Confused48 Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 This is intended to be a discussion of the character of the marriage as a factor in the affair, not the character of the individuals. This different than the thread "can a BS cause a WS to cheat." That was discussed thoroughly. The intent here is simply to see what opinions are out there about a good marriage and infidelity. Are all BS automatically to be labeled as having been in a bad marriage just b/c they are a BS? Obviously after one party cheats then the marriage becomes a bad or even a dead marriage, regardless of what it was before. But can good moral people, in good marriages, become cheaters? Or are those kinds of marriages affair proof?
JamesM Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 But can good moral people, in good marriages, become cheaters? Yes. Anyone can be weak in the wrong situation. And even if in a good marriage, there can be outside circumstances that set up a person to cheat. Plus there are plenty of people who want to cheat despite a good marriage. Or are those kinds of marriages affair proof? No. Two people make up a marriage. Both can make sinful/bad choices. A good marriage does not necessitate good people. This of course begs the question...is an affair in a good marriage the exception to most affairs? I would say yes. 3
Decorative Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 There is no affair proof marriage. It's like a unicorn, the myth of an affair proof marriage. The right combination of issues- and down the slope any marriage can go. My marriage was happy. My spouse cheated. You could push him up against wall - even in the fog post DDAy- and he never ever has blamed the marriage. http://psychologytoday.com/articles/200910/beyond-betrayal-life-after-infidelity ( last reviewed and updated November, 2012) Another good resource for this is Shirley Glass and her book Not Just Friends. In a lot of affair situations - the marriage was happy, and the wayward spouse was the one giving less to the relationship. It's called being overbenefitted. http://www.shirleyglass.com/psychologytoday.htm 2
jwi71 Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 This is intended to be a discussion of the character of the marriage as a factor in the affair, not the character of the individuals. I'm not sure this is a sustainable premise. I cannot see how one can separate the character of the M from the participants as the participants character individually, now joined in M, define the character of the M. The M has no character. The individuals do The intent here is simply to see what opinions are out there about a good marriage and infidelity. Are all BS automatically to be labeled as having been in a bad marriage just b/c they are a BS? The M itself is NOT an entity but rather the perceptions of those in and around the individuals comprising the M. Does the M appear good to the BS and outsiders? In the context of the pretexts you set forth it does. The relationship between BS and WS appears good and is good. However, the WS has some needs that are met outside the confines of M. To this actor the WS, the M is not good in as much as it lacks something needed. So...is the M itself good? Depends on your role, knowledge of events and thusly perception. As such, one cannot isolate "the M" from the participants. And no one is above all temptation so no individual nor the M they are party to is without risk.
NotCamelot Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 The saying: Good people do bad things. I think that applies here as well. Sometimes, in the heat of the moment, emotion takes over and bad choices are made. And this inclueds people who never thought they could. I think that, yes, even in the best marriage, it is possible for a person to cheat. But I think that is these cases it is a "heat of the moment" thing......not a calculated EA to PA type of thing. 1
Ninja'sHusband Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 My WW and her MM both claimed they had good marriages at first. The more we went to counseling, the more my wife changed her mind. Funny thing is when I discovered chats between MM and WW, she had been saying all kinds of untrue negative things about me during the A. For me, it's hard to say "Good marriage" vs "Bad marriage". It depends on the glasses you put on. I was generally happy. With my ex, it depended on when you asked her I guess. 1
Spark1111 Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 Yes. I was in a good marriage. He had issues we weathered together. I thought we came out fine. He felt less than as a man, a provider, but never voiced it to me. At a new job he crashed into her. She didn't know of his past 7 years. She was very impressed with him. He fueled that. He needed that. The more impressed she was with him, the more fault he began to find with me and the marriage. I asked him to go to counseling with me, but he refused. I went alone. The marriage slowly deteriorated after the EA began, and was really bad when the PA began, but when asked repeatedly if anything was wrong, he said " nothing." I and the kids chalked it up to the stress of a new-powered position after so many years of illness, medication and sporadic employment. There was NOTHING we wouldn't do to support him in his career if it would just make him happy. I was working three jobs so he could save more of his income to grow his business financially. We wouldn't discover her existence for almost 2 years. If you spoke to 200 people who know us personally, I don't think you could have found one, pre-affair, who did not think we were one of the lucky ones in that we really loved each other and we really liked each other. Yes! Affairs can happen in good marriages. Just ask Mr. Spark. 3
Betrayed&Stayed Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 For me' date=' it's hard to say "Good marriage" vs "Bad marriage". It depends on the glasses you put on. I was generally happy. With my ex, it depended on when you asked her I guess.[/quote'] That is my hang up on the term "good marriage". It's an oversimplified description to sum up something as complex and dynamic as marriage. Even the strongest marriages have flaws and cracks. I put our marriage into the "good marriage" category because that is how I viewed it at the time of the affair. Prior to meeting OM, my wife viewed our marriage as "still on the honeymoon." Yet, once the EA began she started to question our marriage. I became less of a husband. All of the minor quirks in our marriage became deal breakers. What were once my strengths became flaws and areas of annoyance. Those flaws and cracks in our marriage were exaggerated to justify the PA. If the marriage is in reality so "bad", then seek a divorce. 6
Author Confused48 Posted January 13, 2013 Author Posted January 13, 2013 Yes. I was in a good marriage. He had issues we weathered together. I thought we came out fine. If you spoke to 200 people who know us personally, I don't think you could have found one, pre-affair, who did not think we were one of the lucky ones in that we really loved each other and we really liked each other. Yes! Affairs can happen in good marriages. Just ask Mr. Spark. I wish I could say I was surprised.
