Should I be grateful?

[Elfie]

Hi, well, after 3 successful days at NC, and yesterday he was outside trying to get my attention and I ginored him. Then last night a knock at my door (he lives opposite) no one there - but on the doorstep a bunch of roses (yellow, my favourite which he knows) and some chocolates - not a box, a kind of biscuit pack, the kind you put in kids lunch box or have with coffee.

 

There was also a valentine's card, he'd written "Love -------" (his name) and a few kisses, but inside, I saw the roses were from a supermarket and a couple of them were dead! It was late evening (hence the reason he could nip over in the dark) so maybe he got there in time to buy the reduced ones?! It was actually 2 small bunches, 4 roses in the bunch and one dropped off broken, as I took them out the wrap.

 

I have found NC OK, a bit numb but glad to be out of the head games and booty calls, so when I saw the dead flowers I nearly cried - is this all he thinks I was worth, or should I applaud his efforts? (He always claimed "I don't do cards" so that's a bit of a curve ball, but last year he went on a £3,000 holiday with W - though claimed he wanted to come back to me after a week).

 

Views/opinions welcome.

[Lillyfree]

Elfie... congratulations on keeping NC and ignoring his lame attempts.

 

i wouldn't concentrate on where he buys things and how much he spends on them - heck, i prefer it when i get a flower that he's picked (possibly from someone's garden, tehe) on his way back from work, than hundreds of dollars on overpriced roses because he feels he 'has to'.

 

it's the way he's treated you that sucks. the fact he doesn't respect your wishes for him to stay away and leave you alone.

 

he's spent that much money on a holiday with his wife because she is his wife. they probably share all their finances and he wouldn't be able to justify large amounts missing, hence the cheap presents. that should be enough to send you a message where you are as far as priorities go.

[stevie_23]

The title of this thread is telling...should you be GRATEFUL? For what? For your ex's choice to leave flowers outside your door? That's nothing to feel grateful for. It's a nice enough gesture (the fact some were dead, and they were from the supermarket, is not relevant apart from the fact he didn't go "all out" and get better quality ones, but why would he? You're broken up), but why would you feel grateful to him for it? That would imply to me that you feel undeserving of any positive feelings from him.

 

You live opposite each other? And you're NC? How awkward is that?!?!

[Elfie]

Hi Stevie - thanks for your reply. It is yes, very awkward living opposite, I think that's part of the reason I fell for him - my mum had just died and he'd been trying to get me to go for coffee for a year but I kept turning him away (in between him knocking on my door at night...)

 

I guess my past confirms why I should feel grateful for crumbs - violent alcoholic father and mother neglected me, said when i was 18 she wished she'd got rid of me like her mother told me to, called me fat and I've had a lifelong eating problem resulting in osteo problems and hospitalised and 2 violent/abusive relationships.

 

And people who don't understand think we're selfish and sluts....

[Elfie]

I just want to add, I don't measure him by what he spends, I'd have rather a single flower, like stated, that he picked himself, than a truckload, it was just the fact that some were dead - I wasn't sure what he was trying to say.

[Lillyfree]

I just want to add, I don't measure him by what he spends, I'd have rather a single flower, like stated, that he picked himself, than a truckload, it was just the fact that some were dead - I wasn't sure what he was trying to say.

 

you're over analysing. don't read to much into it, i don't think he was sending you any sort of message. he's just fishing.

 

i'm sorry about your childhood. it makes me so angry to hear that a mother can treat her child that way. and of course, you have carried the demons from your childhood to adult life, and ended up choosing wrong people, continuing abuse.

 

don't do that to yourself anymore! stop the cycle of self-abuse and abuse by others, realise that you're a wonderful person and worth being cherished and loved. this can be your turning point.

 

*hugs*

[whichwayisup]

Hi Stevie - thanks for your reply. It is yes, very awkward living opposite, I think that's part of the reason I fell for him - my mum had just died and he'd been trying to get me to go for coffee for a year but I kept turning him away (in between him knocking on my door at night...)

 

I guess my past confirms why I should feel grateful for crumbs - violent alcoholic father and mother neglected me, said when i was 18 she wished she'd got rid of me like her mother told me to, called me fat and I've had a lifelong eating problem resulting in osteo problems and hospitalised and 2 violent/abusive relationships.

