So fed up and seeking guidance.

[dreamingoftigers]

Hi again folks,

 

A lot of you are familiar with my marital situation.

 

My husband had the infidelity/addiction/abuse dealbreakers going on invite marriage. Luckily for him I never could recognize a deal, so breaking one was very difficult.

 

Anyhow, we've been through the ringer and separated but our reconciliation was forced somewhat early due to circumstance. (not financial)

 

But now we are living very close to the edge most of the time.

As well, he has improved in the way the he deal with our marital issues tenfold. However, the way he dealt with our marriage is before was SO shoddy that he's still way below par.

 

YEA I have issues too. I do. NONE of them come even close to being a massive dealbreaker NONE of them. Of course every time the "hey what about dealing with the infidelity issues?" comes up there's a lot of "we will, but you know you spend too much time on the computer.!" WTF! REALLY!?

 

Anyhow I am fed the **** up after FOUR YEARS of not getting full disclosure and us going back and forth in counseling due to finances. Right now we are also both in school and there's a lot of "I'm behind after slacking off for a week" stuff going on. Needless to say both him and I are major procrastinators.

 

However, he has been very proactive with excuses and he was very proactive with cheating. So I'm sick of it.

 

Right now he's "starting to work on it and we'll do the things on the list you asked for." but I feel like it's only because I nagged and have made moves to pull the plug. He'll put in work double-time to get back into the marriage but he won't do any basic maintenance on say, Wednesday. I am EVERY DAY doing what I have energy for to keep things going between us. I want something more for what I put in.

 

I don't want to just pull the plug, and this isn't "all of a sudden" and no there isn't "another party" or a "just wanna find myself" or a "ILUBINILWU" or a "lost my sex drive and want to torture my husband." or whatever garbage. And no it isn't because he isn't "alpha enough or nice guy enough."

 

It's really about: I don't think he has Very much respect for himself, me or our marriage. And I'm sick of it. Whatever has been sustaining my patience and strength over the last four years, I am on the last case of it. I'm am not ordering another batch.

 

Here's where things start to go. If we weren't so trainwrecked right now we would be using the 3K cheque that I just got for a vehicle. We do need a vehicle. We have one. It isn't in great shape. Now, it isn't NECESSARY to get to school and back. It is necessary to get to childcare and back. We just need something that gets from A to B. Childcare is a ten minute drive but where it is makes it next to impossible to walk

And it takes 3 connections by bus. And the buses don't run that late on the way home. LOL.

 

BUT we have had MC before and our MC was AMAZING. He is also expensive and we were just starting to really cut through stuff when we ran out of $$.

 

We could take half of that cheque and KNOW whether or not this was workable and if not he was able to help us do a managed exit for us and our daughter. This means 1.5K for a vehicle. MAYBE we could fix up our car a bit. MAYBE. but I think it would cost more than 1.5 K.

 

Or we could get an old beater.

 

If we don't do the MC, I will place a little $$ aside for my own managed exit, which looks more than likely.

 

Any thoughts? Should I even put the MC on the table? I think it will piss him off because he will view the vehicle as the priority. And it is IMPORTANT but if I feel like throwing him out of the house on a regular basis, I kinda don't see what having a vehicle would do for him anyway.

 

If my tone sounds totally selfish, it is because I am totally fed up. Seriously I have given A LOT of time, effort and money to both him and the marriage. (in fact he owes me 3K from when we were separated.

 

Arg! Crossroads, help!

[Nyla]

Hi again folks,

 

A lot of you are familiar with my marital situation.

 

My husband had the infidelity/addiction/abuse dealbreakers going on invite marriage. Luckily for him I never could recognize a deal, so breaking one was very difficult.

 

Anyhow, we've been through the ringer and separated but our reconciliation was forced somewhat early due to circumstance. (not financial)

 

But now we are living very close to the edge most of the time.

As well, he has improved in the way the he deal with our marital issues tenfold. However, the way he dealt with our marriage is before was SO shoddy that he's still way below par.

 

YEA I have issues too. I do. NONE of them come even close to being a massive dealbreaker NONE of them. Of course every time the "hey what about dealing with the infidelity issues?" comes up there's a lot of "we will, but you know you spend too much time on the computer.!" WTF! REALLY!?

 

Anyhow I am fed the **** up after FOUR YEARS of not getting full disclosure and us going back and forth in counseling due to finances. Right now we are also both in school and there's a lot of "I'm behind after slacking off for a week" stuff going on. Needless to say both him and I are major procrastinators.

 

However, he has been very proactive with excuses and he was very proactive with cheating. So I'm sick of it.

 

Right now he's "starting to work on it and we'll do the things on the list you asked for." but I feel like it's only because I nagged and have made moves to pull the plug. He'll put in work double-time to get back into the marriage but he won't do any basic maintenance on say, Wednesday. I am EVERY DAY doing what I have energy for to keep things going between us. I want something more for what I put in.

 

I don't want to just pull the plug, and this isn't "all of a sudden" and no there isn't "another party" or a "just wanna find myself" or a "ILUBINILWU" or a "lost my sex drive and want to torture my husband." or whatever garbage. And no it isn't because he isn't "alpha enough or nice guy enough."

 

It's really about: I don't think he has Very much respect for himself, me or our marriage. And I'm sick of it. Whatever has been sustaining my patience and strength over the last four years, I am on the last case of it. I'm am not ordering another batch.

 

Here's where things start to go. If we weren't so trainwrecked right now we would be using the 3K cheque that I just got for a vehicle. We do need a vehicle. We have one. It isn't in great shape. Now, it isn't NECESSARY to get to school and back. It is necessary to get to childcare and back. We just need something that gets from A to B. Childcare is a ten minute drive but where it is makes it next to impossible to walk

And it takes 3 connections by bus. And the buses don't run that late on the way home. LOL.

 

BUT we have had MC before and our MC was AMAZING. He is also expensive and we were just starting to really cut through stuff when we ran out of $$.

 

We could take half of that cheque and KNOW whether or not this was workable and if not he was able to help us do a managed exit for us and our daughter. This means 1.5K for a vehicle. MAYBE we could fix up our car a bit. MAYBE. but I think it would cost more than 1.5 K.

 

Or we could get an old beater.

 

If we don't do the MC, I will place a little $$ aside for my own managed exit, which looks more than likely.

