Generalizations be damned, preconceived notions be shattered

[kaylan]

SO MANY women post that they want a guy taller than them. They see it as a natural desire and don't believe there's anything shallow in that desire, even though it's just as shallow as a man posting "and she better have large boobs."

 

See if you can grasp this. The fact that many/most women want it, and the fact that you managed to overcome it / find a woman that doesn't -- those things aren't contradictory. The exception neither proves nor disproves the rule.

When you consider the fact that men also prefer shorter women, and that men on average are taller than women, its not an unreasonable request for a female to want a taller man.

 

Do I prefer a shorter chick if all these were equal with the tall girl? Yes, I might...but the tall girl has her own unique personality and look, and I find her very appealing. Despite her size, I still find her to be very feminine.

SO MANY women post that they want a guy taller than them. They see it as a natural desire and don't believe there's anything shallow in that desire, even though it's just as shallow as a man posting "and she better have large boobs."

 

See if you can grasp this. The fact that many/most women want it, and the fact that you managed to overcome it / find a woman that doesn't -- those things aren't contradictory. The exception neither proves nor disproves the rule.

It is a natural biological desire. The same way many men desire a smaller and shorter female. Just gotta find girls smaller than you, or who view other qualities in you that override the height thing. For me, tall women can still get my motor going, esp if they have all those lovely curves and assets. Its like they seem like more woman to me because theres so much more femininity to take in.

 

Doesnt mean I still dont love my small and petite gals. I just find theres something to like about several types of women.

Edited February 19, 2013 by kaylan

[PJKino]

You gotta remember women include their height in heels these days

 

If a women is slightly taller then a guy in even 5 or 6 inch heels that could detr her from dating him

[ChessPieceFace]

I want a guy my height or taller.

 

Which is why generalizations are NOT "damned", why preconceived notions are NOT shattered, but in fact very much intact and being defended by both men and women in this thread. That's my point. If you're short you ARE heavily disadvantaged and pretending you aren't won't change that fact. You have to work harder, try harder, be better to compensate and find success, and all of those reasons show why the generalization is valid. And yes, it is shallow to ignore mates based on height. But it's just such an ingrained and accepted shallowness that people don't even see it when it's pointed out to them. Especially since it's a fault of WOMEN and we all know women can't be questioned about their faults.

[serial muse]

That's new information.

 

I was basing my response off of your previous response.

 

Er, no, it's exactly what she said the first time, you just misread. Relevant bits in bold and italics, for fun.

 

I want a guy my height or taller.

 

I am 5'3.5

 

Especially since it's a fault of WOMEN and we all know women can't be questioned about their faults.

 

I see. Let's hear it, then. What are your faults, specifically? You spend an awful lot of time explaining why you don't think much of women. Let's hear you take yourself apart, if you're so honest and whatnot. What are you bringing to the table, in a negative sort of way?

[ChessPieceFace]

I see. Let's hear it, then. What are your faults, specifically? You spend an awful lot of time explaining why you don't think much of women. Let's hear you take yourself apart, if you're so honest and whatnot. What are you bringing to the table, in a negative sort of way?

 

Your question "does not follow." And the fact that you got so personally offended at my comparison basically proves it. Women don't want to be called on their faults, this thread is more evidence of it. A bunch of women and even men coming to the defense of womens' preference of tall men. A preference which is clearly shallow.

 

BTW I'm above-average height. The rest of your question does not deserve an answer. I know plenty of my own faults and have the capability of introspection and honesty to accurately address them. Broadcasting my faults for your amusement has no relevance to anything.

Edited February 19, 2013 by ChessPieceFace

[Shardish]

I'm five foot five inches short and I have attracted women taller than me. I have attracted a woman who was four or five inches taller than me. I've never seen my height as a problem in dating, it's more my fear of intimacy and the fact that I don't always smile and look annoyed that harms my chances more than anything else. Of course I am not saying that women haven't written me off because I'm short, I'm sure some women have, but that doesn't bother me, that's their preference and I say good luck to them.

