Long term affairs

[Spark1111]

Spark...I agree with you. We all have control over our actions, but let me just tell you from experience, I have have seen several "good" people, individuals with a supposed high moral compass slip up and cheat on their spouses. People cheat because something is not being fulfilled in a relationship. Combine that void with meeting someone attractive from the opposite sex, and then venture into this insidious process in which both parties take it a step further over the course of months, sometimes years........it can happen, and it's a stealthier process than you think.

 

No mature person goes through life expecting their marital partner to fulfill all their needs, period.

 

I agree that people can make mistakes, fallout of love, change course, and move on.

 

those I know with a high moral compass are pretty decisive and quick to inform. The do not lie ands earl around for years in some sort of drawn out Shakepearean drama. It's unfair, and good people like to be fair.

 

With that being said, I think there are two camps of.....confused people who have EMR: Those who have high levels of marital dissatisfaction but lack the courage to honestly inform their spouse or take professional steps to change AND the mentally unstable, such as passive-aggressives,bi-polars and narcissists.

 

that's my opinion,not only based on my switch but on all I have seen and experienced IRL.

[CantgetoveritNY]

 

A good place to read is Frank Pittman's summary on affairs that was published in Psychology Today. It's online, and is a summary of his first book. It was last peer reviewed for accuracy last week.

 

It's eye opening, to say the least.

 

Thanks for the Pittman reference! That was great reading!

[canuckprincess]

I read on different boards. Today the OW were bragging about how long they had been in their affair without having a d-day.(some single, some married)

 

One MOW had been in hers 40 years until the MM died. Another OW 20 years, but most 7/8 years.

 

They were proud of how they diligently protected the MM, his BW, and family by keeping the affair secret!

 

It boggles my mind that they(MM & OW/MOW) think nothing about wasting the BS's life away!(for their own selfish purposes)

 

I don't know of any spouses that would want to be married to a long term cheater. What are your thoughts on long term affairs?

 

I don't brag about my relationship with my mm but I also don't hide it. I agree the bs should know about it and in my case she does, she has known for just over a year because he told her. I do feel sad at times for what it is doing to her, and yes I believe he does love more then one.

[MissBee]

No mature person goes through life expecting their marital partner to fulfill all their needs, period.

 

I agree that people can make mistakes, fallout of love, change course, and move on.

those I know with a high moral compass are pretty decisive and quick to inform. The do not lie ands earl around for years in some sort of drawn out Shakepearean drama. It's unfair, and good people like to be fair.

With that being said, I think there are two camps of.....confused people who have EMR: Those who have high levels of marital dissatisfaction but lack the courage to honestly inform their spouse or take professional steps to change AND the mentally unstable, such as passive-aggressives,bi-polars and narcissists.

 

that's my opinion,not only based on my switch but on all I have seen and experienced IRL.

 

Great points!

 

I think the argument about people falling out of love and "marriage is the problem" are moot points.

 

Lots of people get married then don't want to be married anymore and say so. My ex did. He was married, with a child and realized he no longer wanted to be married and got a divorced WITHOUT having an affair. He has his issues, but I respect that he was pretty decisive in that regard and saw no need in staying married and pretending to be in love or monogamous.

 

A friend of mine lived with his girlfriend, they had a house together, he no longer wanted to be with her...he told her so. They still had to live together until they could each tie up the loose ends and move out so they just moved into separate rooms and lied truly as roommates. Although still under the same roof, the discussion was had that they are no longer romantically involved and while they each refrained from bringing anyone they were seeing to the house, as it would have been awkward, they both were well aware that the other sees other people.

 

Evidently there are people in the world who are normal people who fall out of love, who have a house or kids together with their partner and who are honest about the situation when they realize it. In the above cases my ex's ex wife was upset that he wanted a divorce, and my friend's gf was upset that he no longer wanted a relationship...yet at the end of the day these women have to admit that these guys did not play for them for fools but put everything on the table and were forthright about what wasn't working.

[canuckprincess]

But your MM of eight years hides it.

 

He convinced his wife you're A is over or more like (what I've told you previously) he didn't even tell her, but convinced you he did.

 

You could be right, but it's not 8 years it's not quite 7.

[TigerCub]

TigerCub,

 

You asked why I thought my H's brief cheating(3 ONS with OW he met during work) in the early years of our marriage, wasn't as bad as someone who had a LTA for many years.

