nooneyouknow Posted January 21, 2013 Posted January 21, 2013 Hi, Early 50's here, married 25 years, 2 college age kids. I guess I am just sad and depressed at the routine of my life, and the fact that I realize since the kids have grown how little I have in common with my spouse. We really have different interests and lead pretty much separate lives. We live together, but not much else. I had a two year affair which recently ended. I had a lot in common with that person, and there were many good times. I am depressed over the affair ending too, it is heartwrenching, but the other person involved has some serious emotional issues (BPD). I am now thinking that I should move out of my house and be alone and/or see if there is someone else out there that I am more compatible with and can feel some joy with. My spouse and I do very little together, and my spouse works 3 nights a week-12 hour shifts, and sleeps a lot during the day. I am at the point where I feel my kids are pretty much grown, and I deserve to live a bit more for myself. I told my spouse a little over a year ago that I was unhappy, and I wanted out of the marriage. They cried and blamed themselves and said that I was "neglected". I then felt terrible about hurting them, and suggested they join my gym and we work out together. Alas, that was short lived, as my spouse is not an exercise person, and I really am. Eight months ago I told them that I wanted to leave our house and move somewhere warmer. My spouse cannot move because of work and issues with a parent who is not well. I got the same reaction, tears, and I felt like a jerk again. I am stuck between not wanting to hurt someone who has always been good to me, who has always been there for me, and has always been a faithful partner-and feeling that I owe myself the chance to be happy. Any thoughts?
Mint Sauce Posted January 21, 2013 Posted January 21, 2013 - you first told your wife you were unhappy while you were already having the affair for roughly 1 year - you told her again you wanted out while you were still in the affair or recovering from it. - you still admit to not having healed from the heartbreak of ending your affair - you see no justification for leaving your wife, other than that you are unhappy My honest opinion: you owe it to your wife to put some real effort into saving your marriage. Any work done while you were in your affair was useless and does not count. i assume your wife knows about the affair? If not, come clean, see whether she wants to stay with you. What was your justification for having an affair? Why does your happiness depend on having more things in common with your wife. Is having raised a family together not common enough? Is it not enough to share your hobbies with your male friends? No happiness from there? How's your sex life, I assume it's absent? 8
trippi1432 Posted January 21, 2013 Posted January 21, 2013 Welcome to LS. You do realize that there are a combination of things going on here right, it seems you do from your post. a. Mid-life crisis b. Empty Nest syndrome c. Affair fog from the affair (does your spouse know of the affair?) d. Depression With all of that going on, no wonder you found yourself here. It sounds like you are searching for something to make you happy, but looking to a new life, a new person...will typically be short-lived if you don't figure out why you are restless and unhappy within yourself first. Whether you stick with your spouse or move on to a new life, that unhappiness inside will follow you. Have you sought internal counseling for yourself to explore why you are unhappy? 4
Mint Sauce Posted January 21, 2013 Posted January 21, 2013 apologies for projecting a gender onto you and your spouse, while you did not state them. and welcome, of course. 1
Author nooneyouknow Posted January 21, 2013 Author Posted January 21, 2013 First of all, I don't understand why so many people harp on the idea of confronting a spouse with the fact that they had an affair. Life is hard enough, and anyone who has lived with someone for years or decades can pretty much figure out what transpired. I think really think telling the partner face to face is cruel. Yes I realize I am being cowardly too. Secondly, how can it not be important to have things in common and do things with your spouse? This is what builds a relationship, no? I know it built my relationship with my spouse when we were dating and first married. I also know that it helped create the strong bond I had with the OW-we both liked the same things, the same music, sex, going to the movies. My wife and I really have little in common anymore besides the kids. She has lost all interest in life. I have been asking her for 20+ years to work days so we would have evenings together. She has refused for a variety of reasons-doesn't like the hours, doesn't like the people on days, would take a pay cut, doesn't like the work load on days, would lose seniority as far as vacation picks, etc. etc. It just seems to me she put her career ahead of me. That was one of the great things about the OW, I was her priority, I was first in her life.
