So much wrong

[Spark1111]

I want to be happy. I want to appreciate what I have, and I have a lot. I know that I am lucky, blessed, or however you want to say it. I know that what I have most people would love to have. I have been conditioned by the constant excitement and change in my profession, and our counselor says I need to recognize that these states are unusual. I am trying. I rationally understand that no one should want their lives to be like a criminal investigation all the time!

 

My daughter has been battling many addictions and sees us both as the enemy. If my health problems result in nothing more than reuniting her with her mother then it will be worth it. I try to remind myself of that every time I feel afraid.

 

My craving to phone my OW has a lot to do with our shared profession and knowing that she would feel no disgust or disillusionment. She would know where I am coming from and why I am afraid. I am saying this only to answer questions. I know better than to force her to go through this.

 

You need to tell your wife all that you feel, fear, and have anxiety about.

 

Your OW may share your profession and be a non-judgemental listener, but GET REAL busdriver, there is no real investment on her part so it's pretty easy to do so.

 

She won't be holding either the bed pan or the vomit bucket, bud.

 

Not too hard to show compassion via telephone when it is already built into the affair scenario that she will not have to do ANY of the heavy lifting during your illness.

 

Your wife will.

 

So next time you get that urge to call your OW, tell your wife. Then tell her about your illness and it's prognosis.

 

She may leave you and then you can see how self-sacrificing your OW truly is on your behalf.

[NotCamelot]

First, I am very sorry to hear of your medical issues.....I sincerely wish you the best and also will pray for you.

 

Second, If your W loved you enough to R with you after knowing of your A, there is a tremendous amount of love there - even if you don't see it.

 

 

I truly believe you should tell your W immediately. 1. She deserves to know. 2. I think you will be overwhelmed with the love you will find once she knows.

 

Remember, sometimes good things come out of bad. I hope that is where this leads you.

 

I wish you a speedy recovery in the health of both body and marriage.

[JamesM]

Another perspective.

 

I do think you need to tell your wife no matter her reaction. It is only fair and right . She married you for better or for worse, and this is the worst. She needs to prepare for your future as well as hers.

 

Expect some difficult reactions as she must face her feelings for you, too, after the affair.

 

As for telling your OW, I can totally understand. No, I haven't had an affair, but this woman was a big part of your life and she shared your emotions and friendship very intimately. She may have been a closer friend than your wife has ever been. Sharing this with her may be the most natural desire after your relationship despite it being three years.

 

Honestly, I think she should be told too at some point.

 

If this truly is a life changing diagnosis and possibly a life ending disease, then you need to face yourself and your own feelings. If you do love this woman or at the least have deep feelings for her, then living your last days (or what to you seems like it now) may be sad and lonely. She may feel very hurt if she never knew that you had a disease and only discovered this after your death. She may have some words she would want to share with you, too.

 

I don't think no contact in this situation is always the best answer.

 

HOWEVER, if this ends up not being terminal, then be careful what Pandora's box you open if you do contact her. Prepare yourself for opening up the wound that you thought healed.

 

I just find it sad that you cannot share with your wife after you supposedly reconciled. If anything happens in my life, then my first thought is that I want to share it with Mrs JamesM. And yet if your OW is your first thought, then I find it sad that you have to deny yourself and cannot tell her this news either. I guarantee that she would want to know and probably would be respectful of your marriage and not intrude on your life.

 

Not everyone will agree with this perspective but I do feel it needs to be said.

[veryhappy]

If you could turn back the time 3 years ago, would you still choose to beg your W to reconcile?

 

What made you so greatful to get a second chance with her?

[busdriver]

I have maybe not been very clear. I haven't had any desire to try and restart my affair or make my OW be my caregiver. I was only struggling with the fact that she is the first person who came to mind when I got my news, and she has been the only person I wanted to tell. I am sure I never suggested that I was going to ask her to come and live with me.

 

I did at one point say that it made me laugh to hear the standard line about "there will be poop and she will hate it, but your wife is immune to disgust and she will be fine because her love is true." But it also makes me sad and scared because these images are the first things that come to everyone's head when I say I am sick. And that's exactly why I don't want to be the "sick guy". Because instantly everybody's mind goes to puke and poop and helplessness, and forcing people I love to do degrading things.

 

Spark, especially. Further back in the conversation a remark similar to yours was already made. I wonder if you or anyone here would ever actually say that to someone who was given news like this, to their face. Especially when they are not sure whether living with those limitations is worth it. Would you say it to my wife, who would actually be the one caring for me? Would that be your first remark to her, something involving bedpans? I am amazed at the callousness that being anonymous brings out in people.

