thank you for your thoughtful response, AnotherRound. I am feeling much much better today. My story is a bit complicated and actually I'm too embarrassed to post all of the sordid details...lol. I'm not sure if anyone would be able to understand it. I can really relate to the bolded part. I think having empathy for others is sooo important, but with that comes the need to have healthy boundaries for your own well being. If someone, like your xMM for example, struggles with being entangled in an unhealthy relationship then the best thing you can do is detach with love and "hope" that he figures it all out. Afterall, he is the one that has to come to terms with it and there is nothing you can do to change it - he has to. For me, when someone I love is willing to face their situation and deal with it honestly then "I'm all in" and willing to support them through that process...no doubt. I'm very happy to in fact because I want whats best for the ones I love. I WANT them be happy with themselves and their life. But when they swing back and forth between certainty and uncertainty I have set a boundary for myself to not get sucked into it. When I do get sucked in I absorb how they are feeling and it becomes extremely unsettling. Then I start looking for ways to help them solve the problem and the reality is I can't - they need to. Until they see "how and why" they are where they are there is not a thing anyone can do. Thanks again for your response. It sounds like you are at a really healthy place in your life and that's a great place to be! Don't stop growing...its the most exciting part of life. 1
Author spice4life Posted March 10, 2013 Author Posted March 10, 2013 The bolded stuff above makes perfect sense to me Spice and describes my feelings too. When my exmm got back in touch (we dated years ago when he was single) about three emails in he hinted that he wanted to meet as more than friends, even though he was married. I tried to tell myself I was misreading the signs (!!!) and the decent man I knew back then wouldn't do that.....then, when I wouldn't sleep with him and he mocked my 'stupid morals', was another huge red flag, when his words were that he was leaving his wife and was going to do it way before I came back on the scene..blah blah blah, but actions never matched up, another flag, then when his wife read an email I'd sent to him (ironically telling him not to contact me until/if he became single) and his response was pure anger at me for sending the email to his personal account instead of his work one (I'd told him right at the start, I'd send emails to any account I wanted as had nothing to hide and he seemed ok with that.) Finally just the cold hard truth dawned on me that this decent man I'd once known or thought I'd known, was now capable of lying and deceiving on a daily basis to his wife and referered to his children as 'millstones' around his neck, dragging him down. I literally felt a punch to my stomach hearing him say that and all the cards that were all up in the air suddenly flew into place. I knew if I ever got what I thought I wanted (him to be with me), I would always wonder where he was, who he was emailing/texting etc because thats how he was with me. I didn't like the person I was becoming by being with him, I found myself anxious a lot of the time, something which I'd never experienced a lot of in life in general, and certainly not within a relationship which is surely supposed to be loving and nuturing. I wanted him to 'get back to what he was before', if that makes sense. But in the end I couldn't expect to change him, only myself and my own self respect. I got out. Thank you, beyond. I'm so happy that you were able to find the strength to get out of that unhealthy situation. On the one hand he was trying to suck you in with his words, but then punished you when you refused to accept his terms. That can be crazy making and kudos to you for taking care of yourself by getting out! You are very strong and don't let anyone ever make you feel otherwise. I noticed that you were also feeling sad on an anniversary day of something that happened in your life and you know what?...that's okay! It's normal and says that you are human and have a wonderful heart. I too have an anniversary of a sad event every year (the loss of my wonderful mother) and I let myself feel it and it helps so much. I start to feel out of sorts the week before that date and it becomes hard to focus on anything...lol. Again, BIG KUDOS to you. Keep up the good work and stay true to you!
Author spice4life Posted March 10, 2013 Author Posted March 10, 2013 hugs Spice! I hate that feeling :/ Thank you for the support, loredo.