Author nooneyouknow Posted January 21, 2013 Author Posted January 21, 2013 Welcome to LS. You do realize that there are a combination of things going on here right, it seems you do from your post. a. Mid-life crisis b. Empty Nest syndrome c. Affair fog from the affair (does your spouse know of the affair?) d. Depression With all of that going on, no wonder you found yourself here. It sounds like you are searching for something to make you happy, but looking to a new life, a new person...will typically be short-lived if you don't figure out why you are restless and unhappy within yourself first. Whether you stick with your spouse or move on to a new life, that unhappiness inside will follow you. Have you sought internal counseling for yourself to explore why you are unhappy? Yes, I realize it is part mid life crisis, maybe part empty nest, and I realize that I am so torn the crazy GF with BPD finally had enough and walked away. The reason I am unhappy is manyfold. Besides losing the GF, which is hard to describe if someone is not familiar with BPD, is that I just feel I am wasting my time here. I am retired young, and I want to move somewhere warm. I want my life to be about me. I have lived two decades for my kids. Since I retired my life has been all about grocery shopping, laundry, going to the gym, being alone three nights a week, paying bills, taking care of the house and cars, all mundane stuff. I am just tired of it. What life with the OW showed me is that adults can have a life too-one that once their kids are grown, is more like the life of a young adult. As far as the reason I had the affair, well as my spouse said, I am neglected. Someone came along and told me I was wonderful and funny and a great lover. Someone entered my mind and my soul. Someone awoke me. Someone made me the focal point of their life, and made themselves available to me. I was vulnerable and willing.
CptSaveAho Posted January 21, 2013 Posted January 21, 2013 all i read is me me me me me me me me me me me me me sad you have to use other people to wake your mind and soul. 1
Minadee Posted January 21, 2013 Posted January 21, 2013 Sounds like you are putting ALL of the blame on her. Leave, and give your wife a real chance of finding someone who will love her and cherish her and will respect that she works hard not think about himself 24/7. I am not usually this blunt within my posts, but i've read a few of your threads and you sound like a very immature little man. You wanted to have your cake (your poor wife) and eat it too (your gf) and when that little dream was smashed you "settled" and harped on about how you were trying to do this for your wife, when in reality you are doing it because you don't have the balls to leave. If you are so unhappy with someone who loves you unconditionally and is willing to try anything to please you then go, but goodluck finding better.
dreamingoftigers Posted January 21, 2013 Posted January 21, 2013 Please visit my response to you in another thread. I can empathize with you somewhat because my husband reflected some of the similar attitudes. However, your behaviour is just as impactful to others as there's is to you whether or not you are being completely honest about the cause. This isn't meant to cause you "shame." it is made to express to you that as a married man, that comes with a certain set of responsibilities and a particular role which are there to protect yourself emotionally etc as much as your partner and FOSTER intimacy. Your spouse may or may not be fostering intimacy but since she isn't here, we can only respond to you. Your behaviour does not reflect or respect the role of "husband" in a marriage. If you want to be a husband, you must first decide whether you are capable or want to be. If you are not capable, seek help to become capable. If you are not wanting to, than leaving is best for everyone and not floating around untethered reacting to impulses you have to bounce back and forth. I personally believe that you have emotional maturity and intimacy issues. Everything you've expressed just sounds "too par for the course." But I am not a specialist. I strongly suggest you seek independent counseling and if you aren't willing, at least pack up and go so that your ambivalent attitude towards your marriage and marital role does not cause any more damage. As much as you feel "not in control" of the situation, you ABSOLUTELY are. And you hold all of the cards.
dreamingoftigers Posted January 21, 2013 Posted January 21, 2013 By the way, as a BPD sufferer in remission, getting involved with someone who has active BPD will only break you down further. There's a reason you attracted and entertained a relationship with a BPD person that would have incredibly poor boundaries (probably because you yourself lack them). Getting involved with BPD and KNOWING it and even trying to be a "fixer" etc is enough of a red flag to go to counseling regardless of the rest of the situation.
dreamingoftigers Posted January 21, 2013 Posted January 21, 2013 BTW, it looks as though you are looking for a woman to fix what is broken inside you. You were willing to drop your wife for BPD gf and all of the "passion" you were having but then four days later you were cleaving to your wife again like you couldn't let go. That's a very blunt transition. It would suggest that if a different woman cane along, you would be attracted to her as a moth to a flame as long as that illusion of cohesiveness was present. I truly think you badly want to be loved, accepted and intimate with someone but have no idea how to get close without feeling controlled and manipulated. Hence the "me first" attitude. Cohesiveness in a relationship is not built over the short term and requires a large effort on both parties. You can't supply that if you have one foot out the door. With the issues I suspect you have, you can't BUILD cohesiveness because you will ALWAYS have one foot out the door.