[nofool4u]

Yesterday I got some very bad news. I haven't told anyone yet, not even my wife. But my problem is that I'm sitting here with this news, and all I can think about is my OW. I can't call her up and tell her about it, and she's the first person I wanted to speak to. I can't even imagine going through this without her. I am scared because this is my first thought. My wife is laying right next to me, and I could tell her right now. She should be the one I want to talk to. I'm writing here because I know it's wrong to contact my OW, for her sake especially, and my wife's. This is a selfish wish and I need to ignore it. My own loneliness is my own fault. How can I forget my own stupid wants and reach out to my wife?

 

I guess the only question I have is what happened to the following statement by you?

 

I am so truly grateful to her for giving me a second chance, and I feel like I have so much to live up to, becoming the man she thought I was.

[Snowflower]

 

Spark, especially. Further back in the conversation a remark similar to yours was already made. I wonder if you or anyone here would ever actually say that to someone who was given news like this, to their face. Especially when they are not sure whether living with those limitations is worth it. Would you say it to my wife, who would actually be the one caring for me? Would that be your first remark to her, something involving bedpans? I am amazed at the callousness that being anonymous brings out in people.

 

bus, you might want to go back and re-read Spark's post again. I don't want to speak for her but I don't think that is what she was saying at all.

 

Spark is one of the kindest, wisest, gentlest posters we have here on LS. I don't think she or anyone here would say something involving bedpans to your wife if we were face to face with her.

 

Hang in there! I think people are on your side, honestly! We understand you are dealing with a lot right now.

[busdriver]

You need to tell your wife all that you feel, fear, and have anxiety about.

 

Your OW may share your profession and be a non-judgemental listener, but GET REAL busdriver, there is no real investment on her part so it's pretty easy to do so.

 

She won't be holding either the bed pan or the vomit bucket, bud.

 

Not too hard to show compassion via telephone when it is already built into the affair scenario that she will not have to do ANY of the heavy lifting during your illness.

 

Your wife will.

 

So next time you get that urge to call your OW, tell your wife. Then tell her about your illness and it's prognosis.

 

She may leave you and then you can see how self-sacrificing your OW truly is on your behalf.

 

I can't come up with a reading of this that is kind or wise. Not after I repeated that I had not wished to restart my affair, and not after I already responded to a previous "puke and bedpans" remark.

[busdriver]

I know that people are on my side, Snowflower, and I am very grateful to read this support. But these remarks are signs of what terrifies me. I don't want anyone having to take care of me at all. It is actually the fact that my OW is NOT obligated to me that makes me want to talk to her. She doesn't need me for anything. So if she says I should get treatment and not give up, it is a rational voice who knows me well. My wife will of course say she wants me to get treatment because our family is the most important thing to her. But my values are different, I want reasoning too.

[Furious]

I think your story strikes a nerve in people who have been there for their loved ones through an illness, and the complication of you thinking of your OW at this difficult time was hard to hear.

 

Your posts did initially bring back sad memories of my father's battle, and my dad was and still is a very proud man, you sound a lot like him.

 

He was scared, didn't want to be burden, and he was ready to give up. But our love for him and our determination for him got us through it and he's doing great today.

 

You have every right to feel what you feel, and you're going through a hard time. Please don't let your pride stop you from fighting for your heath. Life is precious and those that love you will be there for you because you are loved.

 

Spark is a truly great person, I think she just wanted to spell it out in a way that was a form of tough love, she's someone who knows her stuff.

[jnel921]

Bus driver...I know in another post you mentioned how you've been lurking here and now have decided to post.

First and foremost, welcome....

 

I know it's tough to go through any physical ailment and feel like you need the proper support. I think this may be what brings you and your wife even closer.

 

Please remember that the OW sparked your interest because she had the same interests and she may have been attractive to you at that time.

 

You telling her that you are sick is not going to make anything better. Your wife will not share your last days on this earth with her. She would hurt more after you are gone. Why do you want her to know. To see if she cares? it's been 3 years. She hopefully has moved on with herself and someone who is dedicated to only her.

 

You worked really hard to rebuild your marriage. I am sure if you tell your wife, things may be different. Don't underestimate her reaction.

 

I am a BS. My H and I are working on our marriage.

 

But if down the road My H were sick or dying I'd want to be there to help him and kiss him before his last breath.

