Any one else trying to regain the trust?

[wanderluster]

I am 23 years old, I have been married for 3 years, 6 months ago I had a secret messaging affair with another man, the relationship only got as far as kissing and only lasted for 1 month but along with the deception, I hurt him very bad.

My husband decided to leave, he moved to another state. Last month he asked me to come up to see him, which I did for a few days, things went well, and we both felt like trying again.

So I bought my ticket to leave everything behind, and start fresh with my husband here.

He, as well as every other betrayed spouse needed me to show and display my loyalty, which I have done.

He asked for the following things in order to take me back: Delete facebook, no more parties, only part-time work allowed, clean the house, and help him with his projects.

I understand that he wants back the control he felt he lost when I cheated.

I have tried to be honest and open, he has my pass code for my phone, he can read through everything, I have nothing to hide.

The other day I read through his phone, finding messages to other girls only the week before I was supposed to come up, and we were back together. I called one of the girls and just asked for the truth, she told me he had tried to get with her several times, but she has a boyfriend and she told him that, I asked her if he ever mentioned me and she told me he hadn't and he wasn't wearing a ring.

When I asked him about it, he laughed, got angry at me for going through his phone and literally, threw me out on to the streets. The next day he apologised and asked me to come back, which I did.

This morning one of the girls messaged him, I asked him to tell her that he was married and his wife is here now, he refused to and put a pass code lock on his phone.

I understand that betrayed spouses tend to want to have revenge affairs.

I have been treated like dirt and a slave since I got here, there have been moments of happiness, but if he asks for anything from me I have to do it and I have done, yet he has repeatedly told me that I have done nothing. I left everything to come up here to work things out with him, my only request was that these girls he was seeing knows that he's married, I don't even deserve that much respect. He calls me a criminal, and says I have to be punished for what I did.

I am feeling hurt and helpless, I want to make my marriage work, I have been trying to help him, be with him, and comfort him. I’ve read on many forums and sites about how I can help him recover.

I know what I did was wrong, are there any other cheaters who are trying to regain their spouses trust going through similar experiences?

[TaraMaiden]

He's going too far.

he feels that the best way to exact revenge is to control you and do what he wants.

He doesn't want to 'repair this marriage'.

He wants to control you and he thinks he has the upper hand by resorting to bullying and abuse.

he's got you precisely where he wants you, and he's going to make you suffer.

 

You need to leave, and you need to file for divorce.

This is completely unacceptable behaviour.

It doesn't excuse what you did, and what you did was wrong - you know that now.

 

But what your husband is doing is unhealthy, and completely and totally destructive.

 

Please leave. Go and stay with a friend, with family - anything you can. But don't stay there a moment longer than you have to.

 

if you file for divorce, it may be the catalyst your H. needs to agree to couples counselling.

He may see, or be made to see, that his behaviour is utterly counter-productive.

 

But don't hang your hopes on it, he may not come round....

In any case, you need to put distance between you two, because this is just soul-destroying and almost criminal.....

Edited February 3, 2013 by TaraMaiden

[BetrayedH]

I took out a lot of my anger on my wife after her affair. Not initially, but over time (after I felt safe) it came out in bursts. I had an increasingly difficult time not yelling and swearing. I hazard to say that I think it bothered me a lot more than it did her. I was a broken person. Much like you, she blamed herself for making me that way. Infidelity is a very tough thing to choke down.

 

I sought counsel here to try to stop. I received a lot of advice about my wife needing to ride out the rollercoaster of emotions with me if she wanted to reconcile. But it also became abundantly clear that abusive behavior is still patently unacceptable and a legitimate dealbreaker for my wife if I wanted to reconcile. What I heard from many men with the same issue was that they didn't get much control of it until their WW finally said, enough and put their foot down.

 

My wife and I managed to come to some good agreements. We chose days and times that were appropriate for affair/marriage-related conversations. We set a time limit. We reconnected after each discussion; we cuddled on the couch for one of our favorite shows (hell, celebrate with ice cream if you must). In particular, I agreed to no yelling and no swearing. We also did a journal of sorts where I could ask questions and leave it on her nightstand. She might take a day or two to provide a thoughtful response and return it. This was a safe way to have difficult conversations. Of course, we also did marriage counseling and both of us were in individual counseling.

 

What your husband is doing is unacceptable. You need to make it clear that if he wants to reconcile, it has to stop. Tell him, "enough" and put your foot down. It's time for an ultimatum. It takes two to reconcile a marriage; it only takes one to ruin it. Then tell him that you love him, that you are sorry, that you want to reconcile, and what you are willing to do (MC, IC, transparency, agreements in social lives, how you'll address anxiety, etc)..