Mr. Lucky Posted January 21, 2013 Posted January 21, 2013 I am stuck between not wanting to hurt someone who has always been good to me, who has always been there for me, and has always been a faithful partner-and feeling that I owe myself the chance to be happy. Any thoughts? Can't help but be struck by the irony of your statement about "not wanting to hurt someone who has always been good to me" since you've embarked on the one course guaranteed to hurt above all else. You want freedom and fulfillment but not at the expense of the truth. Doesn't work that way... Mr. Lucky 1
KathyM Posted January 21, 2013 Posted January 21, 2013 I think you should confess your affair to your wife, and then tell her how sorry you were to seek attention outside of your marriage, and how much you want to rebuild your marriage and get back the connection with her that has been missing for quite some time, and that you'll do anything to get your relationship with her back to where it used to be. (Assuming that is what your true feelings are). And then hope that she takes this as a wake up call to work on your marriage, and doesn't decide to throw you out (which is, of course, a possibility, and who could blame her). I think that would be your best bet--confess your affair and your feelings to your wife, and hope that her reaction will be to work on the marriage with you. I don't see any other way of moving forward in the marriage, and your wife deserves the truth, so be a man and bite the bullet. It may lead to the change in your marriage that you are looking for.
Yasuandio Posted January 21, 2013 Posted January 21, 2013 Notice how you are dissatified with things? Notice how your affair is over with? Notice how you are about to disappear your marriage? You know something else? Maybe you need to notice you are 50 plus years old right now. It is impossible for you to have a long term marriage with the life time experiences like you have shared with your wife. Some new tail and adoration will not ever become the love that has grown between you and your wife (whether you want to see it or not, right now). There are not enough years left in your life. So, if you do decide to become a Walk-Away Spouse at this time, when you do come to your senses, say 5-7 years out, when you're pushing sixty, more than likely, your wife will have moved on for sure, and you will not have another chance. Even if she grants you another chance or several - once you dump her, she is never going to trust of you, and you will most certainly lose her in time. You have been warned here on several threads. While you ego is feeling very stoked with the attenion you may be receiving, no one is really gonna be able to tolerate and love the "real you" uncondionally except your current wife of many years. My gut instinct tells me you have labled your X-GF with a mental disorder cause she wouldn't put up with you. I mean, wasn't she OK enough to be a GF affair partner to start with? Now, she's too BPD to be a GF affair partner? What's up with that? Don't make her jump thru hoops to try to keep you. She will for a while. She loves you deeply. Turn yourself around, and address her needs, address the needs of the partnership. Perhaps you should not be so selfish: "I want, I want, I want." "I need, I need, I need." Can you not see anything positive in what you have? Do you only see what you don't have at this moment? Blame, blame, blame. How have you contributed to the problems in the marriage? What contribution can you make to repair the marriage? Have GF on the side? Dude? Really? Look at the title of this thread in particular: "IS IT WRONG TO WANT TO LEAVE A GOOD SPOUSE?" Read your threads over, man. Pretend it's not you. Then ask yourself: why does this OP keeps starting new threads? Now, is it wrong to want to leave a good spouse? It is not a right or wrong question. The question should be phrased differently: "Is It Wise To Want To Leave a Good Spouse? After a 20 year marriage, it is not wise to leave a good spouse. I promise you, once you leave her you will lose her, you will want her back SO bad, and it will be too late. 3
JamesM Posted January 21, 2013 Posted January 21, 2013 The question really is.....is it wrong to leave my marriage? My answer...yes. Is it wrong to DESIRE to leave your marriage? The answer is no. But then the question is....why? And the answer will help you decide what can be done. I am nearing fifty also, so I kinda have an idea of what you feel. My guess is that the excitement of the affair still lingers within you and your wife will never match up to that...unless you decide to rebuild your marriage. Your current attitude is...HOW can I leave my marriage? And I say that if you want to do so, then it is easy. But remember that you also leave your family. Your kids may be out, but they still are your children. And splitting will cause them to take sides. You have nothing in common with your wife because you lead separate lives. If you truly wanted to be close to her, then you would find a way and not wait for her to make the move. Something struck me as I read how your wife doesn't want to change HER job and lifestyle. Could it be that SHE is in an affair? Imagine if she was and you were then alone. Imagine if you could see her with her soul mate laughing and sharing her emotions. Imagine as they cuddled their bodies together and touched each other eagerly giving the other enjoyment. Imagine how you would feel if she were in an affair. Women are smart. You may never have told her of your affair, but she could have easily sensed something was wrong. And this lack of connection with you may have caused her to choose an affair when the opportunity was there. Just because you don't see your wife as attractive and exciting does not mean another man doesn't. If I were you, then I would first decide how I could revitalize my marriage before thinking about how I could leave it. Just a thought. 1