 

And people who don't understand think we're selfish and sluts....

 

Elfie, this man is poison! And he is treating you like second fiddle, an after thought. Keep on ignoring him! Don't make this about the flowers, or how much money he spends on his wife and their trip.. This is about him trying to manipulate you and woo himself back into your life. Keep that door closed and don't ever let him.

 

You have a lot of past hurts, deep wounds that need to be talked about so you can heal and find peace, live life in a healthy way and make good choices that won't hurt you. Please do counseling.

 

Lots of hugs to you.

[jwi71]

Would you be grateful for dead flowers from a single guy?

 

Why or why not?

[MissBee]

Hi, well, after 3 successful days at NC, and yesterday he was outside trying to get my attention and I ginored him. Then last night a knock at my door (he lives opposite) no one there - but on the doorstep a bunch of roses (yellow, my favourite which he knows) and some chocolates - not a box, a kind of biscuit pack, the kind you put in kids lunch box or have with coffee.

 

There was also a valentine's card, he'd written "Love -------" (his name) and a few kisses, but inside, I saw the roses were from a supermarket and a couple of them were dead! It was late evening (hence the reason he could nip over in the dark) so maybe he got there in time to buy the reduced ones?! It was actually 2 small bunches, 4 roses in the bunch and one dropped off broken, as I took them out the wrap.

 

I have found NC OK, a bit numb but glad to be out of the head games and booty calls, so when I saw the dead flowers I nearly cried - is this all he thinks I was worth, or should I applaud his efforts? (He always claimed "I don't do cards" so that's a bit of a curve ball, but last year he went on a £3,000 holiday with W - though claimed he wanted to come back to me after a week).

 

Views/opinions welcome.

 

 

Ahhh applaud what effort exactly?

 

You're in NC trying to move on no?

 

So him dropping reduced price, dead flowers at your door under the cover of dark is not sweet, romantic or commendable. You should be insulted! He is still married to his wife, taking her on vacations and you're still his side piece whom he thinks enough of to drop almost dead flowers on your door steps. Please don't reach and attempt to pull a gold nugget out of this pile of shyyt. Be insulted and use this latest antic to help you move on.

[Turtles]

Seems pretty lame of him to try to buy you out with a cheap gift after you made it clear you did not want to hear from him anymore. I find it mean & selfish of him to try and reopen the wound you are trying to heal. Maybe (depending on situation exactly, and considering the awkwardness of living next door) it would have been appropriate & sweet to pick a non-romantic "just friends" Valentine's card but he is obviously still letting his penis do the thinking.

 

It's a bit insulting that he only spent maybe $5 on it but honestly even for $100 it would have had the same meaning.

[Elfie]

Thanks for your advice, good wishes & honesty, it helps see things I can't, as I'm between head and heart still.

 

I guess I am still looking for signs that I mean something - or meant anything, because I'm one of those OW's who suffers huge self esteem issues and even though I know it's wrong, I fell and I'm still in the stage of "fingers crossed I could be wrong about him and he really does love me more than his W".

 

Or, as he puts it (conveniently ) "it's a different kind of love".

 

**Hugs**

[Turtles]

I am sure you meant something to him and maybe he did/does love you but at the end of the day his wife is who he is building a life with. Hope you find someone who treats you like a princess and puts you as # 1 in his life.

[whichwayisup]

I'm still in the stage of "fingers crossed I could be wrong about him and he really does love me more than his W".

 

Not enough to divorce her and start a new life with you.

 

Put that out of your head...All that does is give you hope. Start listening to your head, not your heart. Take a giant step back, really do your best to see things from a new and different perspective. You'll see 'reality' in a whole new light and hopefully let go more.

[waterwoman]

Grateful? No!

[Catplates]

A rough guess....

 

He got the flowers cheaply at the end of the day, thus they were in poor condition.

 

He nicked the chocolates out of the kid's lunch supplies and chucked together a tawdry package for you.

 

ELFIE ELFIE ELFIE... It show you just how much he values you. Anything is good enough for you. I'll bet he wouldn't do that to his wife.

 

If it were me I would return them to his doorstep with no explanation. Let him explain it to his wife.