 

Any thoughts? Should I even put the MC on the table? I think it will piss him off because he will view the vehicle as the priority. And it is IMPORTANT but if I feel like throwing him out of the house on a regular basis, I kinda don't see what having a vehicle would do for him anyway.

 

If my tone sounds totally selfish, it is because I am totally fed up. Seriously I have given A LOT of time, effort and money to both him and the marriage. (in fact he owes me 3K from when we were separated.

 

Arg! Crossroads, help!

 

I have a lot of questions.

 

What made you reconcile?

 

What kind of issues do you think you have?

 

When you speak of "full disclosure" are you talking about not having secrets or disclosing all the details of infidelity.

 

If you want to stay with your husband, it is important for you to be clear about EXACTLY what you expect from him and why. Explain that marriage counseling is more important than a car and see what your husband says.

 

You say that you are sick of his disrespect and you "don't want to order another batch." Those words seem like you are at the end of the road with your husband.

[xxoo]

I'd go with the "managed exit" route. Get a stable home for you and your daughter established.

 

At some point, you are throwing good money into a bad situation.

 

In your gut, do you believe that your husband is even capable of a healthy marriage?

[dreamingoftigers]

I have a lot of questions.

 

What made you reconcile?

 

We were actually working on reconciling when the circumstance came up. I still wanted the marriage and really loved him despite the nightmare circumstances I've been through due to it. As well he had been doing A LOT of work on himself and his issues. Things were looking fairly golden until the last three months. To be fair to him, he wasnt slipping on any of the changes he HAD made. He was also showing a big want to be married to me abd raise iur daughter together. We co-parent EXTREMELY WELL. There aren't conflicts about that. So I don't think it would be a rough transition if needed. As well, whatever means in therapy or group he has been exposed to, he works at.

 

Last semester he was putting more time and energy into things and it was okay. I went away over holidays and honestly, after visiting my MIL I noticed the tricks she uses (but she's very extreme) and I feel that my husband still does some of the same. It made me feel like I still can't trust him. Even though he's been faithful and addiction-free (from everything I've seen). He's also has not been disappearing on me and is where he says he is without fail. I have no doubts about that.

 

I also noticed all of the things that had been missing (that we were working toward) in our recon. I just STILL FEEL SO HEARTBROKEN about the way he did treat me. We haven't dealt with that and to him it's like "I wanna move past this." and I'm like "me too: DO YOUR STUFF ALREADY THAN WE CAN!"

 

What kind of issues do you think you have?

 

1. My ADD has been treated and then untreated over the last two years, the second I discontinue a course of meds or a dose or type that isn't working the way it is supposed to, I end of waiting another 3 to 6 months to regroup and try again because ADD meds are pretty overwhelming for me to go on. The last dosage increase I did kept me up so that I got 2 hours of sleep in three days. My husband is also adult ADD/ADHD. He can't go on the medication that is covered by our health plan, because it is highly-addictive and he, well, got highly-addicted to it. So his meds were okay last semester (from his psychiatrist samples) BUT adjusting to them had a net effect (to be fair that was part of why he was behind in school) AND our funding hasn't approved the continuation of them yet, so since December 15th, he's been unmedicated. (ARG) this definitely has an effect on how we interact. I am also pretty sure that my dose of meds is not right for me.

 

We have been saving to go to the Amen Brain Clinic for both the best options on brain regulation for ADD and issue #2

 

2. My health, in specific my eating and sedentary patterns. ADD makes it damn hard to stick to any plans as it is but my weight completely yo-yos as much as 100-120 lbs. It shreds my self-esteem when this happens. He has similar health issues but his diet is actually much worse on a regular basis. We both seem to have trouble regulating our health together or individually although I have greater success when on my own because person #2 isn't cooking up bacon Mac and cheese for dinner etc.

 

3. I have a HUGE abandonment trigger from childhood. It has dulled somewhat over the years but is still present. I don't have an issue with being ALONE I have an issue with being ABANDONED. I had some trauma therapy dealing with this years ago and it helped, but I wasn't able to continue. My husband is a huge trigger for this (not surprised I attracted a guy like this either) because for about three years if any conflict/cheating/addiction stuff came up he would disappear. The last time was a year ago. The time before that was for three months. We separated during that time and after that. I couldn't take it. (and no one should. When he lost his daughter for awhile; that hit him really hard and I KNOW that wouldn't ever do that again. I truly don't think he would get back into the addictive realm because he lost everything for nothing and he has so much emotionally invested into our daughter. BUT I am always tense opening my door at the end of the day, especially if we have had a conflict. I still check for his shoes and probably will for as long as we are together or even long after we separate. It was hard going weeks not even knowing if he was alive or dead. And he was pretty random about it too. So emotionally I am pretty reactive to it too. He never uses it against me or anything (I'd honestly kick him out 48 hours notice, his stuff in a storage unit if he did). I will often tell him "I was worried you weren't coming home tonight." "I thought I'd never see you again." He's been empathetic and reassuring about that, but I don't think it's a "good" thing for me to say. It might be a "fair" thing but it isn't a "helpful" thing.

 

4. My computer usage is really high. It is. I admit it. I should be putting more into family time and I tell myself that "I am." BUT with the amount of dumb games I was playing and loveshacking, it wasn't a balanced amount still. I get pissy with him about our M and then he tells me "I feel like I'm second to your phone anyway." and he's right. I've resented him so he has been second. I feel like our marriage is a "for granted thing" that he isn't connected to so I justify my Internet time by that. But it is crap. I night just follow my thread for a bit. But we both make excuses as to why the other is at fault. And it may be really immature but I feel "hey buddy you are like 90% at fault and I shouldn't even be here anymore! So I don't want to hear it until YOU show ME how much you are willing to put in." Which is actually AGAINST one of my personal philosophies. Sometimes it helps just to type it.

 

5. I don't know how to manage my finances very well. Period. Ugh

 

When you speak of "full disclosure" are you talking about not having secrets or disclosing all the details of infidelity.

 

Details of infidelity, I don't need to know that he had a crush on the crazy cat lady in third grade. I know enough other things to blackmail the man

 

If you want to stay with your husband, it is important for you to be clear about EXACTLY what you expect from him and why. Explain that marriage counseling is more important than a car and see what your husband says.

