SoleMate Posted March 8, 2013 Posted March 8, 2013 ...Since its at work we can't cross boundaries. He has been dropping signals all the time like staring at me, constantly tapping his feet when I'm around, following me around the office, going back and forth till we have an eye contact... MINNEAPOLIS — A foot-tapping ritual was a common thread in many of the 41 arrests reported during a four-month airport bathroom sting that snared Sen. Larry Craig.....In ...police reports, officers wrote that...foot-tapping was a signal used by people looking for sex. The reports said the department had received complaints from the public and made numerous arrests. Craig's alleged conduct closely followed the pattern......Sgt. Dave Karsnia ...went into a stall shortly after noon on June 11 and closed the door. Minutes later, the officer....saw Craig peering into his stall through the crack between the door and the frame. Read more here: Many reports of Minnesota airport arrests cite foot-tapping rituals | Larry Craig Investigation | Idahostatesman.com Anyone else notice the eerie parallels? 1
Author ConfinLuv Posted March 8, 2013 Author Posted March 8, 2013 That he is charming and smooth is a given. It is part of the personality profile of a philanderer. This charm is like a magnet for needy women. Why is he so attractive to you? Most women with healthy self esteem would be puking. How is your marriage? Are you in a bad relationship? Is that why you are receptive? I'm happily married for 13yrs now and have 2 healthy kids, don't have any marriage issues. Good looking and successful huband we both have good career paths and financially fit. Everyone @work finds MOM very attractive, he is polite, friendly and manages multiple projects. He is mostly surrounded by people and when there is no-one around him he starts his signals/tantrums. Its like 2-3 times a day, when he is discouraged he just picks his jacket and leaves the office comes back after an hr or so with sad droopy face, sniffing and throws a bottle or can loudly in trash. This is a pattern going on for a while now.
ThatJustHappened Posted March 8, 2013 Posted March 8, 2013 I'm happily married for 13yrs now and have 2 healthy kids, don't have any marriage issues. Good looking and successful huband we both have good career paths and financially fit. Everyone @work finds MOM very attractive, he is polite, friendly and manages multiple projects. He is mostly surrounded by people and when there is no-one around him he starts his signals/tantrums. Its like 2-3 times a day, when he is discouraged he just picks his jacket and leaves the office comes back after an hr or so with sad droopy face, sniffing and throws a bottle or can loudly in trash. This is a pattern going on for a while now. That doesn't sound like love, it sounds like a very severe personality disorder. He doesn't need you, he needs a therapist. And possibly a straight-jacket. This guy is a nutjob. Are you sure this has anything to do with you? Are you sure he's not just throwing tantrums because he's got mental issues?
Author ConfinLuv Posted March 8, 2013 Author Posted March 8, 2013 jlola Your article is very informative but not sure if he falls in the category of Narcissistic Sociopath as he has been in organization for long time and a successful individual. Btw, he also has major in Psychology and then MBA from reputed Univ. So he is very well aware of human Psychology and how to play with it. There is no way for him to commit a crime but following seems true about him "They are charming, agreeable, and engaging. The narcissistic sociopath loves (or seems to love) everything about you. He hooks you. Then he breaks you. His emotional abuse is VERY subtle. "
Pierre Posted March 8, 2013 Posted March 8, 2013 jlola Your article is very informative but not sure if he falls in the category of Narcissistic Sociopath as he has been in organization for long time and a successful individual. Btw, he also has major in Psychology and then MBA from reputed Univ. So he is very well aware of human Psychology and how to play with it. There is no way for him to commit a crime but following seems true about him "They are charming, agreeable, and engaging. The narcissistic sociopath loves (or seems to love) everything about you. He hooks you. Then he breaks you. His emotional abuse is VERY subtle. " Self aware narcissists are extremely uncommon. Many philanderers are very charming. I suspect you were seeking different advise. You were wondering if he is into you. That fact is very gratifying to you.
Author ConfinLuv Posted March 8, 2013 Author Posted March 8, 2013 That doesn't sound like love, it sounds like a very severe personality disorder. He doesn't need you, he needs a therapist. And possibly a straight-jacket. This guy is a nutjob. Are you sure this has anything to do with you? Are you sure he's not just throwing tantrums because he's got mental issues? He stares at me quiet often and mostly when he is leaving or comes back he gives a prolonged look to make sure I notice him. If I don't look at him and try to ignore he will go back and forth couple of times in front of my office. Sits in his chair with loud noice followed by a heavy breathing. Sometimes he throws a stress ball or other object on the common wall we share, tap the wall or just push it hard. I have heard him discussing me with his friends on the phone or other co-workers.