[veryhappy]

As a fOW, I'd like to shatter the wined and dined delicate flower preconceived idea. If an AP wants to move the A to a regular R there's just as much understanding that it includes bodily fluids. Normal people know, including those in affairs, that life is made of more mundane stuff than staring into each other eyes and having stimulating conversations. Yes, if exMM would have taken the path to be with me I would have taken care of him. Not that anyone jumps with excitement at the thought, but it's part of life. I find it much more natural for a partner or child than for a parent.

 

Anyway, to end with the bodily fluids, if there's enough money the dirty part can also be outsourced.

 

OP, can you go back to my questions? I think you are simply questioning your life given your encounter with your mortality. It could be just regret, or the surfacing of the emotional support she had provided, or you might conclude you'd make a different choice today.

 

If there's only one thing you can take away from me is that in these true cases of life and death what truly makes a difference is the wish to live. Some people are simply wishing their way into staying alive. You don't seem to want to live anymore. Ask yourself why. The bad and ugly should be temporary, right? So why not want to fight for your life?

[Spark1111]

I have maybe not been very clear. I haven't had any desire to try and restart my affair or make my OW be my caregiver. I was only struggling with the fact that she is the first person who came to mind when I got my news, and she has been the only person I wanted to tell. I am sure I never suggested that I was going to ask her to come and live with me.

 

I did at one point say that it made me laugh to hear the standard line about "there will be poop and she will hate it, but your wife is immune to disgust and she will be fine because her love is true." But it also makes me sad and scared because these images are the first things that come to everyone's head when I say I am sick. And that's exactly why I don't want to be the "sick guy". Because instantly everybody's mind goes to puke and poop and helplessness, and forcing people I love to do degrading things.

 

Spark, especially. Further back in the conversation a remark similar to yours was already made. I wonder if you or anyone here would ever actually say that to someone who was given news like this, to their face. Especially when they are not sure whether living with those limitations is worth it. Would you say it to my wife, who would actually be the one caring for me? Would that be your first remark to her, something involving bedpans? I am amazed at the callousness that being anonymous brings out in people.

 

I've been in your wife's shoes, and yeah, after many long, hard years where my entire identity was defined by my H's condition which remained a big question mark by the finest doctors for years, and keeping a roof over our heads and our kids on an even keel, I, too was repaid by his having an affair with a work colleague who found him absolutely fascinating, wonderful, and thought she would be a much more appreciative and compassionate steward of this man than I was.

 

Now, I did not blame her entirely because he ALWAYS presented as if HE was all alone in this world, surviving all his trials and tribulations by himself.A real hero, ya know?

 

And it would take years for him to realize his illness WAS OUR illness, and the sacrifice I and our children made for YEARS to get this man, that we loved, WHOLE and to other side with an optimistic ending.

 

I HELD the bed pan and vomit bucket for years cuz I loved him.

 

She loved the fantasy of him, not the reality of it all. she loved the fantasy of themanhewas back on his way to being, after the fact.

 

And yeah, she made him feel like a real important all that....on the phone. she said all the right things, all the time.

 

but she never had to act on it. It was an affair. She never had to.

 

That's easy and fun. No true demands, expectations or reality or obligations.

 

sorry I am not as empathetic as others, but I lived your scenario.

[busdriver]

It's hard to get feeling across in written words. I never meant anything I said about my wife to be a jab. She is definitely smart and probably smarter than me! She has always had the ability to be intellectual, but she just stopped caring about those things. For her, a good conversation might be a story about a family member or a memory of events or someone from our past, or talking about movies or her favorite shows. In the past she enjoyed talking with me about politics, science and discovery. A few weeks ago I was very excited about the identification of King Richard III's body. In the past we would have been up all night talking about it. But now she thinks this kind of stuff is pointless to talk about, because it doesn't have anything to do with our lives.

 

SO we are different types, with her getting her worth from the home, and me getting mine outside the home. It wasn't always like this, or we wouldn't have ended up together. Some people need a partner who is religious, or who is into fitness. I need a partner who is intellectual. I don't think that's wrong, and I don't think it means she's less than me. Just really different.

 

But on d-day, I couldn't just decide on that basis. We were both mourning our relationship with our daughter, and trying to pull our son through it, and abandoning them would have been cruel and cowardly. My OW was hurt but she did not need me in that way. She worked in a different agency than me, but our profession is a small one and I have heard that she has moved on and is engaged to a new partner. She has also achieved an important post, and I am so proud of her.

 

So I don't think I would do anything differently, even though the result has been disappointing. I still wouldn't leave my family under those circumstances. I realize that my OW not needing me is why I love her but also why we won't be together. I don't doubt I have done the right thing in staying with my wife and letting my OW go, but I can't help but be sad about it, especially now that it all seems so final and closed.

