Answer me this

[underwater2010]

I get the fact that most of the MOW/OW/OM/MOM think that they "love" or have a "soul mate" in their AP. But what the heck makes you think that the WS is going to be faithful to you, when they cannot be faithful to someone they married? Also, if they are constantly lying to their spouse, what make you so sure that they are telling you the truth?

[veryhappy]

Because there are nuances. If it's a one time cheating I can believe the person doesn't intend to repeat because I'm a cheater too, and know how I feel about it now and wouldn't do it again.

 

There's always a risk, but I don't think it's bigger than the person cheating again in their original R. Sometimes one needs to take a leap of faith.

 

Why do you think your h won't cheat again? Why do you think he would have been more likely to cheat on OW become partner than on you, reconciled W?

 

About the lying...there's been quite a few MM comig here saying they've been more honest to the OW than the W. I believe mine was and I believe in As where people find themselves, they tend to be at least on some dimensions.

[18Years2Late]

I get the fact that most of the MOW/OW/OM/MOM think that they "love" or have a "soul mate" in their AP. But what the heck makes you think that the WS is going to be faithful to you, when they cannot be faithful to someone they married? Also, if they are constantly lying to their spouse, what make you so sure that they are telling you the truth?

 

How can u be sure that anyone will be faithful to you?...how can u b sure ur S or SO is will u for the right reasons (i.e. just bc she/he doesn't want to share his/her kids, hurt his/her kids, split finances, or loose his/house house)?...50% of marriages end in D and 80% of that 50% is bc of infidelity whether disclosed or not...not good statistics...everything in life is a risk...nothing is guaranteed...and everyone is capable of making mistakes or bad decisions in the right situation...all you can do is TRUST...until you have a reason not to trust anymore...then u make changes as needed...

[jwi71]

I get the fact that most of the MOW/OW/OM/MOM think that they "love" or have a "soul mate" in their AP. But what the heck makes you think that the WS is going to be faithful to you, when they cannot be faithful to someone they married? Also, if they are constantly lying to their spouse, what make you so sure that they are telling you the truth?

 

Because people can and do change.

 

The future, while the best predictor of potential future behavior, is not a perfect predictor. It would be unwise to "write-off" a person because of poor decisions in one's past.

[MissBee]

Part of it is a psychological mechanism.

 

I read a great book the other day called: The Optimism Bias: A Tour of the Irrationally Positive Brain

 

It talks about how optimism is a survival hardwiring in the brain and it goes through different scenarios and examples of how humans have the tendency to discount risks or negative things happening to them and feeling that they are different...likewise, overestimating positive things happening for them, even though it didn't happen for others.

 

It talks about irrational optimism and discusses stuff like:

 

• how the brain generates hope and what happens when it fails

 

• how the brains of optimists and pessimists differ

 

• why we are terrible at predicting what will make us happy

 

• how anticipation and dread affect us

 

• how our optimistic illusions affect our financial, professional, and emotional decisions

 

 

Anyway that's one explanation in a general human/psychological way of why in the case of dating a MM or cheater or what have you why people are able to be optimistic about it.

[underwater2010]

How can u be sure that anyone will be faithful to you?

 

You are right we can never be sure.

 

...how can u b sure ur S or SO is will u for the right reasons (i.e. just bc she/he doesn't want to share his/her kids, hurt his/her kids, split finances, or loose his/house house)?

 

While those are a lot of the excuse that we hear from MOM, I do not believe those are most of the reasons. From what I have found most MOM tend to cheat for pure sex.

 

...50% of marriages end in D and 80% of that 50% is bc of infidelity whether disclosed or not...not good statistics...everything in life is a risk...nothing is guaranteed...and everyone is capable of making mistakes or bad decisions in the right situation...all you can do is TRUST...until you have a reason not to trust anymore...then u make changes as needed...

 

While I get all that....I do not understand why a MOW/OW/MOM/OM would even consider that their AP would be faithful based on prevoius behavior. As a BW with no past behavior of cheating I took a chance on "honest" man. I would not have considered marrying or involving myself with a man that has previous cheating behavioral patterns.

[skylarblue]

What the heck makes you (the BS generally speaking) think that the WS is going to be faithful to you (the BS) when they cannot be faithful to someone they married? They "proved" that by cheating on you (the BS).