Pierre Posted March 8, 2013 Posted March 8, 2013 He stares at me quiet often and mostly when he is leaving or comes back he gives a prolonged look to make sure I notice him. If I don't look at him and try to ignore he will go back and forth couple of times in front of my office. Sits in his chair with loud noice followed by a heavy breathing. Sometimes he throws a stress ball or other object on the common wall we share, tap the wall or just push it hard. I have heard him discussing me with his friends on the phone or other co-workers. Classic psychopath and narcissist. Most women would be repulsed. I suspect you have ow qualities.
Author ConfinLuv Posted March 8, 2013 Author Posted March 8, 2013 What is he, 16 years old? Good Christ. Why would you WANT to be involved with some emotionally and socially stunted mistfit? He is 39 acts like 16, I don't want to get involved with him knowing the fact both of us are married. After reading all the expert advises I'm even more clear in my head that it all needs to end. I just want to resolve this never ending drama with a +ve note.
Author ConfinLuv Posted March 8, 2013 Author Posted March 8, 2013 Classic psychopath and narcissist. Most women would be repulsed. I suspect you have ow qualities.[/quote Thats not true I've met many such men in past who seem to be v.interested and persistent in showing their interest but I have not once crossed any line or got involved with anyone other than my H. Most of the time I let my H know if something like this is going on @work and he just laughs at it saying I know my W is attractive and extrovert. I have not broken his trust and by all means wants to keep it like this.
jlola Posted March 8, 2013 Posted March 8, 2013 jlola Your article is very informative but not sure if he falls in the category of Narcissistic Sociopath as he has been in organization for long time and a successful individual. Btw, he also has major in Psychology and then MBA from reputed Univ. So he is very well aware of human Psychology and how to play with it. There is no way for him to commit a crime but following seems true about him "They are charming, agreeable, and engaging. The narcissistic sociopath loves (or seems to love) everything about you. He hooks you. Then he breaks you. His emotional abuse is VERY subtle. " My father is a narcissist. He was in a position of Authority in a hospital for close to 20 years. He managed to get the position though most who applied were much more qualified. He charmed the pants off the right people and made them feel somehow obligated. He is a master at wearing a mask. He usually takes his "mask" off only to people he knows he has in the palm of his hand or ones he cannot use. My father has never ended up in jail or anything. Most narcissist are too smart to get in trouble. He should have for the mental and physical abuse he did to us. But to the outside world he seemed perfect. He also made sure his outside appearance was perfect. He lifted weights, watched his diet,got his nails done (such a macho man with a manicure, and had a closet full of great suits(though he loved tight shirts with short sleeves to show off muscles). I think narcissist make sure they look great on the outside because their inside is so empty. They need a lure and though science says women do not care for looks, they do. And narcissist understand that well. My father was such a magnet for women, that after awhile I stopped bringing friends home. All the girls I knew had a huge crush on him and he milked it with his false mask of niceness. I was too ashamed to tell people the reality because I knew NOONE would believe it. 2
jlola Posted March 8, 2013 Posted March 8, 2013 jlola Your article is very informative but not sure if he falls in the category of Narcissistic Sociopath as he has been in organization for long time and a successful individual. Btw, he also has major in Psychology and then MBA from reputed Univ. So he is very well aware of human Psychology and how to play with it. There is no way for him to commit a crime but following seems true about him "They are charming, agreeable, and engaging. The narcissistic sociopath loves (or seems to love) everything about you. He hooks you. Then he breaks you. His emotional abuse is VERY subtle. " Forgot to add. My father had a library. One full bookshelf were psychology books on "Child psychology". It always freaked me out because I wondered why he would have so many child psychology books,when he did the opposite of what was recommended. It took me a long time to understand it was part of the mask.It would let people know how concerned he was to raise his children the right way. Wow! "what a great father" ,they would think. He also had many affairs and would use the excuse" He cannot leave his daughters". Meanwhile he treated us all with physical abuse and made us wear hand me downs while he wore new clothes. But he projected himself the perfect father and I'm sure OW were impressed.