[busdriver]

Spark, the difference in the scenario is that I have not and will not ask my OW for help, but cutedragon is right. Not all OW's have to be fickle and shallow. Most who post here would give anything to have a real bond, and are sad to be just weekend fun. I am sorry for your situation but it is not universal. I won't ever know how my OW would react, but I dont' assume she would faint of disgust. I miss her because she is worth missing.

[Furious]

Spark, the difference in the scenario is that I have not and will not ask my OW for help, but cutedragon is right. Not all OW's have to be fickle and shallow. Most who post here would give anything to have a real bond, and are sad to be just weekend fun. I am sorry for your situation but it is not universal. I won't ever know how my OW would react, but I dont' assume she would faint of disgust. I miss her because she is worth missing.

 

Then be honest with your wife and tell her the truth.

[Spark1111]

I know that people are on my side, Snowflower, and I am very grateful to read this support. But these remarks are signs of what terrifies me. I don't want anyone having to take care of me at all. It is actually the fact that my OW is NOT obligated to me that makes me want to talk to her. She doesn't need me for anything. So if she says I should get treatment and not give up, it is a rational voice who knows me well. My wife will of course say she wants me to get treatment because our family is the most important thing to her. But my values are different, I want reasoning too.

 

the fact that you would trust reasoning more now than those who passionately love you speaks volumes about you.

 

the fact that you do not want to tell your wife and handle this all alone is an attempt to try and control the outcome.

 

Why is this of importance to you now?

 

life is messy, love is messy and so is any frightening diagnosis!

 

I think YOU close yourself off from others because you truly fear intimacy. You are, and maybe have been for awhile, shutting off your feelings and emotionally distancing yourself from others who love you.

 

Why are you, have you been doing this? Why be afraid?

 

the people who truly love you want to be there for you, even tough they may cry, be depressed, and display messy emotions. that's love.

 

I feel you seeking reasoning from another is because you are afraid to confront all that will transpire when you tell what is truly in your heart to those who have been there and loved you for a long, long time.

[Spark1111]

Spark, the difference in the scenario is that I have not and will not ask my OW for help, but cutedragon is right. Not all OW's have to be fickle and shallow. Most who post here would give anything to have a real bond, and are sad to be just weekend fun. I am sorry for your situation but it is not universal. I won't ever know how my OW would react, but I dont' assume she would faint of disgust. I miss her because she is worth missing.

 

I respect that.

 

But please let me say this, from the bottom of my heart, one intellectual to another who can discourse on many a topic till the sun rises....

 

Sometimes, just sometimes, some of us can hide behind our witty banter and intellectualism as a defense to feeling a feeling and allowing other who love us....in close enough to our hearts.

 

And while it is fun and entertaining and very, very stimulating....it can often be used as a defense mechanism to keep others from penetrating our self-protective veneers.

 

I have done this. I have raised it to an art form to keep others from getting to close.

 

is this what YOU are doing? because ultimately you do yourself a disservice when you equate love and self-sacrifice to banter, intellect and reasoning.

 

Life and love is messy. Don't hide behind how smart and accomplished you may be. Let people who LOVE you transgress the moat of smarts and into your heart man.

[busdriver]

Your post is giving me a lot to think about. I have been asked about fear of intimacy by our counselor, and it feels like it rings true even if I'm not sure what to do about it. To be honest, I think "moat of smarts" is more spot-on than anything our counselor has ever said. My own family was not close, and they are all gone now. I have spent more time developing myself on paper than in my heart. I'm not even sure what that means. I don't trust things that aren't rational, and it's not rational, to me, that anyone would want to care for me if I am incapacitated. Your experience is evidence to the contrary, if I can use such a clinical way to say it.

[Furious]

Spark knows her stuff.

 

She's been a great help to many here and is admired and appreciated.

[coffeebean201]

I don't have an answer for this situation.

 

When we get older we get a little stuck in our ways.

 

 

Sorry to hear about the health problem.

Hugs

[veryhappy]

I believe you are facing your mortality. You came face to face with it and there's no where to hide. A moment for looking back.

 

Grieve and miss whatever there is to grieve and miss about the OW. To me it was clear that you were not looking to restart an A, but maybe it's because I'm from the other side than most here. As far as real life goes, get your family around you. This is what you stayed for, right? To be a family. You will need their help and I suggest you accept it all.

 

Good luck with your battle.

Edited March 5, 2013 by cutedragon

[Cali408]

You better make amends. For better or worse. Contact your daughter.