Do OW/OM just NOT like their own gender?...

[ComingInHot]

I have been reading... I know, shocker* and there are some responses (one in-particular) that stated A's weren't about love, lust,like or sex but that the OW/OM do it to torment the BS and to prove themselves better than the BS. I can kind of see the thought process behind this. I mean I would have to have some serious animosity towards my gender to Betray my fellow woman. I sometimes think my husband's exOW hated other females as she didn't really have girlfriends just opposite wex frienships. But then I consider, after everything that happened during and after (when she outed the A) that maybe she just really didn't like herself and was insecure therefore constantly had to "prove" to herself that she was prettier, smarter, better etc...

I just don't understand or necessarily believe that a woman could be confident w/herself (or himself) as to knowingly enter into a sexual relationship (knowing the MM/MW is having sex w/their spouse) w/a married person. Insecure, yes. Lonely, yes, competitive, yes. Mean, yes. But confident, admirable, no, not sincerely...

So attraction or not, Why do it? Do you hate your gender? Yourself? Was it sex or "love"?

Then what happened?

For BS's why/what do you feel was going on there w/you WS's OW/OM?

[meandmyself]

I have been reading... I know, shocker* and there are some responses (one in-particular) that stated A's weren't about love, lust,like or sex but that the OW/OM do it to torment the BS and to prove themselves better than the BS. I can kind of see the thought process behind this. I mean I would have to have some serious animosity towards my gender to Betray my fellow woman. I sometimes think my husband's exOW hated other females as she didn't really have girlfriends just opposite wex frienships. But then I consider, after everything that happened during and after (when she outed the A) that maybe she just really didn't like herself and was insecure therefore constantly had to "prove" to herself that she was prettier, smarter, better etc...

I just don't understand or necessarily believe that a woman could be confident w/herself (or himself) as to knowingly enter into a sexual relationship (knowing the MM/MW is having sex w/their spouse) w/a married person. Insecure, yes. Lonely, yes, competitive, yes. Mean, yes. But confident, admirable, no, not sincerely...

So attraction or not, Why do it? Do you hate your gender? Yourself? Was it sex or "love"?

Then what happened?

For BS's why/what do you feel was going on there w/you WS's OW/OM?

 

Although I disapprove on labels for people I guess the easier way to explain it for me is:

 

I think about it like a beta male/female trying to proof they can be an alpha by hitting on the alpha's partner...

 

At the end of the day they are just beta's trying to feel better than the alphas... it is sad

[underwater2010]

My FWH and his MOW never talked about leaving their BSs. So I figure it was just about the sex and "feeling good".

 

Let me tell you...after talking with her BH...she is a piece of work. If I had to hear one more time about her bad childhood, I would scream. Here is a piece of advice...I can feel sorry for anyone that has a bad childhood, but you better learn from it. Learn how to treat people right, do not use it as an excuse to hurt random strangers.

[skywriter]

I have been reading... I know, shocker* and there are some responses (one in-particular) that stated A's weren't about love, lust,like or sex but that the OW/OM do it to torment the BS and to prove themselves better than the BS.

 

That is rediculous...

[meandmyself]

I have been reading... I know, shocker* and there are some responses (one in-particular) that stated A's weren't about love, lust,like or sex but that the OW/OM do it to torment the BS and to prove themselves better than the BS.

 

That is rediculous...

 

Like the Metallica song says "sad but true"....

[MissBee]

I don't think hating one's gender necessarily correlates with affairs. I think that is the case for some people though, or they have an insecurity with self, that manifests as not being able to tolerate their own gender.

 

I have an acquaintance who is this way. All she does is talk about how she cannot get along with women and women this and women that, and how she hangs out with mostly men. Now...her hanging out with them always blurs the lines and it's not platonic at all but her need to hang out with men who want more, who shower her with admiration and attention, where she gets her ego stroked, but then she can say, "we're just friends!". She is attractive but deeply insecure. She gains temporary validation from having a harem of male admirers that she acts like they're just innocent friends. Not unsurprisingly, she has no boundaries with taken men and then when their gfs get upset about it, she uses it to say "See! Women are jealous of me! I look better and she's just scared of me! Women are such drama" blah blah . She hasn't out right been in an A, I don't think, but I do think there is a type of woman like this who is constantly competing with other women and uses men and relationships to do so. I also have another friend who I feel sad for, because the basis of her current relationship is built upon how she "won him" from some other girl. It is sad because she acts like her bf is a trophy and that the ONLY REASON she even wants him, is because this other girl did. This other girl has long moved on (it's been over 3 years) and my friend still brings her up and makes snide comments or posts FB pictures and statuses about her R out of spite towards her. How can your love life be solely based upon using it to rub it in another's face? Yet she does it....so I know some people consciously or subconsciously get into As or other relationships as a means to feel like they're winning. Some OW have indeed said knowing a MM would "risk it all" for them made them special or "more special" than the BS.

