Those of you having dating issues....

[Anela]

It's deeper than that.

 

For the record, my wife and I were NOT friends when we first got together. We barely knew each other, had sex within hours of "hanging out", etc, etc.

 

Whether or not you are friends initially is not important.

 

What IS important is that the men AND women here find a way to LOSE their fear of the opposite sex. Because that's what it comes down to.

 

FEAR.

 

Everyone's "path" to getting rid of this fear is different and THAT IS the hard part.

 

But, understanding what the issue is...is how you start correcting the situation.

 

Yep, I can relate to this, too. I've had an awful lot of fear concerning men. I've wanted to be friends with men again, in order to become more comfortable around them, as I was with the boys I had as friends.

[Lonely Ronin]

Never said anything about a pretty face.

 

Don't mince words, you know what i mean.

 

I'm saying, if a single, straight man sees a woman he's attracted to (looks, personality, etc), his initial thought isn't "oh boy I can't wait to be her friend!" -- it's just not. It's just science that he's going to want to be romantic with her,

 

I disagree completely, it's "science" that they might want to get to know her more, and then decide if they want to be romantic with her, assuming she also wants to be romantic with them.

 

 

so let's stop painting them as these horny losers who only think with their penis and don't respect women as people. They are just doing what biology dictates they do.

 

I didn't say that you did. What I see are a lot of guys that want attention (any kind of attention) from women that they overlook all kinds of signs, and focus 100% on trying to gain attention. This is how so many of them end up in the freindzone. They overlook the obvious signs that she isn't interested, and hang around hoping for more, because hey she will hang out with them because she likes them as a person.

[Lonely Ronin]

it's purely on them if they conjure romantic feelings for her out of thin air. That's what is happening most of the time as far as i can tell. They want attention from women so badly, that they see stuff that really isn't there.

[Pyro]

I know who that is and Im not confusing the two

 

If that is something that Castle has said then I apologize.

[MrCastle]

I didn't say that you did. What I see are a lot of guys that want attention (any kind of attention) from women that they overlook all kinds of signs, and focus 100% on trying to gain attention. This is how so many of them end up in the freindzone. They overlook the obvious signs that she isn't interested, and hang around hoping for more, because hey she will hang out with them because she likes them as a person.

 

I agree. But some men stick around thinking eventually, the girl will come around. That's the wrong way to think.

[Lonely Ronin]

Oh no, a woman wants a little emotional investment from me? Cant have that...next

Oh no, a woman who refuses to only be a **** object? Cant have that...next

 

That is your attitude. Im being overly blunt, but it is what it is

 

 

Please get out of NYC before you become so messed up you can never date properly again.

[AD1980]

My two best buddies wives are the only women that i have any friendship with who i talk to and text with.. i think i definitely have a fear of single women im attracted to..

 

I think i have a problem in general of relating to and making a connection with women and people in general though women much moreso

Edited January 28, 2013 by AD1980

[MrCastle]

Thank you to those who aren't taking pbjbear's bait. We can have a civilized debate without getting out of control.

[Lonely Ronin]

I think i have a problem in general of relating to and making a connection with women and people in general though women much moreso

 

You need to work on this if you hope to ever date successfully.

[pbjbear]

Please get out of NYC before you become so messed up you can never date properly again.

 

Funny, I just was paraphrasing from Mr Castle's posts. I read through his history

 

Again, I was being overly blunt. But that IS his attitude about women

[AD1980]

You need to work on this if you hope to ever date successfully.

 

I know but its not easy its usually something inherently in you..Theyres times i think i hit it off with someone and had a good covnersation and next time i see them their cold to me or seem to forget we had a conversation i guess im a ****in bore:laugh: or most people just dont get me

[MrCastle]

Funny, I just was paraphrasing from Mr Castle's posts. I read through his history

 

Again, I was being overly blunt. But that IS his attitude about women

 

You paint me as some sort of sleazy, sex crazed sociopath. I feel bad that you feel that way. Your beliefs about me are distorted. I hope through further interaction, you can see that I'm a good guy.

[pbjbear]

You paint me as some sort of sleazy, sex crazed sociopath. I feel bad that you feel that way. Your beliefs about me are distorted. I hope through further interaction, you can see that I'm a good guy.

 

I never said those words. I said you view women as sex objects first and human beings second, which you most certainly do.

 

I dont use the word sociopath to describe anyone

[Lonely Ronin]

Funny, I just was paraphrasing from Mr Castle's posts. I read through his history

 

Again, I was being overly blunt. But that IS his attitude about women

 

Because that's all he wants. If you continue to read i think you will see he is very up front about it as well.