jlola Posted March 8, 2013 Posted March 8, 2013 He stares at me quiet often and mostly when he is leaving or comes back he gives a prolonged look to make sure I notice him. If I don't look at him and try to ignore he will go back and forth couple of times in front of my office. Sits in his chair with loud noice followed by a heavy breathing. Sometimes he throws a stress ball or other object on the common wall we share, tap the wall or just push it hard. I have heard him discussing me with his friends on the phone or other co-workers. Girl,RUN!!!!!!!!!! THURSDAY, FEBRUARY 19, 2009 The Stare Of The Psychopath - What Lies Behind Those Eyes? A lot of women and men have noted the particular stare of the psychopath - some have even said there is an “almost animalistic attraction” to him. The Psychopaths stare is very effective during the luring and "honeymoon" phases. Women often mistake it as "being sexy" and for "Sexual Attraction" eye gazing occurs in copious amounts during the "Luring and honeymoon stage" at the beginning of the relationship. Robert Hare refers to the Psychopath's gaze as "Intense eye contact and piercing eyes" and even suggested people avoid consistant eye contact with them. Cool under pressure with an adroit use of charm and charisma, they intimidate and control others. There is often an intrusion of space and the predatory 'stare'. They have a natural ability to lie and deceive, and have an impressive use of jargon. They are naturals at undermining and pushing the buttons of others. Trance is associated with "focused Attention" The Psychopath, like anyone else, can induce trance in others. Just surf the net under “Seduction Techniques” and you will see a hundred web sites teaching men how to use covert hypnotic and Neuro Linguistic Programming techniques to bypass a woman’s cognitive resistance to being “picked up” or “seduced.” If they didn’t work, there wouldn’t be so many men using these techniques. However, psychopath’s are different from these mere seduction students because most psychopaths don’t have to be taught how to use trance states, hypnosis, and suggestion. They are natural’s at these. Pacing, rapport, mirroring, speed seduction , hypnotic commands, sleight of mouth expressions, subliminal arousal techniques , and sensual domination as well as allure are all used by the psychopath to induce trance , hypnosis and suggestibility (NLP) to get what they want. The Rule Of Three. The Assessment Phase, The Manipulation Phase & The Abandonment Phase The psychopathic approach includes three phases: the assessment phase, the manipulation phase and the abandonment phase. Psychopaths are often voluble and verbally facile. They can be amusing and entertaining conversationalists, ready with a clever comeback, and are able to tell unlikely but convincing stories that cast themselves in a good light. They can be very effective in presenting themselves well and are often very likable and charming. Some psychopaths are opportunistic, aggressive predators who will take advantage of almost anyone they meet, while others are more patient, waiting for the perfect, innocent victim to cross their path. In each case, the psychopath is constantly sizing up the potential usefulness of an individual as a source of money, power, sex or influence Once the psychopath has identified a victim, the manipulation phase begins. During the manipulation phase, a psychopath may create a persona or mask, specifically designed to ‘work’ for his or her target. A psychopath will lie to gain the trust of their victim. A psychopath’s lack of empathy and guilt allows them to lie with ease - “they don’t see the value of telling the truth unless it will help get them what they want As interaction with you proceeds, the psychopath carefully assesses your persona. Your persona gives the psychopath a picture of the traits and characteristics you value in yourself. Your persona may also reveal, to an astute observer, insecurities or weaknesses you wish to minimize or hide from view. As an ardent student of human behavior, the psychopath will then gently test the inner strengths and needs that are part of your private self and eventually build a personal relationship with you by communicating (through words and deeds) To further "seal the deal" the psychopath instigates the luring stage, he uses his best listening and communication skills. He wears his "respectful mask" his "loving mask" his "Listening mask" and so on. You feel he is bonding with you. The attraction and chemistry blows you away , he is paying you so much attention and you feel that you "Seem to connect" this is not because the psychopath wants to bond with you. The psychopath is hoovering information from you in order to further seduce you into believing "He is the one for you" and so he can use the information gleaned from you to use it against you in the future. Manipulation is the key to the psychopath's conquests. Initially, the psychopath will feign false emotions to create empathy, and