Email from ex-MM's wife

[Tenacity]

I guess I am looking for advice whether or not to respond to an email I received from ex-MM's W yesterday.

 

Several days ago, ex-MM called me using another person's phone at work to ask me if I was angry and if we could talk, he wanted to explain, etc. Before that he had been emailing me asking if we could continue to be 'friends' (this was after I had been no contact for several months). I had managed to not reply to his emails but the phone call completely threw me.

 

I have never been one to advocate contacting the W - I haven't talked to her since the second D-day which has been several years ago now. (I apologized to her - she yelled at me).

 

But, after the phone call from ex-MM I sent an email to the account that they both use (I did not have her personal email address at the time, and thought it would make a point if I sent it to both of them anyway). I still don't know if ex-MM read it or has any knowledge of this.

 

In the email I forwarded the last email that ex-MM had sent me where he basically asked if we could be friends and if we could talk (similar to his other emails). I added my own reply that ex-MM should please not contact me again as it is just disruptive to everyone involved.

 

This has been several days ago and I didn't get a response until yesterday. The response was from ex-MM's wife (her personal email account, or so I'm assuming from the name on it). It was very long - it was basically one long rambling paragraph and very hard to read and I could tell she was emotional.

 

Basically what she said was that I should stop "dangling myself" in front of ex-MM (those are the words she used) because it was just humiliating to me when he wants to be with her and not with me. My first instinct was to reply and correct that notion as I am the one who has not wanted contact from him - I have ignored many of his attempts at contact and remaining friends and we have not seen each other in years. But I don't know if writing back is the thing to do.

 

She said some really odd things in the email. I'm sure I'm going to take flak for this, but I've never really thought of this woman as much of a victim - yes, I was at fault for the A and I own that, she didn't deserve it, he was hers and not mine, and I have apologized and I meant it. What I did was wrong and I hate that I hurt her. But in reality she just is not a very nice person.

 

She mentioned in this email that her H really loves her enough to have gotten over her affair in 2002 (she mentioned this as if I knew it - I didn't) and that her H (my ex-MM) basically begged her at the time to end that relationship and stay because he loved her so much, so she did. She used that as an example of how much he loves her. That's all she said about her A and I know nothing more than that.

 

She also said that he was only with me for the sex and the fact that she has chosen to live a sex-free life (as she no longer is interested in sex) and that he did not choose me but chose her in spite of that, proves how much he loves her. This is ultimately what led to his initial separation but she seems to be using the fact that he ultimately came back to the marriage as proof that sex didn't really mean that much to him and their love surpassed all of that.

 

I did know that she had chosen not to have sex any longer (that was going on for years before my A with ex-MM) but from what ex-MM said about it to me, he didn't love it quite as much as she indicated and in fact resented her for it... but said to me in the end, after our A ended and he had decided to go back to her, that his reasons for going back had to do with religious beliefs (yes... I know ) and obligations and logistics but that her decision to have a sexless life would otherwise have been a huge dealbreaker for him. It is a large reason why he remains unhappy.

 

Anyway, I do not believe that sex was the sole motivating factor for ex-MM and me simply because we didn't have all that much of it, due to being long-distance for part of our A... we did not have sex at all for a few years after the A started (it was emotional only) and not before he told his W that he was in love with me.

 

I am not trying to justify anything here, but I just think this woman is living in fantasyland at best and completely delusional at worst if she thinks I am "dangling myself" in front of ex-MM and that he loves life without sex. He told me during our A that he did everything to convince W that he did not want to be without sex, to no avail... it was just her decision, and that's what led to his separation.

 

To me it is selfish to withhold sex in a marriage unless both partners want it. There are other examples of how she feels entitled to being waited on and completely taken care of in the marriage without having to work at anything or lift a finger... but I won't go there.

 

The end of the email said to me that she feels sorry for me that I did not have someone who loves me as much as her H loves her (I really can't argue with that, despite what ex-MM told me for his reasons, as he is with her and not me by his choice). She told me to stop "dangling myself" at ex-MM and if it did not stop she would make it stop (a threat?)

 

I don't know what ex-MM has told her and I know he lied to me and gaslighted me (and her) during the A. At this point I am really sorry I sent any communication to his W. I should have just let it go, but now this drama ensues and it kills me to ignore her email as if I am the one instigating this and not ex-MM. Yet replying will just continue the drama. I desperately wish I would not have sent that email.

 

What would you do? Would you reply to her?

 

Sorry this was long.

Edited November 30, 2012 by Tenacity

[whichwayisup]

It IS obvious xMM has lied to you and to his wife. You want NC, so stay in NC mode with him, your A with him is over and you two cannot be friends, ever.

 

As for his wife, yes do reply back and let her know that NC has been in place and that he called you. And yes, you wrote the email but you don't have any intention of starting up the A or having any friendship with him. She may or may not believe you due to the fact years ago you apologized to her and she thought the A was over, you were out of his life - Yet you're still around as far as she know. Any trust built between her and her husband is now going to be on shakey ground, rightfully so.

