colombiana28 Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 Good post. Totally agree. I've always been hypervigilant about reading people. Definitely tied to fear of rejection. If I like a guy a lot and sense (even a little) that he has low/er interest, I immediately forget about him. I don't allow any feelings to linger. I guess I'm just so used to being me, and having these tendencies, it was quite a shock when I realized that so many people get fixated on people who either 1) are flaky/not that interested, 2) disrespect them and/or cheat on them, etc. I've noticed that a lot of people keep tirelessly pursuing those who aren't that into them. If a guy completely ignored my texts, I would not contact him anymore. So I assume if I ignore someones' texts, they'll get the same message. Yet this one guy has been texting me once every couple weeks for about 4 months now. Yeah, I'll admit to being an avoidant chickensh-t, but come on!!! If you don't hear from me, it's because I don't want to hang out with you! So, extrapolating my own experiences to other people has been pointless. There are way too many daters out there who take every tiny crumb they can possibly get and make way too many excuses for the object of their desire. 1
Lonely Ronin Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 The problem is that a whole lot of people have trouble telling the difference between genuine interest and "niceness". If you think somebody likes you but in point of fact they're just being nice and friendly, bad things can happen. Had this issue last night. I was out with friends and a buddies gf's friend sat next to me. She wasn't my type, but was nice so I talked with her off and on. about 2 hours into the evening, she came back from the bathroom and her entire demeanor was different. She started leaning in and putting her hand on my shoulder or back when she wanted to say something to me, and was being noticeably flirty. As soon as I picked up on it, I was thinking to myself how am I going to get out of this without hurting her feelings or making her upset. it was exactly like you said, she interpreted me being nice, as me being interested.
Mme. Chaucer Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 Casual dating is supposed to be fun. A lot of people who are dating are not looking for casual fun, though. They are really looking for a RELATIONSHIP. So all dating related contact assumes a heavier meaning. I'm sure you have noticed, OP, how frequently people post on LoveShack that they do NOT multi-date. So all those people are functioning in a completely different dating reality than you are. Not to day that yours is wrong, but theirs isn't either. 2
Lonely Ronin Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 Casual dating is supposed to be fun. A lot of people who are dating are not looking for casual fun, though. They are really looking for a RELATIONSHIP. So all dating related contact assumes a heavier meaning. This times 100, I don't date for fun, in fact I hate the early stages of it. Mind going a thousand miles an hours, about what does this or that mean, or did something I say come off as to passive, or as to aggressive. I don't start to enjoy dating, until some rapport has been built with the woman in question. 2
scratch Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 Well when I say "dating" I mean going on different dates with different people. Relationships are totally different and extremely complicated. I'm talking about single people looking to have fun. You did a nice job with the opening post, thanks. One thing I'm not sure about, however, is whether this also doesn't apply for people looking to enter into relationships. Doesn't (or shouldn't) every relationship start with casual dating, and then progress if the people continue to enjoy each other and also realize that they'd like to share more (living arrangements, children and finances)? Am I missing something? Is there more to a relationship than that progression?
Sunfire73 Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 I agree, casual dating is fun, when you don't care whether you'll find the one or not. Actually it's more fun when you're not looking for something serious and just want to hang out. But when you're ready for relationships and want to be exclusive, then that's a different experience. You become more invested because you have a specific end-goal in mind. The more it doesn't work out, the more you feel hurt. That's why people who have relationship goals shouldn't go out with the ones who are just dating casually. The ones who do want to have relationships should be upfront about what their intentions are, so they can weed out those that who are not.
Mrlonelyone Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 You did a nice job with the opening post, thanks. One thing I'm not sure about, however, is whether this also doesn't apply for people looking to enter into relationships. Doesn't (or shouldn't) every relationship start with casual dating, and then progress if the people continue to enjoy each other and also realize that they'd like to share more (living arrangements, children and finances)? Am I missing something? Is there more to a relationship than that progression? That can happen and it often is how things do happen. Friends +sexual tension = a possibility Friends +sexual benefits = a casual relationship Friends +sexual benefits +exclusivity = a relationship Some people try to make it go some other way and it never works out.