Author spice4life Posted March 10, 2013 Author Posted March 10, 2013 Spice, I have to say you are one of the posters I admire a lot. You own what you say, you continue to work on you (which is not just reserved for those in affairs...everyone should continue to work on themselves) and you truly seem to post from the heart. That is amazing and honest. Kudo's to you. Thank you, hockeyfan! That is a really nice compliment. It's true, I am always trying to work on myself and I think it's soooo important. I've had to face a lot of adversity in my life due to the choices I made and you know what?...I wouldn't change a thing. It has made me who I am today and even though I've made a lot of mistakes, I've also learned a heck of lot from them. Even in my darkest of times, I've always had the ability to find the silver lining in the whole mess! Sometimes the dark times bring about the best changes one can make. Seriously Pierre, what do you know about women and validation? You are a man. You know nothing of what women go through, feel and think. You can read all day about affairs - but it doesn't make you an expert. Your constant slams to OW about 'external validation' and/or 'low self esteem' gets tiring at best. As anti-affair as I am, even I am turned off by your constant negativity and snarky comments to the posters here. What is so wrong in your life/marriage that you feel the need to hang out with women and take pot shots at them? They are hurting enough in many cases - your constant belittling and "external validation/low self esteem' comments do not help them. Can you try to be more helpful instead of putting them down? Can you try to stop labeling women as needing validation and having no self esteem? You aren't female - you do not have a clue what we feel or how we think. LOL! Thanks for expressing how many of us feel. Pierre, have you ever thought about the fact that you might be looking for the very things that accuse others of doing here? It seems you are stuck on external validation and self esteem issues to a the point of obsession. Have you tried focusing on what comes after these realizations? Answers in bold.
Author spice4life Posted March 10, 2013 Author Posted March 10, 2013 I'm so sorry you are having a hard time. I do understand exactly what you are saying. If things were different in my life, if I had the opportunity to be with someone full time permanently then I really do know that I would want more. That this wouldn't be enough for me. I wish I could help when I see people struggling. I don't have a lot to offer, but I do wish I could give you a hug. *hugs* Thank you, LFH. You do help a lot here and I completely respect your willingness to be totally honest about where you are and the relationship you have. As long as you are comfortable and are staying true to you that's the best place to be. Not every situation needs to be "traditonal" for two people to love and respect each other. Thanks again for the kind words and best wishes!
beyond Posted March 10, 2013 Posted March 10, 2013 Thank you, beyond. I'm so happy that you were able to find the strength to get out of that unhealthy situation. On the one hand he was trying to suck you in with his words, but then punished you when you refused to accept his terms. That can be crazy making and kudos to you for taking care of yourself by getting out! You are very strong and don't let anyone ever make you feel otherwise. I noticed that you were also feeling sad on an anniversary day of something that happened in your life and you know what?...that's okay! It's normal and says that you are human and have a wonderful heart. I too have an anniversary of a sad event every year (the loss of my wonderful mother) and I let myself feel it and it helps so much. I start to feel out of sorts the week before that date and it becomes hard to focus on anything...lol. Again, BIG KUDOS to you. Keep up the good work and stay true to you! Thank you for your kind words Spice. Yes, he got quite manipulative towards the end , especially when It wasn't going his way and I wouldn't be put in a nice compartment marked OW while he carried on with his other life. Logically, I know I did the right thing, but hard to think that sometimes when love is involved. I'm so sorry about your mother Spice, in fact that is why I'm sad today too. It's mothers day here in the UK and even though she has been gone a long time, since I was a young girl....I miss her more than ever. There are times you just want your mum aren't there? and noone else will do. ((((hugs)))) to both of us and our wonderful mothers xx 1
Author spice4life Posted March 10, 2013 Author Posted March 10, 2013 Thank you for your kind words Spice. Yes, he got quite manipulative towards the end , especially when It wasn't going his way and I wouldn't be put in a nice compartment marked OW while he carried on with his other life. Logically, I know I did the right thing, but hard to think that sometimes when love is involved. I'm so sorry about your mother Spice, in fact that is why I'm sad today too. It's mothers day here in the UK and even though she has been gone a long time, since I was a young girl....I miss her more than ever. There are times you just want your mum aren't there? and noone else will do. ((((hugs)))) to both of us and our wonderful mothers xx Yes, big (((hugs)))...I miss her very much! You are very welcome, beyond. I hope you are feeling much better tomorrow.
beyond Posted March 10, 2013 Posted March 10, 2013 Yes, big (((hugs)))...I miss her very much! You are very welcome, beyond. I hope you are feeling much better tomorrow. I hope you feel better soon too Spice. xx
Author spice4life Posted March 10, 2013 Author Posted March 10, 2013 Thanks again everyone for you're thoughtful responses. I am going out of town for a week, so I won't be on the boards as much as I have been lately this coming week. These last few days have really helped me find some important answers. Some of them quite disturbing (lol) and the others brought much needed clarity in how I was viewing things. I must say I'm very relieved in many aspects. I'm not sure where my personal life is headed from here, but I feel armed with the right tools, so I don't end up back in an affair EVER again. Its just not a place I want to be...that's for sure. I have a really exciting transition right in front of me that I'm looking forward to...it was looong over due! So yeah, I'm excited about seeing where life takes me now. Have a great week and talk to you all soon!
