tuxedo cat Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 Unless they're actual deal breakers accept her flaws. I can't tell you how many men, especially inexperienced men, have some fantasy idea of a girlfriend and a relationship and will devalue the woman they're with when she turns out to be human. It's true that women may be harsher critics when it comes to selecting boyfriends but once they're in a relationship they tend to be more accepting of a guy's warts. So many men are just really intolerant of a woman having any needs of her own, and they're also totally out of touch of their own flaws that the woman has to put up with. 1
Author fortyninethousand322 Posted January 27, 2013 Author Posted January 27, 2013 I guess at the end of the day the question is this: would you rather date a guy who was know to be a bad boyfriend in the past, or a guy who had never been a boyfriend and thus had no idea whether he'd be good or not? I'm sure I have unrealistic expectations for relationships and women (I'm very intimidated by women I'm attracted to for example, that's unlikely to change really) but I think that's a relatively small problem when you compare it to the kinds of guys many women date.
ChessPieceFace Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 That's actually not true. Being assertive and not over extending yourself for others are definitely alpha traits. I also think of consistency as an alpha trait as it goes hand in hand with integrity and strength of character. Passive men tend to be flakier in my experience. Alphas have integrity and strength of character? Is my sarcasm meter broken? Wait what planet is this again?
miss_jaclynrae Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 I guess at the end of the day the question is this: would you rather date a guy who was know to be a bad boyfriend in the past, or a guy who had never been a boyfriend and thus had no idea whether he'd be good or not? I'm sure I have unrealistic expectations for relationships and women (I'm very intimidated by women I'm attracted to for example, that's unlikely to change really) but I think that's a relatively small problem when you compare it to the kinds of guys many women date. None of that would even matter to me anyways. It literally would mean nothing to me knowing.
Fondue Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 Unless they're actual deal breakers accept her flaws. I can't tell you how many men, especially inexperienced men, have some fantasy idea of a girlfriend and a relationship and will devalue the woman they're with when she turns out to be human. It's true that women may be harsher critics when it comes to selecting boyfriends but once they're in a relationship they tend to be more accepting of a guy's warts. So many men are just really intolerant of a woman having any needs of her own, and they're also totally out of touch of their own flaws that the woman has to put up with. You just listed a slew of things that makeup a perfect human being. Then you tell us that men should simply accept a woman, despite her insufficiency. ****, if I was as giving as the the perfect guy you describe, you better be a woman of just the same quality. There is no way I will be performing all those things for a woman with flaws.
tuxedo cat Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 You just listed a slew of things that makeup a perfect human being. Then you tell us that men should simply accept a woman, despite her insufficiency. ****, if I was as giving as the the perfect guy you describe, you better be a woman of just the same quality. There is no way I will be performing all those things for a woman with flaws. Everyone has flaws. The behaviors I listed are the bare minimum of a healthy relationship. You don't need to be a "perfect" human being in order to perform them. The problem is a lot of the time "damaged goods" guys will expect the woman to be perfect in order to compensate for their own inadequacies. 1
Leigh 87 Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 I have a cery fixed view as to what makes a great boyfriend. I instinctivly just KNOW what I need in a man, as a minimum: - he loves you deeply, as much as his family, and therefore puts your BEFORE his friends... Sorry, but I want my boyfriend to LOVEh and spend TIME with his mates, but to drop every plan he has with them in a SECOND if I need him to be by my side. - I need a guy who is into me, but not obsessive and writing me bloody poems (although some girls like that sort of guy) So: being into the girl you date, and NOT just dating a women because she is all you can get. Wait to find a girl you are really interested in, or you will not be a good boyfriend to a women your NOT that into and interested in getting to know. There will be something mising.