 

H's ONS were all for sex only.(He was very immature) I assume if someone has a LTA for many years they must have fallen in love with their affair partner. I wouldn't want to be married to someone who loves another person.

 

H's investment of our time or money was zero, as they all happened during regular working hours at their place of business. I assume in LTAs the spouse invests lots of time, energy, and money to keep the OW happy. I wouldn't want to tie up my money, investments,and retirement on someone who was spending it on someone else.

 

Someone else asked why did I assume the WS wasted the BW's life by cheating on her for many years.

 

For me personally, I would never stay with a spouse who would not be faithful to me long term. I want a spouse who has my best interest at heart and who I know I can trust. Life is too short to waste on tons of lies and a fake reality.

 

Thank you for your response.

I think a cheat is a cheat, if it was short term or long term. I think that's why I'm fascinated by people who see it differently.

 

I really appreciate your honest response. Although I don't fully get it, I appreciate it still

 

I see that you underlines "earlier years" - what difference does it make. It was real to you at the time he cheated, wasn't it?

Can you honestly say that you don't hold any resentment towards him at all for betraying you repeatedly?

 

For the couples that decide on open marriages or swinging, I have no problem.

As they discussed the plan openly and honestly, and both spouses agreed to this lifestyle.

 

Completely agree - Open relationships at least are honest.

[Summer Breeze]

Thank you for your response.

I think a cheat is a cheat, if it was short term or long term. I think that's why I'm fascinated by people who see it differently.

 

I really appreciate your honest response. Although I don't fully get it, I appreciate it still

 

I see that you underlines "earlier years" - what difference does it make. It was real to you at the time he cheated, wasn't it?

Can you honestly say that you don't hold any resentment towards him at all for betraying you repeatedly?

 

 

 

Completely agree - Open relationships at least are honest.

 

 

I'm with you TC. It's the act of infidelity that gets me not the extenuating circumstances. I respect that everyone looks at it differently but I don't understand it.

[beenburned]

TC,

 

Thanks, I've always enjoyed reading your posts and love to hear people's different viewpoints on this board!

 

The only reason I stressed "the early years" of our marriage was that we married very young and had 2 kids soon after.( This was customary during the baby boomer generation)

 

H was very immature for his age, and was easily influenced by his fellow co-workers.

 

All of these men would have had sex with any woman that said yes, and they all thought what their wives didn't know wouldn't hurt them. Until they all got caught up with, and all of their wives divorced them!

 

One of the wives called me to tell me about it all.(d-day) I left him fully wanting a divorce. I was a SAHM at that time and had 2 young children.

 

He begged, cried, and pleaded for a chance to prove himself. I eventually gave in and moved back home. But I got a job, and went to college at night, determined to be prepared in case it all didn't work out!

 

It all worked out, and we are still happy and in love many many years after d-day.

 

Since my D's XH was caught in 2 LTA's(4 years), I clearly see all the many differences. He told both OW he loved them and wanted to marry them. He spent thousands of dollars in marital money on gifts(2 cars, 1 beachfront condo, jewelry, etc) and entertainment. He also took out many secret loans to support his lifestyle, and also stole money from her personal bank accounts.

 

D-day occurred when both of the OW found out he had cheated on them both, and lied to them about everything. They both called my D and provided her with all the evidence to support their claims. She kicked him out and immediately filed for divorce.

[TigerCub]

TC,

 

Thanks, I've always enjoyed reading your posts and love to hear people's different viewpoints on this board!

 

The only reason I stressed "the early years" of our marriage was that we married very young and had 2 kids soon after.( This was customary during the baby boomer generation)

 

H was very immature for his age, and was easily influenced by his fellow co-workers.

All of these men would have had sex with any woman that said yes, and they all thought what their wives didn't know wouldn't hurt them. Until they all got caught up with, and all of their wives divorced them!

 

One of the wives called me to tell me about it all.(d-day) I left him fully wanting a divorce. I was a SAHM at that time and had 2 young children.

 

I watch the show Mad Men, and you just described all the people/circumstances on that show. The show is supposed to be about the early 60s, so I'm guessing the years are a bit off, but that thinking and the way you described it just brought that to mind right away

 

He begged, cried, and pleaded for a chance to prove himself. I eventually gave in and moved back home. But I got a job, and went to college at night, determined to be prepared in case it all didn't work out!

 

It all worked out, and we are still happy and in love many many years after d-day.

I remember you mentioned going back to school and I think its great that you did what you knew was best for you.