 

If you have a problem with the men you are meeting then try meeting different men. If that doesn't work, then move some place else.

 

Not all men want sex up front or how ever you interpret it. Some of us get pissed off when people hurl insults..... If that's all you want to do start your own thread, and I'm sure you will find some people to verbally joust with. Just be prepared to get sliced and diced, because some of us "nice guys" aren't so nice well you continually label us and piss us off.

[pbjbear]

Because that's all he wants. If you continue to read i think you will see he is very up front about it as well.

 

If you have a problem with the men you are meeting then try meeting different men. If that doesn't work, then move some place else.

 

Not all men want sex up front or how ever you interpret it. Some of us get pissed off when people hurl insults..... If that's all you want to do start your own thread, and I'm sure you will find some people to verbally joust with. Just be prepared to get sliced and diced, because some of us "nice guys" aren't so nice well you continually label us and piss us off.

 

Hes not upfront about it. He said in another thread he doesnt need to, he just acts unreliable and they get the hint. I highly doubt hes never hurt someone else with his actions...men who do that, I do have a problem with.

 

My comments have nothing to do with the men Ive met, I am responding based on the stuff Mr Castle says

[Lonely Ronin]

I know but its not easy its usually something inherently in you..Theyres times i think i hit it off with someone and had a good covnersation and next time i see them their cold to me or seem to forget we had a conversation i guess im a ****in bore:laugh: or most people just dont get me

 

Maybe they had a bad day, stop sweating the ups and downs of peoples lives. relationships of all types have ups and downs.

 

of course it's not easy, that doesn't mean you should back peddle. find reliable sources of information (hint: not the internet), and plug away at it.

[MrCastle]

I never said those words. I said you view women as sex objects first and human beings second, which you most certainly do.

 

I dont use the word sociopath to describe anyone

 

I don't view them as sex objects though. I just believe in free love. I'm very hippie like in that sense. I love all different kinds of women, so it is hard for me to settle down. Simple as that. I do not lie, deceive, or manipulate women in any way in order to get what I want. We both decide as adults to have casual sex with no strings attached. I don't dangle the possibility of a relationship over her head. Believe it or not, many young women are fine with the set up.

[KungFuJoe]

I wonder if a lot of the people here suffer from unusual anxiety?

 

BTW...I just want to add that I'm not just someone from the "outside" looking in. Every lovable loser in here who feels unattractive and who feels their chest tighten up just standing next to a pretty girl (or guy)...I've been there done that (except for the guy part).

 

But, I know what MY problem is/was. I had mommy issues. Raised by a single mother who became abusive later in my life and who moved me from neighborhood to neighborhood every other month (I probably went to no less than 12 different elementary schools, 3 different jr highs, and 2 high schools) it was difficult to establish relationships (because I never stuck around long enough) and since my mom was EFFING PSYCHO and the ONLY reference I had for women...I was a COMPLETE mess when it came to women...hell...when it came to PEOPLE.

[Lonely Ronin]

 

My comments have nothing to do with the men Ive met, I am responding based on the stuff Mr Castle says

 

Then refer to him directly, and stop using the word men. there are roughly three billion of us on the planet, and we are not all the same.

 

And please don't make go back and copy and past every time you have made a disparaging remark about men.

[AD1980]

I wonder if a lot of the people here suffer from unusual anxiety?

 

BTW...I just want to add that I'm not just someone from the "outside" looking in. Every lovable loser in here who feels unattractive and who feels their chest tighten up just standing next to a pretty girl (or guy)...I've been there done that (except for the guy part).

 

But, I know what MY problem is/was. I had mommy issues. Raised by a single mother who became abusive later in my life and who moved me from neighborhood to neighborhood every other month (I probably went to no less than 12 different elementary schools, 3 different jr highs, and 2 high schools) it was difficult to establish relationships (because I never stuck around long enough) and since my mom was EFFING PSYCHO and the ONLY reference I had for women...I was a COMPLETE mess when it came to women...hell...when it came to PEOPLE.

 

My problem is im very sensitive and want to be liked too much..i overanalyze what i say and do in fear of not being liked..

 

I think thats why im deathly afraid to approach women because im so scared of rejection and not being accepted or being called a creep if i approach and get a little nervous or awkward that it controls me to the point i just cant approach a women i dont know..

 

I dont know where it stems from ive always been a little on the shy side but it might stem from getting picked on in high school..

