somedude81 Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 It happens to men, too. Men may initiate flirting, but for a lot of men that is just a fun, natural way to interact with women in their environment. They do it without expectation, with women of all levels of attractiveness. So then what is the "when you least expect it part?" I'd say in the majority of cases, the man makes a move when he gets signals of interest from the woman. Meh, waiting for an indicator of interest is stupid. Most guys are better off talking to a whole bunch of women and seeing who bites.
truth_seeker Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 So much wrong with what you just said. Because some girl looks happy on her facebook you Think she has never had problems? And there is nothing wrong with being single. Exactly. Don't believe everything you see online. Do you think people are going to post horrible pictures of themselves or write depressing things and post them on their page? Facebook for some is an outlet for insecurity and attention.
JuneJulySeptember Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 I'd say in the majority of cases, the man makes a move when he gets signals of interest from the woman. That is true, but some men get no signals, so they start to imagine them. I went skiing a while ago and every cute teenage and college girl was giving me the come hither smile! Haha. Yea right. Not!
truth_seeker Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 I think one problem for singles are unrealistic expectations. I've met women who expect this, and feel entitled to that. Yet they do not look at themselves as the problem. They continually meet bad guys or losers. Maybe this could be the case, but every guy they meet are no good? I'm no angel but at least I admit my faults and know you got to step up to the plate and take your cuts. Some you'll hit, some you'll miss. Such is life. 1
Lonely Ronin Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 I'd say in the majority of cases, the man makes a move when he gets signals of interest from the woman. This has worked for me since I was 17. 1
xxoo Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 So then what is the "when you least expect it part?". Because they do it without expecting anything. They are just being themselves, focusing on work, and being social. They can be surprised when a pretty coworker starts hanging around more and more often.
Mme. Chaucer Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 You're only seeing it from the feminine view point where things just happen to you. It's passive. Ha! I don't mean this as an insult, but I am so much less passive than you are in the way I live my life. I am a person of action. Even though I am a woman. You, on the other hand, spend a great deal of time waiting for something to happen. It's passive.
Mme. Chaucer Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 Meh, waiting for an indicator of interest is stupid. Are you aware of how offensive it is when you say something is "stupid" that another poster has written? Most guys are better off talking to a whole bunch of women and seeing who bites. Whatever's working for you, dude. But that doesn't make other approaches "stupid."
somedude81 Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 This has worked for me since I was 17. And it hasn't ever worked for me. Are you aware of how offensive it is when you say something is "stupid" that another poster has written? Whatever's working for you, dude. But that doesn't make other approaches "stupid." I wasn't saying anything bad at all about iris nor did I even disagree with her. Also if you noticed, she didn't give any advice, she just made a statement. I said it's stupid for men to wait for signals of interest before they talk to a woman. Many men never get signals, so they can either keep waiting till they get one, or try to take action into their own hands. Personally, if I just waited for signals from women, I might as well become a eunuch.
SJC2008 Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 I don't know what I did to deserve the single life but I'll be happy to rant given the thread! Didn't have a GF until my 1st year out of HS, I was 17. I was too shy and got dumped:( The bad thing was she drug me through the mud at work. She said things like 'I wasn't really attracted to him', 'You can have him'. It destroyed me! Why was she so mean? It took a LONG time to get over it. I think I subconsciously shut down after that and didn't really try. I was happy though and not having a GF didn't bother me until 22-23. Around that time I met a chick when hanging out with some friends and we set up a date and she stood me up! She was all over me too when we were hanging out and I thought she was interested. Funny thing was I wasn't all to attracted to her but I figured I'd give it a shot. Anyway after that I pretty much gave up again in the back of my mind. At about 24 I met some chick at a bar and she liked me a lot! I talked to her for a bit but ended up rejecting her. I think I was too guarded to face more rejection:( It would of been the perfect opportunity because we were both shy. Anyway, I didn't think about it too much until about the age of 29 and ever since then it's all I think about. I'm to the point where a bad relationship would be better than nothing. It sounds crazy but people need companionship but I may be to broken by now. I wonder why I was robbed of this aspect of life? Sex is a normal everyday part of life for most people but not mine! 1
El Brujo Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 Ok just thinking mostly everyone on here has some type of relationship issue, what did we do to deserve such a horrible tough time in dating? Like I was on this girls fb and she is 25 married to a super hot marine and has 2 small kids... How did we get so effed over? I mean I'm sure we don't deserve this alone single loneliness you know? Just thinking... It's my fault, for being born 1. male 2. on this planet. BTW let's not turn "deserve" into a loaded word, ok?
Malia25 Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 I'm a guy and sit alone at restaurants all the time, and I don't think people think I'm jut that weird loser loner guy, but then again... I'm not sure, but if you're a woman sitting alone depending on the place may attract male attention as you may look more approachable. This is true OP. I go out and each lunch alone all the time. I love the ME time! But I'm also well aware that it puts me in an interesting position. Guys DO notice you more when you are alone and you are definitely more easily approachable because of it. I like to be aware of my surroundings, so I definitely notice I get more attention (if any) when I am dining alone. You should try it. It's freakin' liberating. Seriously. (Eating out alone, I mean)!
charlietheginger Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 I don't know what I did to deserve the single life but I'll be happy to rant given the thread! Didn't have a GF until my 1st year out of HS, I was 17. I was too shy and got dumped:( The bad thing was she drug me through the mud at work. She said things like 'I wasn't really attracted to him', 'You can have him'. It destroyed me! Why was she so mean? It took a LONG time to get over it. I think I subconsciously shut down after that and didn't really try. I was happy though and not having a GF didn't bother me until 22-23. Around that time I met a chickI when hanging out with some friends and we set up a date and she stood me up! She was all over me too when we were hanging out and I thought she was interested. Funny thing was I wasn't all to attracted to her but I figured I'd give it a shot. Anyway after that I pretty much gave up again in the back of my mind. At about 24 I met some chick at a bar and she liked me a lot! I talked to her for a bit but ended up rejecting her. I think I was too guarded to face more rejection:( It would of been the perfect opportunity because we were both shy. Anyway, I didn't think about it too much until about the age of 29 and ever since then it's all I think about. I'm to the point where a bad relationship would be better than nothing. It sounds crazy but people need companionship but I may be to broken by now. I wonder why I was robbed of this aspect of life? Sex is a normal everyday part of life for most people but not mine! No sir you dont want a bad relationship . Also sex is not a normal everyday thing couples do Most couples have sex alot the first 3 months then it drops off. After a yr most married couples surveys show sex 2 Times a week is average. couples married 10yrs surveys Show sex 1 times a week to 1 time a month
Malia25 Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 There are days where I ponder why my ex (who I was in love with for 5 years) told me he could not picture me as his wife, is now with a girl fresh out of high school nearly 10 years our junior. She is marriage material, I suppose. There are also days where I wonder why the guy I was recently dating, who didn't want to move too fast, has now moved in with his gf of only 2 months. I wonder what these other girls had that I don't. It boggles my mind. Sure, I'm upset and I think that I deserve the happiness they now have. After all, I gave my all to them...and now I am left with nothing to show for it. It upsets me - greatly, at times. But that's life. And life can drain us dry sometimes, leaving our once excited beating heart almost stagnant. Life. It's a funny bugger. What am I getting at? I guess what I'm trying to say is that you can't let your past experiences dictate your future ones. If the last one didnt work out, try again (even though it's tough). You didn't get "effed over" - you got a lesson. You need to free yourself of that negative mindset and you might just see the light! I know, being single sucks, especially when you see others around you so happy. You and I, we don't deserve happiness. We want it. Another thing you need to do is tell yourself that you are amazing (even if you don't believe it). When a relationship doesn't work out for me, I feel bad for the guy because he lost out on someone amazing - and I will never think less of myself in that sense. You should do the same.
SJC2008 Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) No sir you dont want a bad relationship . Also sex is not a normal everyday thing couples do Most couples have sex alot the first 3 months then it drops off. After a yr most married couples surveys show sex 2 Times a week is average. couples married 10yrs surveys Show sex 1 times a week to 1 time a month I think you're taking what I said about normal everyday thing out of context. I wouldn't expect it everyday lol I'd be happy with 2-3 times a month. Having only been laid twice in 31 years those once a month married couples have me beat! The main thing that hurt me was not having a social group with women in it, being busy with work and school and being too shy. Well I've almost got the shy thing nipped in the bud so to speak. I'll be done with school pretty soon so I'm gonna get a job and get my own place and we'll see what happens! I don't know if I'll ever try online again but it seems like my only option. One thing that really bothers me is to see people I've met that have had R's. One was so bitter it wasn't funny! She had a boyfriend. The last one I dated was a control freak and she had a LONG R! When you can't get a good or bad relationship it really makes you feel like an ogre:( Edited January 11, 2013 by SJC2008 Add
KungFuJoe Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 No sir you dont want a bad relationship . Also sex is not a normal everyday thing couples do Most couples have sex alot the first 3 months then it drops off. After a yr most married couples surveys show sex 2 Times a week is average. couples married 10yrs surveys Show sex 1 times a week to 1 time a month Yeah, I've read those same surveys. Insane and so glad it doesn't apply to my marriage. 10 years so far and we have sex multiple times a day. Though spread out over a week or so it probably averages out to once a day if you count the missed day here and there from being busy with our kids, etc. I'm sorry...but once a week? No way in hell...I would go nuts. 2
Necris Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 I'd say in the majority of cases, the man makes a move when he gets signals of interest from the woman. Indicators of interest would be nice, but waiting for indicators of interest especially strong ones would mean some guys just won't ever get a date in their life, alot of guys probably don't have the luxury of IOIs when approaching women, for the most part guys have to initiate everything.
JuneJulySeptember Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 Soooo...my mom, who married a man who wasn't abusive until I came along and he started abusing me, and then lost her job due to a recession, didn't deserve me? Because she was a young, "jobless bum" with a small child? BAD THINGS HAPPEN to people. Your life can be great, and bad things can still happen to you despite how you think it's going to turn out. My mom's had a very hard life. She sacrificed everything so that I would get the things I needed. She's not also taking care of her brother, my uncle, who has a form of Parkinson's and can't live alone and can't afford to live in a care facility. It's called "realizing that life isn't fair, and not bitching about it." My mom is a survivor. My mom is happy, despite having a lot of challenges in her life. She is happy independent of hardships! And in my opinion, she is WAY ahead of you. So go ahead, assume your life will be sunshine and roses, and that you'll never face anything harder than not finding a guy to make babies with. When you leave fantasy land, we can chat about this again. That is true. Despite all the BS I post here, I do realize in retrospect that my problems are relatively trivial compared to those others have. And I do know other people who have MAJOR problems in life. In some instances, it is their own fault. But still, their life is hard. I think that you growing up and watching your mother is one of the reasons that you are not so shallow as many others. We are in a way a product of the environment in which we are raised. 1
TheZebra Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 Funny how the same feminists/liberals who whine that "nobody deserves sex" feel so unbelievably entitled to my wallet through welfare taxation....to support there lazy asses and their stupid bastard children (**** single mothers). Either everyone deserves EVERYTHING or everyone deserves NOTHING...You can't whine about men not deserving sex/relationship but than support stealing my and other hardworking peoples money through welfare and other entitlement programs....I don't care if you're a single mother and you need to support yourself and your stupid bastard child....Just as I'm not entitled to sex with you....you are not entitled to food and shelter that you can't afford (and you're CERTAINLY not entitled to steal money from taxpayers like myself to pay for it) Can't have it both ways feminists....If no-one is entitled to sex than they sure as hell aren't entitled to steal my money to pay for food/shelter for them and their stupid kids. If you can't tell the difference between a recreational activity that anyone can choose to participate in vs a safety net that must exist if we live in a Capitalist society lest we become social darwinists that eradicate the poor and unlucky, I feel sorry for you. 2
LittlePrince Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 And there is nothing wrong with being single. Yes, as long as you are getting laid constantly and tons of people desire you.
ThaWholigan Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 Man is a bridge, not a destination. Nietzsche would tell you that. I strive daily to become the "overman" which was at the crux of his worldview. Every time I re-read Thus Spoke Zarathustra, I see how Zarathustra's ramblings are applicable more and more to the modern world. What we are experiencing in the modern world is nothing new but rather an exaggeration of evolutionary undercurrents and self-destructive tendencies that humanity has latent within its psyche. There have always been alpha males and beta males, but that was merely a factor of the extreme stratification of wealth that was seen in monarchical societies. In the modern world, wealth is more easily obtained by more people, so alpha and beta are more constructs of social behavior rather than that being derived from a monetary standpoint. There have always been "pickup artists" and seducers. It's presence is greatly exaggerated today because the Internet reveals its techniques to light. You have men who could have never been seducers simply because people such as Lord Byron, Casanova, Lilith, and Ovid monopolized the information and had no way of distributing it to the masses. Even if there was a way, these people would gain no benefit from distributing their techniques as they would not want to level the playing field. The reason we think these developments are new is because we are living in a time where there are no secrets. Everything you ever wanted to know is just a mouse click away. Before, it was harder to be self-reliant. Now, people who are autodidacts will render traditional institutions such as the church and the school as obsolete. Instead of gaining information from those sources, one could easily research from their own home. The wide dissemination of easily-accessible information in our modern world has made it so that it is even more important to self-improve and reach the spire of humanity. This spread of information has led and will lead to the further homogenization of humanity, resulting in less dynamic individuals. That is why those who put in the time and effort towards self-improvement (and ultimately self-actualization) will stand out even more as mediocrity has become a standard within our junk culture. Those who have a natural inclination towards autodidactism will be the ones who benefit most from this sea change. Self-improvement for the sake of attraction is a masturbatory gesture at best and should be treated as one by all those who realize that doing so for sake of getting more dates is a ruse. Anyone who is against self-improvement is a fool and thus, should be removed from the natural world accordingly. We actually agree on something. A hip hop producer I look up to shared a quote that "it's becoming trendy and cool to be completely talentless at whatever it is that you do", and I look across and on some level, this is true on a more mainstream level. Even the talented ones fall victim to it to an extent. 1
Woggle Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 We actually agree on something. A hip hop producer I look up to shared a quote that "it's becoming trendy and cool to be completely talentless at whatever it is that you do", and I look across and on some level, this is true on a more mainstream level. Even the talented ones fall victim to it to an extent. I agree with this. There are some people on the radio who actually can sing but they bury it in a bunch of auto tune and studio crap. Can you picture the singers from back in the day with great voices changing it so they sound like inhuman robots? 1
Mme. Chaucer Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 There have always been "pickup artists" and seducers. It's presence is greatly exaggerated today because the Internet reveals its techniques to light. You have men who could have never been seducers simply because people such as Lord Byron, Casanova, Lilith, and Ovid monopolized the information and had no way of distributing it to the masses. Wasn't Lilith a demonic seductress? I acknowledge that there is a lot I don't know about PUA "theory," so perhaps I've missed something ...