 

You say that you are sick of his disrespect and you "don't want to order another batch." Those words seem like you are at the end of the road with your husband.

 

I made a list for him. He did respond to it.

 

I really do feel at the end of my rope. However, I also wonder if I am playing some of the some games he is "no you go first, no you go first."

 

But I AM SICK of leading. SICK of it. Maybe if I just back off for a little while. IDK just frustrated.

 

Maybe I should put the money toward the Amen Clinic. It would almost cover a scan for one of us. IDK IDK.

 

I often wonder if the brain regulation issues play more into the dynamic and immaturity than anything else. I mean, I've seen him under the influence etc and it's very different than the other side of the spectrum of being on meds.

 

Often when I feel like giving up and giving in I come on here, type it all out and them see what I am missing.

 

Thanks for your response Nyla.

[dreamingoftigers]

I'd go with the "managed exit" route. Get a stable home for you and your daughter established.

 

At some point, you are throwing good money into a bad situation.

 

In your gut, do you believe that your husband is even capable of a healthy marriage?

 

Thank you xxoo,

 

I think I will be stashing some, even as personal savings.

 

I agree that it has been a long time in coming but we've also had lots of joint and individual challenges on the way so it's hard to sort just how much is lack of effort (disrespect) vs. "Holy Crap I'm trying to stop and outbreak here!"

 

I actually DO believe that he is capable of a healthy marriage but not without both of us facing FOO issues and some more EMDR I see a lot of immaturity BUT I see a lot of growth too. It's just so damn tough when things stagnate. But I do feel he doesn't get how important this is and I don't want a guy around just because I bugged him to look into things.

 

I should say this: he HAS been more proactive about things like dates and initiating sex (although much less than I would like but about a double to triple improvement). He also has been a bit better about the health thing and makes us smoothies every morning. I just got my blood pressure done and it is back to low/normal.

 

He just isn't doing the "how can I make this ten times better and conquer the Hell out of this list?" "hey I really do owe my wife big time and I should be less of an asshat."

 

IDK it seems like I lost my old attitude about M and am just sick of trying while he stagnates.

 

One thing that has changed the dynamic recently is that instead of staying silent and waiting for his minor epiphanies. Lately I refuse to "suffer in silence" and take more of a break and complain about one thing at a time. Now everything that's been bugging me or hurting my feelings gets an instant report card because I RESENT disclosure having taken so long. Needless to day that isn't getting me the results I want. And he's shutting me down a lot more too which is pissing me off even worse!

 

Arg. I HATE navigating this. Especially freshly medicated.

[dreamingoftigers]

So we talked about the cheque.

 

A couple of interesting things came up tonight.

 

A friend of the family volunteered to fix the "heat (cold?) sensor" in the car that is busted so our block heater doesn't work. Sometimes the car won't start in the cold. We are junking another vehicle that my husband had last year. That will give us another $100.

 

I don't think our car will survive the winter so having it start over the next while will be good, but not solve the problem. Honestly, it's just waiting for us to pull the plug.

 

So we will be getting a vehicle on this cheque. BUT I found out we are getting an additional 700-1K from late taxes that H said he is totally okay with going to MC. He liked our last MC quite a bit and helped H realize a lot of his stuff was FOO and anxiety response.

 

I am still not okay with a lot of what he said happened yesterday. I am looking at transferring schools for the last semester of funding because I would like to be away from him a bit more. I always found us going to school together to be "a tad weird."

 

I started packing some stuff away and throwing away other stuff in preparation of having to move to a smaller place if necessary. We do have too much stuff anyway that we have been sorting through and discarding so it shouldn't raise too many flags. I am reluctant to discuss my possible intentions outside of MC because he has flipped his lid in the past. I don't think he would again but I also don't need to drag us through months of "yours or mine?" When really, a lot of it is totally disposable and not worth the headache.

 

I want to be in a position to easily leave if I have to or things are not working at all. In fact it was recommended to me. I have no major problems losing everything and starting over, but I've done it twice and would like a better, more stable transition for our daughter if necessary.

 

I guess spending a few sessions in MC at this point would really show if anything was progressing.

 

H has been more forthcoming etc today but there has also been more pressure lately. I want to see if this will keep up when the ball is dropped on my end but we CAN access supports.

 

IDK. Am I going the right way here? I FEEL like I am, but when I reread my thread (aside from this response) I just look all over the place, and over the last few years, I've felt pretty focused on what I want etc.

[xxoo]

A better question might be, do you think it is likely that he will be able to be a healthy marriage partner? It's not so much about his theoretical potential, but about his realistic path, given the actual situation.

 

I can tell you this--I've had a handful of friends in similar situations, dealing with a partner's addictions and/or mental illness. When a child is involved, most of the people I know cut the partner loose, and focus on creating a stable home for the kid. I've never heard a person who chose this course regretting it (esp as they watch the other parent have breakdown after breakdown, but from the relatively comfortable distance of a separate home).

 

A couple have chosen to stick it out, and as the years go by, they don't seem to be gaining much peace.

 

I hear you on having your own addictions (internet and food). Do you think you'd be better able to handle these issues if you were free of this relationship drama?

[dreamingoftigers]

A better question might be, do you think it is likely that he will be able to be a healthy marriage partner? It's not so much about his theoretical potential, but about his realistic path, given the actual situation.

 

I'm half and half on this. On one hand he has done incredibly well in personal and relational growth. He just isn't putting the first foot forward 90% of the time. He has a huge fear of being manipulated. So that's the big one. If he starts addressing that (which he can in the here and now) then yeah, it's sustainable. It really depends on his next steps. It's been a year relapse-free so it could go either way.

 

I can tell you this--I've had a handful of friends in similar situations, dealing with a partner's addictions and/or mental illness. When a child is involved, most of the people I know cut the partner loose, and focus on creating a stable home for the kid. I've never heard a person who chose this course

regretting it (esp as they watch the other parent have breakdown after breakdown, but from the relatively comfortable distance of a separate home).

 

H has been stable over the past year aside from procrastinating about things. One of the reasons I am reluctant to split us is actually because of what our daughter has been through last year. CPS was very clear: together or apart, pick. We picked together and a six month supervision order was in place. Expired at the end of October. He is excellent with her. He has been steady, stable, attentive, affectionate, involved etc etc etc. It may be hard to picture a husband like him being a great father. He really is a GREAT father. He plays with her everynight and we read to her together. He makes toys with her, goes swimming with her on the weekend (I go about half the time depending on studying). He takes her tobogganing and to the store etc.