 

WAKE UP GIRL... More crumbs. What on earth do you have to be grateful for.

 

Cat.

[Elfie]

"He should be grateful you are not me. I'd take the flowers to his wife with a note explaining everything".

I've no intention of hurting her - this is a really grey area for me, I've been the cheated on wife, though what I'm doing isn't good or right, I don't believe I could intentionally hurt her as well as myself.

"Not enough to divorce her and start a new life with you".

Though hard to think about, this is a very good and valid thing to be told.

"I would not put any meaning behind how much the flowers costs, that is really crass to do so".

I don't mean to be crass, I am the kind of person who doesn't measure things that way - usually - but may be that I am now looking for any kind of sign that I'm worthy - ie to analyse dead flowers.. Just shows how little I think of myself.

 

Toxic isn't he?

 

ELFIE ELFIE ELFIE... It show you just how much he values you. Anything is good enough for you. I'll bet he wouldn't do that to his wife.

[fllygirl]

I just want to add, I don't measure him by what he spends, I'd have rather a single flower, like stated, that he picked himself, than a truckload, it was just the fact that some were dead - I wasn't sure what he was trying to say.

 

I don't think he was trying to say anything other then getting your attention.

Do you really think he would intentionally bring you dead/broken flowers?

Really? Who does it? Then why he would even bother?

 

Not all men know how to pick up good flowers and sometimes the sellers put one or two bad into the bunch. He could bought your flowers in the morning, but got busy and didn't deliver till late night and some flowers went dead without water. Maybe it was only yellow roses were left and he didnt want to buy any other, because yellow are your favorite and he knows that.. And why bother to buy two bunch? If he didn't care or was really cheap he would buy only one. And what is wrong to leave a small little candy/chocolate? Would a big box of chocolate make you happier? Would $400 flowers make him better in your eyes? What it would change? It's not about flowers at all. He wants your attention and he clearly got it.

Stay at NC and stop over analyzing and guessing.

[Elfie]

Well Thursday night (Valentine's) he actually knocked at the door in full view of the neighbours - kind of, it was dark - he had a single red rose. I felt bad for moaning/overanalysing the yellow/dead roses and he talked. He said he doesn't bother giving any to his W as she complained the last time with "why bother on this day just because you have to".

 

Today we had a coffee at a really nice place, we talked non stop, he was nice, attentive, but I bottled it again, thinking of his W so I told him I just wanted to be friends, he was really nice and OK about it - I know I can't ignore him completely as i tried so many times (and he lives opposite) but I don't know how convinced I am.

 

I don't blame anyone but myself, I guess I'm not ready to leave him yet, not sure why. A lost cause.

[whichwayisup]

but may be that I am now looking for any kind of sign that I'm worthy - ie to analyse dead flowers.. Just shows how little I think of myself.

 

Do you see though by having an A with a MM does make you line yourself up to be second fiddle automatically? If you are insecure and self confidence issues to begin with, this is NOT a healthy situation for you to be in PERIOD! Elfie, you are worthy! And you SHOULD think highly of yourself! Please work on you, get some counseling to rebuild your self esteem. To try to rely on a man to make you happy, make yourself feel good, you need to be happy with "you" first. Nobody can provide self worth except you!

[Elfie]

Having been cheated on before, you know exactly how his wife feels. And you are choosing to participate in that hurt and deception.

 

Why? seriously. Why? What is he offering you that you are so willing to push aside the incredible hurt and betrayal you felt before?

 

He doesn't love you.

He is playing with you.

He isn't leaving his wife for you, no matter how often he bad mouths her (which is so incredibly crass and disrespectful...doesn't it make you wonder what he says to his wife about you???)

 

Why are you so willing to accept such disgusting crumbs?

 

There is concrete evidence his W treats him in a shoddy way - wether it is both of them as bad I don't know.

I am aware of the hurt I am causing, and I'm aware of what little I'm accepting, but I'm not in a place where I can leave.

 

I can though, leave HERE, the last post is too much - I came here for support and help - thank to all who have given me genuine help and constructive advice and helped me see more, but I've been open about what wrong I'm doing, I know, but life happens and I didn't come here for more abuse.

