USMCHokie Posted December 15, 2012 Posted December 15, 2012 The best advice that is commonly given for being able to attract women is to seek self improvement to simply be more attractive. This is not just limited to physical attractiveness, but also includes intellectual, emotional, and social attractiveness. However, is there a realistic and practical "ceiling" that one can hit in terms of improving themselves before you have to start to wonder if it's something else that is the issue? Do people ever reach the point where their lives are so well in place that there's really no where left to "improve"? For those of you who struggle with dating who have sought self improvement and feel comfortable and confident with who you are and what you've accomplished, where do you go from there? Is it the law of diminishing returns at work? Can the issue really be something out of your control?
MrCastle Posted December 15, 2012 Posted December 15, 2012 I think even for men who are successful, there is a limit, but that's based on the individual woman. No one reaches a point where they hit a home run every time. Just because I'm successful with most girls doesn't mean there will come a time where I'm successful with all girls. No one will ever bat a thousand, because different women are into different things and you can't be everything to everyone. So, in that sense we have a ceiling. In the sense that no matter what we do, we will never be able to be successful with any girl we meet. 2
Author USMCHokie Posted December 15, 2012 Author Posted December 15, 2012 I think even for men who are successful, there is a limit, but that's based on the individual woman. No one reaches a point where they hit a home run every time. Just because I'm successful with most girls doesn't mean there will come a time where I'm successful with all girls. No one will ever bat a thousand, because different women are into different things and you can't be everything to everyone. So, in that sense we have a ceiling. In the sense that no matter what we do, we will never be able to be successful with any girl we meet. Do you sleep...? And my question was really more focused not on those who are trying to attract every woman, but those who can't attract any woman...
Revolver Posted December 15, 2012 Posted December 15, 2012 There's only so much someone can do. Attraction is just is, there are no “1-2-3 Steps” to getting someone to like you. That’s what everyone wants: How can I make him/her like me? You can’t make someone like you. It’s like saying there are steps to liking the color Red. You either do or you don’t. If there were 1-2-3 steps, then every man in America would just “get” supermodels all the time, because, hey, they followed the steps! I think most of the stuff designed to help men in that regard at their core, just gives them more confidence and helps them be better at capatilizing on opportunities. What I mean is, there are alot of guys that have women in their lives interested in them but don't even know it and when they do know it, don't know how to take the next step. Things like PUA and others help with that. 2
MrCastle Posted December 15, 2012 Posted December 15, 2012 Do you sleep...? And my question was really more focused not on those who are trying to attract every woman, but those who can't attract any woman... These are my primetime hours right now. When I'm not in school, going to bed at 6, 7am is my thing 4
Eternal Sunshine Posted December 15, 2012 Posted December 15, 2012 These are my primetime hours right now. When I'm not in school, going to bed at 6, 7am is my thing OMG! we have so much in common 1
iris219 Posted December 15, 2012 Posted December 15, 2012 These are my primetime hours right now. When I'm not in school, going to bed at 6, 7am is my thing OMG! we have so much in common You guys are weird. I wake up around 6 am! For those of you who struggle with dating who have sought self improvement and feel comfortable and confident with who you are and what you've accomplished, where do you go from there? Is it the law of diminishing returns at work? Can the issue really be something out of your control? Absolutely. There are a lot of factors at work when it comes to meeting and attracting the opposite sex, and "improving yourself" isn't going to cut it for some. I see people, like myself, who are pretty awesome people yet we struggle with dating. For these people, I'm convinced there isn't much they can do at all.
EasyHeart Posted December 15, 2012 Posted December 15, 2012 Of course there's a limit for "improving yourself". That goes for all aspects of life, not just dating. We all have natural ceilings in everything we do. I think a better way to look at it is: "Make the most of what you have". You can't make yourself better looking, but you can get a flattering haircut and learn to dress well; you can't turn yourself into the life of the party, but you can learn how to initiate and maintain a conversation; you can't look like Adonis, but you can learn how to exercise and get in decent shape; you might never be Mr. Sensitive, but you can learn to listen and understand how women think; you might never be rich, but you can learn to live within your means and follow a budget; etc., etc., etc. The other important thing to accept is that you will never be able to attract every woman in the world. Even the best-looking, most charismatic men in the world will run into lots and lots of women who say, "no thanks". But you don't need to attract every woman in the world; you just need to attract one that you're happy to be with.