[clia]

A bunch of women and even men coming to the defense of womens' preference of tall men. A preference which is clearly shallow.

 

Tell you what....I'll go out with a guy who is 5'3" if you go out with a woman who weighs 300 lbs. Deal?

[pbjbear]

Well yeah, height is definitely the biggest physical disadvantage for men.

 

But you really don't have to put in more work with girls in your social circle.

 

I've also found that I'm just as successful than my most successful tall friends at cold approaching too.

 

I haven't found there to be much of a difference between our results. Attitude, confidence, and personality far outweigh everything else for guys.

 

This is why I dont feel bad for men that bitch about their looks. Sorry, but men are more shallow when it comes to looks. If you have other things to offer, many women will be interested in you.

 

I see women date down all the time but never the same for men (and no, these men arent rich or famous, they have nice personalities)...men always date in their league lookswise. Nowadays theres an epidemic of average men who feel society owes them a woman much hotter than them.

 

I have also noticed many guys only "go crazy" for women who are much hotter than them and some will only be inspired to commit to a woman out of his league lookswise. Men are DEFINITELY more shallow with looks. Its a no brainer, thats why women are more obsessed with their looks in general when compared to men.

 

If youre a woman and you arent goodlooking...nothing you can do will make a man want to be with you. Not saying guys dont give a damn about personality but its not as important on their priority list and personality only comes into play AFTER you satisfy their looks requirements, not before like some women. This is the harsh truth but many people on this site live in a fantasy world and dont want to accept it. I encourage all women I meet to work on their hotness because that really is the only way to attract more opportunities for dating. TRUTH

 

Not only that, us women are well aware theres a certain window of time where we are deemed attractive. Then we get old and our once endearing nice husbands grow sick of us and lust after younger women, no matter how good of a wife we are. And we are told to roll over and accept it.

 

Men, feel lucky you can CONTROL the things most women are attracted to. You can always gain confidence, work on your social skills and personality, work on your career (few men nowadays seem willing to work on being nice or respectful however...men nowadays are so emotionally immature...look up emotional intelligence and work on that)

For us women, good diet and exercise is a must and must be focused on at all times. Then its all fruitless after some length of time. You get to a certain age where being thin and fit doesnt matter because youre too old

Edited February 19, 2013 by pbjbear

[Shardish]

Not saying guys dont give a damn about personality but its not as important on their priority list and personality only comes into play AFTER you satisfy their looks requirements.

 

I went on a date with a girl who was very good looking, she was so good looking she could have been a model, but we had nothing in common and the date didn't excite me and I was glad when it finished. A few months later I went on a date with a girl who was nowhere near as good looking, but who was a real cutie and we clicked instantly, unfortunately it was a short lived relationship because she went to University some 300 miles away and things just broke down. Looks are important to everybody, regardless of who you are or whether you're a man or woman, but personality is also important. I'd say they are as important as each other when wanting a relationship with someone.

[melodymatters]

... AND, another thread with a decent concept: DERAILED !

 

Thanks OP, I was thinking of starting a similar thread. NOWHERE in RL do I ever run across the prejudiced perceptions I do here.

 

What many here seem to do is throw anecdote after statistic after bold faced lie, all the while forgetting that all it takes is ONE.

 

 

ONE person who doesn't care about your height, your age, your religion, your bank account, your profession, your coloring.....

 

 

JUST F*CKING ONE ! That's not so hard, really. I am in what is probably a socially frowned upon MARRIAGE, and you could not meet a happier more madly in love couple. Would our dynamics work for everyone ? Hell no, but what's the magic number again when it comes to finding that ONE person who rocks your world ?

 

1:love:1:bunny:1:love:1:bunny:1:love:1:bunny:1:love:1:bunny:1:love:

[pbjbear]

I went on a date with a girl who was very good looking, she was so good looking she could have been a model, but we had nothing in common and the date didn't excite me and I was glad when it finished. A few months later I went on a date with a girl who was nowhere near as good looking, but who was a real cutie and we clicked instantly, unfortunately it was a short lived relationship because she went to University some 300 miles away and things just broke down. Looks are important to everybody, regardless of who you are or whether you're a man or woman, but personality is also important. I'd say they are as important as each other when wanting a relationship with someone.

