fortyninethousand322 Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 I've done some hard thinking over the past few weeks and I've come to some conclusions. Agree or disagree, I'd like to hear some thoughts. 1. When women complain about how there aren't any "nice guys" it's really a complaint about how the guys they like or are interested in aren't nice. These women know (consciously or subconsciously) that there are plenty of "nice guys" out there but those guys are either unattractive or boring, perhaps both, or have some other negative trait that make them not interested. The problem seems to be that the men that aren't boring and are attractive are just not very "nice" or "pleasant", which is why these women complain. Now, I will be clear, not all women complain about not being able to find nice guys. Plenty of women (perhaps a majority, I don't know because I've never done a poll or a study on the subject) meet nice guys and know how to spot someone off kilter a mile away. And sometimes this is just young women making this complaint because they haven't matured enough to the point of being able to know what they want and what they don't want. Or perhaps most of the men their age aren't nice because they aren't mature enough yet. 2. Women shy away from inexperienced men: I'll be honest, they should shy away. The problem so far as I can tell is three fold. One is the worry that inexperienced guys will be bad at sex, either they won't last that long or they'll try to emulate every move they saw in porn. Another issue is the worry that he'll want to "sow his wild oats" and once he gets a girlfriend and other women start being interested in him he'll be tempted to either stray and cheat or he'll be tempted to break up and pursue other options. And finally, each relationship one has whether failed or successful, causes one to gain more experience and (hopefully) emotional maturity. You learn how to engage with someone as a romantic and personal partner, you learn how relationships work, how they can break down, how they can stay fresh, and how they aren't all roses and butterflies. As you get older, people start to look for more longer term relationships and marriage, the idea of having to "break someone in" for a while is just not an enticing proposition. It can be exhausting to some and just a turnoff for others. These days there are plenty of options in the prospects carousel so there's no need to go after fresh meat. When younger, I don't think this is much of a problem. But when you get into your mid twenties I think the issue just grows and grows. 3. There really are such things as "alpha" and "beta" personalities. I'm not sure if those are the right etymological terms, but I really do think that there are attractive personalities and unattractive personalities. If you're the guy (or gal) that people call up on a Friday or Saturday night when people want to do something, you have an attractive personality. If you're the one desperately calling or texting people because you don't want to be stuck at home, you probably have an unattractive personality. Likewise, if women feel at ease around you and like bantering or flirting with you and it flows easily, your personality is attractive. If you're fumbling for words and women seem kind of taken aback or nervous or looking around for an escape route (like another person to talk to or an "event" they have to urgently attend) you have an unattractive personality. My personal opinion is that this personality thing is largely fixed by nature rather than nurture. In other words I think your personality is largely something that you are inherently. You can learn to mimic more attractive personality types but ultimately it's very difficult to do this for a long time. Eventually the person you are inside will want to come out and will do so. Sorry for the length, and sorry if this sounds too morose or melancholy. But it's some thoughts that I figured I'd share. I'll add some more as I go along.
JuneJulySeptember Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 1. True 2. True 3. True Just figured those out, huh? They're all pretty obvious. 1
JuneJulySeptember Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 I'm not sure if those are the right etymological terms, but I really do think that there are attractive personalities and unattractive personalities. If you're the guy (or gal) that people call up on a Friday or Saturday night when people want to do something, you have an attractive personality. If you're the one desperately calling or texting people because you don't want to be stuck at home, you probably have an unattractive personality. Likewise, if women feel at ease around you and like bantering or flirting with you and it flows easily, your personality is attractive. If you're fumbling for words and women seem kind of taken aback or nervous or looking around for an escape route (like another person to talk to or an "event" they have to urgently attend) you have an unattractive personality. I have to say this is a really good observation. People love charisma. Not only is looks not very subjective, but neither is personality to a large extent. In romantic and non-romantic relationships. The thing is when people here say that men who suck with women need to get a social life, they don't realize that these guys are trying hard, but it's very hard for them.
jakelongot Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 What you wrote in your OP could apply to many women, but it probably doesn't apply to just as many women (if not more). Every person is unique and is looking for something completely different from the next. Way to broad of a generalization you are making and it will only prove to work against you if you truly believe this.
Author fortyninethousand322 Posted January 14, 2013 Author Posted January 14, 2013 I have to say this is a really good observation. People love charisma. Not only is looks not very subjective, but neither is personality to a large extent. In romantic and non-romantic relationships. The thing is when people here say that men who suck with women need to get a social life, they don't realize that these guys are trying hard, but it's very hard for them. Right. There's having a social life and then there's having a social life. Just being out and about and around women doesn't guarantee anything. For some guys all it guarantees is that you'll be around a bunch of single women who are completely unattracted to you. 1
Author fortyninethousand322 Posted January 14, 2013 Author Posted January 14, 2013 What you wrote in your OP could apply to many women, but it probably doesn't apply to just as many women (if not more). Every person is unique and is looking for something completely different from the next. Way to broad of a generalization you are making and it will only prove to work against you if you truly believe this. Well I tried to make it clear that I was talking about generalities not that every single person behaves this way. The women for whom points 1 and 2 are both false, are so rare as to be almost impossible to find and thus not worth mentioning, especially if one is looking for that type of woman while she's single.