[TaraMaiden]

I am aware of the hurt I am causing, and I'm aware of what little I'm accepting, but I'm not in a place where I can leave.

 

Yes you are. You always have been.

But you just don't want to.

Because this poor quality of attention, this abuse, this cruelty is better than nothing at all.

You devalue yourself - and his wife - by what you say.

 

I can though, leave HERE, the last post is too much - I came here for support and help - thank to all who have given me genuine help and constructive advice and helped me see more, but I've been open about what wrong I'm doing, I know, but life happens and I didn't come here for more abuse.

 

There is no abuse here at all.

you were the one to post threads on how unhappy he makes you feel, and how you hate this situation.

You complain now because you're not receiving pats on the back and reassuring virtual cuddles. You're getting people 'telling you like it is'.

 

Where is abuse?

There is none.

There is just truth.

But you don't appreciate it, because it's too raw, too revealing and too close to the mark.

 

Until you face facts - until you realise that this is exactly how it is - then you will never be able to look life in the face and spit in its eye.

You will always feel second-best and used.

 

And you'll always put up with it, because you will always believe it's the best you can do.

[Elfie]

Yes you are. You always have been.

But you just don't want to.

Because this poor quality of attention, this abuse, this cruelty is better than nothing at all.

You devalue yourself - and his wife - by what you say.

 

 

 

There is no abuse here at all.

you were the one to post threads on how unhappy he makes you feel, and how you hate this situation.

You complain now because you're not receiving pats on the back and reassuring virtual cuddles. You're getting people 'telling you like it is'.

 

Where is abuse?

There is none.

There is just truth.

But you don't appreciate it, because it's too raw, too revealing and too close to the mark.

 

Until you face facts - until you realise that this is exactly how it is - then you will never be able to look life in the face and spit in its eye.

You will always feel second-best and used.

 

And you'll always put up with it, because you will always believe it's the best you can do.

 

Alot's changed since my last posting - I didn't leave this forum, I think I just needed to step back and think. TaraMaiden you made some valid points, but re abuse, I was referring to alot of posts I read before deciding to join (months back) so I was scared by admitting I couldn't leave the MM. You were right, it was too raw and I wasn't ready to hear it.

 

I'm not sure how many OW's have to come to a place by themselves, where they can leave, but my next thread will show I think I possibly have.

 

I will always believe this is the best I can do, because of my history, but it doesn't mean I want it, or went into it willingly - I'd lost my mum, she'd been dead 2 days before I was told, there was alot ot get my head around and this guy had been asking me for coffee for a year - infact I only told him of my loss because I wanted to make sure he knew not to hassle me as I'd just lost a parent* - he used it to his advantage and suggested a coffee and a talk - a month of asking later and I gave in - I really did just give in to stop him asking. When we sat down he was pawing at me and I felt uneasy, realising he'd conned me, but he was just so good at convincing me I needed him, and sometimes being the OW means you can't see things in black and white, or even think clearly, because the MM (in my case) just didn't get the message and plays mind games.

 

*He'd tried to grab me down the road a few days earlier and pull me into his van "for a kiss, just a peck on the cheek" and I'd struggled to get away from him. It was 9am on a Saturday morning too, in the middle of the main road!

[tulip80]

Nope..you should be insulted..because you're worth more than a bunch of dead $6 grocery store flowers. Not saying to waste your energy hating him, but continue to do you.

 

I'd feel SO flattered with xOM and it has been 2 days of NC for me..that I finally gathered up the courage to stand firm to. I feel like I'm coming off of heroin sometimes but I swear if you push thru a few more days/weeks..you're gonna see this guy for what he really is. It's hard when we don't give our hormones time to rest.

 

Let the superficial feelings die off and you'll become stronger by the day. I know it's hard as HELL..but keep posting here if you need to. I'm a nervous wreck and know I've done wrong and using this forum to keep giving me small doses of reality. Funny thing is..I totally knew better before I got sucked into this but my mind is just all messed for having played with fire and I want to get back up on my feet

[Catplates]

Elfie you are being wound up by BSs on here. I didn't mean you were being crass i was referring to what other posters said about your MM. I really think you should ignore these people they are not here to help you but help themselves feel that you as an OW mean nothing.

 

I am not a BS.. former OW

 

Cat