 

Also, if they are constantly lying to their spouse, what make you (the BS) so sure that they are telling you the truth? They have "proven" themselves to be liars to you (the BS) throughout the A.

 

How could you (the BS) be able to reconcile with such a person?

 

For me, the part doesn't always equal the sum. Yes, it says there is POSSIBLE potential because/if it has happened before, but just because I did A there/then doesn't guarantee I'll do B here/now (otherwise we'd all be doomed). I get the technical aspect - the only person that could know what is 100% true/certain is the person "selling" it. I get the practical aspect - you're only as good as your current behavior. But in reality there are other things to be considered when making determinations.

[Got it]

I get the fact that most of the MOW/OW/OM/MOM think that they "love" or have a "soul mate" in their AP. But what the heck makes you think that the WS is going to be faithful to you, when they cannot be faithful to someone they married? Also, if they are constantly lying to their spouse, what make you so sure that they are telling you the truth?

 

What makes the BS think that they can recommit to them and be truthful and faithful after an affair? The answer, because you hope they will and you work to trust that they are.

 

I cheated on my spouse. I have never cheated on my dMM nor have I lied to him. My relationship and the dynamics of it was very different in both relationships. While I was unfaithful with my ex husband, the reasons for it no longer exist so I have no need or desire to be unfaithful to dMM. Why? Because I know that dMM is strong enough to handle me in my entirety. He can handle the truth on things, he can hang the struggles, and he is strong enough emotionally to be able to allow me to be honest about my needs, wants, desires, and concerns and not bury his head in the sand or lie to me.

 

To be honest, this relationship has more honesty in it than my marriage. I can be me with him.

[ComingInHot]

I am CIH's husband once again "hijacking" her user name. (she's sleeping on my lap). Couldn't help bug comment on this.

I Was more honest with the other woman (ex). It was actually easier to tell her stuff (stretching other things) cause I wasn't worried about disappointing her.

It would've killed me to disappoint my wife. But I did so much more to her than just disa ppoint. I will never take her for granted again.

My 02 cents.

[18Years2Late]

I am CIH's husband once again "hijacking" her user name. (she's sleeping on my lap). Couldn't help bug comment on this.

I Was more honest with the other woman (ex). It was actually easier to tell her stuff (stretching other things) cause I wasn't worried about disappointing her.

It would've killed me to disappoint my wife. But I did so much more to her than just disa ppoint. I will never take her for granted again.

My 02 cents.

 

Uuuum...creepy...someone else here used to do that (can't remember who) and it made me uneasy...don't know why...

[RickFox]

If xMW and I had somehow gotten together I honestly don't think I'd ever trust her at all, figuring she'd be out f'ing some other guy while I was at work just like she did with me while her H was out earning a living.

 

Sure I thought it was the pefect match, but then again, no matter how hard I tried to convince myself it would be different, I realized the trust would never be there and more than likely, it would end in disaster. The addictive nature of the affair tended to overshadow the negatives much of the time.

[firstandlast]

If xMW and I had somehow gotten together I honestly don't think I'd ever trust her at all, figuring she'd be out f'ing some other guy while I was at work just like she did with me while her H was out earning a living.

 

Sure I thought it was the pefect match, but then again, no matter how hard I tried to convince myself it would be different, I realized the trust would never be there and more than likely, it would end in disaster. The addictive nature of the affair tended to overshadow the negatives much of the time.

 

This is exactly right. You get so caught up in the emotions that all reason goes out the window.

[justwhoiam]

But what the heck makes you think that the WS is going to be faithful to you, when they cannot be faithful to someone they married?

23 years of marriage, never having sex with anyone else other than his wife. His past: few partners, very selective. Not much of a risk-taker.

 

Also, if they are constantly lying to their spouse, what make you so sure that they are telling you the truth?

The ability to verify and check anything and therefore being able to tell if he's lying or not.

[justwhoiam]

I wouldn't be too confident if I were you.

The question was not "Why are you so confident..."

 

These are the ones who are more likely to cheat on the OW-turned girlfriend/wife with their ex-wives.

That wouldn't make any sense.