Lonely Ronin Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 The ones who do want to have relationships should be upfront about what their intentions are, so they can weed out those that who are not. Personally, I think that should be the other way around. If you just want something casual you should say it up front, because what you want goes against several hundred years of social norms. 1
Mme. Chaucer Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 The ones who do want to have relationships should be upfront about what their intentions are, so they can weed out those that who are not. I think that outside of the "club scene" hook-up culture, the majority of daters are actually looking for a relationship. Maybe not a great majority. Am I off base?
Sunfire73 Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 Personally, I think that should be the other way around. If you just want something casual you should say it up front, because what you want goes against several hundred years of social norms. Yeah, but the casual daters, since they don't care about the outcome, are not usually honest. The ones who care and are gonna be more invested, the relationship-oriented ones should be the ones to bring it up. Yeah, it may scare others away, but would leave at least some who are open to it.
clia Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 I love you for posting this and think it should be pinned! Everyone should read it because it is so true. Dating – when done right – should be fun and easy. 90% of the questions posted in this Dating forum can be answered like this: “He/she is just not that into you.” All of the time spent pining over people and checking the cell phone and posting long stories about a person who rarely responds to text messages and wondering “What is going on?” or “Does she like me?” is time that is not being spent looking for the person who will make dating easy. Too many people (myself included when I was younger) waste so much time on these uninterested types. Think about it from a logical standpoint. Man or woman, if you are interested in a person, you respond to their text messages and you call them back and you quickly reschedule if you have to cancel a date and you schedule times to see each other. You don’t leave them hanging and wondering and wishing and hoping. If you are a well rounded, stable person, there are no games and no need to play any games. (i.e., a stable person isn’t going to call or text someone eighteen times a day when they first meet them; a well rounded person has other interests and hobbies and isn’t clamoring to spend every second with a person they just met). If you aren’t a well rounded, stable person, work on that. The difficulty in dating is finding the right person who will make dating easy and learning to quickly “next” the people who make dating difficult and stressful. The faster you “next” the wrong people, the quicker you will find the “right” person. (Also, the faster you “next” the uninterested types, the less likely you are to get completely emotionally invested in them.) I also believe that at least some people who argue that it’s difficult to find that person may need to not be so picky about minutia. You look at the big picture qualities – loyalty, trust, character, kindness, stability. You don’t worry about her goofy laugh or whether he said something lame while you were having sex or his dorky haircut. A person with 100% of what you want does not exist. Learn it now, because it’s true. You will have to compromise on something. Compromise on the minutia. I don’t even think there is much difference between easy dating and easy relationships. The easy dating will move into the easy relationship, where it all only gets better as you get closer. 3
Author MrCastle Posted November 30, 2012 Author Posted November 30, 2012 Personally, I think that should be the other way around. If you just want something casual you should say it up front, because what you want goes against several hundred years of social norms. Casual dating goes against several hundred years of social norms? Wow. News to me.
Lonely Ronin Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 Casual dating goes against several hundred years of social norms? Wow. News to me. Yep it does. Dating or courtship as it used to be called, was what proceeded marriage. You meet someone, and based on your initial social interaction you deiced you would like to get to know them better. So you would go on dates, and see how things developed. Regardless of how it ultimately turned out, You always entered into it under the assumption that the other party wanted long term commitment as well. Casual dating, where from the beginning you know you don't want anything serious, is a relatively new thing. I'd say the last 50 years or so, and it hadn't really become widely socially acceptable till the last 20 year or so. Even today, several older generations look down on it, and a large portions of the younger generations are uneasy about it.
Author MrCastle Posted November 30, 2012 Author Posted November 30, 2012 Yep it does. Dating or courtship as it used to be called, was what proceeded marriage. You meet someone, and based on your initial social interaction you deiced you would like to get to know them better. So you would go on dates, and see how things developed. Regardless of how it ultimately turned out, You always entered into it under the assumption that the other party wanted long term commitment as well. Casual dating, where from the beginning you know you don't want anything serious, is a relatively new thing. I'd say the last 50 years or so, and it hadn't really become widely socially acceptable till the last 20 year or so. Even today, several older generations look down on it, and a large portions of the younger generations are uneasy about it. Well, like you just pointed out, it's been around for about 50 years. Being that I only go after people in my age range (early-mid 20's) and not someone 50+, the idea is not foreign at all and is pretty much assumed unless one of the parties makes it vocal they're looking for something more. Maybe it was taboo 50 years ago. Not anymore, with speed dating, online dating, etc.