TouchedByViolet Posted December 15, 2012 Posted December 15, 2012 The other important thing to accept is that you will never be able to attract every woman in the world. Even the best-looking, most charismatic men in the world will run into lots and lots of women who say, "no thanks". But you don't need to attract every woman in the world; you just need to attract one that you're happy to be with. A lot of truth to this. Their are definitely certain ceilings to attraction but it's not so straight forward. Attraction is like an art. Their is always room to experiment, be creative and try something new. Sometimes the results can be surprising.
jcrew11 Posted December 15, 2012 Posted December 15, 2012 The best advice that is commonly given for being able to attract women is to seek self improvement to simply be more attractive. This is not just limited to physical attractiveness, but also includes intellectual, emotional, and social attractiveness. However, is there a realistic and practical "ceiling" that one can hit in terms of improving themselves before you have to start to wonder if it's something else that is the issue? Do people ever reach the point where their lives are so well in place that there's really no where left to "improve"? For those of you who struggle with dating who have sought self improvement and feel comfortable and confident with who you are and what you've accomplished, where do you go from there? Is it the law of diminishing returns at work? Can the issue really be something out of your control? I would focus on the physical attraction improvement. There is only so much you can "socially" improve other than by practice.
yongyong Posted December 15, 2012 Posted December 15, 2012 I don't think there is a ceiling. It's just about whether you want to put an effort or not. A lot of people just want to justify themselves by saying 'you either have it or don't. I don't have it. so it's not my fault' instead of admitting their laziness. I think I will do a lot better if I read lots of books in different categories, focus on at least one hobby heavily. But I am lazy to do that.
Author USMCHokie Posted December 16, 2012 Author Posted December 16, 2012 When are you going to Australia? I decided to change my plans.
ThaWholigan Posted December 16, 2012 Posted December 16, 2012 I don't think there is a ceiling. It's just about whether you want to put an effort or not. A lot of people just want to justify themselves by saying 'you either have it or don't. I don't have it. so it's not my fault' instead of admitting their laziness. I think I will do a lot better if I read lots of books in different categories, focus on at least one hobby heavily. But I am lazy to do that. Thinking out loud..... I would say that people are innately gifted more in some areas than others and that it sometimes takes a little more work. However, I'm not sure if this could necessarily be applied to attraction - there are attraction styles that resonate with some groups of individuals but not with another group. I think the "ceiling" as it were may possibly relate to the generality of one's sex appeal or attractiveness in men and women. As in, how many people you attract. It's no secret that I study astrology, and I do use it for social purposes with regards to analyzing society and people. When doing charts, I sought to find the "sexiest" chart combinations. Not surprisingly, the most attractive people had similar placements. Sometimes, they weren't even objectively attractive, but they still attracted people and this showed up in their charts. Ever since then I started using them as a way to see where people's strengths lie and how they could improve certain things - the first test was myself of course . That test is ongoing . I digress.... I think to a large degree, no matter how much "improvement" and boosting of one's appeal you do, you don't have a great deal of control in the outcome of attraction. It happens. Again, learned that from astrology. Free will still trumps all . Also, considering synastry, there are always people who will match/complement you, even if you think they won't. Where there may be a propensity for attraction. Just have to meet more people to find them. Easier said than done.....
Author USMCHokie Posted December 16, 2012 Author Posted December 16, 2012 I would focus on the physical attraction improvement. There is only so much you can "socially" improve other than by practice. To be perfectly honest, I think I'm at the point where I'm as physically attractive as I'm ever going to get...
Eternal Sunshine Posted December 16, 2012 Posted December 16, 2012 To be perfectly honest, I think I'm at the point where I'm as physically attractive as I'm ever going to get... And that's plenty!
Author USMCHokie Posted December 16, 2012 Author Posted December 16, 2012 A lot of truth to this. Their are definitely certain ceilings to attraction but it's not so straight forward. Attraction is like an art. Their is always room to experiment, be creative and try something new. Sometimes the results can be surprising. Well I'm not talking about ceilings of attraction, i.e., the most attractive woman you can attract, but ceilings in yourself, i.e., the most attractive you can be. It's a very important distinction that must be made.