I'm also glad that you 2 are very happy together to this day.

No matter what I think I'd do if I were in BW's shoes or not(even though I truly do know that I'd never really know until I was in that position). I still have mad respect for people that find their happiness and explain different ways of life to me (as foreign and confusing as they seem to me at first), I love hearing it and having a more open view on things .

 

Since my D's XH was caught in 2 LTA's(4 years), I clearly see all the many differences. He told both OW he loved them and wanted to marry them. He spent thousands of dollars in marital money on gifts(2 cars, 1 beachfront condo, jewelry, etc) and entertainment. He also took out many secret loans to support his lifestyle, and also stole money from her personal bank accounts.

 

D-day occurred when both of the OW found out he had cheated on them both, and lied to them about everything. They both called my D and provided her with all the evidence to support their claims. She kicked him out and immediately filed for divorce.

 

I also do recall hearing about your Daughter's husband's affair. I didn't know the details or that he actually had a LTA or took her money. That is despicable and I'm glad she rid herself of him.

 

You open my mind to so many different things and I do appreciate your honesty and openness in your posts.

 

[j'adore]

Statistically if a MM does not leave his wife in the 1st year within the affair they rarely leave... Anyway my point was that is not nice to brag in a forum thread about how they are being able to deceive another person for a long time... Karma exist and when I think the BS is the biggest victim in this game ... it is my beleive that very often the OM/OW are (to another level) victims as well as they are used as sex toys by the WS... (Not generalizing, they can be many different stories but the truth is that most of the cases is like this when the MM does not leave his wife )

 

I don't know why or where anyone brags about having a long term affair? It is nothing to brag about, it often is fraught with emotion and sadness from what I have experienced and read.

 

Realist quoted:

New Love - A Short Shelf Life - NYTimes.com

 

 

Re this article that someone quoted about love. It is strange that there is always the exception to the rule if it were to be believed, but it quotes long term marriages as often being renewed when the nest empties. it is bizarre to me this because this was when our affair started, when MMs eldest kids left home who he is really close to. So instead of bonding closer as this article states, he went looking for me.

[Realist3]

That wasreally a good article. I hope people read it.

[beenburned]

TC,

 

I have never watched the show Mad Men. Is it funny? What night does it come on?

 

Thank you for the compliment!

[road]

Thank you for your response.

I think a cheat is a cheat, if it was short term or long term. I think that's why I'm fascinated by people who see it differently.

 

I really appreciate your honest response. Although I don't fully get it, I appreciate it still

 

 

 

It is simple to get.

 

78% of marriages survive an affair.

 

That means that 78% of the BS's are willing to forget what their WS did.

 

They process what happened during the affair. To process what happened is why the BS fights so hard against being trickled truth. They need to know how bad the damage was. This also shows that the WS is past lying any more.

 

So once the BS feels safe that the WS has stopped lying and now knows everything that happened can say thank god my WS only did "this" but not "that" and the healing process starts.

 

Though for some BS "this" can be too much to forgive. This is why the other 22% of marriages don't survive affairs.

 

Just as some BS can hear that their WS did "this", "that", and "this too", "that too", "also", and "that as well" and chose to stay in the marriage.

 

After hearing all that and some BS will leave the marriage.

 

Recovery is not based on what was done.

 

Recovery is based on how the BS can handle the damage that was done.

[beenburned]

road,

 

The stats I have read say only 35% of all marriages touched by infidelity make it in the long run.(they used 5 years after d-day for the stats)

 

I imagine lots of people stay for a while(after d-day), in order to see if they can make the marriage work. Then later divorce when it doesn't work out.

 

My recovery was based on the fact my H would change and be faithful or he was history.

[Decorative]

TC,

 

I have never watched the show Mad Men. Is it funny? What night does it come on?

 

Thank you for the compliment!

 

mad men is not a comedy, it's a period drama. it's on AMC, it is usually on Sunday nights, and is not coming out again until next summer.

 

It's one of my very favorite shows.

[LoveTKO]

Great article!

 

Here's comedian Chris Rock's take on marriage and all this soulmate bullcrap.....funny stuff!!

 

[TigerCub]

TC,

 

I have never watched the show Mad Men. Is it funny? What night does it come on?

 

Thank you for the compliment!

 

Mad Men isn't a funny show - its definitely more of a drama, but it has its funny moments.

 

It shows on AMC, but their latest season ended in June.