[alexandria35]

I think a lot of it depends on the circumstances of the affair and what happens once the affair is discovered.

 

If the BW stays with WS then I would hope that the affair is a big wake up call to both spouses. If the married couple simply fight about it for a few weeks/month then go back to business as usual then I think there is high possibility of future cheating. If they use the affair as the catalyst to getting counselling and getting truly honest with each other on an intimate level then I think the there is much less chance of a future affair. Overall I would think that a WS who stays in the marriage after an affair is discovered and faces up to the daily hell and consequences of their affair and who shows a willingness to make it right and make the marriage better is probably less likely to cheat again then the WS who would simply walk away for the OW after causing such pain and destruction to their marriage, their family and their BS.

 

If the WS leaves for the OW and there is no period of mourning the marriage, there is no deep soul searching or counselling, no attempts at properly dealing with and healing whatever is deep inside the WS that allowed them to end their marriage in such a hurtful and destructive way, then I think the chance of future deceit and cheating is very very high. I would have a difficult time putting any of my faith or trust into a man who would leave a marriage and family for me. It might be ego boosting and validating in the moment to believe that a man would walk away from everything for me but in the longer term I doubt I could feel very good about it.

 

I have walked away from several long term relationship where

our lives have been very intertwined right down to shared living quarters, mutual finances and debts, etc. I believe I had very good reason for leaving those relationships due to the seriousness of the problems within them. Substance abuse, mental and emotional abuse bordering on physical, financial irresponsibility, etc. I don't regret leaving any of those relationships but to be honest, once you walk away from one relationship, it gets easier to walk away from the next one, and the next one. A man who would walk away from the marriage, family and life he has spent years building with his spouse, won't find it all that hard to walk away from whoever is next.

 

On one affair support board I used to read they had a section of the forum specifically for the OW who had MM's who had left the BS. When a MM would leave his wife there were usually many high fives and congradulations given by all on the boards. It was a cause of great celebration for the all the OW on the forum. Usually their relationships crashed and burned pretty quickly once the MM left the marriage. The MM would go back to their wives or eagerly jump back into the dating pool, excited to try out their newfound freedom. However there were a few OW with MM's that filed for divorce and quickly moved into committed relationships with the OW, often moving in with her and proposing marriage, playing step daddy to her kids, becoming part of her whole family and social circle. These OW often felt like the lucky ones, however it wasn't uncommon for even these OW to be back a year or even several years later wailing about how the MM had cheated on them or dumped them for someone new, or that they discovered that the MM was actually a self serving abusive creep once the BW was out of the way and could no longer be blamed for the MM's behaviour. I think an affair relationship can survive a divorce and go on to be a longterm long lasting relationship, however I think a lot of work has to be done in order to make that happen and I think many OW and MM don't do that work because they falsely believe that what happened before couldn't happen again.

[cocorico]

I get the fact that most of the MOW/OW/OM/MOM think that they "love" or have a "soul mate" in their AP. But what the heck makes you think that the WS is going to be faithful to you, when they cannot be faithful to someone they married? Also, if they are constantly lying to their spouse, what make you so sure that they are telling you the truth?

 

His track record shows him to be highly trustworthy. His family, friends, business associates etc all know him to be highly reliable and his "cheating" was completely out of character, and under particular circumstances. Before his A he had been completely faithful to his xW for decades. In all other contexts he is a model of propriety.

 

He did the work in counselling to understand why he acted as he did, and he's addressed those issues. Our R is very different from theirs, so those stressors which led to his infidelity aren't likely to arise, anyway, but even if they did he has other ways of dealing with such things now. And I know (with evidence) that he has never lied to me. He knows where I stand on issues, and we discuss things all the time, including our R, so any unhappiness has ample opportunity to get aired and addressed.

 

We've both been through the A, and we both know how wrong a R can go and how vulnerable a R can become to an A. We both know how lucky we are to have each other, and this R, and we make a point of prioritising it and making sure that it's the best R it could be.

 

But whatever I might think, I am realistic enough to know that no R is completely immune to something like infidelity. If it happens, it happens, and we'll deal with it at that point. For now, we're having a wonderful life together, and nothing will ever be able to take that away, even if things were to go awry down the track.

