Redbirdinabrightsky Posted December 29, 2012 Posted December 29, 2012 Few months ago i literally flushed away all the girls i used the hang around much with, Me, the buddies and the gym is all i need, until i find a girl who is strongly attracted to me and the opposite. I have seen the light, i personality find it useless to have female friends since i have seen most don´t really want to be true friends with males. Like this i can´t be F-Zoned, taken advantage of and waste time on uninterested women. This is the way to go!. Of course women don´t like it, because if all men where like that they would have no friends to leech. It is always good to have a menagerie, a plethora, of friends. The more diverse t better. You are missing out by excluding the females, and you are hiding by avoiding their friendship. Plus, do you have any concept of how totally 4ucking cool it is to have female friends? Ya see, they have other females, and they love to play match-maker... Surrounding yourself with beautiful women always works to your benefit... Anyone here know how goddamn great it feels to walk into a bar surrounded by female friends? Ya know how it feels to have every other lady in that bar looking at you, wanting to meet you, because you DO have female friends? Get over the whole 'not-getting-to-have-sex' with them bit, female friends are sex magnets, and when you get sick, if you are not a total 4uckup, they bake you things, and bring you soup, and yeah, they do sometimes sleep with ya; and that rocks! 2
TheBigQuestion Posted December 29, 2012 Posted December 29, 2012 I thought the idea is that people learn from their failures in life? I'm for one, am very much interested in what anyone with more experience than me has to say. That's what smart people do. Only those who are not that bright think they have all the answers. Hint? I don't think I have all the answers. Far from it. If I have to choose between listening to advice from people who have made long-term relationships and marriages work and those who have multiple failed marriages (which I'm sure were ALL the other ex-spouse's fault:rolleyes:), I'm going to listen to the former. I have no interest in listening to people who make the same idiotic mistakes over and over again. That's common sense in just about any area of life, and it's no different when it comes to relationships.
sweetkiwi Posted December 29, 2012 Posted December 29, 2012 Im a good friend to my guy friends. And my best guy friend and i hook up If we're both single. 2
Necris Posted December 29, 2012 Posted December 29, 2012 If he were to say that 'some women' or 'the women that I have dealt with act this way' then he would be taken seriously. The world has 7 billion people and half of them are women, so unless he knows 3.5 billion of the people he can't be taken seriously. I think that it is safe to speak for a majority of the people who have replied to this thread. You are 18 and feel this way? You have some learning to do and some growing up to do. What I don't get is how the OP is wrong? From what I gather he's getting rid of his female "friends" as they only serve as an obstacle in his life. He's right in my experience girls do not make the best of friends, most of the time you are helping them out but they never do much at all to help you, IMO friendship should be mutually beneficial not parasitical. Also he may have acquired these so-called "friends" from rejections, where the girl rejects you and just states "let's be friends" this is usually untrue, as they do not desire to truly be friends with you but they like your personality enough they feel they can use you, you don't want "friends" like that.
Mrlonelyone Posted December 29, 2012 Posted December 29, 2012 What I don't get is how the OP is wrong? From what I gather he's getting rid of his female "friends" as they only serve as an obstacle in his life. He's right in my experience girls do not make the best of friends, most of the time you are helping them out but they never do much at all to help you, IMO friendship should be mutually beneficial not parasitical. Also he may have acquired these so-called "friends" from rejections, where the girl rejects you and just states "let's be friends" this is usually untrue, as they do not desire to truly be friends with you but they like your personality enough they feel they can use you, you don't want "friends" like that. He hasn't made it clear weather he's distinguishing between real friends and women who have friend zoned him. Real female friends will do things for a man. In fact, real female friends have a tendency to want to match everyone up with someone who they think will be a good fit for them. Real female friends can be and often are the facilitators who will find a lonely man a girlfriend. What you say is quite true. Dave Chapelle even joked about a woman using her chest that way. It's a Wonderful Chest - Video Clip | Comedy Central 1
Necris Posted December 29, 2012 Posted December 29, 2012 do you have any concept of how totally 4ucking cool it is to have female friends? Ya see, they have other females, and they love to play match-maker... Surrounding yourself with beautiful women always works to your benefit... Get over the whole 'not-getting-to-have-sex' with them bit, female friends are sex magnets, and when you get sick, if you are not a total 4uckup, they bake you things, and bring you soup, and yeah, they do sometimes sleep with ya; and that rocks! What a strange world you live in, personally I've never experienced anything remotely close to that with female friends. Play matchmaker? I've never experienced this, the female friends I've had never tried in the slightest to help me in the dating arena. Also if your female friends are sleeping with you are they really friends or do you have something else going on, because I don't know man that doesn't sound like you are just friends with these girls.
