edgygirl Posted January 13, 2013 Posted January 13, 2013 So one of my best girlfriends, 34 yo, super frustrated about dating for more than a year now and not being able to find someone who is commitment driven, went away for the Holidays and met this 26 yo guy in MX through a friend. He dropped out of med school and became a hair dresser, but has no degree for it. After 5 days she decides she wants to marry him and bring him to live in her city where she will have to pay for everything for at least 2 years as he has no degree and she knows he won't be able to get a decent job in one of the main metropolis. She's in the other hand is quite established in her career, paying expensive mortgage by herself etc. In my opinion this all seems like a train wreck waiting to happen. She's prone for going for wrong relationships that always end bad. I've told her my opinion in the last two ones and I was right about both although she didn't hear me back then. I know we all have to make our own mistakes but I think it's fair to give her my opinion. I did while she was talking about him today. She didn't like it and said I offended her for the first time since we started our friendship 10 years ago. Isn't it the duty of friends to tell the truth? I said she isn't seeing the big picture, and she isn't. I explained why. But I said I'm happy she's happy anyway. But I think our friendship is over. Should I have just pretended all is great and shut up? Not sure if I could as I really care for her. Are we supposed to keep bad things to ourselves?
MrCastle Posted January 13, 2013 Posted January 13, 2013 May I ask a question? It seems like a big reason you think this isn't a good fit is because she's established and making money, and he's not. Would you be more comfortable if the roles were reversed and he was established/making money and she was the hair dresser? Just a question. 2
todreaminblue Posted January 13, 2013 Posted January 13, 2013 So one of my best girlfriends, 34 yo, super frustrated about dating for more than a year now and not being able to find someone who is commitment driven, went away for the Holidays and met this 26 yo guy in MX through a friend. He dropped out of med school and became a hair dresser, but has no degree for it. After 5 days she decides she wants to marry him and bring him to live in her city where she will have to pay for everything for at least 2 years as he has no degree and she knows he won't be able to get a decent job in one of the main metropolis. She's in the other hand is quite established in her career, paying expensive mortgage by herself etc. In my opinion this all seems like a train wreck waiting to happen. She's prone for going for wrong relationships that always end bad. I've told her my opinion in the last two ones and I was right about both although she didn't hear me back then. I know we all have to make our own mistakes but I think it's fair to give her my opinion. I did while she was talking about him today. She didn't like it and said I offended her for the first time since we started our friendship 10 years ago. Isn't it the duty of friends to tell the truth? I said she isn't seeing the big picture, and she isn't. I explained why. But I said I'm happy she's happy anyway. But I think our friendship is over. Should I have just pretended all is great and shut up? Not sure if I could as I really care for her. Are we supposed to keep bad things to ourselves? No you shouldn't keep bad things to yourself, but, you have a heart to heart about why you feel this person is bad for her, and then you accept her right to make her own choices on who she is with, as she just may know him a little better than you......and if it fails, like the other two relationships....you be that friend that supports her then too.....no i told you so, no you should have listened...just be there, she will feel bad enough already you just then need to be that decade long friend......you have to trust her judgments....your her friend...she chose right then didn't she, so her taste is not all bad..., she may have made the right choice with her new guy too ...you just dont see it yet..friends to the end...good or bad choices....good or bad relationships ...through success and failures..friends exist through it all...the sign of a true friend.............i am sure you exist through it all, because you bothered to post this thread in the first place.......deb
Author edgygirl Posted January 13, 2013 Author Posted January 13, 2013 MrCastle - Haha I knew this was coming up and I was going to put it in my original thread. Well as this is not what is going on, I think my opinion on this is irrelevant. I just think 5 days is a little early to decide on getting married to someone, specially with the other facts involved. 1
carhill Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 She's prone for going for wrong relationships that always end bad. I've told her my opinion in the last two ones and I was right about both although she didn't hear me back then. At some point it became her style. I'd focus on the other aspects of the friendship and limit 'bitch' sessions if/when things go sideways. Being a friend doesn't require persistent validation of unhealthy behaviors, whether overtly with proactive support or covertly by being a 'sounding board' or 'tampon'. As your opinion is known and she feels offended, leave it at that. IMO, this is a V-day romance and will blow up soon enough. Nothing wrong with that. People do it all the time. If they do get married, attend the wedding and eat some crow....er chicken 1