fortyninethousand322 Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 Well, like you just pointed out, it's been around for about 50 years. Being that I only go after people in my age range (early-mid 20's) and not someone 50+, the idea is not foreign at all and is pretty much assumed unless one of the parties makes it vocal they're looking for something more. Maybe it was taboo 50 years ago. Not anymore, with speed dating, online dating, etc. Eh, it takes longer than 50 years for something to become more socially acceptable. Our grandparents and many of our parents didn't do "casual dating", we learn a lot about life from those people and thus for many casual dating is still not exactly mainstream. Most people (even people our age) hope that dating turns into something special or more serious, even if we don't always expect that it will.
Lonely Ronin Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 Well, like you just pointed out, it's been around for about 50 years. Being that I only go after people in my age range (early-mid 20's) and not someone 50+, the idea is not foreign at all and is pretty much assumed unless one of the parties makes it vocal they're looking for something more. Maybe it was taboo 50 years ago. Not anymore, with speed dating, online dating, etc. I disagree with you man, i'm not that much older than you, and i have a lot of female friend and women I have dated that are your age. None of them want casual dating. I know 2 women out of maybe 100 that want something casual, and they hate their dating lives. One is averaging a guy a month or so. She's been at this for like 3 years now, meets a guy goes on a few dates, and then she gets upset, because she realizes they want more than just hook-ups and a female companion to drink with. You're right it's not taboo anymore, and while society knows it goes on, it's still looked down on in a lot of social circles, it defiantly is in mine...
Green Light Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 OP, not everyone has the same luck or resources. Not everyone has a myriad of choices no matter how much they improve themselves. A string of bad luck or an extended dry spell can make a person very serious about the dating game. In fact, I define good luck as when things "flow easy." But things don't flow easy for everyone all the time and it never happens for some people. I certainly get the point you are trying to make and it is a good one. But if these people did not focus on the "wrong" people chances are there would not be any "right" people showing up anytime soon for them to focus on, thus leaving a void. Let's face it, when it comes to dating and relationships there are MANY single people out there who are absolutely starving for someone, sometimes, anyone who can fill that void. To a billionaire a dollar bill is pretty worthless because he has so many of them, to a poor person a single dollar means a lot.
Divasu Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 Dating should be easy, when two people are compatible with one another. I view dating as spending time together, interacting with one another, and finding out whether or not he/she is someone you're compatible with and someone you like enough where you can see a potential relationship. Each moment is like a stepping stone of sorts. Problems arise when you're on opposite (or different) stepping stones. In others words, two people who are simply not on the same page (one but not the other is still dating other people, one but not the other is dating just to have "fun", so on and so forth).
Sunfire73 Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 I think that outside of the "club scene" hook-up culture, the majority of daters are actually looking for a relationship. Maybe not a great majority. Am I off base? With OLD, in my experience, there's more casual daters on those sites than those who want relationships. I guess because there's a lot more options, more newly divorced men and women who found it easier to get dates without getting serious.