Leigh 87 Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 Hmmm what else makes a GREAT boyfriend: - to care about your wellbeing as much as he cares about his own (if not MORE than he cares about his own happiness!) - to adore the girl he is with. Or as I said before, WHY on earth bother with a girl you just think is "okay" and "good enough to keep me company" - to not make huge decisions unless consulting the girl - to stick up for you when people talk badly of you - to make an effort to sexually compromise with you, for instance: if you have a higher need for sex than he does, to meet you half way. - to learn to try new things he is not fond of, if it makes you happy and there is a legit reason for it (rather than just forcing him to do stuff he hates for no reason!) ................ A good boyfriend is basically a guy who is in love with his girlfriend, and prefers being with her more than anyone else, which is why he should pick her as a long term partner to begin with. ...AS long as a guy loves and adores his partner, or is into her leading up to falling in love, most men should be fine.. Unless they are selfish and are not apt to feeling strong love for any women. But normal men with a normal capaity to love, should simply be kind, considerate, adore and be into their partner.
ChessPieceFace Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 Everyone has flaws. The behaviors I listed are the bare minimum of a healthy relationship. You don't need to be a "perfect" human being in order to perform them. Actually what you listed looks like the bare minimum for a perfect relationship. I think you have totally unrealistic expectations for men, at least when you call it "the bare minimum" and act like they will be kicked to the curb for messing up. That's the real disconnect and problem I would say. I don't have a problem with what you listed as being ideals or goals for guys to work toward, but when you say "this is the bare minimum" it reeks of entitlement. Seriously, I have to wonder what the male equivalent of your list would be, and whether you or most women here would meet the requirements? Or are men just objects to be used and discarded when they fail to meet your requirements, and perhaps occasionally pleased whenever you feel like it?
Eternal Sunshine Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 The absolute worst is when you are really kind and forgiving to the man, accepting of all his flaws; yet he picks apart every little flaw you have and throws it in your face Love is about acceptance.
somedude81 Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 The absolute worst is when you are really kind and forgiving to the man, accepting of all his flaws; yet he picks apart every little flaw you have and throws it in your face Love is about acceptance. And you broke up with him right away when he did that? 1
SJC2008 Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 Most relationships lack emotional intimacy and communication. Also, approximately 10% of couples acutally discuss thier problems and don't "argue" them so don't listen to the crap that you don't know what it takes. You are who you are and you're not going to change when you get a GF. If you're a spinless chicken shyte, you'll be one with your GF. If you always have to be right and can't lose an argument you'll be the same with your future GF. If you're well balanced and try to view something from your persepective as well as the others when you argue you'll be the same with your GF.
Eternal Sunshine Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 And you broke up with him right away when he did that? No, I tolerated it for a long time but I wouldn't do it again.
ChessPieceFace Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 You are who you are and you're not going to change when you get a GF. If you're a spinless chicken shyte, you'll be one with your GF. If you always have to be right and can't lose an argument you'll be the same with your future GF. If you're well balanced and try to view something from your persepective as well as the others when you argue you'll be the same with your GF. Amazingly, people DO actually have some capability to change behavior patterns, filter thoughts, analyze problems and learn from mistakes. If "we are who we are and aren't going to change" why are any of us wasting time on this forum?
Fondue Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 I've noticed that many guys fall into these traps and end up ruining their relationships: -Consistency! This is probably the biggest hurdle for most guys and it kills many relationships. This means... a) Words and actions should be consistent. b) Don't flake on your dates or commitments to her unless you have a good reason. c) Don't blow hot and cold, promising her the moon one day and retracting your promises the next. Choose your words wisely; don't future fake her or make promises you can't keep! d) Even if you're in a bad mood treat her kindly. -Direct communication a) If you are upset or annoyed with her about something be assertive and tell her immediately. Don't be passive aggressive, hold grudges and collect grievances or act out. She will respect you more for this. b) Take responsibility for your actions. If she gets upset with you about something carefully consider her point of view and be willing to compromise and apologize for your behavior if you feel her feelings are justified. Avoid deflecting the blame onto her at all costs as this will erode her trust and set up a caustic environment. -Make her a priority a) Don't overextend yourself trying to please others or yourself at the sake of your SO. You can't make everyone happy. Unless you have children, she should come first in most cases. -Take an interest in her and her life a) Ask her