 

I don't see him being an unstable influence with her AT ALL. in fact if we split, I see NO PROBLEM with 50-50 custody. She is definitely the priority for both if us. I realize that he had a very long period filled with addictions etc. And that it has not been THAT LONG since he was in active addiction. There doesn't appear to be a struggle with any of that and his AADAC advisor and addictions assessments that were done for CPS stated him at a low risk for relapse. Part of why they returned our daughter earlier.

 

Our home has not been a high-conflict zone in the last year. The raging over crying I listed was two separate incidents all when our child was not present. One back in May and one yesterday.

 

A couple have chosen to stick it out, and as the years go by, they don't seem to be gaining much peace.

 

I AM frustrated in his lack of leadership in dealing with the residual effects from his infidelity/addiction/abusiveness. I am really frustrated about that. Not peaceful? IDK. Virtually every night is peaceful here, now I feel almost foolish considering what it was like before. That stinks because I am not happy that he's putting me off a lot (although I am happy that he's willing to revisit MC to deal with these things better.

 

If things stay as they are, than no, I'm not happy. I'd like to see the same or similar amount of growth and change as last year. I'd be totally happy with that. Our day-to-day stuff is pretty good in general. I would like him to do more around the house. Just feeling "emotionally neglected" without dealing with our history and ADD issues.

 

I hear you on having your own addictions (internet and food). Do you think you'd be better able to handle these issues if you were free of this relationship drama?

 

Food: yes because we both have a food problem and we both subtly encourage each other to eat poorly at times. But again, he's been encouraging healthy eating too. He makes us Bfast every morning. Etc.

 

I find the only way to deal with my food issues is yo be really rigid about it. Just dive in and stick to my plan and not let anything distract me. But food addiction oscillates that way too. Goes from strict to binge to strict again. I think I need to access local resources. I am almost wondering now if I am avoiding working on my food and Internet issues by blaming my husband and marriage (of which both have improved). Arg. Analysis paralysis.

 

Internet: ha! No I probably would be on just as much or worse if I was by myself. I've just been trying to stick to my own thread today. Arg.

 

So maybe I should be looking a little more at myself first. Hmm.

 

I don't like that as an answer either. Not comfortable.

 

So far I am seeing that I have 2 addictions. He's been in recovery for a year (low risk of relapse) and working on his food stuff. Hasn't taken full responsibility for the residual effects of his previous actions. Willing to go to MC. We can and do co-parent effectively. Our daughter IS really happy. Honestly I think she likes Dad better and I need to step up more.

 

Am I deluded?

[Nyla]

A person can be a terrible spouse but an excellent parent. Not really unusual since the relationships are very different from each other.

 

My dad is a lazy sexist cheater, but he was still a wonderful father to me growing up.

 

Do you mind if I ask why CPS had to get involved?

 

I hope you don't mind me asking questions.

 

I just want to get the best picture of your situation, so that I can respond to your posts appropriately.

[dreamingoftigers]

A person can be a terrible spouse but an excellent parent. Not really unusual since the relationships are very different from each other.

 

My dad is a lazy sexist cheater, but he was still a wonderful father to me growing up.

 

Do you mind if I ask why CPS had to get involved?

 

I hope you don't mind me asking questions.

 

I just want to get the best picture of your situation, so that I can respond to your posts appropriately.

 

My husband's addictions issues were a large part but the actual investigation started with my parents. They had an employee complain about their home (my Dad) in specific. They came and had him go through alcohol treatment etc.

 

But at the time I was dealing with the fallOut of h disappearing.

 

They interviewed and found sufficient cause with H's behavior to follow-up including an incident where (the evening he was thrown out) he got drunk and trashed our place.

 

T and I had been doing well without him. But when they interviewed him, he freaked and said everything was my fault and that I was crazy and didn't supervise our daughter etc etc etc and that he had to leave. When I asked him why in the Hell he did that, he was still in active addiction saying "I was sick of everyone making everything out to be my fault. I get that it wasn't fair or accurate I just really didn't think they'd ever take her. I felt like everyone was against me."

 

Well I had an 8 year old relapse-free mental health record. That gave them enough grounds to seize her on a temporary order. He was initially refused visitation. I had my mental health evaluated and due to the wait (despite visitation) they had to do reattachment therapy.

 

He worked all of his terms early including domestic violence intervention, alcohol treatment (he had to attend the same group as my Dad, which I thought was poetic justice to both of them). We had marital counseling, I did domestic violence course for women (mixture of victims and assailants. I did bite him when I found him doing something inappropriate which was NOT OKAY). I did a parenting course voluntarily. He did two voluntarily. We had a parenting assessment and therapeutic attachment.

[Nyla]

Okay, the information you have given about why CPS was called takes the cake!

 

I wouldn't try to save a marriage with an addict who is vindictive enough to lie to CPS, because he is tired of taking responsibility.

[BehindTheseHazelEyes]

When you think about the future, what do you picture in your mind? What do you want for you and your children?

 

You seem to think that divorce is in the future (using $$ for a managed exit).

 

Why is MC in the cards then? What would your goals be for MC? What are your feelings toward him? How does he fit in your vision for your family?

 

I guess my biggest question is why would you even talk to him after he disappeared on you and turned you in to CPS on lies?

 

This is not a safe relationship to be in by any definition, for you or for your children. Dysfunction is being modeled here, do you realize that? And it is controllable, to a certain extent.

 

You've been at this for how many years now? It stops when you say it does. He hasn't earned your trust or your gift of R. You should draw your line in the sand now. You have a choice here.

[LittleTiger]

Sorry to see you're having a rough time again DOT.

 

Your marriage seems to be on a wash, rinse, repeat cycle. My ex was nothing like yours but I can empathise with the sense of hope in your relationship which keeps getting dashed, and the feeling that you are the only one who is making any real effort.

 

My only advice is to imagine how you will feel in five years time if you are still in the same situation. That might help you to see what it is you really want.

 

It is sooo difficult to break out of a marriage that isn't working, all the more so when you have children but, realistically, how much longer can you go on washing, rinsing and repeating before the fabric completely disintegrates?

