KungFuJoe Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 I feel you man, I have the same issue, same thing happened to me recently, I asked out a girl I know, we went to see a movie, everything went smoothly, she told me she had a great time and thanked me for taking her out, and then when I tried to call her a couple of times to see how she is doing she ignored me, then about 9 days later when I gave her a message saying Merry Christmas to her on Christmas day later that night she finally replies with Merry Christmas. That's very annoying to me mainly because its so confusing, I'd prefer women to just tell it to me straight makes things so much easier. I wonder should I flat out ask girls that do this to me about this or not? Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. YOU should have never texted her NINE FREAKIN DAYS LATER after she blew you off. YOU caused your own annoyance. Can't blame this on the fair ol sex this time, buddy. 3
Necris Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. YOU should have never texted her NINE FREAKIN DAYS LATER after she blew you off. YOU caused your own annoyance. Can't blame this on the fair ol sex this time, buddy. It was Christmas day so I told most of the people I know Merry Christmas, I wasn't going to send her anything but I was told telling her merry christmas would be a good idea, but what can I say I'm terrible at this, but I would like girls to be more upfront.
Els Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 (edited) Certainly. I mean in life you run into both genders, that's just how it is. Whether through work, school, whatever. Men and women will come in and out of your life on a daily basis. However, ultimately, you decide who you keep around and for what reasons. Now, in theory; I could be friends with someone who's not attractive to me and vice versa but that's very rare. Usually one of the parties wants more. I've cut girls out for being too clingy and not taking no as an answer. I wouldn't mind being friends with a woman that shared mutual platonic feelings but it's rare. Rare to the point that I don't have a single one. The girls I talk to are either girls I'm actively dating, or potential future dates. I am curious how it is possible to never have had a single person of the opposite sex in your social circles who is not attractive to you and vice versa. I'm not disbelieving you, I'm just genuinely curious. Is it that you purposefully tailor your social circles to never include any women whom you don't find attractive, or is it that you just don't notice that the others exist, or is it that you genuinely find such a large % of women attractive that the remaining % are all interested in you? 1. I wanted to sleep with every female friend I have ever had. 2. Never have I looked to make friends with girls. 3. Befriending people of the opposite gender was either something I just stumbled into or I screwed up my approach and accidentally came on to her as a friend and ended up accepting the friendzone. At least I can say that I haven't been friendzoned in over a year since I started using a more direct approach with girls. Consequently, I haven't spent anytime with a girl as a friend or otherwise in over a year. I'm still trying to decide what is worse, having no women in my life, or being around girls I like that are completely hands off. Well, this is what some of us are trying to tell you, "What you're doing isn't working for you." If it did work for you, like MrC, then I don't think anyone would be trying to convince you otherwise. I don't think you should hang out with women you're crushing on one on one in the friendzone as you are doing. I do think you need some social circles that have women in them whom you can interact with. Nope. I meant in the romantic/healthy/successful relationship sense. Women are no different. They won't date men they aren't physically attracted to. So, what's the point of playing up a charade that you're 'connecting' with her when really she's decided in the first 5 minutes whether or not she will ever sleep with you. The meaningful connection stuff can happen later with a woman who has given you a chance. I'm not sure we're talking about the same sort of 'friends' here. When I say 'be friends with people of both genders' I am absolutely not talking about puppy-dogging around women, doing whatever they want you to despite knowing that they aren't interested in you and having intense emotional connections that are not reciprocated. That is NOT truly being 'friends'. I am literally talking about just 'talking' to lots of people regardless of gender and attractiveness, and being platonic friends with both genders. 'Women' also do not decide in the first 5 minutes whether or not they will ever sleep with a guy. Sorry, but this myth has been debunked several times over, regardless of whether you believe it or not. Just because everyone needs sexual attraction to sleep with someone, does not mean that that is the ONLY thing required for a healthy long-term relationship. A strong friendship is one of the cornerstones for a relationship, along with sexual attraction and a romantic connection. You need all of the above. And someone who has never talked to women or been friends with women outside of the all-encompassing desire to hook up, will be very much at a disadvantage when it comes to that. If they don't want a relationship, s'all good. If they do, then they need to understand this. Edited December 28, 2012 by Elswyth 1
Mrlonelyone Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 Men like Mr. Castle are trying to avoid the "friendzone". The women around them, younger adult women from the sound of it, are prone to doing this. They will say to a man who ask them out that they want to be friends and mean one of two things 90% of the time. They want to keep you around for moral support and like you as a person. Which wouldn't be all bad if they were willing to provide simmilar support for the man. They don't really want anything to do with you at all and have turned the word "friend" into a codeword for someone they don't want anything to do with. The third possibility, hardly worth mentioning is that a woman will say that about a man she only wants for sex...but dosen't want a relationship with. A FWB but she can't bring herself to think she could do that. That is is contradistinction to actually being friends. Real friends, male or female want to spend some time with you. They share common interest with you. They are there for you emotionally at times but not in a sexual way. This can happen between hetero/bi sexual men and women if their is some other circumstance keeping them from having an intimate relationship right away. i.e. they are in relationships already, they are working together and the complexities of that situation, timing etc. Relationships that grow out of real friendship, with genuine shared interest, and common goals and values etc are the strongest by far. My favorite example would be John and Abbigail Adams. They famously addressed many of their letters to eachother "To My Dearest friend". 5