TheZebra Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 May I ask a question? It seems like a big reason you think this isn't a good fit is because she's established and making money, and he's not. Would you be more comfortable if the roles were reversed and he was established/making money and she was the hair dresser? Just a question. If I had to guess, I'd say edgygirl is 1. worried that the guy is mooching on her friend and 2. dating someone who doesn't have similar values, since obv her friend is established and focused and this guy is not. At least, those are the things that came to mind as I was reading it. I have a similar problem in that my best friend is too desperate when it comes to men and will literally date the first guy that asks her out. Her current boyfriend is super possessive... she has to text him when she's alone with another guy friend, he gets upset at what she wears, etc. I've tried telling her not to put up with that, but she makes excuses. For the 10 years we've been friends, she always makes excuses for all of her ex boyfriend's bad behaviors. I just stopped telling her. She won't listen, and I don't want to feel like I'm bugging her. 1
Author edgygirl Posted January 14, 2013 Author Posted January 14, 2013 @todreaminblue: yes she did say she has the choice to make her decisions etc. but I feel she's being blindsided by despair and frustration. It's hard to trust a judgement of someone who meets someone (in an alcoholic stupor by the way) and then decides she's going to marry him after 5 days and goes to meet his family... Thing is I've dated younger (around the same difference) and although I know sometimes it works, I know in this age bracket they probably are in different phases of their lives. @carhill: I am not sure we are going to be talking anymore tbh. I'm going abroad on the weekend and she said: good trip as in I don't intend to talk with you again I also think it will blow up soon... I'm flabbergasted she can't see it. @TheZebra: these are exactly the things I'm worried about. Plus I think the maturity level might be very different too, he hasn't experienced many things in life by what she told me. Plus even she recognized that people in the US might have prejudice with him being Mexican and having no degree while trying to find a job when he moves here. Same here: "For the 10 years we've been friends, she always makes excuses for all of her ex boyfriend's bad behaviors." Did you stop telling her how you feel? I'm not sure I did the right thing though. Maybe I should have just pretended and encouraged her?... I know it's hard for me to pretend though :/ I understand she may want to cut the relationship with me as she doesn't want to listen to my points and keep living in the fairy tale, she just wants to be happy, etc.
Ninjainpajamas Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 This woman seems extremely vulnerable and desperate for a relationship and she's going to pursue that as intently as possible. As her friend, it's likely she is NOT going to take any of your objective advice and apply it...the best thing you could do is listen or hear her out first, instead of riding her off in 5 days, and then making subtle suggestions but the thing is she has her mind made up (for now)...she isn't going to want to listen to anyone who objects on this decision and in your situation she will just view you as being not being supportive. She's already in that emotional phase, and it's very hard to get through to women in that...I've practiced for a very long time talking to women in that state and I've definitely learned a lot, but you can't get through to anyone and many people are stubborn and have got to go down with the ship. Find out her plans, when and how she is determining to pull this whole thing off...luckily in that time she'll start to be more realistic, but this doesn't seem like a thing that's going to happen over night (hopefully) so let her sit on this for while...try to be present if she allows you and just gracefully try to steer her in the right direction by asking tough questions, they may not blossom right away but if you plant the seed she might not have any choice at some point to consider the reality and abandon this course of action. Otherwise if she's willing to go this far for it then she's just going to have to learn the hard way...this is extremely incompetent and naive decision, and she deep inside knows that...it's ultimately her life and her decision though...but I think you'll have some opportunities to influence her if you can stay close to her and be her outlet, many times you have to help people see their mistakes using their own methods, you can't just force your will upon them. 1
Author edgygirl Posted January 14, 2013 Author Posted January 14, 2013 MrCastle - Haha I knew this was coming up and I was going to put it in my original thread. Well as this is not what is going on, I think my opinion on this is irrelevant. I just think 5 days is a little early to decide on getting married to someone, specially with the other facts involved. ps: Just want to point out that that's the main reason I didn't want to settle in my 20s. I wanted to be able to have my life together BEFORE settling with a guy who would pay for my life. So, no, in theory I think the reverse role would also not be ideal. My sister did it in her 20s but fortunately for her they are happy together up to this day. But they are one of the two couples I know from their generation who are still happily married.
Author edgygirl Posted January 14, 2013 Author Posted January 14, 2013 Thanks ninja, you are usually right on spot! I am waiting for that book you're going to publish on relationships and men view on dating! I believe she's having him move here in the Summer. And he's also coming to stay here for 2 weeks in Feb or March. Something tells me I won't be invited hehe. She asked me why I can't just be supportive and happy for her? I think I tried to be supportive asking tough questions today and that's why she got so offended. But you're right, I'll let her marinate on what I said. Not sure I'll have the opportunity to influence her, I think she'll just cut me off so she doesn't have to hear the truth, or at least what I view as the big picture here. Funny thing is I told her about LS, I wish she had joined and came here to tell this story, I am sure you guys would put some sense in her. Yes I guess you're right she's going to have to learn by herself, if we could infuse sense in people no one would be hurting in the world...