wisernow Posted March 10, 2013 Posted March 10, 2013 Thanks again everyone for you're thoughtful responses. I am going out of town for a week, so I won't be on the boards as much as I have been lately this coming week. These last few days have really helped me find some important answers. Some of them quite disturbing (lol) and the others brought much needed clarity in how I was viewing things. I must say I'm very relieved in many aspects. I'm not sure where my personal life is headed from here, but I feel armed with the right tools, so I don't end up back in an affair EVER again. Its just not a place I want to be...that's for sure. I have a really exciting transition right in front of me that I'm looking forward to...it was looong over due! So yeah, I'm excited about seeing where life takes me now. Have a great week and talk to you all soon! Having new and exciting things to look forward to are one of my favorite things. Hopefully you'll be able to focus on YOU and all the wonderful, new things that life is putting in your path. Awesome! :)
2sure Posted March 10, 2013 Posted March 10, 2013 I see you are talking about other related things but I'm going to answer the original question about losing respect. The last MM I was involved with was around just prior to my meeting my my husband. We had cooled considerably and he was clinging to the friendship. We would meet for lunch, talk on the phone, but this it. Affair was over. I liked him. When I became engaged, he came on full force wanting to get back to a sexual affair. I was insulted. It seems hypocritical of me now, cuz it was...but I was absolutely insulted and offended that he would think I would cheat on someonei committed to..... Like he did. That was the moment.
todreaminblue Posted March 10, 2013 Posted March 10, 2013 (edited) A lot of things I have been reading lately have really got me thinking about this very question. I want to thank AnotherRound in particular because I view her story as the pomised land...lol. A place where you are takin care of yourself. I mean when did you reach a point where continuing, no matter how much you cared about your AP, meant you were betraying yourself? And at what point did it mean that you began to lose respect for your AP for choosing to be in an affair? This isn't a slam against MMs/MWs and if their choice is to have an affair that's fine...to each his own. I guess I'm asking because I've always been one to want to evolve, grow and deal with issues head on and there came a point when I just didn't want to be in a situation that goes against that. I saw how illogical it was and that it was not a good way to deal with the issues in your life. It was also a situation where I couldn't be myself and feel comfortable. As a matter of fact I never felt comfortable with it...lol. In my life in general I am the same person no matter where I am - work, home and social life - and I realized one day that the "only" place I wasn't myself was in the affair. I am an open easy going person with pure intentions and I couldn't be that in the affair, so it just stop working for me...ya now? I loved and cared about him and that evolved to a deeper care over time, but it didn't allow me to be who I am. I don't know if this makes any sense or not; hopefully it does. The questions lately got me thinking about this stuff! this is one reason i can forgive the woman who had an affair with my ex and is now with him, because maybe it wasnt her and who she reallywas....people make mistakes ....... i did however lose major respect for my ex, i have some horrible truths about myself that i had shared with him i was always honest and respect and trust are vital to me even though i find it really hard to share them i do ........when my ex was deceitful it made me feel like a lesser person not during the deceit but when i found out about it, he portrayed himself to be something that he was not and here i was this flawed human being ..who had a lack of self respect because of my flaws....and I admitted it because i do have an honest heart....so all my honesty and the trust i had that he accepted me for who i was ....was all a lie...... because the honesty was never reciprocated by him, for me........so i think respect, trust honesty, through flaws mistakes and the good times is the glue that binds someone to someone else..not only love and desire..an acceptance and willing to share the imperfections ....... when you are the only one being honest and wanting honesty because you are honest and true at your heart...it is no wonder you lost respect...congrats for getting it back....self respect that is..hugs....deb Edited March 10, 2013 by todreaminblue
Pierre Posted March 10, 2013 Posted March 10, 2013 When I became engaged, he came on full force wanting to get back to a sexual affair. I was insulted. That is quite common. Men want to have sex as often as possible if there is a hint they are losing the woman. That explains the hysterical bonding some cheating men do when the wife threatens with divorce. 1
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