 

It is entertaining.

 

[TigerCub]

Sorry to repeat you Decorative. I didn't see your Mad Men reply

[TigerCub]

It is simple to get.

 

78% of marriages survive an affair.

 

That means that 78% of the BS's are willing to forget what their WS did.

 

They process what happened during the affair. To process what happened is why the BS fights so hard against being trickled truth. They need to know how bad the damage was. This also shows that the WS is past lying any more.

 

So once the BS feels safe that the WS has stopped lying and now knows everything that happened can say thank god my WS only did "this" but not "that" and the healing process starts.

 

Though for some BS "this" can be too much to forgive. This is why the other 22% of marriages don't survive affairs.

 

Just as some BS can hear that their WS did "this", "that", and "this too", "that too", "also", and "that as well" and chose to stay in the marriage.

 

After hearing all that and some BS will leave the marriage.

 

Recovery is not based on what was done.

 

Recovery is based on how the BS can handle the damage that was done.

 

Thanks for your take on it Road.

I didn't think that so many people that get cheated on actually stay. I thought that stat would be a lot lower.

 

I appreciate your explanation.

[Decorative]

Sorry to repeat you Decorative. I didn't see your Mad Men reply

 

No big deal! Now she can be doubly assured that it's a fabulous show, but not a comedy! LOL!

[j'adore]

Thanks for your take on it Road.

I didn't think that so many people that get cheated on actually stay. I thought that stat would be a lot lower.

 

I appreciate your explanation.

 

 

I doubt the figure is that high, but realistically the people that stay just end up miserable anyhow. My father had an affair and was truly in love, but he stayed because that was the thing to do, they were both miserable. It was really sad to not live their lives to be happy but just because neither wanted to leave the house not each other. They just affected everyone around them with their constant bickering. I have seen other marriages go this way too.

[road]

I doubt the figure is that high' date=' but realistically the people that stay just end up miserable anyhow. My father had an affair and was truly in love, but he stayed because that was the thing to do, they were both miserable. It was really sad to not live their lives to be happy but just because neither wanted to leave the house not each other. They just affected everyone around them with their constant bickering. I have seen other marriages go this way too.[/quote']

 

 

Staying married and still doing thinks the same as before the affair will not make the marriage better.

 

Learning how to have a healthy happy releationship takes work. Your dad and mom did not do the work to improve the marriage.

 

Insanity, doing some thing that does not work over and over again.

[beenburned]

TC,

 

The stats I found are posted above.^^^(they are much lower than road's percentage) They were compiled based on how many marriages were still intact 5 years after d-day.

 

I really think most people try to reconcile, especially if there are children.

But sometimes it just doesn't work, especially if the WS is really just faking everything, and has no intention of changing!

 

jadore,

 

I'm sorry you had such a sad childhood!

 

But today's divorce laws are much different than years ago. The majority of all states here are no fault, and assets are divided 50/50. If one spouse wants a divorce, the other can not stop it.

 

There are many happy loving marriages out there!!! Don't let your parents bad example influence your negative views about all marriages!

[TigerCub]

TC,

 

The stats I found are posted above.^^^(they are much lower than road's percentage) They were compiled based on how many marriages were still intact 5 years after d-day.

 

I really think most people try to reconcile, especially if there are children.

But sometimes it just doesn't work, especially if the WS is really just faking everything, and has no intention of changing!

 

 

Thanks BB

 

The stats you provided sound a lot more realistic to me.

 

The explanation you gave also makes so much sense to me and I can better understand why people would at least try to reconcile.

 

The part in bold is by far the most truthful statement there, without a doubt.

[j'adore]

TC,

 

The stats I found are posted above.^^^(they are much lower than road's percentage) They were compiled based on how many marriages were still intact 5 years after d-day.

 

I really think most people try to reconcile, especially if there are children.

But sometimes it just doesn't work, especially if the WS is really just faking everything, and has no intention of changing!

 

jadore,

 

I'm sorry you had such a sad childhood!

 

But today's divorce laws are much different than years ago. The majority of all states here are no fault, and assets are divided 50/50. If one spouse wants a divorce, the other can not stop it.

 

There are many happy loving marriages out there!!! Don't let your parents bad example influence your negative views about all marriages!

 

I know that but you are assuming that no fault divorce is just that. Quite often no fault is the way to get a divorce quickly regardless of what happened.

 

I still believe in love despite my parents' actions