TheZebra Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 I think there's a very distinct difference between avoiding the friendzone and ending up with friends of the opposite sex because you share a common interest but no attraction to each other (mutually). My whole life I've always had a lot of male friends and I just can't fathom having only female friends. That sounds so boring! And no, they're not guys I friendzoned. They're usually people I met through a group of friends, a club in college, or co-workers from a company I've worked in. Although sometimes I wish that men and even women were as direct as you, MrCastle. It certainly would make it a lot easier to gauge interest from other people and would save a lot of hurt feelings on either side. 1
betterdeal Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 Who knows, maybe she had PMS, or heard her father had prostate cancer, or lost her phone, or finds rejecting someone quite an awkward experience, or gets the sense you're far too needy and controlling to be any fun to get involved with, or met someone else she fancies more, or just isn't in the mood for it. There are millions of possible reasons for someone reserving their right to silence. It sucks, sure, especially if you've had the courage to start being more direct and honest, but this is just one step in the process of becoming adept at dating. You'll get more rejections, but hopefully you'll get less sensitive to them as you get used to them and realise someone turning you down isn't the end of the world, and that your life sucks no more than it did before they blanked you. And then when you get into a relationship it doesn't stop: partners will blank you and get pissed off with you. They'll be distant sometime and cryptic others. The more you can entertain yourself and not need them there all the time, the easier it'll be for you, and them, to have a relationship. Each rejection is just training. 3
KungFuJoe Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 It was Christmas day so I told most of the people I know Merry Christmas, I wasn't going to send her anything but I was told telling her merry christmas would be a good idea, but what can I say I'm terrible at this, but I would like girls to be more upfront. You have to ask herself...by messaging her Merry Xmas...two things would have happened...and neither of them good: - She never texts back. You wonder why and just think she's a rude bitch. - She does what she does and now you think she's giving you mixed signals when she was just trying to be polite. It's lose/lose. NO good was to come from your actions and you need to learn to recognize these things BEFORE you act. Now, I'm not saying you have to stop and think about every little thing you do, but THESE things should be almost instinctual. 2
Author somedude81 Posted December 28, 2012 Author Posted December 28, 2012 You have to ask herself...by messaging her Merry Xmas...two things would have happened...and neither of them good: - She never texts back. You wonder why and just think she's a rude bitch. - She does what she does and now you think she's giving you mixed signals when she was just trying to be polite. It's lose/lose. NO good was to come from your actions and you need to learn to recognize these things BEFORE you act. Now, I'm not saying you have to stop and think about every little thing you do, but THESE things should be almost instinctual. Those are the exact reasons why I didn't give a merry Christmas greeting to the most recent girl I was interested in. In order to be polite she would have to respond and there would be no meaning behind it. Now if she initiated, that would be a different story.
Els Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 Those are the exact reasons why I didn't give a merry Christmas greeting to the most recent girl I was interested in. In order to be polite she would have to respond and there would be no meaning behind it. Now if she initiated, that would be a different story. You were right not to. You'd already gone out on a limb for her and she ignored you. Definitely no point going further. Next. 1
xxoo Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 Flirt heavily, and directly, first, before asking a girl out. Make your interests undeniable!
TheZebra Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 You have to ask herself...by messaging her Merry Xmas...two things would have happened...and neither of them good: - She never texts back. You wonder why and just think she's a rude bitch. - She does what she does and now you think she's giving you mixed signals when she was just trying to be polite. It's lose/lose. NO good was to come from your actions and you need to learn to recognize these things BEFORE you act. Now, I'm not saying you have to stop and think about every little thing you do, but THESE things should be almost instinctual. Wish I would've seen this post earlier. So true.
Author somedude81 Posted December 28, 2012 Author Posted December 28, 2012 Flirt heavily, and directly, first, before asking a girl out. Make your interests undeniable! What if you're not a natural flirt? Or are a little shy? It was a big enough deal for me to get the number. Requiring me to act like a cartoon character so that she knows I'm really interested feels excessive. No matter how much I try I can't make my eyes bug out and make heart shapes.
xxoo Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 What if you're not a natural flirt? Or are a little shy? It was a big enough deal for me to get the number. Requiring me to act like a cartoon character so that she knows I'm really interested feels excessive. No matter how much I try I can't make my eyes bug out and make heart shapes. You can flirt in a shy way. It doesn't have to be loud and smooth. Dorky and shy can be charming. Just make your interest clear before asking her out, and gauge her reactions. Replace the stress of getting her number with paying her a few compliments. It will make getting her number so much easier, and more productive, a meeting or two later. A quiet, "That's a very good dress for you," can go a long way.