 

If he refuses, then you have no choice but to take Tara's advice. The only way I differ from her at this point is that I think you make one serious, ultimatum-like attempt to change his direction before you throw in the towel. For many of us betrayed husbands, it's what we needed in order to change gears. I think you should make that effort.

 

I will say that your H's behavior is pretty over the top. I also assume he is young (since you are only 23) and probably pretty immature. Based on the short bit I have read from you above, I wouldn't give you high chances of success. I just think your marriage deserves that one last effort. Reconciliation takes a truly remorseful wayward spouse and a truly forgiving betrayed spouse. You may be remorseful but I'm not sure if he can forgive. You may both have to accept that your affair was ultimately a dealbreaker for him. But it doesn't need to be a life sentence and if this keeps up, that's what it will be for both of you.

 

Good luck.

Edited February 3, 2013 by BetrayedH

[KathyM]

You're not really in any position to issue ultimatums at this point, I think. You hurt him badly and it's going to take some time to recover from it. That doesn't mean that you have to put up with abuse, however. He probably won't want to treat you warmly or nicely for awhile, as a self defense since you hurt him so badly. You can't really expect him to get over it at this point and not be angry or show his anger. Suggest marriage counseling, and that will help both of you to gauge if the marriage is salvageable. There may be too much hurt for your husband to get past this. And you're really not in a position to dictate anything about his phone at this point, since he is not sure if he wants you back yet, so he's probably not willing to cut ties with anyone he's been seeing/talking to while you were separated. Suggest marriage counseling, and there the counselor will help you to establish boundaries you both can live with.

[TaraMaiden]

Sorry - I cannot agree with her taking the softly-softly approach here.

She needs to get out - then suggest negotiations and counselling.

But his behaviour is completely unacceptable, and the more she remains and is exposed to it, the more it will grind her down, weaken her and render her helpless. It will utterly destroy her self confidence, and he will simply berate her more.

She needs to take action first - to show she is serious - if she does it the other way round, he may even take measures to prevent her from carrying out any warning of separation.

[road]

Just because the WW drops her pants does not mean that her BH can act like a WS and deny access to his cell, FB, email, etc. They both have to be open books as part of recovery and for the rest of their marriage.

 

It is one thing for the anger to get the best of a BS shortly after dday and the start of recovery and have a short out burst.

 

This BH is acting as a WH and is punishing his WW. Recovery is not done by punishing. Being transparent may be hard on a WS at first. So is giving up a toxic friend. Those are things that have to be done. A foged up WW may not see it that way at first but they do when they defog. These things are not punishment.

 

Her BH/WH? is punishing her.

[wanderluster]

I don't want to portray my husband as a sadistic unreasonable sadist. He is not, he is just deeply hurt, and the feelings of betrayal are too overwhelming for him to grasp.

I just wanted to know if this was the only path to reconciliation. I agree that this is counter-productive, I needed to hear that this is normal and it’s not permanent and submitting to his requests and anger was what he needs in order to trust me again.

I think he fears that by letting me have any rights at all, he will be leaving himself vulnerable again.

I keep trying to explain to him that I am not here to hurt him. I think his decision to be hurt is just a form of defence.

I don’t want to give up on this marriage. I don’t want to offer any ultimatums, I just want to know how to fix this mess I made, and that things will get better.

I have been reading your responses with him. They’ve really helped me to explain to him that this behaviour doesn’t place us on the road to reparation.

After a day of peace, he gave me the pass code to his phone, and has told the girl he is married.

This morning he felt a wave of anger again, we tried setting a time limit, I’ve tried to diffuse his anger and assure him that I’m here because I am sorry and I am not going to hurt him again, I’ve agreed not to go through his phone without asking him first, I made him a coffee and fed him, what else can I do to stop his pain?

[wanderluster]

You broke his trust by cheating on him and then when he gave you another chance you broke his trust again by snooping through his phone without his permission.

 

You don't sound very patient, why not actually stop being deceptive--don't just "try" to be "open and honest", BE "open and honest"--for a couple of months and see if he softens up a bit.

 

On the other hand maybe you are the type of woman who just doesn't know how to be completely open and honest because you never have been?

 

Was it really only a "kiss" with the other man? Do you think your husband believes it was really only a kiss?

 

What happened? Did the other man dump you?

 

Cheating at age 23 after only a couple of years of marriage?

 

You sound like you were too young and immature to get married in the first place.

 

Although pretty much everyone else is suggesting you portray your husband as an abusive unreasonable sadist, I'll take the opposite tack and recommend that you stop feeling sorry for yourself and looking for reasons to blame him for the current situation.

