CantgetoveritNY Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 I've not been on LS long but since I have been I've felt like I'm the only one that feels there is some responsibility for the OM/OW to act morally. I keep hearing that the wayward spouse is all to blame. The wayward spouse gave the gift that belonged to you, BS, willingly to the OM/OW. So you have no complaint with the OM/OW. The OM/OW was just accepting that what your spouse owed to you but gave to them. Well maybe if your spouse lied to the OM/OW and told them they were single. But that is not often the case. I think more often than not the OM/OW is fully aware that they are involved with a married person. In fact many times the OM/OW must have been actively seeking out married persons. Take the example of the serial cheater, who sets his or her sights on a married person who had never cheated before. The experienced party with well practiced and expert skills begins the pursuit. Calls and texts relentlessly. In the case of an OM he plays the romance card to the fullest. In the case of the OW she offers passion with little or no strings attached. The pursued party is flattered but responds only sparingly. Tries to do the right thing. Eventually the pursuer overcomes the moral compass of the pursued. At that point the pursued do indeed betray their spouse. They then become part of the equation that wrecks havoc in their lives, the lives of their children and their spouse. But I hardly think that in a case like this, where one party is pursued relentlessly by an "office slut" or as in my case a serial cheater who had been caught by his wife 7 times previous and sued successively by a former employee once, well in these types of cases it is ludicrous to say that the pursuer is blameless. No, the pursuer is akin to a rapist or child molester. The participating spouse in not as blameless as a child or a rape victim but is certainly not to be seen as the source of all evil in the affair. What do you think? 1
underwater2010 Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 I believe that in majority of the cases the OW/OM deserves 50% of the responsibility. Which comes with 50% of the anger when the affair is exposed. The only time I feel sorry for the OW/OM is when they DID NOT know that the AP was married. I DO NOT give my FWH a pass just because she pursued him hard. He should have dropped all contact when it began to be anything other than casual. He was weak and not moral enough to keep from engaging in the affair. But I am just as angry at her as I am at my FWH. She was married with kids for christ sake. She knew just as well as he did how much pain they could inflict and took a chance at destroy two families. She is also a serial cheater who thinks of nothing but herself. And please do not forget to use her childhood as an excuse. 1
Decorative Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 You are not the only one. I don't even think you are a small minority. I think the majority of betrayed spouses and repentant others agree with you. 3
frozensprouts Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 I agree with you in many areas... if one looks at an affair from he perspective that it is hurtful, and that without the affair, this hurt would not exist. It takes two people to have an affair- the wayward spouse and the other man/woman-without both those parties, the affair would not exist. The end result of this is that , since it took two people to have the affair, both are responsible albeit in different ways, for the affair and any fallout that occurs... a few points... (a) this doesn't absolve the wayward spouse of their responsibility for the affair-both parties are responsible (b) this doesn't mean that all other men/women are horrible people, rather, it means that they made some pretty poor choices © while it may be true that if it wasn't that particular other man/woman, the wayward spouse would have cheated anyway with someone else...the pragmatics of it are that it wasn't someone else, it was that particular other man/woman (d) it's not really for the other man/woman to say how the betrayed spouse should allocate responsibility for the affair... (e) many people feel that we do have a responsibility to treat others with respect and common decency...some may not agree, but I would hazard a guess that they wish to be treated that way themselves...seems a a pretty hypocritical stance to not extended that same courtesy to anyone else....
Decorative Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 There was a lengthy thread about this topic not long ago at all. I cannot remember which forum it was in- but it was quite recent. It had a lot of great insight, and the vast majority of people believed they owe other people to try and not and cause harm to them. It supports the OP's view that both affair partners share responsibility - and perhaps it would make the OP feel less alone? Does anyone else remember that thread? It's in General. Titled "I'm Going To Get in Trouble For Saying This". 1
frozensprouts Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 that was one I started a few weeks ago...