Ruby Slippers Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 I agree that the best thing you can do is be honest with her, but stand by her when this thing falls apart. People do have to make their own mistakes and have their own experiences to learn things, no matter how disastrous those events may sometimes be. Experience is the greatest teacher. I myself have learned a lot from the dumbest things I've done. And I have one friend in particular who has some self-sabotaging tendencies. But I realize those have nothing to do with me, and I stand by her through it all. I think that's what a real friendship is - accepting people as they are, even when they're being unwise, and gently encouraging them to grow. 2
Imajerk17 Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 (edited) What's really happening: I betcha the sex is just really, *really*, that good.... Edited January 14, 2013 by Imajerk17 1
Woggle Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 The big issue is how can she know this guy is future husband material after meeting him over the holidays. It must been only a few weeks. 1
charlietheginger Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 Really successful women mid 30s often end up With younger guys . Why u ask? Becuase most Mid 30s men date mid 20s females. The guy is single No kids and available. Most guys her age are taken Or have kids. Plus to top it off not all successful men Date successful women. Guys that are very successful Have no need for a successful women all they want is A hot women they make enough to support a stay At home mom.
xxoo Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 She's a big girl. She can make her own decisions, and her own mistakes. Unless she is putting herself in danger, just hedge with a, "Sounds exciting!" It does sound exciting! You can add small truisms like "time will tell :)" If you don't get it, that's ok to admit, too. "I don't really get it, but I can tell you are really excited. I wish I could meet someone who lit me up like that, too."
Author edgygirl Posted January 14, 2013 Author Posted January 14, 2013 Ruby: I'm afraid I was too honest and therefore not a good friend, that she feels I can't support her decision making and judgement. She implied she knew I'd be the one friend who'd be cynical about it... I call it realistic, lol. Sometimes I feel friends prefer to lie and be in good terms with someone than say the truth and try to show people you love when something is off. If she's open to it, I'll certainly be there if she needs me. Imajerk: she did mention that, lol. Woggle: exactly... She said that phrase "when you know, you know". Hmm I do believe in love at first sight in a way... but talking about moving and marriage after 10 days together is waaay to much! 1
TheZebra Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 Did you stop telling her how you feel? Yup. There's no point. She just denies everything.
Woggle Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 You have to realize that some people will just do what they want to and no amount of talking to them will change that. Your only choice is to let her be.
Author edgygirl Posted January 14, 2013 Author Posted January 14, 2013 She's a big girl. She can make her own decisions, and her own mistakes. Unless she is putting herself in danger, just hedge with a, "Sounds exciting!" It does sound exciting! You can add small truisms like "time will tell :)" If you don't get it, that's ok to admit, too. "I don't really get it, but I can tell you are really excited. I wish I could meet someone who lit me up like that, too." Yes maybe that's what I should have done the problem is I do get it as I've been there. I wasted 2 precious years of my life with a younger guy at her age... (1 just recovering from the mess). Honestly I know how it ends... Guys that age change their mind often or can't commit at that age, and I don't want her to get to my age lonely because of her stupid choices. Now is the time for her to be looking for someone who matches her maturity, values and goals in life. She claims he wants to marry her and has the same goals. Oh well. Thing is this kit shows how people can get desperate after dating and dating and not finding someone to commit to.
Ruby Slippers Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 Ruby: I'm afraid I was too honest and therefore not a good friend, that she feels I can't support her decision making and judgement. She implied she knew I'd be the one friend who'd be cynical about it... I call it realistic, lol. Sometimes I feel friends prefer to lie and be in good terms with someone than say the truth and try to show people you love when something is off. If she's open to it, I'll certainly be there if she needs me. I believe in being 100% honest with people, and I practice it. You can be honest without being rude or mean. If my friends ask, I tell them when I think they're making a bad decision. But as long as that decision doesn't drag me down, it's really not my concern. We all do stupid things sometimes. Maybe your lone voice of reason will be a good influence. It's a good thing at least one of her friends is brave enough to be straight with her. 1
Author edgygirl Posted January 14, 2013 Author Posted January 14, 2013 Yes you guys are right. Ill just let her be. I wish I knew how to be more supportive. But please you guys, do tell ME when I come here trying to make it work with someone who is clearly a wrong choice for me! 1
Author edgygirl Posted January 14, 2013 Author Posted January 14, 2013 Maybe your lone voice of reason will be a good influence. It's a good thing at least one of her friends is brave enough to be straight with her. Thank you for your kind words I do have to practice talking more diplomatically though. You're a great inspiration for it actually - you're straight to the point but candid at the same time. Maybe I'll learn sometime! She did say though that she knows it's coming from a good place in my heart and that I care for her.
xxoo Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 The thing is, she's not you, and this guy isn't your ex. It may end up as you imagine, but it may not. There is a way to express concern while acknowledging the independence and the experience of the other person. Use I statements like, "I'm a little concerned because......" But sandwich it with confidence in your friend: "I know you'll see the signs if they arise." 1
Author edgygirl Posted January 14, 2013 Author Posted January 14, 2013 xxoo - Yes you're right. But you know after a while on LS, you can kind of tell the difference from seeing others' threads? It's like reading a script and telling if its a train wreck. I do hope it works though and I'm proven wrong. I'll take your sandwich approach - I wish I had come here before for advice about it before talking with her today. 1
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