 

If I were you I would start focusing on just you and your child (children?) and making a good life without him. I know you love him but it doesn't seem as though he is making any positive changes and he is keeping you stuck in a place that isn't healthy or fun.

 

I do hope you find the strength and courage to move on. Otherwise you are going to find yourself looking back in 10 years and wondering where your precious life went.

[dreamingoftigers]

Okay, the information you have given about why CPS was called takes the cake!

 

I wouldn't try to save a marriage with an addict who is vindictive enough to lie to CPS, because he is tired of taking responsibility.

 

Nor would I try to save a marriage with an addict who trashes my house, but that isn't the behavior that we are dealing with at all anymore.

 

My husband was a monster in active addiction. Not a total and complete sociopath BUT someone who couldn't see the forest for the trees and I've been there too.

 

My issue isn't with what happened with CPS even though it's something I've resented.

 

This particular piece is something that was addressed in MC repeatedly. This is one of the pieces he has taken FULL and TOTAL responsibility for and made every single solitary effort to have his child returned and CPS set straight.

 

He very much let them know after the fact where he was coming from and his skewed viewpoint at the time. There's been addictions therapy and parenting etc etc etc. He isn't vindictive toward me at all about anything previous. He does get that that was a very damaging and completely disgusting way to act as well as the infidelity and addiction behaviors. A far as the alcoholism and disappearing and CPS issues go, there's been a lot of continuing effort to help me through that kind of betrayal. The one thing that isn't getting addressed in a proactive way is the infidelity.

 

I never would have looked at him twice if there was still an issue regarding addiction or vindictiveness.

 

We do not have that type of conflict anymore. He has total faced that 110%.

 

That is why if we were to split, I have no problem

putting 50-50 before the court. He is an excellent parent following the tremendous amount of self-work he put in. It has been a year but he has not lost any changes he has made. And I have no fear that he would lie to the

court or CPS (if they ever followed-up).

 

If we were to split, I also don't believe

 

Here's the things I have an issue with (thought I made this clear):

 

1. Not addressing his (former) infidelity in a proactive way.

 

2. Sometimes acting/feeling manipulated when I cry over said (former) infidelity.

 

3. Putting in some more effort around the house. (this is actually getting worked out okayish).

 

I truly believe that he has matured in leaps and bounds regarding addictive

behaviors, things like a control-fleeing-vindictiveness trigger, temper (this was toward the end of things falling apart), doing infidelity, financial responsibility, housework (although not as much as I'd like), keeping up with his counseling and self-maintenance (the self-maintenance could use a little more work at this point but I am not in much of a position to go after that).

 

Considering the monster behavior that me and T were dealing with before, we actually are looking at a great deal FOR HER.

 

Truly, honestly his addiction was like a conflict between me and him, I wouldn't take it and he wouldn't leave it, so he tried pinning it on me. It only worked for so long and he suffered some pretty heavy consequences before he realized:

 

A: it's his own fault

B: he's being a total asshat

C: he's losing everything because of it

D: he will continue to lose until he eventually die

E: it had to change

F: there was nowhere to go but up

G: he wanted to go home

H: his wife was actually trying to protect herself and daughter from his addicted behavior

I: addiction and infidelity was making making him a TERRIBLE parent not a "better" one.

J: he had a lot of work ahead of him now.

K: he loved wife/daughter more than "dreams of freedom" and "booze/infidelity."

 

Seriously, yes he was d-bag to us a BIG d-bag. Like he was even a Douchebag of the Year Finalist.

 

This year he hasn't even made the nominee list.

 

This year I am pissed off at him because:

 

1. Even though he has dealt with conflict/addiction/parenting/life skills (which actually is a lot), he has not proactively dealt with the marriage piece.

 

The key word is: PROACTIVE. It makes me feel unloved.

 

He isn't all like: "**** you bitch, I do what I want."

He's more like: "okay we'll do that. But how long do we have to do this for?"

Me: "what's it damn well matter how long we "have to do this for?"

Him: "I thought we were past this."

Me: "I never had a full disclosure. And we never finished MC! I am still really pissed about xyz incident and zyx incident! You know that! I have anxiety about this stuff every day!"

Him: "we'll do disclosure right now if you want but you want it at the MC! why don't you go see IC to help deal with until we can afford to go to MC? There's IC right at the school."

Me: I think you should be trying to get us back into MC. You owe me like a crapload of money and you haven't done anything about that! I'm sick of arranging MC and an IC is going to really help without the MC portion anyway."

Him: "we can't afford the MC right now and I know you don't want to go to CCC (low-cost counseling at CCC, I've had really BAD experiences there). Plus you want to go to Amen Clinic which is another six grand! We need a vehicle and if I start working right now I won't be able to finish my courses."

Me: "I know we need a vehicle. But MC is really really important to us I am getting so frustrated! I am so sick of this. I feel really last!"

Him: "I try all the time to show you that you aren't last. Dammit! It's easier to get T to come to the table for dinner than you because you are LSing/games every spare moment! I can't even connect with and I should be able to outside of MC. do you even realize how many times you ask me to repeat myself?"

Me: "it's not that bad! I've been trying to deal with all of these feeling for years and I can't! And we're getting nowhere now!"

Him: "then go see an IC!"

me: "an IC isn't an MC!"

 

Then it kind of goes around like this, if it even continues.

[dreamingoftigers]

Is this the thread you wanted more people on?

 

I have only read the first few posts.

 

Have you thought of getting the good MC but less often? Lay it out to them about the money and get "homework" to do between sessions.

 

I am a list maker. I'd suggest making lists of what you want from ea h other and what you are prepared to do that you know of. Wiggle out how to deal with the needs that weren't in the other persons list and meet to formally discuss progress each week. Ok maybe that sounds really forced but it would work for me.

 

I wouldn't go to a less good counselor and I can see you really want to see I'd you can work it out. So how about trying to do it just monthly or something

instead?

 

Thanks MFH70.

 

Our particular MC is one we are both pretty attached to. He addresses my H very well and H has been very forthcoming with him. I fund he is really able to draw the roots of the matter out and address FOO issues right in session. It's awesome! I have no doubt that our M would be ten times better if we continued to go.