many of them study the tricks that can be employed by the empathy technique. Psychopaths are often able to incite pity from people because they seem like "lost souls" as Guggenbuhl-Craig writes. So the pity factor is one reason why victims often fall for these "poor" people. Psychopaths Attachment The Psychopathic bond can take place very quickly, sometimes within hours. That means it could happen over coffee, drinks, in a business meeting etc. The psychopath does NOT bond to his victim emotionally , he doesn't in fact bond at all, but he does "attach" himself to his victim pretty much the way a leech attaches to a body to suck the life blood from them. He is an emotional vampire. He views any social exchange as a "feeding opportunity," a contest or a test of wills in which there can be only one winner. His motives are to manipulate and take, ruthlessly and without remorse. One psychopath interviewed by Dr Robert Hare's team said quite frankly: "The first thing I do is I size you up. I look for an angle, an edge, figure out what you need and give it to you. Then it's pay-back time, with interest. I tighten the screws." Another psychopath admitted that he never targeted attractive women - he was only interested in those who were insecure and lonely. He claimed he could smell a needy person "the way a pig smells truffles." They are masters of recognizing "hang-ups" and self-doubts that most people have, and they will brazenly pander to them to gain a follower to use later. The Psychopath attaches himself only for the desire to be around a "special person" he is "seeking proximity" to be around the woman he desires to control and dominate. It is only through attachments that the psychopath can avoid boredom and gain "The Central Three: Power, Status & Dominance" As Sandra L. Brown says in her book Women Who Love Psychopaths "If psychopaths didn't attach, they also wouldn't stalk which we know they often do" Getting Past The Surface Of Things It is not easy to get beyond the winning smile, the captivating body language, the fast talk of the typical psychopath, all of which blind us to his or her real intentions. Many people find it difficult to deal with the intense, "predatory state" of the psychopath. The fixated stare, is more a prelude to self-gratification and the exercise of power rather than simple interest or empathic caring and women seem to mistake this predatory stare for "sexuality" I remember being stared down in a pub by a male friend, I felt uncomfortable, and mistook that sign for "sexuality" and "attraction" Try not to be influenced by "props" it is not easy to get beyond the winning smile, the captivating body lanuage, and the fast talk of the psychopath, all of which blinds us to his or her real intentions. Some people respond to the emotionless stare of the psychopath with considerable discomfort, almost as if they feel like potential prey in the presence of the predator. Others may be completely overwhelmed and intimidated, perhaps even controlled, with little insight into what is happening to them. Whatever the psychological meaning of their gaze, it is clear that intense eye contact is an important factor in the ability of some psychopath to manipulate and dominate others. One of the most effective skills psychopaths use to get the trust of people is their ability to charm them. Some psychopaths lay the charm on too thick, coming across as glib, superficial, and unconvincing. However, the truly talented ones have raised their ability to charm people to that of an art, priding themselves on their ability to present a fictional self to others that is convincing, taken at face value, and difficult to penetrate”. One must always keep in mind that the charm, like manipulation, can be very subtle. The next time you find yourself dealing with an individual who nonverbal mannerism or gimmicks - riveting eye contact, dramatic hand movements, "stage scenery" , and so on tend to overwhelm you, close your eyes or look away and carefully listen to what the person is saying because the chances are you are talking to a "wolf in sheep's clothing" 2
jlola Posted March 8, 2013 Posted March 8, 2013 jlola Your article is very informative but not sure if he falls in the category of Narcissistic Sociopath as he has been in organization for long time and a successful individual. Btw, he also has major in Psychology and then MBA from reputed Univ. So he is very well aware of human Psychology and how to play with it. There is no way for him to commit a crime but following seems true about him "They are charming, agreeable, and engaging. The narcissistic sociopath loves (or seems to love) everything about you. He hooks you. Then he breaks you. His emotional abuse is VERY subtle. " On side note I think personality disordered people are like magnets for many non-personality disordered folks unless you have knowledge. This is why though only 9% of the population has "Cluster B" personality disorder. Almost everyone has been touched by