 

 

She was still a "real cutie" though so your post is pointless. She still met your physical requirements its just the other girl greatly surpassed them.

Tell me, if she wasnt a " real cutie" would the story be the same? NO

 

I know tons of women that have boyfriends with whom they didnt find all that cute in the beginning, but their personality made up for it. For men, the looks must be there first before the personality is ever examined in the first place

 

Men dont give girls that dont meet their physical standards a chance, then fall madly in love with parts of their personality...that never happens...men are focused on looks.

 

This is why I have no issues getting dates...because Im goodlooking. Im alot more than being goodlooking though but that part is what men focus on the most

Edited February 19, 2013 by pbjbear

[ChessPieceFace]

Tell you what....I'll go out with a guy who is 5'3" if you go out with a woman who weighs 300 lbs. Deal?

 

Except 300 lbs is much more overweight for a woman than 5'3" is short for a man. Again an obviously out-of-proportion comparison to disingenuously defend your height preferences. Is this 5'3" guy also going to be fat? If so maybe we can work with this comparison, otherwise it's just a joke.

 

Also, anyone can lose weight. People can't gain height. Well not really, unless you like breaking your bones all the time just to make them longer.

Edited February 19, 2013 by ChessPieceFace

[Shardish]

For men, the looks must be there first before the personality is ever examined in the first place

 

That's the first thing a man sees though isn't it? When I first lay eyes on a woman I don't see her personality, I see her. It's only after I get to know her that I begin to see her personality.

 

A weird thing has happened to me in the past where by I was initially unattracted to a girl, but then after a while become attracted to her because I got to know her, so you're just spouting a load of blue waffle.

 

Looks are important to men, we have to be able to get sexually aroused for a woman, but many men want a good woman with a great personality. You seem to be making a sexist stereotype which paints all men as wild sex-raved wilderbeasts who are only interested in a trophy girlfriend and nothing else.

Edited February 19, 2013 by Shardish

[serial muse]

Your question "does not follow." And the fact that you got so personally offended at my comparison basically proves it. Women don't want to be called on their faults, this thread is more evidence of it. A bunch of women and even men coming to the defense of womens' preference of tall men. A preference which is clearly shallow.

 

BTW I'm above-average height. The rest of your question does not deserve an answer. I know plenty of my own faults and have the capability of introspection and honesty to accurately address them. Broadcasting my faults for your amusement has no relevance to anything.

 

Huh. I don't feel personally offended. **check underarms for flop-sweat**

 

Nope. I'm good.

 

I just thought that what you wrote was the same ol' knee-jerk stuff you always write, so I thought I'd give you a chance to put your money where your mouth is. Unsurprisingly, you demurred. Instead, you went back to the well. Color me shocked.

[pbjbear]

I assumed that you kept saying this because you weren't good looking.

 

Now I'm confused. You say that guys will date hot girls, but not settle down with them?

 

 

No. This isnt out of personal bitterness but I work in a profession where I read scientific studies on social issues and some of it includes dating/gender issues.

 

I also have always been the type to observe my surroundings alot. Alot of the stuff I observe I look up in research too.

 

In NYC where there is a surplus of women, many men dont want to settle down period unless its with a woman out of their league lookswise. Lots of women around me have made comments about this and there are studies to back this up (this pretty much happens in any area where there is a surplus of one gender) so I dont think its me better bitter or jaded. Some people just cant handle reality...

[ChessPieceFace]

Instead, you went back to the well.

 

As opposed to your post. Going back to the well of personal attacks and judging others.

[serial muse]

As opposed to your post. Going back to the well of personal attacks and judging others.

 

Oh? That's interesting. I find your posts to be extremely judgmental, actually. And the attacks go without saying. When have you not made a post that tells the world how little you think of others, and women in particular? I offered you a chance to hold up a mirror. Offer still stands.