kaylacole Posted December 29, 2012 Posted December 29, 2012 It is always good to have a menagerie, a plethora, of friends. The more diverse t better. You are missing out by excluding the females, and you are hiding by avoiding their friendship. Plus, do you have any concept of how totally 4ucking cool it is to have female friends? Ya see, they have other females, and they love to play match-maker... Surrounding yourself with beautiful women always works to your benefit... Anyone here know how goddamn great it feels to walk into a bar surrounded by female friends? Ya know how it feels to have every other lady in that bar looking at you, wanting to meet you, because you DO have female friends? Get over the whole 'not-getting-to-have-sex' with them bit, female friends are sex magnets, and when you get sick, if you are not a total 4uckup, they bake you things, and bring you soup, and yeah, they do sometimes sleep with ya; and that rocks! Absolutely right, and even if you do occasionally sleep with them, so what? At that point it is more about simple companionship, and maybe FWB which enhance your life. Always leave those doors open, because you never know what you will find from those experiences, but life is full of lovely surprises!!!
kaylacole Posted December 29, 2012 Posted December 29, 2012 What a strange world you live in, personally I've never experienced anything remotely close to that with female friends. Play matchmaker? I've never experienced this, the female friends I've had never tried in the slightest to help me in the dating arena. Also if your female friends are sleeping with you are they really friends or do you have something else going on, because I don't know man that doesn't sound like you are just friends with these girls. Buddy you need to get out more. Redbird is not in some strange world, just the modern world, and so what if you don't think Redbird is right? What's wrong with having more friends?
Necris Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 He hasn't made it clear weather he's distinguishing between real friends and women who have friend zoned him. Real female friends will do things for a man. In fact, real female friends have a tendency to want to match everyone up with someone who they think will be a good fit for them. Real female friends can be and often are the facilitators who will find a lonely man a girlfriend. As for women being matchmakers I have never experienced that really at all in my life, if I have a girl for a friend that won't happen, I've never had a girl try to help me in the dating arena at all in even the slightest way. Buddy you need to get out more. Redbird is not in some strange world, just the modern world, and so what if you don't think Redbird is right? What's wrong with having more friends? Sorry Kaylacole and Mr.LonelyOne but in my personal experience women usually do not make the best of friends, not to say they are all terrible, but in general for me I have much better more meaningful friendships with guys than girls. Also I'm with the OP if a girl you like "friend zones" you its best to keep going, even if you are truly okay being just friends she is going to be a terrible friend to you.
Mrlonelyone Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 As for women being matchmakers I have never experienced that really at all in my life, if I have a girl for a friend that won't happen, I've never had a girl try to help me in the dating arena at all in even the slightest way. They have tried to do that for me in the past. Usually they are horribly wrong about what I like in either a man or a woman. Sorry Kaylacole and Mr.LonelyOne but in my personal experience women usually do not make the best of friends, not to say they are all terrible, but in general for me I have much better more meaningful friendships with guys than girls. Also I'm with the OP if a girl you like "friend zones" you its best to keep going, even if you are truly okay being just friends she is going to be a terrible friend to you. Read my thread of suggestions. It's possible that they don't even see you as a sexual being. If you wait on the woman to make all the moves, even subtle flirtations then she will think you are asexual or "gay" or whatever.