them somehow. They need people to survive. They are like vampires. Many people on LS who are dating or in affairs would really do themselves a service and investigate PD's. Would save a hell of a lot of heartache and maybe now they could go on with their lives and stop chasing the "crazy".. THE SOCIOPATHIC (PSYCHOPATHIC) PERSONALITY They can be very successful corporate leaders and play that role very well. Life is a game and people are pieces on their game board to be moved at their will. If one doesn't play their game, they will have no use for them. If one begins to play their game and gets in their way, they will eliminate that person by either destroying or by discarding them. Because they live larger than life and are highly seductive, many people find them attractive, particularly individuals who are a bit timid and believe they can succeed by “going along for the ride”. Sociopaths prey on the innocent. They are the true predators of humanity. The cost to the individuals in their web and to society is immeasurable. He will choose you, disarm you with his words, and control you with his presence. He will delight you with his wit and his plans. He will show you a good time, but you will always get the bill. He will smile and deceive you, and he will scare you with his eyes. And when he is through with you, and he will be through with you, he will desert you and take with him your innocence and your pride. You will be left much sadder but not a lot wiser, and for a long time you will wonder what happened and what you did wrong. And if another of his kind comes knocking at your door, will you open it? From an essay signed, "A psychopath in prison." Without Conscience: The Disturbing World of Psychopaths Among Us. -Dr. Hare 1
Author ConfinLuv Posted March 8, 2013 Author Posted March 8, 2013 OMG you really made me scared now, earlier he was just an attactive co-worker who seem to be v.interested and have no way of saying it. But after reading your articles I'm convinced there is more to this cause are so many behaviour patterns that matches. Talking about using props, he uses his stress ball often squeezing it agressively or bouncing it around as seduction technique. The foot tapping gets louder or faster at times indicating pace. Following is so true about him and I didn't had a clue that I was a victim for 2 yrs if not physically but mentally he is totally controlling me. <Cool under pressure with an adroit use of charm and charisma, they intimidate and control others. There is often an intrusion of space and the predatory 'stare'. They have a natural ability to lie and deceive, and have an impressive use of jargon. Theyare naturals at undermining and pushing the buttons of others.> <Pacing, rapport, mirroring, speed seduction , hypnotic commands, sleight of mouth expressions, subliminal arousal techniques , and sensual domination as well as allure are all used by the psychopath to induce trance , hypnosis and suggestibility (NLP) to get what they want. > Thanks for the eye opener I totally think differently about him now. Its amazing how strangers on this forum can be so caring and a wellwisher like your parents. 1
ThatJustHappened Posted March 8, 2013 Posted March 8, 2013 The way you describe him makes him sound kind of like Ted Bundy or Charles Manson..eek! 1
spice4life Posted March 8, 2013 Posted March 8, 2013 Whoa...this stuff is down right scary! Thanks Jlola for the information extremely enlightening and I am afraid to say that it answers A LOT of questions I had. Yikes! Confinluv, put up your super power shield and RUN! 1
LadyGrey Posted March 8, 2013 Posted March 8, 2013 I know that some posters get annoyed when personality disorders/sociopaths are brought up, but sometimes things like that needed to be pointed out. In this case, absolutely it was relevant, because from what the op told us about this man, He IS creepy and it really made me a little sick to my stomach what he is doing and the sad thing is he knows exactly what he is doing the op, he picked her, because he knew how naive she is. He got a read on her and is trying to draw her further in. Run.........please. 1
jlola Posted March 8, 2013 Posted March 8, 2013 Whoa...this stuff is down right scary! Thanks Jlola for the information extremely enlightening and I am afraid to say that it answers A LOT of questions I had. Yikes! Confinluv, put up your super power shield and RUN! It was not till I began to research certain behaviors of my upbringing and my relationships, did I understand the true impact of personality disorders. My most painful,whirlwind,confusing relationships ere explained. I now can step back and see the 2 men I thought were soulmates were charismatic narcissist. It took years to get over them. But as reality hit, I am more disgusted by who they are and feel sad for anyone they lure into their web. Ya kno something is wrong with the relationship, but since you can't really put a finger on it cause you're so confused you begin to think it's you.