[kaylan]

Which is why generalizations are NOT "damned", why preconceived notions are NOT shattered, but in fact very much intact and being defended by both men and women in this thread. That's my point. If you're short you ARE heavily disadvantaged and pretending you aren't won't change that fact. You have to work harder, try harder, be better to compensate and find success, and all of those reasons show why the generalization is valid. And yes, it is shallow to ignore mates based on height. But it's just such an ingrained and accepted shallowness that people don't even see it when it's pointed out to them. Especially since it's a fault of WOMEN and we all know women can't be questioned about their faults.

Um. Shes saying she would date a guy whos short. Just not one shorter than her. Most girls wont even date a guy whos of average height because they want to factor their heels into the relationship.

 

Pbjbear is saying shes not like these women.

I wasn't going to delve into this further, but since we're knitpicking...

 

She stated that she wants a guy her height or taller. Yes, she is not tall. But that's irrelevant. What IS relevant is her immediate specification on height.

 

If she was 5'8, her requirements would most likely be the same. She just happens to be 5'3.

 

So if she met an awesome guy that's 5'2, would she disregard him because of his height? Based on her initial statement, we don't know the answer to that. Only later did she specify and state that the answer is probably "no."

 

I was incorrect in stating that she only wanted tall guys. My bad.

 

Just to clarify.

I wouldnt blame her if she did. For a girl of her small stature, having a guy be smaller than her may indeed be a turn off.

[pbjbear]

I dont meet guys shorter than 5'3...all of those men are not men, but boys who are under 14 years of age

 

Youd be better off asking taller women

 

ehhh Im not a huge heels girl so I didnt think about that

[kaylan]

The thing is, guys complain about height...but its not like tall girls dont deal with bs. The chick I mentioned in my OP has issues getting approached...and even when she is approached, guys say typical or stupid things about her height and it turns her off. And shes a good looking gal too, so its obvious that the height turns some guys away, the same way short height turns women away from men.

[ChessPieceFace]

Oh? That's interesting. I find your posts to be extremely judgmental, actually. And the attacks go without saying. When have you not made a post that tells the world how little you think of others, and women in particular? I offered you a chance to hold up a mirror. Offer still stands.

 

A mirror? I debate the issues in the thread. How about looking in the mirror at someone who searches for posts of a particular poster they hate, to specifically engage them in personal attacks. Since that would be you. You admitted to it above.

[kaylan]

Well yeah, height is definitely the biggest physical disadvantage for men.

 

But you really don't have to put in more work with girls in your social circle.

 

I've also found that I'm just as successful than my most successful tall friends at cold approaching too.

 

I haven't found there to be much of a difference between our results. Attitude, confidence, and personality far outweigh everything else for guys.

Id say these are icing on the looks cake. In my experience, with the exception of one of my exes, all the other girls who have dated me, were initially drawn to me physically.

[kaylan]

This is why I dont feel bad for men that bitch about their looks. Sorry, but men are more shallow when it comes to looks. If you have other things to offer, many women will be interested in you.

Untrue. I know plenty of shallow women.

 

I see women date down all the time but never the same for men (and no, these men arent rich or famous, they have nice personalities)...men always date in their league lookswise. Nowadays theres an epidemic of average men who feel society owes them a woman much hotter than them.

I know several guys whove dated down.

 

I have also noticed many guys only "go crazy" for women who are much hotter than them and some will only be inspired to commit to a woman out of his league lookswise. Men are DEFINITELY more shallow with looks. Its a no brainer, thats why women are more obsessed with their looks in general when compared to men.

If women are more concerned about their looks than men, why do I know a number of guys who are fashion obsessed? And why do so many guys hit the gym?