AD1980 Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 Id tend to agree with most of what you wrote..I dont know if i beleive in the alpha beta stuff i think its more charisma or not having it and there are people that other people gratvitate to.. My friend is good looking and charismatic he somehow has people eating out of the palm of his hands and want to be around him and find him hillarious Me on the other hand im more laid back and even when i try to be interesting and start convos i sense people get bored easily and want to get out of the conversation lol
Green Light Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 My personal opinion is that this personality thing is largely fixed by nature rather than nurture. In other words I think your personality is largely something that you are inherently. You can learn to mimic more attractive personality types but ultimately it's very difficult to do this for a long time. Eventually the person you are inside will want to come out and will do so. Right now the whole society is screaming out for "Type A" personality types. Women certainly seem to overwhelmingly prefer this in men for the most part and the women themselves(at least online) seem to go to great lengths to at least appear as being this type as well(although I question how many of them actually are Type A). This is the age of the Type A! The problem is that leaves many(the majority) of the rest of us behind. I can mimic certain Type A traits but I will never be a Type A personality. I wasn't born that way. You had to be born with it, period!
jcrew11 Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 I think you have to ask yourself as a "Man" are you trying to attract "Many Women" or "One specific type of woman." If you are trying to "attract many women" at a bar or at any other social event, then you have to "become the center of attention with your personality." You have to become outgoing, friendly, approachable, talkative, and have interesting hobbies. If you are trying to "attract a specific type of wife or girlfriend" you don't have to be as outgoing, but you do have to be the "strong, capable man" that she wants. You don't want to be boring with boring hobbies. Take up some interesting hobbies that women like such as yoga, wine tasting, cooking, etc. and you will be able to maintain some level of interest or attraction.
ThaWholigan Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 This is one of those threads that reinforces negative beliefs so that people who identify with them can solidify those beliefs and continue to fail . I shouldn't laugh, but it's just funny. 4
lino Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 Your points are valid OP but not the be all, end all. Have you done absolutely everything possible to make yourself as physically attractive as you can? If not, do it. Also, I think I've read before that you aren't working or are but just casually and not earning much. If so, you need to do whatever possible to get a steady flow of disposable income. Like I've told another struggling guy on here repeatedly, you need a steady flow of disposable income to be appealing to a wide variety of women. This other member always conveniently avoids the subject. A guy without money is as appealing to women as a guy with aids. And most important of all DON'T BE A NICE/GOOD GUY!
KungFuJoe Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 Your points are valid OP but not the be all, end all. Have you done absolutely everything possible to make yourself as physically attractive as you can? If not, do it. Also, I think I've read before that you aren't working or are but just casually and not earning much. If so, you need to do whatever possible to get a steady flow of disposable income. Like I've told another struggling guy on here repeatedly, you need a steady flow of disposable income to be appealing to a wide variety of women. This other member always conveniently avoids the subject. A guy without money is as appealing to women as a guy with aids. And most important of all DON'T BE A NICE/GOOD GUY! Yeah! Don't be a good guy! BOO! HISS!!! Holy freakin christ. The next person on here that says, "Don't be a nice/good guy" is gonna get my virtual boot up their ass.
RichieBoy Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 I've often found from experiance, especially with the way some of my friends treat the girls that the saying "Treat them mean, keep them keen" is suprisingly powerful in that it does seem to get their attention if not at first, later ons i.e. Girl's boyfriend cheats on her, but she finds she still loves the guy despite it.
JuneJulySeptember Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 This is one of those threads that reinforces negative beliefs so that people who identify with them can solidify those beliefs and continue to fail . I shouldn't laugh, but it's just funny. I don't understand what's so negative about what he wrote. OP qualified the statements by saying he knew all women were not like that. Women do a lot of that stuff. You've never had a woman call you a nice guy, reject you and then complain she can't get guys? I have. Your points are valid OP but not the be all, end all. Have you done absolutely everything possible to make yourself as physically attractive as you can? If not, do it. Also, I think I've read before that you aren't working or are but just casually and not earning much. If so, you need to do whatever possible to get a steady flow of disposable income. Like I've told another struggling guy on here repeatedly, you need a steady flow of disposable income to be appealing to a wide variety of women. This other member always conveniently avoids the subject. A guy without money is as appealing to women as a guy with aids. And most important of all DON'T BE A NICE/GOOD GUY! The $ is very important. So is a place of your own, and unless you live in NYC/SF/Chicago, a car. I wouldn't go looking for a serious relationship unless I had all of those things. Funny thing is, I would be OK if a woman didn't have those things as long as she was trying to get them.
KungFuJoe Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 LOL. I got my gf and eventual wife when I was living with a roommate in my dad's condo paying 250 dollars a month in rent. I was making 38K a year (which isn't much in Orange County, CA) and I drove a 95 Acura Integra GS-R (LOVED that freakin car btw). This was back in 1999/2000, btw. I drove an '85 Toyota Corolla SR-5 before that. Paid 2 grand for it. It was a total hooptie. Let's just say I wore out the back seat of that car. Yeah...money matters!