 

 

You sound like someone who has been betrayed by someone you loved, I don't know your full story so I wont make too many assumptions and judgements on what is going on with your life.

But I will ask you to understand that my situation is different from yours, I want and love my husband very much, I was selfish and stupid and maybe your WS feels the same.

Please don't let the pain turn you into a bitter man, or let your experience change you into someone who builds your walls too high.

Everyone you let in will have a chance to betray you, but you have to trust that not everyone will.

I guess your spouse isn't there to comfort you with the agony she inflicted, I'm sorry that you have to do this alone.

[Ninja'sHusband]

I don't want to portray my husband as a sadistic unreasonable sadist. He is not, he is just deeply hurt, and the feelings of betrayal are too overwhelming for him to grasp.

I just wanted to know if this was the only path to reconciliation. I agree that this is counter-productive, I needed to hear that this is normal and it’s not permanent and submitting to his requests and anger was what he needs in order to trust me again.

I think he fears that by letting me have any rights at all, he will be leaving himself vulnerable again.

I keep trying to explain to him that I am not here to hurt him. I think his decision to be hurt is just a form of defence.

I don’t want to give up on this marriage. I don’t want to offer any ultimatums, I just want to know how to fix this mess I made, and that things will get better.

I have been reading your responses with him. They’ve really helped me to explain to him that this behaviour doesn’t place us on the road to reparation.

After a day of peace, he gave me the pass code to his phone, and has told the girl he is married.

This morning he felt a wave of anger again, we tried setting a time limit, I’ve tried to diffuse his anger and assure him that I’m here because I am sorry and I am not going to hurt him again, I’ve agreed not to go through his phone without asking him first, I made him a coffee and fed him, what else can I do to stop his pain?

The problem is I don't think it's normal. But...some BS's do go for revenge affairs(RAs) and that just creates more mess. The marriage is very unlikely to survive after that. It's tough enough with only 1 affair..

To me it sounds like neither of you were ready for the challenges of marriage. Please don't bring children into this. It makes it so much worse.

 

Also I think both of you should be completely transparent, no secret passwords, hiding things, etc. There's really no privacy in a trusting marriage. Shouldn't be something you have to worry about. I know I didn't until after D-Day...then everything changed. It was a nightmare, kinda like what you are going through.

[wanderluster]

The problem is I don't think it's normal. But...some BS's do go for revenge affairs(RAs) and that just creates more mess. The marriage is very unlikely to survive after that. It's tough enough with only 1 affair..

To me it sounds like neither of you were ready for the challenges of marriage. Please don't bring children into this. It makes it so much worse.

 

Also I think both of you should be completely transparent, no secret passwords, hiding things, etc. There's really no privacy in a trusting marriage. Shouldn't be something you have to worry about. I know I didn't until after D-Day...then everything changed. It was a nightmare, kinda like what you are going through.

 

I agree, I keep trying to explain that a healthy marriage requires no secrets, secrets cause doubt, and doubt causes insecurity, he replies by telling me that I am the WW, and he doesn't have to allow me access to his phone, because there's personal stuff on there I shouldn't be reading.

He has just asked that he should have the right to place a pass code on my phone when he chooses, he has done this before to me, I denied him this right, because I have no friends here and I need support and advice at times like these, my phone is my only way to contact everyone. He is insistent, what is the compromise?

[TaraMaiden]

To threaten to leave, because it's wiser to deal with this from a distance.

While you are under his roof, he feels he can exert control over you.

This - is - completely - unacceptable!

 

You're bending over backwards to accommodate him, and trying to reason with him - but it's not working.

Please - if you want to save this marriage - leave, and tell him that the only thing you will agree to now, is MC.

 

The big problem is, you're in the thick of it - you can't see what we can - it really is an unhealthy situation to be in.

 

Compromise is the road to ruin.

Not heard that one?

It's true - because there is always an element of resigned sacrifice.

 

And there is no compromise, here.

[wanderluster]

You broke his trust by cheating on him and then when he gave you another chance you broke his trust again by snooping through his phone without his permission.

 

You don't sound very patient, why not actually stop being deceptive--don't just "try" to be "open and honest", BE "open and honest"--for a couple of months and see if he softens up a bit.

 

On the other hand maybe you are the type of woman who just doesn't know how to be completely open and honest because you never have been?

 

Was it really only a "kiss" with the other man? Do you think your husband believes it was really only a kiss?

 

What happened? Did the other man dump you?

 

Cheating at age 23 after only a couple of years of marriage?

 

You sound like you were too young and immature to get married in the first place.