Decorative Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 that was one I started a few weeks ago... It all came rushing back to me! LOL
waterwoman Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 I don't know that I'd call it a duty. Unless everyone in a society subscribes to certain morality it would be impossible to demand that they all follow rules pertaining to it. The law won't help as it isn't illegal in most countries to have an affair with someone else's SO. Religion won't do it -how many people who profess a religious belief always follow all the precepts of that faith in every particular?. I'd prefer to think that simple compassion would make anyone reluctant to do anything to hurt another so deeply. I try to live that way but I know I fail often enough. Anyway even that doesn't work although from reading these boards it is clear that a lot of OW/OM do feel a sense of abiding concern for the BS in the situation - but not enough to stop I guess. You can't force people to do the right thing. You can't force them to feel bad for not doing it either. 2
Author CantgetoveritNY Posted December 5, 2012 Author Posted December 5, 2012 that was one I started a few weeks ago... How do I find it?
Decorative Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 How do I find it? Look in the General forum. I believe it's on page 3 or so.
eleanorrigby Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 The only AP that gets a "do not go to jail" card from me is the one that didn't know. The moment they know, they get blame from me for their part. Period. 6
MissBee Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 I don't know that I'd call it a duty. Unless everyone in a society subscribes to certain morality it would be impossible to demand that they all follow rules pertaining to it. The law won't help as it isn't illegal in most countries to have an affair with someone else's SO. Religion won't do it -how many people who profess a religious belief always follow all the precepts of that faith in every particular?. I'd prefer to think that simple compassion would make anyone reluctant to do anything to hurt another so deeply. I try to live that way but I know I fail often enough. Anyway even that doesn't work although from reading these boards it is clear that a lot of OW/OM do feel a sense of abiding concern for the BS in the situation - but not enough to stop I guess. You can't force people to do the right thing. You can't force them to feel bad for not doing it either. I have to agree. I think duty and owe are a bit too strong. I think it comes down to one's choice and free will to be compassionate/empathetic or to act based upon certain principles as you said. I felt badly for my part in the A at the time and I believe I was culpable and an accomplice to that situation and would never have spouted on about "It's his problem, not mine" or just had that type of arrogant attitude. However, I wouldn't say I owed or had a moral duty to the BS. In terms of duty and obligation, then the WS has to bear the brunt of that. 1
Realist3 Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 Does OW/OM have a duty to the BS? I've not been on LS long but since I have been I've felt like I'm the only one that feels there is some responsibility for the OM/OW to act morally. I'm a bit confused by the question. A duty or responsibility to act morally to the BS in what context? 1
Ninja'sHusband Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 As far as blame goes, I believe they are 50/50 but the person the BS should focus on is the WS, not the AP. I think this is what people who "blame only the WS" really mean. They have a very valid point that I agree with. The WS is the one they have the relationship with...and really you can't even control them. All you can do is be the best person you can and decide if you want to stay in that relationship or not. An example of laying the responsibility on the WS is having them notify you immediately if the AP contacts them. The shouldn't try to hide it. You can't stop the AP from trying to make contact but you can make it clear that your WS should make such attempts known...or you can't trust them because they still hide things from you. That said, in general I think it's everyone's responsibility to stay the hell out of someone else's marriage! I dug back in time and found a couple older similar threads: http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/other-man-woman/344400-fault-all-ow Why be angry at the other person? - LoveShack.org Community Forums though I think I'm still missing the one I was looking for ^^
Spark1111 Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 I'm a bit confused by the question. A duty or responsibility to act morally to the BS in what context? As in not to engage in an affair with a MP. In your case, it would be your MAPs H finding out about her affair with you. I think he would be angry at both of you. Very. What do you think?