sweetkiwi Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 I friendzoned a guy. I thought he was gay until he ripped my pants off and went to town. 1
Necris Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 Read my thread of suggestions. It's possible that they don't even see you as a sexual being. If you wait on the woman to make all the moves, even subtle flirtations then she will think you are asexual or "gay" or whatever. Not sure what that has to do with friendship, but if you're talking about dating I actually have to make all the moves, like asking her out, if I waited for the girl to make a single move I'd never get a single date in my entire life as no "moves" will be made. Though I try to take things easy and I try to be as gentleman-like as possible and while old-fashioned I'm not the kind of guy to kiss a girl on the first date and I don't recall ever making any sexual advances before but I do try to flirt sometimes though unfortunately I've never kissed a girl and I also have never been on a 2nd date. Now if by making moves on women you mean to go out and with every good looking girl I see make brazen remarks about her body, attempt to make sexual advances on her, and try to grab her waist, butt, breasts or whatever so that she knows that I'm a man, and not just any man a manly man then nah, I don't do that, and if that's what I have to do to not be seen as gay or asexual, I guess I do seem extremely asexual:lmao:.
Mrlonelyone Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 (edited) No Necris I mean making moves on your female friends. You said you were just friends you have an established friendship or are even just in the FZ with them. My cousin has a little story about what he would do with female friends. They would say: Give me some money. He would say : Well give me some pussy. He got girlfriends that way. They respected the fact that he wasn't a mark, or a sucker to be taken advantage of. Edited December 30, 2012 by Mrlonelyone
Imajerk17 Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 (edited) I love these discussions. This topic is a crowd-pleaser, not quite as much as the PUA debate, but still.... The opinions are hilarious. Here's the thing. There's "newbie" advice to stop the bleeding so to speak. And there's the whole story. If you are the kind of guy whose idea of "friendship" with women is doing them favors and buying them things while they give you only platonic approval in return, then you need to stop that. Going cold-turkey on your female "friends" would probably be your best bet. If you are a guy and almost all of your friends are female, you probably need to take a good hard look as to why it is too. Maybe that is because you can't hang with the fellas. (Ironically as much as I like the whole concept of the PUA Community, there are a lot of guys in there who are like that. It's more fun to these PUA-type guys to hang out with their female friends and talk about male-female dynamics with them while the women provide "social-proof" to the PUA. And to spend time doing things like yoga where there are girls to meet rather than do typical dude things like playing sports or watching the game.) If you are a guy and there is a woman in your life you are a "sexless boyfriend" to, then you need to seriously reevaluate the relationship. On the other hand, if you are really truly a newbie who is so uncomfortable with women, then a woman who is willing to hang out with you, even if it is only platonic, might be an improvement and what you need to get more comfortable around them. Getting past that though....I have had female friends (a) help me decorate my place and (b) help me hook up with someone--many many times. I have also learned A LOT from the women who friendzoned me. I guess overall there is a difference between being friends and being in the friendzone. Edited December 30, 2012 by Imajerk17 4
Els Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 Regardless of anything else said so far, I think it's absolutely hilarious that anyone with multiple failed marriages would have the nerve to think that anything they have to say on how to make a romantic relationship succeed should be taken seriously. Take the advice, commentary, and criticism of those who have made it work for decades Yes, that absolutely explains why you are liking the same posts as all of the people who have never even had relationships, as opposed to the ones by xxoo and kungfu Joe, right?