trippi1432 Posted January 21, 2013 Posted January 21, 2013 Yes, I realize it is part mid life crisis, maybe part empty nest, and I realize that I am so torn the crazy GF with BPD finally had enough and walked away. The reason I am unhappy is manyfold. Besides losing the GF, which is hard to describe if someone is not familiar with BPD, is that I just feel I am wasting my time here. I am retired young, and I want to move somewhere warm. I want my life to be about me. I have lived two decades for my kids. Since I retired my life has been all about grocery shopping, laundry, going to the gym, being alone three nights a week, paying bills, taking care of the house and cars, all mundane stuff. I am just tired of it. What life with the OW showed me is that adults can have a life too-one that once their kids are grown, is more like the life of a young adult. As far as the reason I had the affair, well as my spouse said, I am neglected. Someone came along and told me I was wonderful and funny and a great lover. Someone entered my mind and my soul. Someone awoke me. Someone made me the focal point of their life, and made themselves available to me. I was vulnerable and willing. Why is it that "here" in the bolded part above, you make it sound like your wife told you this? She said these things and you came clean with her about the affair? This sounds more like you convincing yourself in your mind that she would say these things to you to comfort you and ignore her own hurt. You know, your wife could probably show you the same things your OW showed you if you would open yourself up enough to be close to her to let her know how you felt and what your needs are. Instead, what you get with the OW is the comfort or not having to be responsible for anyone else but yourself. Here we are though, you continued the affair since you hit the boards last May and now you are here....still unhappy.
K Os Posted January 21, 2013 Posted January 21, 2013 First of all, I don't understand why so many people harp on the idea of confronting a spouse with the fact that they had an affair. Life is hard enough, and anyone who has lived with someone for years or decades can pretty much figure out what transpired. I think really think telling the partner face to face is cruel. Yes I realize I am being cowardly too.So many people harp on about this because it's to do with the TRUTH, which is a key ingredient of any healthy relationship, or any single life for that matter. You're right, 'anyone who has lived with someone for years or decades can pretty much figure out what transpired'. We all have excellent radar for this, it's true, particularly after many years together. But this doesn't take into account your partner giving you the benefit of the doubt, and/or being in denial about it. It's surprising how effective these strategies can be. By not telling the truth openly, you're condemning your partner to live in doubt about you and, far worse, to live in doubt about their own intuition. This is actually a kind of hell. I speak from direct experience. Or do I? I can't be completely sure. I think I'm pretty sure. But maybe I'm wrong. Who knows? It's hell. Telling them face to face isn't cruel. It's hard, and it's horrible, but it is kinder in the long run. Intimacy begins with honesty, in my book anyway. And that means telling the truth, not just knowing it. 2
Author nooneyouknow Posted January 21, 2013 Author Posted January 21, 2013 Why is it that "here" in the bolded part above, you make it sound like your wife told you this? She said these things and you came clean with her about the affair? This sounds more like you convincing yourself in your mind that she would say these things to you to comfort you and ignore her own hurt. You know, your wife could probably show you the same things your OW showed you if you would open yourself up enough to be close to her to let her know how you felt and what your needs are. Instead, what you get with the OW is the comfort or not having to be responsible for anyone else but yourself. Here we are though, you continued the affair since you hit the boards last May and now you are here....still unhappy. Yes, those are my wife's exact words the first time I told her I was unhappy and wanted out of the marriage-15 months ago. She said I was neglected, and that she was even told by her mother that she was wasting her life sleeping and working. As far as opening up, and having wonderful sex, it's not going to happen. My wife is a few years older than me. She does enjoy sex when we have, but honestly, neither one of us is into it that frequently. Thirty plus years together will do that to a couple, I guess.