[KathyM]

What the heck makes you (the BS generally speaking) think that the WS is going to be faithful to you (the BS) when they cannot be faithful to someone they married? They "proved" that by cheating on you (the BS).

 

Also, if they are constantly lying to their spouse, what make you (the BS) so sure that they are telling you the truth? They have "proven" themselves to be liars to you (the BS) throughout the A.

 

How could you (the BS) be able to reconcile with such a person?

 

And this is one huge reason why reconciliation is so difficult. The trust has been shattered, and is so difficult to get back. I think, in the vast majority of cases, trust is not fully regained after such a betrayal. Once the man (or woman) has proven they are capable of crossing that line, it is extremely difficult to be able to trust them again. Difficult for the BS for sure. And I don't see how the OW/OM would be able to trust the WS either. He/she has proven what he's capable of, and that he is OK with crossing that line.

[cocorico]

He/she has proven what he's capable of, and that he is OK with crossing that line.

 

I think this might be the dividing line. I doubt I'd be ready to believe someone's promises if they'd shown they were OK with breaking promises, even if they were promises made to someone else.

 

While I can't speak for anyone else, in my own case watching how he dealt with the infidelity, talking through the issues with him, participating in his struggles and witnessing his progress through counselling showed me that he was anything but "OK" with "crossing that line", that the costs to him were very high and that the lessons he learned made future infidelity far less likely for him than for someone who had never had that exposure.

[18Years2Late]

I think a lot of it depends on the circumstances of the affair and what happens once the affair is discovered.

 

If the BW stays with WS then I would hope that the affair is a big wake up call to both spouses. If the married couple simply fight about it for a few weeks/month then go back to business as usual then I think there is high possibility of future cheating. If they use the affair as the catalyst to getting counselling and getting truly honest with each other on an intimate level then I think the there is much less chance of a future affair. Overall I would think that a WS who stays in the marriage after an affair is discovered and faces up to the daily hell and consequences of their affair and who shows a willingness to make it right and make the marriage better is probably less likely to cheat again then the WS who would simply walk away for the OW after causing such pain and destruction to their marriage, their family and their BS.

 

If the WS leaves for the OW and there is no period of mourning the marriage, there is no deep soul searching or counselling, no attempts at properly dealing with and healing whatever is deep inside the WS that allowed them to end their marriage in such a hurtful and destructive way, then I think the chance of future deceit and cheating is very very high. I would have a difficult time putting any of my faith or trust into a man who would leave a marriage and family for me. It might be ego boosting and validating in the moment to believe that a man would walk away from everything for me but in the longer term I doubt I could feel very good about it.

 

I have walked away from several long term relationship where

our lives have been very intertwined right down to shared living quarters, mutual finances and debts, etc. I believe I had very good reason for leaving those relationships due to the seriousness of the problems within them. Substance abuse, mental and emotional abuse bordering on physical, financial irresponsibility, etc. I don't regret leaving any of those relationships but to be honest, once you walk away from one relationship, it gets easier to walk away from the next one, and the next one. A man who would walk away from the marriage, family and life he has spent years building with his spouse, won't find it all that hard to walk away from whoever is next.

 

On one affair support board I used to read they had a section of the forum specifically for the OW who had MM's who had left the BS. When a MM would leave his wife there were usually many high fives and congradulations given by all on the boards. It was a cause of great celebration for the all the OW on the forum. Usually their relationships crashed and burned pretty quickly once the MM left the marriage. The MM would go back to their wives or eagerly jump back into the dating pool, excited to try out their newfound freedom. However there were a few OW with MM's that filed for divorce and quickly moved into committed relationships with the OW, often moving in with her and proposing marriage, playing step daddy to her kids, becoming part of her whole family and social circle. These OW often felt like the lucky ones, however it wasn't uncommon for even these OW to be back a year or even several years later wailing about how the MM had cheated on them or dumped them for someone new, or that they discovered that the MM was actually a self serving abusive creep once the BW was out of the way and could no longer be blamed for the MM's behaviour. I think an affair relationship can survive a divorce and go on to be a longterm long lasting relationship, however I think a lot of work has to be done in order to make that happen and I think many OW and MM don't do that work because they falsely believe that what happened before couldn't happen again.

 

Excellent post Alexandria!!!...all so true...