Ninja'sHusband Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 (edited) Is it an outsider's duty not to shoot your spouse with a gun? Hmm, another thought is that your spouse could have had an A with anyone, and still could. They are the one who you should hold accountable...but do people have a duty to act morally to other people? YES..it's just a matter of what situation you choose to put yourself in. You have to decide if you trust your WS or not. That's the person that matters. Edited December 5, 2012 by Ninja'sHusband 2
Realist3 Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 As in not to engage in an affair with a MP. In your case, it would be your MAPs H finding out about her affair with you. I think he would be angry at both of you. Very. What do you think? He would be beyond furious. Is it my duty or responsibilty to act in some moral way regarding what made his wife go outside of their marriage for affection? No. 1
Author CantgetoveritNY Posted December 5, 2012 Author Posted December 5, 2012 As far as blame goes, I believe they are 50/50 but the person the BS should focus on is the WS, not the AP. I dug back in time and found a couple older similar threads: http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/other-man-woman/344400-fault-all-ow Why be angry at the other person? - LoveShack.org Community Forums though I think I'm still missing the one I was looking for ^^ I think it is probably very rarely a 50/50 thing. I think if you had the facts of what happened you could evaluate each affair partner objectively and the parts each party played and assign culpability based on that. I think that is what drives a lot of BS's to want to have the whole story, the whole truth and be able to believe what they are told about what happened. Including what otherwise might seem to be minor details. We want to be able to judge for ourselves how culpable was our WS. We have seen the posts about how that is impossible to determine to a satisfactory level at times but to try and get as close as you can to an answer is what a lot of us here are doing. Thanks for digging up the old threads. 1
buckeyeblue Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 Hi. This is my first post. I have been lurking in various forums for a few months now. I see the topic of morality visited frequently here. Of course there is a moral/social obligation to treat people with respect and honor - as you yourself would want to be treated. In fact, there is a moral/social obligation to treat YOURSELF with respect. This obligation is one of the most prevailing characteristics which separates us from other animals. So, yes, the AP has an obligation, not only to the BS, but also to himself/herself to act decently, honorably, and compassionately, not just when the mood strikes him/her, but at all times. It's about honor and respect for yourself and for others. 3
woinlove Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 Like several others, I would not call it a duty or obligation but agree with the sentiment. I think it comes down to how one wants to treat others (as well as oneself, if one values honesty). One's choices put one's values and attitudes toward others on display. An example which is much less unkind and hurtful, is jumping a long line simply because one doesn't want to wait. Again, this is not a duty or obligation, but a matter of whether one chooses to treat others with respect.
William Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 (edited) that was one I started a few weeks ago... For interested readers, here's the link: http://www.loveshack.org/forums/general/general-relationship-discussion/357071-im-going-get-into-trouble-saying Unless the thread starter is actively in an affair, on either side (meaning MM/MW or BH/BW), this thread will be moved to GRD as well, and perhaps merged, as the content appears similar. Edited December 5, 2012 by William
Ninja'sHusband Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 For interested readers, here's the link: http://www.loveshack.org/forums/general/general-relationship-discussion/357071-im-going-get-into-trouble-saying Unless the thread starter is actively in an affair, on either side (meaning MM/MW or BH/BW), this thread will be moved to GRD as well, and perhaps merged, as the content appears similar. I vote to leave the thread here. It's about infidelity and the OP is a BS. Thanks for the link. Good thread Good God, 24 likes on the first post? 1
NotCamelot Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 I believe that in majority of the cases the OW/OM deserves 50% of the responsibility. Which comes with 50% of the anger when the affair is exposed. The only time I feel sorry for the OW/OM is when they DID NOT know that the AP was married. I agree 100% with this comment. It is a point I have tried to make many times. Unfortunately most do not agree with me.
Author CantgetoveritNY Posted December 5, 2012 Author Posted December 5, 2012 They're probably the same people who see a car accident and just keep going rather than call 911 or stop to help because they feel it's not their business. I find those people to be loathsome. I think it is worse than that. A better analogy would be a person at partial fault for an accident that then leave the scene. Hit and run. 4
eleanorrigby Posted December 5, 2012 Posted December 5, 2012 I think it is worse than that. A better analogy would be a person at partial fault for an accident that then leave the scene. Hit and run. I like that analogy, but I can already imagine that the counter argument that they were merely a passenger in MM's car when he rammed headlong into the marriage. 1
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