 

Although pretty much everyone else is suggesting you portray your husband as an abusive unreasonable sadist, I'll take the opposite tack and recommend that you stop feeling sorry for yourself and looking for reasons to blame him for the current situation.

 

My husband has asked me to answer your questions:

 

Was it really only a "kiss" with the other man?

It was an affair through emails and messages, my husband found out and I had stopped, the boy contacted me again through an app called "line", and I continued to message him. My husband found out once again, and he kicked me out of the house, although at the end of the day he changed his mind, I still wanted to leave. I left to stay at an uncles place. That boy came over comforted me, spent the night and we kissed. This was the only time I was alone with the boy. Every other meeting in person was with other people, and not at all intimate.

 

Do you think your husband believes it was really only a kiss?

I think he believes it, I've let him confirm it with my cousins who I was talking to about this at the time. I even offered for him to speak to the boy.

 

What happened? Did the other man dump you?

No, the other man did not dump me, I left him. He made several attempts to speak to me again, which I have ignored, even after my husband decided to leave.

[wanderluster]

To threaten to leave, because it's wiser to deal with this from a distance.

While you are under his roof, he feels he can exert control over you.

This - is - completely - unacceptable!

 

You're bending over backwards to accommodate him, and trying to reason with him - but it's not working.

Please - if you want to save this marriage - leave, and tell him that the only thing you will agree to now, is MC.

 

The big problem is, you're in the thick of it - you can't see what we can - it really is an unhealthy situation to be in.

 

Compromise is the road to ruin.

Not heard that one?

It's true - because there is always an element of resigned sacrifice.

 

And there is no compromise, here.

 

Thank you so much for your reply. I have just asked him what he thinks about trying to sort this out with space between us, he told me he doesn't want to talk to me.

I have spoken to him about this before, he has told me that in order for him to recover he needs me with him. He can't do this being apart. And that it's his way or the high way.

[veryhappy]

You have said you feel like he's slave now, and he also conditioned your marriage yo you working part time. Which will become no working at the first child. It wouldn't be a problem if it weren't for the mandatory aspect of it.

 

He seems the type to always hold the A over your head, and he might cheat on you at any time because you've done it first.

 

Based on my prediction of your marriage...bail yesterday.

[Ninja'sHusband]

My husband has asked me to answer your questions:

 

Was it really only a "kiss" with the other man?

It was an affair through emails and messages, my husband found out and I had stopped, the boy contacted me again through an app called "line", and I continued to message him. My husband found out once again, and he kicked me out of the house, although at the end of the day he changed his mind, I still wanted to leave. I left to stay at an uncles place. That boy came over comforted me, spent the night and we kissed. This was the only time I was alone with the boy. Every other meeting in person was with other people, and not at all intimate.

 

Do you think your husband believes it was really only a kiss?

I think he believes it, I've let him confirm it with my cousins who I was talking to about this at the time. I even offered for him to speak to the boy.

 

What happened? Did the other man dump you?

No, the other man did not dump me, I left him. He made several attempts to speak to me again, which I have ignored, even after my husband decided to leave.

 

 

Uh oh, your husband is reading this? Now unfortunately everything you say is suspect... Trickle truth is soooo common among WSs. My WW minimized horribly and I eventually found the truth, it made things so much worse. I really hope you are being honest. It might take months, or even years, but I suspect your H will eventually find out what he needs to know if you aren't being honest. It took me 4 months(including 3 months of wasted therapy) to find out it hadn't been just one night, but actually 4 months of hotels, sneaking around, etc.

[Darren Steez]

My husband has asked me to answer your questions:

 

Was it really only a "kiss" with the other man?

It was an affair through emails and messages, my husband found out and I had stopped, the boy contacted me again through an app called "line", and I continued to message him. My husband found out once again, and he kicked me out of the house, although at the end of the day he changed his mind, I still wanted to leave. I left to stay at an uncles place. That boy came over comforted me, spent the night and we kissed. This was the only time I was alone with the boy. Every other meeting in person was with other people, and not at all intimate.

 

Do you think your husband believes it was really only a kiss?

I think he believes it, I've let him confirm it with my cousins who I was talking to about this at the time. I even offered for him to speak to the boy.

 

What happened? Did the other man dump you?

No, the other man did not dump me, I left him. He made several attempts to speak to me again, which I have ignored, even after my husband decided to leave.

 

hmmm He kicked you out but you still wanted to leave because you wanted to have some time alone with the OM, and duly obliged because you messaged him to come over or he invited himself..either way at some point even after that you communicated with him and STILL let him come over.

 

Your husband wants to believe that nothing happened but when your wife is messaging another man, caught, messages him again, is caught again, kicked out then goes and meets the man and he spends the night...well.. come to your own conclusions

 

Some of your husbands actions are inexcusable. Maybe it's best you just broke it off for a while.