Content Posted December 16, 2012 Posted December 16, 2012 Well I'm not talking about ceilings of attraction, i.e., the most attractive woman you can attract, but ceilings in yourself, i.e., the most attractive you can be. It's a very important distinction that must be made. Possibly but all that i care about is that im attracitve enough to attract who im attracted to, if i cant is when theyres a problem for me anyway 1
Author USMCHokie Posted December 16, 2012 Author Posted December 16, 2012 Possibly but all that i care about is that im attracitve enough to attract who im attracted to, if i cant is when theyres a problem for me anyway And therein lies my original question...when you've made the diligent effort to be the best you can be, and that still isn't good enough to attract who you're attracted to, what next...? Is it truly out of your control...? For example, if you take one of LS's Lovable Losers, and he actually does make the self improvements and women still aren't attracted to him, what is next to do...?
Content Posted December 16, 2012 Posted December 16, 2012 And therein lies my original question...when you've made the diligent effort to be the best you can be, and that still isn't good enough to attract who you're attracted to, what next...? Is it truly out of your control...? For example, if you take one of LS's Lovable Losers, and he actually does make the self improvements and women still aren't attracted to him, what is next to do...? I agree in that you cant force attraction so if you maxed out your physical and personality then i dont know what the answer is or if there is one i just know of seen all types of men from hideous looking ones to no personality to f'in weirdos with women so its why i dont beleive anyones totally helpless. I think for guys who arent born with great genetics its more about luck in that you have meaning you have to be lucky enough to have the small number of women that might be attracted to you somehow a part of your social circle or life somehow wheter through a friend work or whatever and if that doesnt happen then you might have issues. Its weird but ive beem in social circles where women wanted nothing to do with me and while they straight out didnt reject me i could tell by how cold they were in conversation they didnt want to give me the impression they were interested and ive been apart of other social circles where most women in it told my friends how cute they thought i was So my point is for us mere mortals unfortunately a lot of it is luck and being in the right place at the right time
Content Posted December 16, 2012 Posted December 16, 2012 I will say though some men just inherently turn women off and i dont know what you can do to fix it because its an intangible thing My friend is not an attractive man at all facially but hes not a monster,hes in decent shape makes a decent living and is pretty friendly so on paper he isnt bad. Ive seen him get rejected by a whole club and bar of women which is pretty hard to do,hes been on tons of dates through online but cant get past a first or second date. When ive talked to my friends wives about him they say somethings just off about him that he comes off as creepy and gives off no masculine energy whatever that means to them and that something about him just turns them off immensely. Now if he was very good lookign hed probably get more opportunities and women glossing over it for at least casual sex maybe but regardless how do you change something inherently that turns women off and is so intangible? I dont know if you can
KungFuJoe Posted December 16, 2012 Posted December 16, 2012 Human beings are the most dynamic things in the universe. We have an almost infinite amount of qualities, features, characteristics, etc that can be manipulated in specific ways. Yes, you can change these things just so much, but remember, the line between beauty and homely is VERY VERY thin.
Author USMCHokie Posted December 16, 2012 Author Posted December 16, 2012 Human beings are the most dynamic things in the universe. We have an almost infinite amount of qualities, features, characteristics, etc that can be manipulated in specific ways. Yes, you can change these things just so much, but remember, the line between beauty and homely is VERY VERY thin. Sure, but that infinite amount is severely limited by things such as finite time, resources, and energy...as well as the practicalities of life.
KungFuJoe Posted December 16, 2012 Posted December 16, 2012 Sure, but that infinite amount is severely limited by things such as finite time, resources, and energy...as well as the practicalities of life. See the post I just made in the other thread regarding improving your physical looks and exterior appearance. I don't care what anyone says about confidence. You can act like the most confident person in the world, but if you walk around looking like a sloppy bum (and don't have the luck of looking like a runway model) you are going to look like a sloppy bum. Not all of us look like Ryan Gosling or Channing Tatum. So we have to work a little harder. It's the natural order of things and how life works. Just like some of us aren't as naturally intelligent as others and we have to study longer and harder.
runner Posted December 16, 2012 Posted December 16, 2012 let's assume that there is this supposed 'ceiling' and that you have hit yours. so what comes next ? i'd suggest getting out of your own head and try making the girl you desire feel attractive instead.
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