jlola Posted March 8, 2013 Posted March 8, 2013 I know that some posters get annoyed when personality disorders/sociopaths are brought up, but sometimes things like that needed to be pointed out. In this case, absolutely it was relevant, because from what the op told us about this man, He IS creepy and it really made me a little sick to my stomach what he is doing and the sad thing is he knows exactly what he is doing the op, he picked her, because he knew how naive she is. He got a read on her and is trying to draw her further in. Run.........please. I notice many people try to ignore PD's like they do not exist. It seems those people who REALLY should pay attention do not want to discuss it. I have a friend who is notoriously falling for the wrong girl. But he is in severe denial and only looks at positives and ignores RED FLAGS. We had been speaking with a Harvard graduate surgeon who mentioned his ex's personality disorder. My friend quickly said that was "crazy stuff" and it was over diagnosed. The doctor looked at him seriously and shook his head, saying "No, it's the opposite. It is under diagnosed and you would do well to educate yourself about this". I really think a lot of people do not want to know about PD's or associate it with convicts. Many do not understand they probably know a "Sociopath/psychopath or narcissist. I we can save just one person's sanity with this info, we need to. There is a movement to give people more awareness. 2
spice4life Posted March 8, 2013 Posted March 8, 2013 (edited) It was not till I began to research certain behaviors of my upbringing and my relationships, did I understand the true impact of personality disorders. My most painful,whirlwind,confusing relationships ere explained. I now can step back and see the 2 men I thought were soulmates were charismatic narcissist. It took years to get over them. But as reality hit, I am more disgusted by who they are and feel sad for anyone they lure into their web. Ya kno something is wrong with the relationship, but since you can't really put a finger on it cause you're so confused you begin to think it's you. Yes yes YES...this is it exactly! I also hear you about how painful these relationships are too. Most painful because they focused solely on our biggest vulnerabilities and nothing else. And then kept poking and prodding (sp?) those wounds to keep them from healing over. And so methodically! UGH...I have THE biggest pit in my stomach now. On the one hand I am relieved I survived to go on with my life and the other I feel sick that it even happened to me. Edited March 8, 2013 by spice4life 1
spice4life Posted March 8, 2013 Posted March 8, 2013 I notice many people try to ignore PD's like they do not exist. It seems those people who REALLY should pay attention do not want to discuss it. I have a friend who is notoriously falling for the wrong girl. But he is in severe denial and only looks at positives and ignores RED FLAGS. We had been speaking with a Harvard graduate surgeon who mentioned his ex's personality disorder. My friend quickly said that was "crazy stuff" and it was over diagnosed. The doctor looked at him seriously and shook his head, saying "No, it's the opposite. It is under diagnosed and you would do well to educate yourself about this". I really think a lot of people do not want to know about PD's or associate it with convicts. Many do not understand they probably know a "Sociopath/psychopath or narcissist. I we can save just one person's sanity with this info, we need to. There is a movement to give people more awareness. I completely agree! I have had more than my fair share of experiences with people who have PS's...I attract them nails to a magnet! (Well, use to anyway...acutely aware of them now!) Now this is a field of study and movement I could sink my mind into. 1
spice4life Posted March 8, 2013 Posted March 8, 2013 Whoops... sorry. I meant "have had more than my fair share of experience with people who have PD's."
spice4life Posted March 8, 2013 Posted March 8, 2013 I notice many people try to ignore PD's like they do not exist. It seems those people who REALLY should pay attention do not want to discuss it. I have a friend who is notoriously falling for the wrong girl. But he is in severe denial and only looks at positives and ignores RED FLAGS. We had been speaking with a Harvard graduate surgeon who mentioned his ex's personality disorder. My friend quickly said that was "crazy stuff" and it was over diagnosed. The doctor looked at him seriously and shook his head, saying "No, it's the opposite. It is under diagnosed and you would do well to educate yourself about this". I really think a lot of people do not want to know about PD's or associate it with convicts. Many do not understand they probably know a "Sociopath/psychopath or narcissist. I we can save just one person's sanity with this info, we need to. There is a movement to give people more awareness. I feel so bad for your friend. The bolded part describes me pre-therapy to a tee. He must be hurting and feeling so alone if he is in denial. That is exactly how I was feeling when I sat on my therapist's couch for the first time. I felt so broken and confused and the pain I was in was the worst I've ever felt in my life. Like your friend, I was happily driving right past the red flags into hell!
jlola Posted March 9, 2013 Posted March 9, 2013 I feel so bad for your friend. The bolded part describes me pre-therapy to a tee. He must be hurting and feeling so alone if he is in denial. That is exactly how I was feeling when I sat on my therapist's couch for the first time. I felt so broken and confused and the pain I was in was the worst I've ever felt in my life. Like your friend, I was happily driving right past the red flags into hell! I see so many people speaking about painful relationships in this forum. They are in denial and think it's love. Love does not manipulate,cause so much confusion and take you on a roller-coaster ride. We are taught that love means suffering. I understand IT DOES NOT!!! Then we try to fix the person, thinking if we show our loyalty and how dedicated we are to their "issues" they will love us. We believe noone understands them like we do. We do not realize that we do not understand them at all. If we did, we would understand the pain we are in is caused by them and their disfunction and run like hell because we will be pulled down into the abyss with them. We need to love ourselves enough to stop trying to fix people in order to get love. 1
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