questions about herself and really listen when she talks. -Be physically affectionate in non sexual ways too a) Hold her hand or find ways of affectionately (but discreetly) touching her in public. Surprise her with hugs from behind or little touches on the back when you pass by her. Most women love this. b) If you guys are sitting at a restaurant or cafe take her hand across the table. c) If you are in a crowded room catch her eyes across the room and give her a knowing smile. d) Make her the center of your attention whenever you're out with other people. All of the bad boyfriends I've had failed on most of these counts. The boyfriends I remember with happiness did all of these things. I re-read this again, and then I changed up boyfriend to girlfriend. You will be VERY hard-pressed to find a woman who will fit the bill and have these qualities. Hell, especially these: a) If you are upset or annoyed with her about something be assertive and tell her immediately. Don't be passive aggressive, hold grudges and collect grievances or act out. She will respect you more for this. b) Take responsibility for your actions. If she gets upset with you about something carefully consider her point of view and be willing to compromise and apologize for your behavior if you feel her feelings are justified. Avoid deflecting the blame onto her at all costs as this will erode her trust and set up a caustic environment. Find me a woman who would do those two things. You probably wont. 1
ChessPieceFace Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 Find me a woman who would do those two things. You probably wont. I would even say - find a woman who would do even consistently do ONE of those two things, and it would take quite a bit of searching. But in fairness, the men's list wouldn't be the same as the women's list. Even though it's obviously completely childish and hypocritical for women to say "don't hold grudges & act out, and take responsibility for your actions" when they have little or no capacity to do that themselves. But seriously, she's listed 12 requirements under 5 main headings. What would the 12 requirements and/or 5 main headings be for women, listed by men? Might be amusing. I'm not qualified to make that list, I'm not the usual guy and (thankfully?) probably have a lot of non-standard requirements.
chex Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 I would even say - find a woman who would do even consistently do ONE of those two things, and it would take quite a bit of searching. My present girlfriend does both and it's amazing. She's drop-dead honest with me when it comes to anything important, and she doesn't ever shift blame to anyone else. She's also very calm, and I've never had her freak out about anything. As a result, our relationship is practically drama-free, and simply amazing.
Leigh 87 Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 The absolute worst is when you are really kind and forgiving to the man, accepting of all his flaws; yet he picks apart every little flaw you have and throws it in your face Love is about acceptance. I fart in front of my boyfriends. I fart loudly at times, and they smell really bad. It is seriously genetics. It actually traumatizes him, but he NEVER makes me feel.... bad about myself, or... wrong about it. Even though he really, really, really, really, really, really HATES it. He laughs with me about it...... And accepts something he HATES, in a way that does not make me feel unloved or de valued. 1
SJC2008 Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 Amazingly, people DO actually have some capability to change behavior patterns, filter thoughts, analyze problems and learn from mistakes. If "we are who we are and aren't going to change" why are any of us wasting time on this forum? Good point but it takes self awareness and a willingness to change. If people are self aware of what their flaws are and bring them to the table, it will help both of them work through things.
chex Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 You sure she's a woman? It's terrible that being high maintenance is seen as a defining feminine trait
xxoo Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 A good partner builds you up, and does not knock you don't. That doesn't mean accepting everything. Boundaries are important, too. But being a good partner means being supportive, even while enforcing boundaries. It's a challenge! 1
xxoo Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 I fart in front of my boyfriends. I fart loudly at times, and they smell really bad. It is seriously genetics. It actually traumatizes him, but he NEVER makes me feel.... bad about myself, or... wrong about it. Even though he really, really, really, really, really, really HATES it. He laughs with me about it...... And accepts something he HATES, in a way that does not make me feel unloved or de valued. Bless you, Leigh, this was some funny stuff And bless him, too!
KungFuJoe Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 I re-read this again, and then I changed up boyfriend to girlfriend. You will be VERY hard-pressed to find a woman who will fit the bill and have these qualities. Hell, especially these: Find me a woman who would do those two things. You probably wont. My wife doesn't do that crap. She doesn't have a passive aggressive bone in her body. 1
Eternal Sunshine Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 A good partner builds you up, and does not knock you don't. That doesn't mean accepting everything. Boundaries are important, too. But being a good partner means being supportive, even while enforcing boundaries. It's a challenge! I also found that if your self-esteem is going down, you are in the wrong relationship. 2
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