 

He even addressed my computer usage as being anxiety response. There were a few other behaviours I was doing that were as well and I was able to realease them effectively. Unfortunately I sunk a lot of $ into one before I quit. H recognizes this as a huge issue whereas sometimes I font see it until the end. Unfortunately that was where we left off

 

Our MC requires a minimum commitment of biweekly. He was very clear about that. He estimated between 10-15 sessions based on our history and FOO. he saw we were both pretty committed to the M.

 

I've made H a list and was pissed that he didn't start tearing through it on Thurs. He started going through items 1&2 today though. So I feel like a little bit of an asshat for throwing him under the bus.

 

I am actually not up to following up with list items today myself as I have gotten VERY sick overnight. To the point where I feel really weak from retching.

 

Ugh. This stuff just feels like sometimes it doesn't stop coming.

[dreamingoftigers]

When you think about the future, what do you picture in your mind? What do you want for you and your children?

 

You seem to think that divorce is in the future (using $$ for a managed exit).

 

Why is MC in the cards then? What would your goals be for MC? What are your feelings toward him? How does he fit in your vision for your family?

 

I guess my biggest question is why would you even talk to him after he disappeared on you and turned you in to CPS on lies?

 

This is not a safe relationship to be in by any definition, for you or for your children. Dysfunction is being modeled here, do you realize that? And it is controllable, to a certain extent.

 

You've been at this for how many years now? It stops when you say it does. He hasn't earned your trust or your gift of R. You should draw your line in the sand now. You have a choice here.

 

*sighs*

 

We don't have an unsafe, conflict-ridden, relapse in alcohol, infidelity relationship anymore!

 

I get that everyone is concerned for T and I. But T and I are safe or CPS wouldn't have returned her EARLY and our lawyer wouldn't havebusted out the gingerale for the 1 in 20 cases that happens in!

 

Okay! There's no "he hits me cause he loves me" crap going on.

 

If anything, it's pretty mundane here.

 

The CURRENT ISSUE is that my H has not addressed infidelity prior to last year. Four years ago there was PA and then after that there was porn addiction for a couple of years. To him the PA was four years ago and he's thinking it's time to move past it or wait out until we can "safely" afford MC, to manage my anxiety in the meantime he is strongly recommending I go see a school-IC until we can afford it. I have been so pissed off about the wait

that I want it NOW. I hate the anxiety. I hate it and I am sick of living with it.

 

This isn't an "unsafe" relationship.

 

Of course I want a stable loving home for my daughter to grow up in.

 

When I found out my husband was relapsing last year I tried to have him removed and they wouldn't because his name was on the lease and we were legally married. So I tried to get us into a shelter, I wasn't a priority. I tried for about a month everyday. I wasn't having my bones broken and he wasn't in any way abusing my kid so I was stuck with this drunk in my home until he had a final blow out and I kicked him out no matter what the police had to say about it. I figured he wasn't going to fight to get back in. Than he disappeared and our lease ended the next week. So I signed a 1.5 year lease in my name only.

 

Our separation has been pretty well documented etc. After the lock-out he went up to Grande Prairie where he stayed with a friend who tried to show him how to "control" his drinking LOL. That didn't work and in the meantime CPS interviewed him and he said his dumbass things. Arg.

 

They collected our daughter and he fell apart. That was OVER A YEAR AGO.

 

Since then you can see what happened in the above thread.

 

I was actually glad that CPS got involved (but not for the seizure) because he made it VERY clear that he was going to fight for her. And that may have meant she would've had half-time with a father in active addiction.

 

After my mental health evaluation and parenting assessment ruled me "fit." it would've been a slam-dunk to get sole custody. Potentially without visitation. But that's rare. What CPS did was take the conflict out of our hands.

 

My husband had to quit the addiction or lose his daughter right there. It had nothing to do with "fighting with the wife" anymore. It was no linger between us.

 

So instead of doing what a high-percentage of fathers do under CPS terms, he didn't say "F you CPS, you have no right! I'm not working your terms! F the police!" He actually regrouped, sobered up, got himself together and worked his ass off to get visitation and then MC for us as well. Which he didn't NEED to do. He could've gotten his own place for the same cost and just independently patented our daughter once CPS assessed him as safe.

 

The rate in which we did the CPS terms was as fast as possible, like a full-time job. It still took about six months. And our supervision order was six months after that. It's been three months since the order expired.

 

There have been no relapses or forms of DV.

I wouldn't have let him back for the supervision order if he had. And I would have filed for sole custody because he clearly wouldn't have "gotten it."

[dreamingoftigers]

Hi TC.

 

He did do a lot. He did. We aren't dealing with the same old crazy schtick.

 

The longer this thread goes the more of an asshat I feel like.

 

He's not an alcoholic, vindictive, house-trashing, porn addict, refugee anymore.

 

Now he's a great Dad and kind of a dumb guy with a stubborn wife.

 

He hasn't dealt with the infidelity history. That's it. That's my beef.

 

Not whatever he was doing under the influence. I get it. Addiction changes people. A lot of them check-out or go nuts. He stopped, smartened up and invested in us.

 

He did a lot of personal work on how he handled conflict too. It used to be he'd just run out the door. Now he talks things out and even *gasp* empathizes.

 

Arg. I do see more of his point now having read my own stuff and others responses. He hasn't been anywhere near as much of an asshat as he was historically.

 

We had been a bit back and forth the week before I wrote this post.

 

I visited my MIL and felt emotionally "burned" by her. I came back so edgy from holidays I just wanted everything RIGHT NOW including MC which we can't really afford. We do need a new vehicle. Badly. You can floor it sometimes and it misfires. It'll do like 10 mph for a bit and then you have to kind of "work up" to residential speed. The brakes are good though!

 

I knew I shouldn't have included my h's "addiction/infidelity/abuse" in the front line because that's all a lot of posters are going to read. Even if people were going to say "wait more time and see if he stays sober." I could get that but a lot of those things are pretty far back now.

 

I'm not up at night playing "it's 3 a.m., do you know where your husband is?"

 

It's more like, "Where the Hell are those pants I put in the laundry 3 days ago? Why in the world did you wash all of the redundant blankets first?"

 

Even though I've said it quite a few times in thread I'll say it again:

 

My main issue is him not dealing PROACTIVELY with the HISTORICAL INFIDELITY.