Author nooneyouknow Posted January 21, 2013 Author Posted January 21, 2013 ......it is no longer about the OW. She is out of the picture. Because of her emotional outbursts, accusations, mood swings, all the things that go with BPD, I could not leave my wife to be with her. I never felt she could provide a calm, stable, loving environment. I feared that I would move in with her, and then I would become homeless over some imagined incident leading to a domestic argument. There were also the issues of being away from my kids, upsetting them, and the financial aspects of separation and divorce. I think given a few more months, and especially if the OW was a stable partner who stood beside me throughout the process, I could have done it. But in any case, that was not to be. When I didn't leave my wife soon enough for the OW (18 months or so), she cut off contact. Being a person with BPD, she suffers from black and white thinking, fear of abandonment, and she is able to "throw the switch" and just turn off her feelings for a person, as she did to her husband of 22 years. My question now is, is it OK to leave a marriage just to be free? Or is it so selfish and just plain wrong to leave a good person? I just don't feel I will ever be happy here, and yet this is my home, my spouse, my kids home.
Mr. Lucky Posted January 21, 2013 Posted January 21, 2013 My question now is, is it OK to leave a marriage just to be free? Or is it so selfish and just plain wrong to leave a good person? I just don't feel I will ever be happy here, and yet this is my home, my spouse, my kids home. What do you see yourself doing with this new found freedom that compares favorably with your current hearth, home and family? Wild and crazy sex? World travel? Finally run that marathon? I think you're projecting dissatisfaction with the normal life inventory we all do in middle age onto your marriage. And it strikes me as slight chicken sh*t to blame someone else for our own deviances from life's ideal plan. I'd start with an honest and fearless assessment of my role in the marriage. And then I'd be very careful what I wished for - it might come true ... Mr. Lucky 2
imtooconfused Posted January 22, 2013 Posted January 22, 2013 nooneyouknow... I feel for you man. I am in a similar situation, but different in the fact that my spouse is not (what I would consider) a good spouse and the fact that there has not been an affair. I still have one child at home who means the world to me and is the only thing keeping us together. I don't understand why it's so important to keep a marriage together for the sake of keeping two people in a painful situation? 1
trippi1432 Posted January 22, 2013 Posted January 22, 2013 Yes, those are my wife's exact words the first time I told her I was unhappy and wanted out of the marriage-15 months ago. She said I was neglected, and that she was even told by her mother that she was wasting her life sleeping and working. As far as opening up, and having wonderful sex, it's not going to happen. My wife is a few years older than me. She does enjoy sex when we have, but honestly, neither one of us is into it that frequently. Thirty plus years together will do that to a couple, I guess. When you told her you were unhappy....but not that you were having an affair. Good play really. Make her feel uncomfortable to make her feel she needs to fulfill your needs when you were getting them fulfilled somewhere else. Nice. I will say that these types of posts have made me decide to have a man on the side in a committed relationship now, I realize now that being a good person has nothing to do with commitment. Thanks for the lesson.
Author nooneyouknow Posted January 23, 2013 Author Posted January 23, 2013 When you told her you were unhappy....but not that you were having an affair. Good play really. Make her feel uncomfortable to make her feel she needs to fulfill your needs when you were getting them fulfilled somewhere else. Nice. I will say that these types of posts have made me decide to have a man on the side in a committed relationship now, I realize now that being a good person has nothing to do with commitment. Thanks for the lesson. I know you are being sarcastic, but yes I do believe that being a good person has more to do with being around and being supportive of a stable family life than it has to do with where you happen to get off. I know many will disagree with me, but honestly, one is a physical need and one is a commitment.
Author nooneyouknow Posted January 23, 2013 Author Posted January 23, 2013 Lesson learned. The affair taught me to value my spouse very much. Whatever her faults are as far as intimacy, hygiene, making herself appealing, putting an effort in-they pale in comparison to dealing with a deranged psycho, which the OW is. My spouse is good, loyal and loving. She understands respect, boundaries, and commitments.
Mystery2Me Posted January 24, 2013 Posted January 24, 2013 Hi Nooneyouknow, We here at LS know exactly who you are...You are unfortunately another wayward spouse. Just because you have not shared your actually name, does not mean that we have not been properly introduced. You do not realize how very fortunate you are; because of your Good, Loyal and Loving wife. The real truth is that you do not know us, the betrayed spouse, because you have avoiding telling your wife the truth. Please do get some professional help to learn to think beyond your own wrapped personally happiness, and acknowledge marriage is a shared union and you have absolutely no right to make unilateral decisions concerning it's future. God bless your wife and children. ~Mystery
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