 

I am ALWAYS leery of women who claim they can't get along with other women. Those kinds of women always have some deep issues, from my experience and their own issues and insecurities often cause them to feel threatened by other women, even when no threat exists, but they turn it around to say other women are bad/drama/jealous. I also know men who are deeply insecure and who cannot get along with other men, so only have a harem of female admirers...but their spin on things is different.

Edited December 4, 2012 by MissBee

[BrokenPrincess]

I never felt like I was in competition with his W. Our relationship was separate and we both had no desire to leave our Ms. I don't hate women and have tons of girlfriends, both new and lifelong friendships.

 

Should I have a loyalty to MM's wife just because we're the same gender, versus the man I've connected with and have happily enjoyed spending hours & hours talking to, reading books together, going out dancing, getting physically intimate, etc?

[freestyle]

I do believe there are cases, where it's more about competing, and "besting" the BS---but I don't think it's the norm.

 

One of my former girlfriends is a good example of this---she turned out to be a serial OW. (much more than I realized, when I compared notes with another one of her former friends)

 

In over ten years of friendship with her--I saw her date a handful of single guys, but she'd sabotage the relationship, every time. And continue crying over/pursuing the men who were already married/in relationships.

 

It makes me wonder if she wasn't replaying some childhood wound of sibling rivalry, over & over again. Feeling the need to continually compete, and "win" to be the center of attention.

[freestyle]

I don't think hating one's gender necessarily correlates with affairs. I think that is the case for some people though, or they have an insecurity with self, that manifests as not being able to tolerate their own gender.

 

I have an acquaintance who is this way. All she does is talk about how she cannot get along with women and women this and women that, and how she hangs out with mostly men. Now...her hanging out with them always blurs the lines and it's not platonic at all but her need to hang out with men who want more, who shower her with admiration and attention, where she gets her ego stroked, but then she can say, "we're just friends!". She is attractive but deeply insecure. She gains temporary validation from having a harem of male admirers that she acts like they're just innocent friends. Not unsurprisingly, she has no boundaries with taken men and then when their gfs get upset about it, she uses it to say "See! Women are jealous of me! I look better and she's just scared of me! Women are such drama" blah blah . She hasn't out right been in an A, I don't think, but I do think there is a type of woman like this who is constantly competing with other women and uses men and relationships to do so. I also have another friend who I feel sad for, because the basis of her current relationship is built upon how she "won him" from some other girl. It is sad because she acts like her bf is a trophy and that the ONLY REASON she even wants him, is because this other girl did. This other girl has long moved on (it's been over 3 years) and my friend still brings her up and makes snide comments or posts FB pictures and statuses about her R out of spite towards her. How can your love life be solely based upon using it to rub it in another's face? Yet she does it....so I know some people consciously or subconsciously get into As or other relationships as a means to feel like they're winning. Some OW have indeed said knowing a MM would "risk it all" for them made them special or "more special" than the BS.

 

I am ALWAYS leery of women who claim they can't get along with other women. Those kinds of women always have some deep issues, from my experience and their own issues and insecurities often cause them to feel threatened by other women, even when no threat exists, but they turn it around to say other women are bad/drama/jealous. I also know men who are deeply insecure and who cannot get along with other men, so only have a harem of female admirers...but their spin on things is different.

 

 

I didn't see your post before I posted my reply.

 

You just described my former friend, to a "tee".

 

My FF actually went so far as to try to seduce a mutual married friend of ours.

 

He turned her down--and a week later, she sent his W a friend request on Facebook. (I guess she was going to try the backdoor approach of befriending her, gaining her trust, to find out where the chinks in the marriage were, so she could start chiseling)

[cocorico]

So attraction or not, Why do it? Do you hate your gender? Yourself? Was it sex or "love"?

Then what happened?

 

No, I hate neither my gender nor myself. But I also don't hate men, and nor do I generalise across genders (or race, or class) - I prefer to form opinions about people as individuals, rather than assuming some kind of solidarity because we might share a gender, a race, a social class or a nationality. So I like some women, dislike others, like some men, dislike others, etc. no one gets a free pass based solely on their gender.

 

Why did I do it? It suited me. We both wanted the same thing, there was no hidden agenda, it suited both of our needs. She did not feature in the motivation at all - at least, not from my side. I wanted a certain type of R, I wanted him, and the two came together quite nicely.