Imajerk17 Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 (edited) On a somewhat related note (to Elswyth's post) I've noticed that men and women tend to look at relationship history differently. Women tend to look favorably on past long-term relationship experience while many men are at best indifferent to it. I'll give an example. We had a debate on this forum a while ago about whether a woman would be better off dating a "never-married man in his late 30's or a "divorced" man of the same age. The debate was split pretty neatly across gender lines. We argued for "never-married". After all, a divorce represents a failed situation and "never-married" indicates to us better-judgement in not getting married in the first place. We also would rather not have to deal with the baggage that often comes with a divorce. The women argued for "divorced" though, and they weren't swayed by our arguments. I now realize that they looked at relationship history much the same way that an employer might look at a candidate's job history. Someone who was gainfully employed for a few years at a time is typically considered a much better candidate in the job market than someone with a much spottier employment history. See, the former candidate is at least able to commit to a job and he is attractive enough to be hired and to stay employed, and that says a lot. Similarly, someone who is divorced is considered a much better prospect by most women because according to them, the guy had "something"--i.e., the combination of attractiveness, social skills, relationship skills, and willingness to commit, that enabled him to get married in the first place. Edited December 30, 2012 by Imajerk17 1
Samilia Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 Few months ago i literally flushed away all the girls i used the hang around much with, Me, the buddies and the gym is all i need, until i find a girl who is strongly attracted to me and the opposite. I have seen the light, i personality find it useless to have female friends since i have seen most don´t really want to be true friends with males. Like this i can´t be F-Zoned, taken advantage of and waste time on uninterested women. This is the way to go!. Of course women don´t like it, because if all men where like that they would have no friends to leech. I have no male friends, so I'm in your boat. I find that when I have a male friend either me or the guy is interested in something more, one of us is wasting time. I hang out with my girlfriends and that's that.
mn311601 Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 I have no friends at all, so I'm even better.
somedude81 Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 He hasn't made it clear weather he's distinguishing between real friends and women who have friend zoned him. Real female friends will do things for a man. In fact, real female friends have a tendency to want to match everyone up with someone who they think will be a good fit for them. Real female friends can be and often are the facilitators who will find a lonely man a girlfriend. What you say is quite true. Dave Chapelle even joked about a woman using her chest that way. It's a Wonderful Chest - Video Clip | Comedy Central If they aren't "real female friends" then is there anything wrong about getting rid of them? 1
Necris Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 No Necris I mean making moves on your female friends. You said you were just friends you have an established friendship or are even just in the FZ with them. My cousin has a little story about what he would do with female friends. They would say: Give me some money. He would say : Well give me some pussy. He got girlfriends that way. They respected the fact that he wasn't a mark, or a sucker to be taken advantage of. On the subject of making moves on female friends in my personal situation I don't have many female friends since I'm not really hanging out with women that much (the female friends I have are friends of friends) and of the few I do have, they already have boyfriends or not attractive enough for me to want to even try to have a boyfriend-girlfriend relationship. Also its extremely risky to make moves on friends, if you fail, you will lose that friend. They'll lose all interest in being around you and will avoid you and get out of your life.
TheBigQuestion Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 (edited) Yes, that absolutely explains why you are liking the same posts as all of the people who have never even had relationships, as opposed to the ones by xxoo and kungfu Joe, right? xxoo is consistently one of the brightest and most levelheaded posters on this site. Unless explicitly stated otherwise, my agreement with her goes without saying. Other than one quote from a different thread, I take no issue with anything KungFuJoe says either. He's pretty much spot on and all his advice is good-natured. With that said, my comment was clearly limited as a criticism of those who are trainwrecks and relationship failures having the nerve to lecture young folks who are trying to figure things out. I firmly believe that the best advice is given by those who do things right and, if they make mistakes, are quick to rectify them rather than repeat them ad nauseum. I don't feel like I have much to learn from people who have lifetime losing records in relationships, and any pontificating on their part should be taken with a grain of salt. Additionally, I just looked back at the posts I "liked" in this thread, and there were only three. One each for sweetkiwi and Imajerk, both of whom are levelheaded and have had relationships, and one for somedude because he showed a moment of self-deprecating humor (making fun of the "women from the US are evil" BS). So I have to ask, what in the blue hell are you talking about? Edited December 30, 2012 by TheBigQuestion
Mrlonelyone Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 On the subject of making moves on female friends in my personal situation I don't have many female friends since I'm not really hanging out with women that much (the female friends I have are friends of friends) and of the few I do have, they already have boyfriends or not attractive enough for me to want to even try to have a boyfriend-girlfriend relationship. Also its extremely risky to make moves on friends, if you fail, you will lose that friend. They'll lose all interest in being around you and will avoid you and get out of your life. So? If they want out of your life all together because you made a move on them then they weren't your friend. I have plenty of friends going back to high school that I have had a more than friendly interaction or two with. We are just friends now but hey....more than a couple of my friends from high school have married eachother. So who knows what can go on there. You cannot fear loosing people from your life who find you so repulsive that they would react that way to you touching them even once.