dasein Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 I see some truth to what both OP and Mrlonelyone post. The difference is that in the past, other factors made dating easier. No cellphones, no texting, no net, no FB, women stayed at home unescorted, were expected to be a bit more coy and harder to win over. Couples could do with some push and pull then and the process would still be tolerable. Now, there's just too much noise in the world to spend time trying to turn signs of disinterest into interest. Better to gauge interest, stay binary, and keep moving when lack of interest is perceived. 2
Under The Radar Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 OP, not everyone has the same luck or resources. Not everyone has a myriad of choices no matter how much they improve themselves. A string of bad luck or an extended dry spell can make a person very serious about the dating game. In fact, I define good luck as when things "flow easy." But things don't flow easy for everyone all the time and it never happens for some people. I certainly get the point you are trying to make and it is a good one. But if these people did not focus on the "wrong" people chances are there would not be any "right" people showing up anytime soon for them to focus on, thus leaving a void. Let's face it, when it comes to dating and relationships there are MANY single people out there who are absolutely starving for someone, sometimes, anyone who can fill that void. To a billionaire a dollar bill is pretty worthless because he has so many of them, to a poor person a single dollar means a lot. I understand what you are saying, but I'd rather be single than in a ****ty relationship. I mean, who wants to be with someone that "isn't into you"? Someone giving 20% to another individual that's pushing 80% isn't sustainable or healthy. The Law of Reciprocity is critical for long term success no matter how "into someone" I am. Without a complimentary effort on the other end I'm gone. Being single has numerous advantages to co-existing in a miserable relationship. First impressions are everything. If someone has to work THAT HARD to get a return text or phone call, then it's simply not worth it. Yes, to a degree it is a game, but it's all relative. A scenario unfolding like that in the very beginning of dating does not bode well for future relations . 1
Content Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 I never understood trying to win over somebody who doesnt seem that into you..Seems sad and desperate..if theyres any signs of game playing or disinterest i move the f on I want somebody whos actually into ME..being alone is much better then being with somebody you can tell isnt all the way into it.. I dont understand why some people are so co dependent and have to be with somebody all the time even if its not a great situation.. 1
clia Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 OP, not everyone has the same luck or resources. Not everyone has a myriad of choices no matter how much they improve themselves. A string of bad luck or an extended dry spell can make a person very serious about the dating game. In fact, I define good luck as when things "flow easy." But things don't flow easy for everyone all the time and it never happens for some people. I certainly get the point you are trying to make and it is a good one. But if these people did not focus on the "wrong" people chances are there would not be any "right" people showing up anytime soon for them to focus on, thus leaving a void. Let's face it, when it comes to dating and relationships there are MANY single people out there who are absolutely starving for someone, sometimes, anyone who can fill that void. To a billionaire a dollar bill is pretty worthless because he has so many of them, to a poor person a single dollar means a lot. I think everyone has choices -- it might mean lowering your standards, but everyone has choices. Some people overestimate their own value on the dating market and aren't realistic about the type of people they can legitimately attract, get, and maintain. It's one thing to be confident in yourself -- it's something else entirely to ignore reality and your own flaws. Not everyone can get the hottest girl in the bar, or the most intelligent man in the room, or the man with the best body. It's simply not reality. Other people are overly picky in what they are looking for in a partner and want complete perfection. Other people create a fantasy relationship in their mind about someone they barely know and waste years dreaming about that fantasy and that person. No one they will ever meet can live up to a fantasy. Frankly, I can't think of anything more depressing than spending your life focusing on the "wrong" people -- i.e., those who are uninterested in you. Why would anyone choose to do that when there are millions of people in the world? How can a void for someone be filled by a person who isn't even truly there? Are you legitimately arguing that there are people out there who -- if they truly tried and put their best foot forward -- would not be able to have a relationship with someone who is interested in them? Because I disagree with that. It may not be the person of their dreams or Kate Upton, but, they could likely have a relationship with someone who cares about them. I suspect that many of those people who are starving for someone could name at least one or two people they have encountered in their lives who was interested in them. But guess what, they weren't interested because that person didn't live up to their standards. If anyone is sitting at home alone, starving for someone and crying into their beer every night, I would maintain that they need to look at themselves to figure out what the problem is. Are their standards too high? Are they doing things to better themselves and to make themselves attractive to the opposite sex? Do they have hobbies and interests outside of starving for another person? Are they able to hold a conversation? Are they getting out of the house and putting themselves in a position where they can meet people? How is their hygeine? Etc.... 1
Under The Radar Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 I agree. Generally speaking, people who complain that no one is available to date them, have unrealistic standards. All of us are capable of meeting potential mates and "falling into" LTR's. The difficulty will always be long term happiness, attraction, and compatibility. The crux of the matter is most people don't want to "settle" and people tend to "chase" what they cannot have.
fortyninethousand322 Posted November 30, 2012 Posted November 30, 2012 I agree. Generally speaking, people who complain that no one is available to date them, have unrealistic standards. All of us are capable of meeting potential mates and "falling into" LTR's. The difficulty will always be long term happiness, attraction, and compatibility. The crux of the matter is most people don't want to "settle" and people tend to "chase" what they cannot have. Eh, the problem is knowing what to shoot for. There can be any number of reasons someone might not be into someone. Could be physical attraction, could be height, could be money, political views, race/ethnicity, etc. It's very hard to know whether the person you're interested in is out of your league is just not interested in you...
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