[meandmyself]

No, I hate neither my gender nor myself. But I also don't hate men, and nor do I generalise across genders (or race, or class) - I prefer to form opinions about people as individuals, rather than assuming some kind of solidarity because we might share a gender, a race, a social class or a nationality. So I like some women, dislike others, like some men, dislike others, etc. no one gets a free pass based solely on their gender.

 

Why did I do it? It suited me. We both wanted the same thing, there was no hidden agenda, it suited both of our needs. She did not feature in the motivation at all - at least, not from my side. I wanted a certain type of R, I wanted him, and the two came together quite nicely.

 

Just one question and really not meant in the bad way, just pure curiosity... have you ever felt guilty about it? have you ever feel sorry for his wife? Have you ever felt he was using you when he was going back to his wife?

Not trying to judge you... just from the pure curiosity stand point.

[frozensprouts]

If it's a single one time only, never did it before and never will again, then it's probably not an issue of "hating their own gender" or lack of empathy...

 

if someone is a serial other man/woman, then it seems to me that there is something that keeps that person from being able to feel any empathy for the people who may be hurt by their behaviors, or a severe need to boost one's self esteem by somehow "proving" themselves that if the married person chose to cheat with them, that that somehow makes them "better" than the spouse and therefore boosts their self esteem...

 

I never really understood people who prefer relationships with married people and who go out of their way to pursue that particular type of relationship...there is something really wrong there...

 

the same is true for other women ( or other me too) who feel a need to constantly run down their affair partners spouse...especially when it's someone they don't even know and who, in all reality, has done nothing to them...to me, that speaks greatly to the insecurity of the "other person"

[cocorico]

Just one question and really not meant in the bad way, just pure curiosity... have you ever felt guilty about it? have you ever feel sorry for his wife? Have you ever felt he was using you when he was going back to his wife?

Not trying to judge you... just from the pure curiosity stand point.

 

Guilty, no, never. We are both consenting adults, exercising free choice, happily owning the consequences (good and bad) of our choices. I don't do guilt. I live authentically and make sure that my choices are always in accordance with my values.

 

I did not feel sorry for his xW because he had an A. I did fleetingly feel pity for her for alienating a man who had stood by her (despite the awful way she treated him and his family) for decades, who was (and still is, but no longer to her) an ideal H in every way I can think of, to the extent that he checked out of the M and landed up in another woman's arms. But the more I got to know of her, the more the pity was replaced with active dislike.

 

And no, I never felt "used". We were two consenting adults wanting the same thing, and we both gave and we both received, there was no asymmetry in the R. I also knew he was not "going back to his W", I had a pretty good idea of their R from his family and friends, certainly nothing to envy or covet. And at the point where I started to resent that we were not together full-time, I found he was feeling the same, so we both made the necessary changes so we could be together.

 

Apologies for the off-topic response, OP.

[meandmyself]

Guilty, no, never. We are both consenting adults, exercising free choice, happily owning the consequences (good and bad) of our choices. I don't do guilt. I live authentically and make sure that my choices are always in accordance with my values.

 

I did not feel sorry for his xW because he had an A. I did fleetingly feel pity for her for alienating a man who had stood by her (despite the awful way she treated him and his family) for decades, who was (and still is, but no longer to her) an ideal H in every way I can think of, to the extent that he checked out of the M and landed up in another woman's arms. But the more I got to know of her, the more the pity was replaced with active dislike.

 

And no, I never felt "used". We were two consenting adults wanting the same thing, and we both gave and we both received, there was no asymmetry in the R. I also knew he was not "going back to his W", I had a pretty good idea of their R from his family and friends, certainly nothing to envy or covet. And at the point where I started to resent that we were not together full-time, I found he was feeling the same, so we both made the necessary changes so we could be together.

 

Apologies for the off-topic response, OP.

 

Thank you for the honest answer.

And also apologies to the OP !

[ComingInHot]

Skywriter,

If you had commented,"that's not how I am", or something not so defensive, I may have been inclined to see your point. But you came across defensive which leads me to think the latter...

But posts can easily be mis interpreted*

[skywriter]

I wasn't defensive, it was the my first thought when reading, that an A wasn't about anything other than tormenting another human being. The only thing I could think is , "that's rediculous"!....and it is....

 

That statement is how reading that made me feel. I suppose there are men and or women that behave that way, and I hope that I don't know them.

[ComingInHot]

MEMyself & Coco;

No off topic at all! I think it actually fits within perfectly. It is enlightening (and I mean that in a good way) to read the comment that Coco wrote. Funny. I just agreed with Coco...