Els Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 (edited) On a somewhat related note (to Elswyth's post) I've noticed that men and women tend to look at relationship history differently. Women tend to look favorably on past long-term relationship experience while many men are at best indifferent to it. I'll give an example. We had a debate on this forum a while ago about whether a woman would be better off dating a "never-married man in his late 30's or a "divorced" man of the same age. The debate was split pretty neatly across gender lines. We argued for "never-married". After all, a divorce represents a failed situation and "never-married" indicates to us better-judgement in not getting married in the first place. We also would rather not have to deal with the baggage that often comes with a divorce. The women argued for "divorced" though, and they weren't swayed by our arguments. I now realize that they looked at relationship history much the same way that an employer might look at a candidate's job history. Someone who was gainfully employed for a few years at a time is typically considered a much better candidate in the job market than someone with a much spottier employment history. See, the former candidate is at least able to commit to a job and he is attractive enough to be hired and to stay employed, and that says a lot. Similarly, someone who is divorced is considered a much better prospect by most women because according to them, the guy had "something"--i.e., the combination of attractiveness, social skills, relationship skills, and willingness to commit, that enabled him to get married in the first place. My post was made solely in response to TBQ's post (re: only taking advice from people who are currently in a multi-decade successful marriage). I don't personally believe that people need to have been married for decades in order for their advice to be of any use. My own personal yardstick for good advice is that it comes from someone who: 1) is able to explain the rationale for their advice in a coherent manner that makes sense and is non-contradictory, and 2) consistently gives non-judgemental and unbiased advice instead of using their posts as a sounding board for personal bias or agenda. IMO, this can come from people who are married for decades (xxoo/KungfuJoe), divorced (Mme Chaucer/LittleTiger/carhill), recently married (zengirl/Pyro) or have been in LTRs and never been married (LonelyRonin), or are currently dating casually (ThaWholigan). I admit that I do not usually place much stock in what people who have never been in a LTR have to say about anything relationship-related. Note that never having been in a LTR is not in any way similar to not having been married. This is because I feel that at least some level of experience is beneficial in talking about something. Not always necessary (as I said, I think ThaWholigan gives excellent advice), but usually beneficial. xxoo is consistently one of the brightest and most levelheaded posters on this site. Unless explicitly stated otherwise, my agreement with her goes without saying. Other than one quote from a different thread, I take no issue with anything KungFuJoe says either. He's pretty much spot on and all his advice is good-natured. With that said, my comment was clearly limited as a criticism of those who are trainwrecks and relationship failures having the nerve to lecture young folks who are trying to figure things out. I firmly believe that the best advice is given by those who do things right and, if they make mistakes, are quick to rectify them rather than repeat them ad nauseum. I don't feel like I have much to learn from people who have lifetime losing records in relationships, and any pontificating on their part should be taken with a grain of salt. Additionally, I just looked back at the posts I "liked" in this thread, and there were only three. One each for sweetkiwi and Imajerk, both of whom are levelheaded and have had relationships, and one for somedude because he showed a moment of self-deprecating humor (making fun of the "women from the US are evil" BS). So I have to ask, what in the blue hell are you talking about? I was actually talking about MrC's post that you 'liked' along with somedude, Necris, and a few other people who've not been in a R (I forget exactly who, I think it was d'Argennes or such). That post was essentially the antithesis of what all the people here who ARE in long-term, happy relationships here are saying (although MrC clarified some parts of it later). Now, I can't claim to read your mind, and it's entirely