 

I don't want to take away everything else he's done for the M and for our daughter. Seriously.

 

I wrote my post at a high point of frustration. You see that a lot on here. We start off posting:

 

"my spouse is the BIGGEST ASSHAT on the PLANET."

 

And than we go, "well maybe not the biggest..."

"actually, I kinda suck too...."

"okay okay part of this is on me and I have some work to do too."

"oh crap, my spouse has been addressing my complaint lately without me nagging him (today). I feel like kind of a jerk now, and now I have stuff to work on. Arg."

 

I guess I got too used to being 100% right with him.

 

Jeez, even when we do have issues, we are able to talk to each other friendly even joking in between tense conversation now. He even does repair gestures.

 

Omg, I feel like such an asshat.

 

Yes the infidelity reaction is 100% valid and I shouldn't settle for that being swept under. I don't think he would if we had MC. I am 99% sure of that. I just don't like how long it took and the fact I actually had to give a list. I kind if think he should've seen all of that stuff. IDK if that is fair or not. I mean I read tons of relationship books and now he's picking them up to read.

 

He even read a Mars & Venus fighting one and a couple others on sexual addiction. He doesn't read very fast. We read an infidelity one together but that was three years ago and his memory sucks (and he was still in active infidelity and/or porn addiction) so he obviously didn't take much away from it at the time.

 

Currently he's reading a Gottman.

 

Have you ever been mad at a mate and just not seen the efforts they are making because you are looking at the one or two things they aren't doing?

 

I feel like that's what this thread is.

 

I hope I'm not selling myself the Golden Gate here. This isn't stuff he's feeding me to say or anything. I just feel like I was so mad about MIL and MC and him bugging me about the computer (rightly or wrongly) that I missed the efforts he's been making to keep the old patterns broken.

 

He texts me consistently as to where he is etc. He texts me when I am in tests at school so I have a nice text to come out and see. He does make an effort for date day. I got really annoyed because we missed last week's when he was sick and he never talked about making it up to me. Arg. I mean that's 50/50.

 

Oh crap. I just feel bad now. I kinda knew something was up with my thread starter because I went from all of these years being dedicated to being patient and working through our shared history in a measured, reasonable way. And then I just felt so RESENTFUL that these things hadn't happened yet... And I hadn't really hit him with a list in over a year. Really he did the stuff on that list. My resent and anxiety just say: this is an emergency! Now!

 

But with all of the stuff we have been dealing with, there are like 6 emergencies, and maybe I should see the free IC and work out this food and computer thing.

 

He's doing the low-cost/free stuff on the list and I was a little surprised that he was willing to put the tax thing toward MC instead of adding it on for a better vehicle and house stuff. Or even his meds which aren't covered.

 

I know that my concern is valid and something that needs to be dealt with in our marriage. But I think I jumped the gun on D this time where I should've been more inclined to do that, oh, maybe three years ago....

 

 

 

 

 

Sorry to see you're having a rough time again DOT.

 

Your marriage seems to be on a wash, rinse, repeat cycle. My ex was nothing like yours but I can empathise with the sense of hope in your relationship which keeps getting dashed, and the feeling that you are the only one who is making any real effort.

 

My only advice is to imagine how you will feel in five years time if you are still in the same situation. That might help you to see what it is you really want.

 

It is sooo difficult to break out of a marriage that isn't working, all the more so when you have children but, realistically, how much longer can you go on washing, rinsing and repeating before the fabric completely disintegrates?

 

If I were you I would start focusing on just you and your child (children?) and making a good life without him. I know you love him but it doesn't seem as though he is making any positive changes and he is keeping you stuck in a place that isn't healthy or fun.

 

I do hope you find the strength and courage to move on. Otherwise you are going to find yourself looking back in 10 years and wondering where your precious life went.

[dreamingoftigers]

I see. Well good luck dot. I'd still put the financial issue to the MC and see what he says. I have worked before for an employer who regularly had clients in news but penurious and honestly it can't be uncommon. Point is he may be willing to be more flexible in your case where you've shown commitment and an established rapport. Not likely to do 1 session and disappear. If here was no possibility of even putting it on the table I suspect he would lose a lot of established clients.

 

Worth asking. Nothing ventured nothing gained.

 

I honestly don't feel right about doing that with this MC. As well he was really hard to get into.

 

He's honestly worth double what he's charging (although that would be double the recommended rate for his type of counseling).

 

Thanks MFH70.

[xxoo]

It's hard for me (and probably others) to understand your decision to go back to him at all after your relationship led to losing your daughter.

 

It doesn't have to be a matter of blame, or labeling. I see it as a dynamic between the two of you, bringing out the worst in each other instead of the best. The end result is, you two have a ton of problems fundamentally, historically and ongoing, without adequate resources to work on the marriage.

 

With your limited resources, and the knowledge that you both parent well alone, why not go that route and focus your limited resources on better investments? Why take money that could be used for safe transportation, education, your daughter, etc and dump it into this marriage?

[dreamingoftigers]

It's hard for me (and probably others) to understand your decision to go back to him at all after your relationship led to losing your daughter.

 

It doesn't have to be a matter of blame, or labeling. I see it as a dynamic between the two of you, bringing out the worst in each other instead of the best. The end result is, you two have a ton of problems fundamentally, historically and ongoing, without adequate resources to work on the marriage.

 

With your limited resources, and the knowledge that you both parent well alone, why not go that route and focus your limited resources on better investments? Why take money that could be used for safe transportation, education, your daughter, etc and dump it into this marriage?

 

I can see that people wouldn't understand why we would get back together after something like that. I knew that he was off and unregulated. I knew that. It took me years to truly decide to separate the behaviour from the person that reciprocated being loved and cherished when he was doing better. Every MC etc we went to said that there was a lot of hope etc. For our marriage despite the issues we faced because it was clear even through that we had a really strong friendship and regard for one another despite his unmanageable behaviours. None of them ever suggested calling it quits ever after T was gone. I listened mainly to that. I knew that we both had major FOO issues etc. And we both have been committed to working on them. It was just impossible with his addictions and behaviors. Like most addicts, he thought he could live in both world and that other people were the problem.

 

Without the addictions etc. The M is mostly how I want things yo be and he does too. We had a shared history long before this and it was worth fighting for. I would never allow my daughter to go through any kind of episode like that again. Or anything close to it.