JuneJulySeptember Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 LOL. I got my gf and eventual wife when I was living with a roommate in my dad's condo paying 250 dollars a month in rent. I was making 38K a year (which isn't much in Orange County, CA) and I drove a 95 Acura Integra GS-R (LOVED that freakin car btw). This was back in 1999/2000, btw. I drove an '85 Toyota Corolla SR-5 before that. Paid 2 grand for it. It was a total hooptie. Let's just say I wore out the back seat of that car. Yeah...money matters! Good for you? What do you want me to say buddy? Those are my experiences with women. I've been rejected all up and down over town having all those things. A job, a degree from a good school, and a decent paying job. Sure, I've gotten a few women, but the vast majority of the time it is rejection. And if you asked every woman that rejected me, she'd call me a good guy. Bet everything I have on it. Maybe you're taller and better looking? Who knows.
Author fortyninethousand322 Posted January 14, 2013 Author Posted January 14, 2013 Your points are valid OP but not the be all, end all. Have you done absolutely everything possible to make yourself as physically attractive as you can? If not, do it. Also, I think I've read before that you aren't working or are but just casually and not earning much. If so, you need to do whatever possible to get a steady flow of disposable income. Like I've told another struggling guy on here repeatedly, you need a steady flow of disposable income to be appealing to a wide variety of women. This other member always conveniently avoids the subject. A guy without money is as appealing to women as a guy with aids. And most important of all DON'T BE A NICE/GOOD GUY! I have a job. It just pays zero dollars a year. If it succeeds though it would be a tremendous career. That's just up in the air right now though. I'm at least a year (but probably 2-3 years) away from living on my own (at the earliest, it very well could be 5+ years). But, this isn't a thread about "how can 49322 get dates and attract women". This is a thread listing some things that I've learned and observed. In my experience what I've written here is true.
KungFuJoe Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 Good for you? What do you want me to say buddy? Those are my experiences with women. I've been rejected all up and down over town having all those things. A job, a degree from a good school, and a decent paying job. Sure, I've gotten a few women, but the vast majority of the time it is rejection. And if you asked every woman that rejected me, she'd call me a good guy. Bet everything I have on it. Maybe you're taller and better looking? Who knows. Those are YOUR experiences with women. And I have mine. Everyone has their own experiences. There are no rules when it comes to this kind of stuff. It might just be luck of the draw. Besides, you're saying you had money and you still couldn't find a girl...so you're proving that money isn't everything. A girl rejects you and calling you a good guy doesn't mean she doesn't like you BECAUSE you're a good guy! Sheesh...she's just being nice. If a girl ever told me (has never happened) that she didn't want to see me because I'm too nice, I would have laughed in her face and walked away. And never thought about it agian.
JuneJulySeptember Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 (edited) Those are YOUR experiences with women. And I have mine. Everyone has their own experiences. There are no rules when it comes to this kind of stuff. It might just be luck of the draw. Besides, you're saying you had money and you still couldn't find a girl...so you're proving that money isn't everything. A girl rejects you and calling you a good guy doesn't mean she doesn't like you BECAUSE you're a good guy! Sheesh...she's just being nice. If a girl ever told me (has never happened) that she didn't want to see me because I'm too nice, I would have laughed in her face and walked away. And never thought about it agian. Exactly. So why I am I a doucheb@g because I agree with OP's sentiments. They mirror my experiences, not necessarily yours. I should play the blind man and say that women don't care about things like looks, height, and money? They do. BTW, no woman ever said that to me when they rejected me. Well, they have, but they said it before too. Edited January 15, 2013 by JuneJulySeptember
KungFuJoe Posted January 15, 2013 Posted January 15, 2013 Exactly. So why I am I a doucheb@g because I agree with OP's sentiments. They mirror my experiences, not necessarily yours. I should play the blind man and say that women don't care about things like looks, height, and money? They do. BTW, no woman ever said that to me when they rejected me. Well, they have, but they said it before too. You should be the guy who isn't concerned about whether or not he is good enough for women. I never, not once, was concerned about if I was good enough. I was just concerned about finding a woman who was right for me.
JuneJulySeptember Posted January 15, 2013 Posted January 15, 2013 You should be the guy who isn't concerned about whether or not he is good enough for women. I never, not once, was concerned about if I was good enough. I was just concerned about finding a woman who was right for me. Ideally, yes. But that is not an easy thing to convince yourself of. Especially when you have faced a lot of rejection and have not been able to reject yourself too often. I'm pretty sure every man here who whines is aware of this.
TheZebra Posted January 15, 2013 Posted January 15, 2013 This is one of those threads that reinforces negative beliefs so that people who identify with them can solidify those beliefs and continue to fail . I shouldn't laugh, but it's just funny. Because it's easier to join a group of like-minded individuals and complain about lack of success than it is to try and change yourself and seek out success.
somedude81 Posted January 15, 2013 Posted January 15, 2013 You should be the guy who isn't concerned about whether or not he is good enough for women. I never, not once, was concerned about if I was good enough. I was just concerned about finding a woman who was right for me. Perhaps you're that way because you never struggled with women?
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