Author somedude81 Posted December 28, 2012 Author Posted December 28, 2012 You can flirt in a shy way. It doesn't have to be loud and smooth. Dorky and shy can be charming. Just make your interest clear before asking her out, and gauge her reactions. Replace the stress of getting her number with paying her a few compliments. It will make getting her number so much easier, and more productive, a meeting or two later. A quiet, "That's a very good dress for you," can go a long way. OK, I'll try that with the next girl that catches my eye. Flirt and compliment first before I go for the number. Thanks. 1
Lonely Ronin Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 OK, I'll try that with the next girl that catches my eye. Flirt and compliment first before I go for the number. Thanks. compliment first, If she is receptive, then you flirt.
Ruby Slippers Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 When women ignore you they mean no. When they say no, they mean maybe if you work for it. Pretty much. 1
Author somedude81 Posted December 28, 2012 Author Posted December 28, 2012 When women ignore you they mean no. When they say no, they mean maybe if you work for it. Pretty much. For real? Where is the logic?!
Lonely Ronin Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 For real? Where is the logic?! Logic, only applies to dating part of the time.
Mme. Chaucer Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 Couple of things. First of all, SD's concept of women is not wrong. He's a single, heterosexual man. Single, heterosexual men are not looking for female friends. I have, currently, exactly 0 female friends. I'm looking to hook up, you're not interested? There's the door. No interest whatsoever in befriending a member of the opposite sex. Whatever, but you are not the norm. I have always had male friends since high school days, and my daughter has too. I mean real friends, and not guys who tried and failed to "hook up." You know, this "friend zone" that you and some of the other guys here seem to be fearful of and obsessed with is really no big deal, and it's probably not a real friendship. Women and men are all people. One gender does not exist just to provide sex for the other. People can have very valuable connections with each other regardless of their genders, even if there is some unfulfilled sexual tension between them. Why is that such a huge deal to guys like you? I think it's sad to dismiss half of the population from being in your life in any way other than a "hook up." Depressing to conceive of that. 4
JuneJulySeptember Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 For real? Where is the logic?! Who cares? They both mean no. Never chase a woman that has said no. Especially a guy in your (our) shoes.
KungFuJoe Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 MrCastle, I sense a bit of flip flopping... Here you say: "No interest whatsoever in befriending a member of the opposite sex." Then later on you say that it only applies if you're INTERESTED in her. The first comment...I think warrants some concern on how you view women. But, if you really meant to say it only applies to women you are INTERESTED in...then that's different.
Mme. Chaucer Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 I think there's a very distinct difference between avoiding the friendzone and ending up with friends of the opposite sex because you share a common interest but no attraction to each other (mutually). It's even possible to have friends of the opposite sex who you do find attractive, and/ or vice versa, or both ways. You just need boundaries, and sometimes it's well worth the trouble. Of course, this would not be happening with all these men who claim that there is no reason in the world that a heterosexual man would want a friendship with any "female" unless she was too ugly to screw … but they don't sound like very worthwhile friends, anyway. 3
JuneJulySeptember Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 (edited) It's even possible to have friends of the opposite sex who you do find attractive, and/ or vice versa, or both ways. You just need boundaries, and sometimes it's well worth the trouble. Of course, this would not be happening with all these men who claim that there is no reason in the world that a heterosexual man would want a friendship with any "female" unless she was too ugly to screw … but they don't sound like very worthwhile friends, anyway. It's a result of having been rejected by women where you were friends first, got to know them, they love you, but just don't think you're attractive. That is painful. Once you've been through it enough times, you don't want to ever go through it again. Not even a dog would continue to walk through an electronic fence and get shocked over and over again. Sad perhaps. But that's how it happens. It doesn't happen to all guys BTW. Edited December 28, 2012 by JuneJulySeptember 1
Author somedude81 Posted December 28, 2012 Author Posted December 28, 2012 If I find a girl attractive, and get along / have fun with her, after enough time together, I will fall for her. It's guaranteed. Then the question is, why would I want to put myself into a situation where unrequited love is going to happen? I'm not foolish enough anymore to believe that the female friend would fall for me.
TheZebra Posted December 28, 2012 Posted December 28, 2012 It's even possible to have friends of the opposite sex who you do find attractive, and/ or vice versa, or both ways. You just need boundaries, and sometimes it's well worth the trouble. Of course, this would not be happening with all these men who claim that there is no reason in the world that a heterosexual man would want a friendship with any "female" unless she was too ugly to screw … but they don't sound like very worthwhile friends, anyway. Ah, but I must differentiate between attractiveness and attraction. Attraction most often does not necessarily have everything to do with how attractive someone is. You can still be friends with attractive people but find other qualities of theirs to be unattractive, or they're just not your type. Here's my current situation, for example. I have a guy friend who objectively is attractive. We have a lot in common and hang out a lot. Regardless of how attractive he is, I still wouldn't date him though but for other reasons (lack of ambition/initiative is a biggie) that makes me have no attraction to him in a romantic way, even though he is a buff, tall, good looking dude.
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