possible that you do agree with KFJ and xxoo's opinions in this thread despite that, but I just found it slightly ironic that you did that and then threw out the 'only people who have been in a successful M for decades should be giving advice' card. I am curious, though, why you feel you have 'nothing to learn from anyone' who has ever tried and failed, despite you yourself having very minimal experience in terms of relationships. Relationships fail for all sorts of reasons, some of them even beyond the control of the people involved. I agree that some divorcees are essentially very messed up, but painting ALL of them by the same brush is slightly disingenius. Do you genuinely feel that carhill, for instance, who was in a marriage for 20(?) years has nothing to say that you could possibly benefit from despite the fact that your longest relationship is, I don't know, 1-2 years long? Edit: Ah, OK, that post was on another thread. https://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/dating/363772-hate-how-women-rather-ignore-you-than-just-say-no-8.html#post4480578 , for context. Edited December 30, 2012 by Elswyth
TheBigQuestion Posted December 30, 2012 Posted December 30, 2012 (edited) I was actually talking about MrC's post that you 'liked' along with somedude, Necris, and a few other people who've not been in a R (I forget exactly who, I think it was d'Argennes or such). That post was essentially the antithesis of what all the people here who ARE in long-term, happy relationships here are saying (although MrC clarified some parts of it later). Now, I can't claim to read your mind, and it's entirely possible that you do agree with KFJ and xxoo's opinions in this thread despite that, but I just found it slightly ironic that you did that and then threw out the 'only people who have been in a successful M for decades should be giving advice' card. I am curious, though, why you feel you have 'nothing to learn from anyone' who has ever tried and failed, despite you yourself having very minimal experience in terms of relationships. Relationships fail for all sorts of reasons, some of them even beyond the control of the people involved. I agree that some divorcees are essentially very messed up, but painting ALL of them by the same brush is slightly disingenius. Do you genuinely feel that carhill, for instance, who was in a marriage for 20(?) years has nothing to say that you could possibly benefit from despite the fact that your longest relationship is, I don't know, 1-2 years long? Edit: Ah, OK, that post was on another thread. https://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/dating/363772-hate-how-women-rather-ignore-you-than-just-say-no-8.html#post4480578 , for context. I fully recognize that people can do their best in a relationship or marriage and have it fail. But people who consistently fail? Divorce multiple times? Consistently get involved with the wrong people, or abusive people? Are you really going to call up Larry King or communicate with Liz Taylor beyond the grave to ask them how to make a marriage work? Furthermore, I did not say that only people who have been married for decades should be allowed to give advice. I merely said that the advice of those who have demonstrated a pattern of repeating dysfunction in their lives should be taken with a grain of salt, and that when those people get snippy or judgmental at younger people trying to figure things out or disagreeing with them, they should be ignored altogether. I have a major problem with self-professed trainwrecks acting outraged at statements and behavior that are saintly compared to what they themselves may have engaged in throughout their lives. After all, some of the biggest, most immature morons I've met have been in their 40s, 50s, and 60s (although there are plenty of jackasses my age too). I only agreed with that post because in general, I agree with MrCastle's views about friendships with women. There is nothing wrong with them in the abstract, but I've never had one more than one "good" female friend at any point in my life (and perhaps that's enough). I don't feel like I've missed out on anything as a result, nor has that fact negatively affected my dating life. I was irked by the implication that his views somehow render him morally deficient, and I also disagreed with this idea that friendships with multiple women is somehow necessary to date them, meet them, or have a healthy view of them (I'm living proof that it isn't necessary). Edited December 30, 2012 by TheBigQuestion
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