 

But I also realize just how skewed one's perception can get from my Pre-therapy days. I know how much a person can change and I knew he could do it too. And he did. He did a lot of work. I didn't feel right denying him a second chance at a life with us and splitting up T from him. She asked about him EVERY visit until he could come. She is very very close with him and I think that not having her Dad around half the time would be MORE damaging than having the situation we currently have.

 

As well, my daughter has A TON of resources. Seriously, everything she could possibly want at get fingertips. She is the only grandchild on my side (as well as great-grandchild to my maternal grandmother and grandfather) (and jy aunt chips in a lot) and the only great-grandchild (H's mother died and he was her only) on the other. Her education is already covered. Health etc. Is already covered in Canada and she has so many toys and books that my house

is starting to look like an episode of Hoarders.

 

She has far more clothes etc than she needs up to Age 6! Already!

All of her winter stuff was even bought a year early. I have boxes and boxes of stuff that I have to organize and give away or sell. Arg. It's so time-consuming.

 

Even her bed sets are all givens. My mother's side was the same with me as a kid, whether or not my parents were even speaking to the rest of my family. They seriously give tons to kids. When she was in CPS, everyone from ONT. Offered to take custody of her. Even my crazy Uncle.

 

But they don't send kids across the country until it's a last resort. My daughter is really looked after. It is a blessing in a lot of ways and I dint refuse her from having relationships with my family as long as they are respectful etc. Around her and they really are. My parents kept me out of their conflict with their parents completely growing up, so we do the same.

 

I just feel the marital piece is the one thing missing from the whole dynamic. I don't see how we can even SEE without going to MC. The transportation DOES need to come first, no doubt. I can see that better now.

 

We are also really good supports for the other portions of our life, like school. He'll work around my schooling completely etc. And vice-versa. I just got REALLY sick tonight. Like unbelievable and he really stepped up to the plate changing out my puke bucket etc. And getting me distilled water and back rubs etc.

 

There isn't this boatload of tension going on day in and day out. I have been frustrated by how there aren't anymore changes without MC. The reason I would consider investing more into MC was because what did occur with our last MC in the last year DID pay out. There was an ROI.

 

A lot of our other expenses are covered right now as we attend school. This would probably be the optimal time to work on it. So much of our dynamic has changed in the last year. How we handle conflict etc has been radically different. I just got really sick of the anxiety I still have because not everything was addressed.

[dreamingoftigers]

It doesn't have to be a matter of blame, or labeling. I see it as a dynamic between the two of you, bringing out the worst in each other instead of the best. The end result is, you two have a ton of problems fundamentally, historically and ongoing, without adequate resources to work on the marriage.

 

This had been historically true AND the converse has been true historically as well.

 

I would say that the last year and a bit has shown more of the latter half that reflects in mine and his education. We also check each others parenting and encourage each other really well there. As well as more intimate stuff as of late.

 

The healthy eating dynamic isn't great IMO.

 

From where it was to where it has come... IDK. I don't want to just throw away everything after what we went through in putting it back together. But I don't want to live with anxiety either.

 

You really think it's just done? IDK. I've been really frustrated over the lady couple of weeks..... I think it would be pretty sucky for me and T to go through all of that again. Hmmm.

 

I would do it in two seconds flat if he relapsed, had a fling/online/cheating whatever, stopped working or going to school, blew up at us, hurt either or us at all, got verbally abusive, stole money, disappeared, started lying etc. I really would just put his suitcase in the garage and the rest of his stuff in storage that he can get himself.

 

I know we wouldn't be back together if I hadn't been there myself when I was younger. The completely narcissistic thinking. It was like black and white coming out of that.

 

There was/is a lot to work through. IDK if I have tried on myself as much as I should have either. IDK.

[dreamingoftigers]

Before I give any input, because there is a LOT here to digest and I want to think about it first, I have a question.

 

If the two of you were to decide to separate, would you not still need a functional and safe vehicle?

 

Yes, the vehicle is the priority.

 

I was pretty frustrated about M when I wrote my OP.

[dreamingoftigers]

Thank you for your post.

 

I've been on here for awhile. There are a lot of posters who recognize my story.

 

He's gotten treatment etc.

We didn't get back together solely and only for T. It made things faster in that regard though. I definitely see unfinished business which should have been dealt with before recon. But we didn't so here we are.

 

I have been reading a lot over the last four years and he has been reading some too.

 

I just have to think a bit more when I am feeling a little better.

 

I need that IC more than I thought.

 

No we dont know old story's you post here there are 100 s of story's coming in

so we dont keep a record of you.

 

and i did not read it all cause its to much.

 

but i see a lot of you complaining and being tired of this and that .

 

and that he is not really serious about all the issues especially his cheating?

 

you know at the end it takes 2 to go to tango.

you cant make a marriage work by yourself.

 

he need to be serious about the solution at least.

i think some one like this needs a shock treatment .

being soft etc, will not work with this one i think.

maybe the way you act makes him also think he can get away with it.

you need to think about the real reason you took him back and the real reason he is there. for the kids? thats not a good reason it have to be something between you and him!

 

you can read books, borrow books(Christian) at the library also

for some self help. talk to your pastor.

and pray to God for to guide you.

[xxoo]

I think there is an issue of relativity going on.

 

Relative to when he was active in his addictions, things are good!

 

But relative to a satisfying marriage, how are things, really?

 

This is sort of the "bread crumb" effect. When you are starving, any crumb seems really great. But you are still very hungry.

[dreamingoftigers]

I think there is an issue of relativity going on.

 

Relative to when he was active in his addictions, things are good!

 

But relative to a satisfying marriage, how are things, really?

 

This is sort of the "bread crumb" effect. When you are starving, any crumb seems really great. But you are still very hungry.

 

Where we currently are in terms of ideal marriage:

 

Short of the ideal, I am missing the disclosure from H which I want to happen in MC, about 25-35% more sex would be great! More help around the house. Not acting like I am "manipulating" him when I cry. I have to limit my computer usage and we both should be exercising and changing our diets more than we have. The dietary changes are in progress. I would like to see more leadership on the MC/infidelity/disclosure. Just more "come together" on the subject. Not a fear of being shamed about it, I guess.