It is one thing to disagree with her engaging in an A but as far as her response toward the now exW, it sounds (and correct me if I'm wrong) you knew her personally and through mutual acquaintances and through other means and the end result was that your opinion of her was based on as much fact as you had as well as experienced. And the conclusion was she just wasn't a very nice person (and that's sad. I think mean people suck*). It had no bearing on her being female or Coco being competitive or insecure.

Would you say that Affairs are "okay" then, since yours turned out with your happy ending? I am just curious and sincerely at that*

[skywriter]

Skywriter,

If you had commented,"that's not how I am", or something not so defensive, I may have been inclined to see your point. But you came across defensive which leads me to think the latter...

But posts can easily be mis interpreted*

 

 

CIH,

 

It wasn't my intention to come across as defensive, so I hope you will accept my apology for giving that impression. If I am defensive then I can't learn from others.

 

I may not always agree, and even then I can disagree respectfully.

 

In this thread, I was only conveying how, "that's not how I am", would've made me feel I was defending myself. My feelings there are I made an unwise choice, so I have to own it and learn from that choice.

[Spark1111]

I do believe there are cases, where it's more about competing, and "besting" the BS---but I don't think it's the norm.

 

One of my former girlfriends is a good example of this---she turned out to be a serial OW. (much more than I realized, when I compared notes with another one of her former friends)

 

In over ten years of friendship with her--I saw her date a handful of single guys, but she'd sabotage the relationship, every time. And continue crying over/pursuing the men who were already married/in relationships.

 

It makes me wonder if she wasn't replaying some childhood wound of sibling rivalry, over & over again. Feeling the need to continually compete, and "win" to be the center of attention.

 

yep, this rings true!

[Spark1111]

I have been reading... I know, shocker* and there are some responses (one in-particular) that stated A's weren't about love, lust,like or sex but that the OW/OM do it to torment the BS and to prove themselves better than the BS. I can kind of see the thought process behind this. I mean I would have to have some serious animosity towards my gender to Betray my fellow woman. I sometimes think my husband's exOW hated other females as she didn't really have girlfriends just opposite wex frienships. But then I consider, after everything that happened during and after (when she outed the A) that maybe she just really didn't like herself and was insecure therefore constantly had to "prove" to herself that she was prettier, smarter, better etc...

I just don't understand or necessarily believe that a woman could be confident w/herself (or himself) as to knowingly enter into a sexual relationship (knowing the MM/MW is having sex w/their spouse) w/a married person. Insecure, yes. Lonely, yes, competitive, yes. Mean, yes. But confident, admirable, no, not sincerely...

So attraction or not, Why do it? Do you hate your gender? Yourself? Was it sex or "love"?

Then what happened?

For BS's why/what do you feel was going on there w/you WS's OW/OM?

 

Maybe it is more a situation of their own gender does not care too much for them!

 

Which happens and we have all seen it IRL.

 

The woman other women do not like nor trust too much. Maybe she is too flirtatious, too needy, too different when around members of the opposite sex. Or she needs and craves to be the center of attention, or too desperate to receive any attention from men.

[BetrayedH]

I don't think my ex-wife's OM had any issues with men. He just liked ****ing my wife instead of his own.

[Spark1111]

I don't think my ex-wife's OM had any issues with men. He just liked ****ing my wife instead of his own.

 

BH, how do men view that guy? The one always bragging on the women he's scored, dated; the one always looking to catch the eye of the women in the group... A little too flirtatious?

 

I always sensed he was envied for all the action he saw. many men seem more impressed by another man dating a super-model, than a PH.D, KWIM?

 

Whereas women tend to NOT like, nor friend his female equivalent. We tend to more admire those women who attract men of substance and date them exclusively for a long time.

[BetrayedH]

BH, how do men view that guy? The one always bragging on the women he's scored, dated; the one always looking to catch the eye of the women in the group... A little too flirtatious?

 

I always sensed he was envied for all the action he saw. many men seem more impressed by another man dating a super-model, than a PH.D, KWIM?

 

Whereas women tend to NOT like, nor friend his female equivalent. We tend to more admire those women who attract men of substance and date them exclusively for a long time.

 

I suppose when I was younger I envied those that saw more action. I like external validation (sexual at that) as much as the next guy and I'm not too big to say I was jealous of those guys at one point. But I think I much prefer my own angle to that of a player's angle. I have probably a little too much care and concern for others to be capable of just hitting whatever I can get at. It helps for me to like who I am. For the most part, I saw those guys as pretty shallow and I appreciated that I was in more committed relationships. I still could've used a greater period of sowing my wild oats. Guess I am riding the fence a bit but I was never all that envious.

 

As for the OM, he ruined his marriage in addition to my own and I am glad I am not in that position. Hope it was worth it to him.