 

If youre a woman and you arent goodlooking...nothing you can do will make a man want to be with you. Not saying guys dont give a damn about personality but its not as important on their priority list and personality only comes into play AFTER you satisfy their looks requirements, not before like some women. This is the harsh truth but many people on this site live in a fantasy world and dont want to accept it. I encourage all women I meet to work on their hotness because that really is the only way to attract more opportunities for dating. TRUTH

This is true for both men and women. Increasing your sex appeal increases your dates. Ive seen the gym and wardrobe change the dating life of a couple guys I know. Plenty of men dont get the chance to show some women their personalities because they dont make it by her looks requirement first.

 

Not only that, us women are well aware theres a certain window of time where we are deemed attractive. Then we get old and our once endearing nice husbands grow sick of us and lust after younger women, no matter how good of a wife we are. And we are told to roll over and accept it.

Dont listen to internet forum trolls.

Men, feel lucky you can CONTROL the things most women are attracted to. You can always gain confidence, work on your social skills and personality, work on your career (few men nowadays seem willing to work on being nice or respectful however...men nowadays are so emotionally immature...look up emotional intelligence and work on that)

For us women, good diet and exercise is a must and must be focused on at all times. Then its all fruitless after some length of time. You get to a certain age where being thin and fit doesnt matter because youre too old

Lmao...do you ever talk to older married women? Because some of the stuff me and my friends have heard from friends and coworkers in the past made our eyes widen and jaws drop. These women noticed young beef as much as older men noticed young women.

 

And there are plenty of older women who cant be bothered with a guy thats balding or has a belly...and that comes with aging. Ive heard a number of women say that on this site, but I dont let it affect my world view. Just gotta find someone you click with and hope for the best.

 

We all change.

She was still a "real cutie" though so your post is pointless. She still met your physical requirements its just the other girl greatly surpassed them.

Tell me, if she wasnt a " real cutie" would the story be the same? NO

 

I know tons of women that have boyfriends with whom they didnt find all that cute in the beginning, but their personality made up for it. For men, the looks must be there first before the personality is ever examined in the first place

 

Men dont give girls that dont meet their physical standards a chance, then fall madly in love with parts of their personality...that never happens...men are focused on looks.

 

This is why I have no issues getting dates...because Im goodlooking. Im alot more than being goodlooking though but that part is what men focus on the most

I noticed my ex's personality before her looks. It was our mental click that made it so I always found her as cute.

 

Shes not a bad look girl at all. But if I saw her on OLD I would have skipped over her. So yes, plenty of guys fall for a girls personality and have her grow on him. But youll never listen to me

[serial muse]

A mirror? I debate the issues in the thread. How about looking in the mirror at someone who searches for posts of a particular poster they hate, to specifically engage them in personal attacks. Since that would be you. You admitted to it above.

 

I honestly don't know what you're talking about here. Sorry if I gave the impression I hate you. I don't know you from Adam. I just dislike the blanket statements that are rampant on these boards, I do feel like you're a contributor to that trend (and I don't know anything else about you but what you post, and that's all you seem to post) and yes, you made one above and I challenged you on it because I find it tiresome. Perhaps you're a well-rounded chap with many other interesting viewpoints on life that aren't about why you dislike women so particularly. Who knows.

 

My feelings on what kaylan posted were expressed earlier, quite fully.

 

Whatever, enough threadjacking, this is clearly not going to go anywhere useful. Sorry k.

Edited February 20, 2013 by serial muse

[Zed]

No. This isnt out of personal bitterness but I work in a profession where I read scientific studies on social issues and some of it includes dating/gender issues.

 

I also have always been the type to observe my surroundings alot. Alot of the stuff I observe I look up in research too.

 

In NYC where there is a surplus of women, many men dont want to settle down period unless its with a woman out of their league lookswise. Lots of women around me have made comments about this and there are studies to back this up (this pretty much happens in any area where there is a surplus of one gender) so I dont think its me better bitter or jaded. Some people just cant handle reality...

 

 

This is true. The skewed gender ratio can be seen in Wilston, ND an oil boom town in which the sex ratio is toward men and not women based on this article:

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/16/us/16women.html?pagewanted=2&_r=0

 

Here are some choice quotes to illustrate it: