Els Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 I fully recognize that people can do their best in a relationship or marriage and have it fail. But people who consistently fail? Divorce multiple times? Consistently get involved with the wrong people, or abusive people? Are you really going to call up Larry King or communicate with Liz Taylor beyond the grave to ask them how to make a marriage work? Furthermore, I did not say that only people who have been married for decades should be allowed to give advice. I merely said that the advice of those who have demonstrated a pattern of repeating dysfunction in their lives should be taken with a grain of salt, and that when those people get snippy or judgmental at younger people trying to figure things out or disagreeing with them, they should be ignored altogether. I have a major problem with self-professed trainwrecks acting outraged at statements and behavior that are saintly compared to what they themselves may have engaged in throughout their lives. After all, some of the biggest, most immature morons I've met have been in their 40s, 50s, and 60s (although there are plenty of jackasses my age too). I only agreed with that post because in general, I agree with MrCastle's views about friendships with women. There is nothing wrong with them in the abstract, but I've never had one more than one "good" female friend at any point in my life (and perhaps that's enough). I don't feel like I've missed out on anything as a result, nor has that fact negatively affected my dating life. I was irked by the implication that his views somehow render him morally deficient, and I also disagreed with this idea that friendships with multiple women is somehow necessary to date them, meet them, or have a healthy view of them (I'm living proof that it isn't necessary). Okay, I really don't get this. My point is: You agree with MrC. Virtually EVERYONE who is in a good/happy LTR and posted on that thread, disagrees with MrC. You then say that we should listen to what people in good LTRs have to say. It just does not make any logical sense. Why bring that up at all in this topic when you are personally doing the exact opposite in this topic?
TheBigQuestion Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 Okay, I really don't get this. My point is: You agree with MrC. Virtually EVERYONE who is in a good/happy LTR and posted on that thread, disagrees with MrC. You then say that we should listen to what people in good LTRs have to say. It just does not make any logical sense. Why bring that up at all in this topic when you are personally doing the exact opposite in this topic? It makes perfect sense. My only point is to be wary of listening to people who are repeatedly failing at relationships or consistently getting into bad ones. My suggestion to listen to people who have made marriages work for a while does not entail a suggestion that all other groups have nothing valuable to say. MrCastle is not interested in relationships and hasn't been in one, but he isn't unhappy with his dating life and appears to be satisfied with his life as a whole. The men on behalf of whom he was speaking still need to get their foot in the door as far as their inner mental life and meeting women is concerned. As a guy who has that part of it figured out, I don't see what's so bad about hearing him out. 1
Els Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 So who in this thread were you suggesting that people not listen to, then? I'm sorry, it's difficult to understand why you came up with that statement all of a sudden in this thread of all things. I think I'd best just leave it as one of those odd mysteries of LS, to avoid derailing the thread further.
TheBigQuestion Posted December 31, 2012 Posted December 31, 2012 So who in this thread were you suggesting that people not listen to, then? I'm sorry, it's difficult to understand why you came up with that statement all of a sudden in this thread of all things. I think I'd best just leave it as one of those odd mysteries of LS, to avoid derailing the thread further. I'm not going to say who, obviously, but there were a few posters a few pages back who fit the description I provided (i.e. clearly are colossal failures at relationships, yet still find the nerve to take swipes at those who are still figuring things out and have done nothing wrong).
edgygirl Posted December 31, 2012 Posted December 31, 2012 I find their posts immensely helpful and it's naive and a little judgmental of you to think that only because people went through divorce/s or hardships they can't possibly know better. They have more experience and experience counts a lot no matter what type of experience.
TheBigQuestion Posted December 31, 2012 Posted December 31, 2012 I find their posts immensely helpful and it's naive and a little judgmental of you to think that only because people went through divorce/s or hardships they can't possibly know better. They have more experience and experience counts a lot no matter what type of experience. I'm willing to bet you don't even know the particular posters I'm talking about. But that's fine. This is too much of a thread derailment as it is.
Els Posted December 31, 2012 Posted December 31, 2012 I'm not going to say who, obviously, but there were a few posters a few pages back who fit the description I provided (i.e. clearly are colossal failures at relationships, yet still find the nerve to take swipes at those who are still figuring things out and have done nothing wrong). Eh, okay, can't say anything without knowing who, because there are some divorcees whose advice I value greatly and some whom I don't. My point is, that with regards to THIS particular topic, there is absolutely no difference between what anyone who has ever been divorced and anyone who has not, is saying. In the most recent two threads about this topic, including this one, everyone who has ever been in a relationship regardless of divorced or not, is saying essentially the same thing: Friends of both genders are important. This isn't a divorce thread in which the lines are drawn between some divorcees arguing that marriage is outdated and people in happy marriages saying that it's a fine and beautiful thing, or somesuch. The lines here are not drawn between those who have 'succeeded' and those who have not, but rather between those who have never been in an R (for whatever reason), and those who have. The only exceptions I have seen in all of the pages have been ThaWholigan and yourself, presuming you have been in an R. That's why I think your remark is pointless. Even if we were to take your advice and not listen to what 'those' posters are saying, it's a moot point because whomever they are, they are saying the exact same things that the people in happy LTRs (including the two whom you mentioned respecting greatly) are saying. Unless I have my LS history all wrong and Necromancer, Necris, d'Argennes, Greznog, CptSaveaHo and Somedude all actually have long strings of failed marriages that I was unaware of, instead of simply being unable to get dates. It's not a mystery at all. I'm more interested in listening to people who have success in gaining' date=' keeping, and maintaining the attraction of multiple people. Individuals who have been in many, many, many short term relationships with women and somehow the woman has had more investment in the relationship than they did. I am looking for guys who [b']truly[/b] know what the **** is going on and didn't just stumble into relationships out of "serendipity" or "I got introduced to her and I guess we just hit it off". No. If you've been through three different marriages with three different people, what does that say? Doesn't the common denominator failure lie with you in some way, shape, or form? I don't care about relationships. I am more interested in the quintessential quotient in what sparks attraction that could potentially lead to a relationship. I'm not interested in hearing from people who fumble around. I know guys like this in real life but they more often than not tend to be what we call "naturals". They didn't learn "game". They didn't learn "PUA". You can't ask how a natural does something because it comes easy to them. They can't explain it. So far, the only person I have found on here who even remotely fits that criteria is Mr. Castle. Everybody else is too busy looking at the forest through binoculars, too politically correct, or too cliche. That doesn't help anybody. You are perfectly welcome to listen to whomever you want to listen to. In fact, I think listening to anyone at all is a welcome change from what you have been doing since you joined LS.
Recommended Posts