ThaWholigan Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 Yes, but I listed her name among the others to state that archetypes of the "infallible seducer" (gender neutral) have always existed in real and fictionalized versions of people. That is why I laugh at anyone who believes that a "guru" invented a system or a breakthrough in this area. Everything that is currently going on in the world of PUA is just another step on the evolutionary ladder. Roosh, Carlos Xuma, David DeAngelo, take your pick... It's all the same **** from thousands of years ago. People of both genders have always been attracted to alpha traits (dominance, self-reliance) and been repulsed by beta ones (neediness, dependency, low self-esteem). Even with PUA prevalent in the mainstream and with the information out there in various forms, only a small minority will become modern day Casanovas. Most men will never truly be able to internalize seduction techniques because they simply cannot override their nuture. Seduction at it's base is an amoral, selfish, and deceptive practice. That's why its no secret people who exhibit Dark Triad traits are more easily able excel in this area because they do not care about what consequences their actions will result in, as long as they achieve their own satisfaction. James Bond is a prime example of a Dark Triad male, self-actualized. Most men are not able to adopt a "at whatever means necessary" approach to seduction and thus will not be at the apex. It's not good or bad, it just *is*. True players have a higher incidence of Dark Triad tendencies than the general dating population and that is why they are often successful individuals in this field. Still the correlation between player and the perception of a lonely old man later down the road is not linked to manipulating and having sex with lots of girls but rather the Dark Triad inclination towards psychopathy and the inability to form salient bonds with what is in their eyes - another commodity. I agree to an extent....a few things from my own personal POV: -I don't consider seduction to be solely a selfish endeavor. Amoral, yes. But if something is amoral, that doesn't necessarily make it immoral. There can certainly be a deceptive element involved, but that depends on the nature of your seduction. -Your posts about the "dark triad" are interesting to me because of the "players" that I have met (and I know/have met quite a few), not more than half of them exhibited the traits that you spoke of as pivotal to attracting hordes of young women. Being at university for the short time that I was there, the course I was on exposed me to a lot of women. What I do also serves the same scenario. I tended to think like you at that point - that men had to be dicks to get women. This thought reared itself at varying points because I'd been around quite a few guys who were like this. However, deep down I knew this wasn't true to me because of the women I was meeting, they were heavily attracted to all sorts of different dudes. Some of whom were actually cool ass dudes, not necessarily great looking, some where short dudes too. Much of it did have to do with status to an extent, but not status in terms of wealth, but their social intelligence. Being socially savvy doesn't have to entail "dark" traits in my experience. It all depends on how one defines manipulation. The word itself conjures negative viewpoints regarding the practice of manipulation, but in my experience and opinion, that is another word that could be construed as "amoral". You can manipulate a scenario to the favor of all parties involved in said scenario. That may be "deceptive" but is it bad, or selfish? Especially given that one could easily manipulate a situation to his/her advantage solely? - A lot of men ARE able to be seductive. However, being that I am a believer in biodiversity and neurodiversity, I firmly believe that it depends on how they are able to manipulate their own character to adopt traits that benefit them in the long run - at times it may take a lot of work whereas for some people it will be relatively easy. In that sense, yes, not many will be able to develop themselves enough to attract people - depending on whether they want an LTR or a large body count. I firmly believe that not many guys want to do the work involved with reinventing themselves into a synthesis of traits including some "bad traits" or those considered exclusive to "attractive men". I also believe you don't have to be a psychopath , or view women as a commodity to be able to attract them. It just takes even more work than it does to be the dick that gets laid . You're a smart dude d'Argennes. Brash, but smart - you remind me a little of another certain poster who used to post here . Things might seem a little different to you a while down the road.
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