[TaraMaiden]

Thank you so much for your reply. I have just asked him what he thinks about trying to sort this out with space between us, he told me he doesn't want to talk to me.

I have spoken to him about this before, he has told me that in order for him to recover he needs me with him. He can't do this being apart. And that it's his way or the high way.

 

Leave.

leave, get your own head together without referring to him at every question.

Of course he's going to manipulate things to suit him.

He needs help. He needs professional help and so do you.

This is a completely wrong way to go about making your marriage work,

All it's doing is creating a subservient role for you, and a bitter, twisted and unforgiving one for him.

Is this really what you both want?

 

Showing him this thread, is not proving to be constructive: openness in this case, simply gives him more weaponry with which to 'beat' you.

 

Leave, and get your head together, under your own steam. While you are there with him, your view is fiogged by the circumstance of his dominating everything you think, say and do.

 

And Husband - if you DO read this - you should be completely ashamed of yourself.

How dare you attempt to dominate and overwhelm with your bullying tactics.

Your actions are twisted and based on revenge; you're a poor excuse for a spouse, and this will all end badly, if you don't completely change what you're doing.

 

There you go, OP.

You can't speak to him as you should.

Thought I'd do it for you.

[waterwoman]

IMO you should not put up with that. It's quite unreasonable behaviour. Why the hell should anyone accept being treated that way? He's being childish and vengeful - H cheated on me and that is exactly why I would never do that to him, because I know how much it hurt.

[waterwoman]

Oh and 'I understand that he wants back the control he felt he lost when I cheated' sounds pretty crappy to me. He isn't supposed to have control of you, you aren't a puppet. He is supposed to trust you and love you - he won't get that back by behaving even worse than you did. Sounds like a path to desctruction to me.

[TaraMaiden]

Two wrongs don't make a right, but three rights make a left.

 

[wanderluster]

Lik, I enjoy reading your responses because you can see things from my husbands point of view,

Sometimes... I think you are my husband???

He hasn't been reading my past few posts with me.

 

My husband asked me to come here to be with him for a reason.

He chose to be with me again. I'm not forcing him.

So surely if that is what he wants, we should not totally disregard all the basic foundations of a healthy and happy marriage?

Does it really bring him towards happiness if he gains control over every aspect of my life?

Wouldn't he just be better off and healing faster on his own?

I'm here to help but sometimes I feel helpless to do so.

[SmokeRat]

So surely if that is what he wants, we should not totally disregard all the basic foundations of a healthy and happy marriage?

 

That above statement strikes me as odd, from someone who has run off and had an affair. Let's keep everything else the way I am comfortable with, but the whole promising to keep our VOWS, and basic respect for monogomy and what I SIGNED UP FOR WHEN I ACCEPTED A RING.

 

Psh that's just hogwash, to the dungeon with being faithful. But punish to you who judges me and treats me unfairly after having an affais!

 

You disregarded one of the most fundamental foundations stones of a marriage, and also managed to knock over a few other stones too:

 

Trust

Love

Honesty

 

Should I name a few more?

[TaraMaiden]

Yup in the end it's all just a big joke to you.

 

Ha.

 

No, I'll tell you what the joke is:

You've been here a fraction of the time I have (although I heavily suspect you're one of the band of regular mysogynists who trollolloll here, who's been banned but who's come back under a different name) and not once have I seen you on a thread, having the same kind of opinion towards a man who's done this. You're perpetually snapping at the heels of women and criticising them, but have you been on a thread biting at the heels of men who have behaved in similar/identical fashion?

 

If you can show me any post before this date/time, then fine....

But I've just gone through your hitherto 42 posts and sure enough, you post like you're a woman-hater.

 

At least I'm not partisan in my criticisms.

 

But you are.

 

 

That's the joke.

[TaraMaiden]

I'm sure you've written a pithy and witty riposte, but as with so many of your 'ilk', I have you on ignore.

[TaraMaiden]

Lik, I enjoy reading your responses because you can see things from my husbands point of view,

Sometimes... I think you are my husband???

He hasn't been reading my past few posts with me.

 

My husband asked me to come here to be with him for a reason.

He chose to be with me again. I'm not forcing him.

So surely if that is what he wants, we should not totally disregard all the basic foundations of a healthy and happy marriage?

Does it really bring him towards happiness if he gains control over every aspect of my life?

Wouldn't he just be better off and healing faster on his own?

I'm here to help but sometimes I feel helpless to do so.

 

Wanderluster, if you want to know how to put him on ignore, I'll talk you through it.