Author Confused48 Posted January 13, 2013 Author Posted January 13, 2013 The saying: Good people do bad things. I think that applies here as well. Sometimes, in the heat of the moment, emotion takes over and bad choices are made. And this inclueds people who never thought they could. I think that, yes, even in the best marriage, it is possible for a person to cheat. But I think that is these cases it is a "heat of the moment" thing......not a calculated EA to PA type of thing. But in the heat of the moment, one could start an EA, right? Not intending a PA. Not intending even an EA the next day. Then one thing leads to another and bam! Your life and everyones you know is changed forever. But you were in a good marriage just seconds before. Or not. Anyone want to say not?
Realist3 Posted January 13, 2013 Posted January 13, 2013 But in the heat of the moment, one could start an EA, right? Not intending a PA. Not intending even an EA the next day. Then one thing leads to another and bam! Your life and everyones you know is changed forever. But you were in a good marriage just seconds before. Yep. That is certainly a way it can happen.
Spark1111 Posted January 13, 2013 Posted January 13, 2013 But in the heat of the moment, one could start an EA, right? Not intending a PA. Not intending even an EA the next day. Then one thing leads to another and bam! Your life and everyones you know is changed forever. But you were in a good marriage just seconds before. Or not. Anyone want to say not? So is that the fault of the marriage or of the spouse who begins to fuel an attraction to another? because all marriages have ups, downs, arguments. there are NO perfect marriages or relationships. 2
CantgetoveritNY Posted January 13, 2013 Posted January 13, 2013 So is that the fault of the marriage or of the spouse who begins to fuel an attraction to another? because all marriages have ups, downs, arguments. there are NO perfect marriages or relationships. No, not the 'fault' of the marriage. The point of this thread is to see what people think about perfect marriages. Or best case scenario marriages. Where the marriage itself can not be "at fault". If there is such a marriage, can there be a way for cheating to intrude? Can a spouse in such a marriage be tempted to "fuel an attraction to another?" Despite being in an ideal relationship.
Spark1111 Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 No, not the 'fault' of the marriage. The point of this thread is to see what people think about perfect marriages. Or best case scenario marriages. Where the marriage itself can not be "at fault". If there is such a marriage, can there be a way for cheating to intrude? Can a spouse in such a marriage be tempted to "fuel an attraction to another?" Despite being in an ideal relationship. And I think when it does happen, we are dealing with the disordered, the depressed, those broken by life circumstances....and it has nothing to do withe the spouse. it has to do with what is damaged and broken within the cheater, that hey have never expressed because they do not know how to express it, or fear expressing it. yes, affairs can happen in good marriages.
Author Confused48 Posted January 14, 2013 Author Posted January 14, 2013 And I think when it does happen, we are dealing with the disordered, the depressed, those broken by life circumstances....and it has nothing to do withe the spouse. it has to do with what is damaged and broken within the cheater, that hey have never expressed because they do not know how to express it, or fear expressing it. yes, affairs can happen in good marriages. You say yes, affairs can happen in good marriages but everything else above describes an impossibly bad relationship. With such a damaged partner how could it be a good marriage.
Spark1111 Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 You say yes, affairs can happen in good marriages but everything else above describes an impossibly bad relationship. With such a damaged partner how could it be a good marriage. There is no perfect person and no perfect relationship. No one runs around perpetually happy in a long-term relationship without having to experience moments of grief, sadness, or disappointment, and usually, with a supportive partner and honest communication, the low times are worked through. But some people do not cope as well as others when life starts throwing curve balls at them. One partner may then give more while one gives less to the relationship. One may suggest counseling, one may refuse.
NotCamelot Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 (edited) I think in a lot of situations, like it was in mine, LIFE gets in the way. We become so busy with focusing attention on the life going on around us that we tend to neglect life inside our own house. People become comfortable with the status quo and wrongly assume that all will remain good when, in fact, if left unattended, things start to decay. Even the finest things need maintainence. You can't buy a Lamborghini, drive it every day, then never give it any loving care. It WILL break. Marriages are the same way. If people would take a a little time out of every day to let the partner know they are loved and appreciated, a lot of the affairs would never happen. NEVER take your spouse nor your marriage for granted. If you do, you are in for heartache. Edited January 14, 2013 by NotCamelot 1
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