 

I couldnt undertsand why i got picked on at times..i never considered myself that odd a kid i was alwaysa little shy but pretty well liked in grammar school getting picked on made me feel inadequate and that i was weird so maybe thats why i desires others aceeptance so much i dont know..

[Ruby Slippers]

But, I know what MY problem is/was. I had mommy issues. Raised by a single mother who became abusive later in my life and who moved me from neighborhood to neighborhood every other month (I probably went to no less than 12 different elementary schools, 3 different jr highs, and 2 high schools) it was difficult to establish relationships (because I never stuck around long enough) and since my mom was EFFING PSYCHO and the ONLY reference I had for women...I was a COMPLETE mess when it came to women...hell...when it came to PEOPLE.

How did you get over that?

[TheZebra]

Most of my friends are guys. I still can only see them as walking penises though... but only when I do too many drugs at once

[Woggle]

I think what helps is seeing that women or men are individuals and don't operate with a hive mind. Not all members of the opposite sex are one way.

 

Also is Mr Castle is honest there is nothing wrong with what he does. Of course it is wrong to lie to somebody but if they know the score from the start then they are not a victim. It reminds me of the one FWB I had. She herself said she hated relationships and seemed to get a kick out of making men fall in love with her and then breaking their hearts. At the time I was fresh out of my horrible first marriage so I thought it was perfect because nobody would get hurt. She ended up falling in love me and got mad at me because I stuck to the originally agreed upon terms of the deal.

 

I never lied to or mislead a woman though to get what I wanted from her.

[KungFuJoe]

How did you get over that?

 

It took a LONG time. You might even say I still have some "issues" but who doesn't, right?

 

Growing up the way I did, I craved attachment from women because I never got it from my mom. I hate to say it, but I wasn't even attracted to my first gf when I asked her out. I asked her out because I was an 18 year old, out of high school, and I never had even kissed a girl and I just wanted someone ANYONE. So I asked out a girl that I knew liked me...not someone that *I* liked.

 

We eventually broke up...well...to be honest, I cheated on her. Twice. This was after 4 years...the latter 2 being absolutely horrible. But, she quickly found another boyfriend and I was alone. And that was NOT fair! I had to have my cake and eat it too! Basically, I was a weak, spoiled, little boy. I begged and begged her to take me back, threatened to kill myself, drank whiskey and took sleeping pills to get through the day. I shared the room of my best friend's parents house and I never left that room for weeks. I didn't even go to work, eventually getting fired.

 

Anyways...I was in BAD BAD shape for a long time. What made it even worse is that my gf still kept in contact with me (not her fault, I didn't give her much choice...I'm lucky she didn't have me arrested) and we still had sex on the side. She was cheating on her new boyfriend and he found out...all hell broke lose basically. I mean...talk about a freakin mess. I remember how it happened. I was parked outside her house at 3AM, as usual, just KNOWING "he" was in there with her...and I just started honking the horn. I didn't just honk my horn. I PUNCHED my horn over and over and I busted it to where it just kept going and going and going and going. I didn't care. I just sat there, letting it blast through the night. After what seemed like forever, she came out. I shouted at her, "If you don't tell him...*I* will!". Then he came out...and that's how he found out.

 

He broke up with her and, to my surprise, she didn't immediately jump back into my arms. Yeah...if you haven't figured out how clueless I was back then, I hope I'm giving you a clearer picture. She wanted nothing to do with me.

 

And this is where I say I finally let her go, right?

 

WRONG. I'm not a fast learner. Well, not back then. After a few more months of begging and coaxing and convincing, she took me back.

 

FINALLY! YAY!!!!

 

...We broke up a month later. And when it was over, I just looked back on it all and I just wanted to give myself the biggest ****ing facepalm ever. I mean...what a waste of time, emotion, I had just ****ed up so royally. My **** up was monumental. I hurt so many people, not just myself, because of the way I was.

 

I HATED myself. No...scratch that. Hate is too kind a word. I LOATHED myself. And at that point, I had to make a choice because I couldn't possibly sink any lower.

 

And it's like something snapped in me. I don't even know how to explain it. I just...changed. I guess that's what they mean you they say you have to hit rock bottom. I didn't just hit rock bottom...I had crashed into it from a 1000ft free fall.

 

It wasn't an instantaneous change, but this is when things started to get better. I "woke up" but it was like waking up slowly, limb by limb.

 

That was a LONG time ago (15 years would be my guess)...but I still remember the events like they were yesterday.

[chex]

-snip-

 

Wow, I never guessed that you had such a pathetic/awesome at the same time story. I just imagined this baptist preacher I used to know saying this very angrily but very quietly, it was amazing.