 

Your exMM is a skilled liar - Who knows what the real truth is but my guess is, he wants to keep you around on some level and wants to stay married. Semi cake eating..:laugh: Anyway, don't get involved, don't freak out at him for this, just distance yourself and detach .. Take this as your moment to make up your own mind once and for all, cut him out of your life. that the guy is messed up and hasn't been honest with you or his wife.

 

Her personality has nothing to do with this, who cares if she wasn't a nice person. Whatever their reasons are for staying married has worked and he must love her enough to stay. He may be addicted to their dynamic too, just like he was during the A with you.

 

Remember, he has fooled her into believing that you've been out of his life for so long and who knows if he threw you under the bus telling her you've been chasing him again.

[Tenacity]

It IS obvious xMM has lied to you and to his wife. You want NC, so stay in NC mode with him, your A with him is over and you two cannot be friends, ever.

 

As for his wife, yes do reply back and let her know that NC has been in place and that he called you. And yes, you wrote the email but you don't have any intention of starting up the A or having any friendship with him. She may or may not believe you due to the fact years ago you apologized to her and she thought the A was over, you were out of his life - Yet you're still around as far as she know. Any trust built between her and her husband is now going to be on shakey ground, rightfully so.

 

Your exMM is a skilled liar - Who knows what the real truth is but my guess is, he wants to keep you around on some level and wants to stay married. Semi cake eating..:laugh: Anyway, don't get involved, don't freak out at him for this, just distance yourself and detach .. Take this as your moment to make up your own mind once and for all, cut him out of your life. that the guy is messed up and hasn't been honest with you or his wife.

 

Her personality has nothing to do with this, who cares if she wasn't a nice person. Whatever their reasons are for staying married has worked and he must love her enough to stay. He may be addicted to their dynamic too, just like he was during the A with you.

 

Remember, he has fooled her into believing that you've been out of his life for so long and who knows if he threw you under the bus telling her you've been chasing him again.

 

Thanks wwiu. I do agree with you that he is a skilled liar and is also very good at gaslighting. I know that from first hand experience.

 

We haven't been involved for several years though (part of the continued communication after that time was my pregnancy, having the baby, demanding him to take responsibility, etc but even that was over sometime in 2010 when I realized it wasn't going to happen). After that we tried being "friends" with contact as friends - he told his W at the time that he was communicating with me as friends (that ended many months ago when I decided it was just prolonging the pain, was stupid, and just gave him a reason to keep me connected to him).

 

So maybe that's why she thought I was "dangling myself". But the truth is that I decided months ago that I didn't want him in my life on any terms, not as friends or even as a coworker (it's why I sold my part of our business) and I just want to keep it that way. At this point I just want it to go away and want him to go away.

[Mount]

I would say - don't reply. Believe me that woman is enduring a lot stress that caused by his H (your XMM).

 

She knew her H does not truely love her, otherwise she even would not bother to reply your email, or emphasize to you that her H loves her not you, pretty childish for my POV.

 

May I know their age range? 40ish?

[Tenacity]

I would say - don't reply. Believe me that woman is enduring a lot stress that caused by his H (your XMM).

 

She knew her H does not truely love her, otherwise she even would not bother to reply your email, or emphasize to you that her H loves her not you, pretty childish for my POV.

 

May I know their age range? 40ish?

 

Thanks Mount. I do think that the long email from her was very defensive but I understand why she might feel defensive if she has been told that I am the one causing all of this.

 

They are both in their mid 50's; I am in my 40's.

[veryhappy]

I don't think you can reason with her. The email you sent clearly showed him contacting you, and yet she chooses to be in denial and believe whatever bs he's telling her.

 

ExMM made the same choice of loving the sexless wife. If that love is so strong, good for them and their dysfunctional dynamics.

 

I would let it go and not respond. You might get another rambling in the future. You can always choose to reply later. Frankly, both of them seem a little off and engaging with them doesn't seem constructive.

Edited November 30, 2012 by cutedragon

[Tenacity]

I don't think you can reason with her. The email you sent clearly showed him contacting you, and yet she chooses to be in denial and believe whatever bs he's telling her.

 

ExMM made the same choice of loving the sexless wife. If that love is so strong, good for them and their dysfunctional dynamics.

 

I would let it go and not respond. You might get another rambling in the future. You can always choose to reply later. Frankly, both of them seem a little off and engaging with them doesn't seem constructive.

 

Thanks cd...

 

I don't think anyone can rationalize with this woman for the reasons you mentioned, but I guess I just wanted to defend myself. It is pointless though, as you said.

 

Honestly, I can't believe how many YEARS this has gone on. One way or another. I wsh I could be a poster child as to how you can ruin a decade of your life if you make the dumb choices that I did.

[Decorative]

I would let it go and block her and her spouse six ways to Sunday.

 

You don't need crazy knocking on your door. No way.

[veryhappy]

The more you would defend yourself, the more material she gets to attack and a confirmation that you are the one who won't leave him alone.

 

If you think of it...defend yourself in front of the BW? How deemed to fail it that anyway? And why does it matter to you, since you don't hold her in the highest regard anyway? If you get them out of your life, none of their opinions will ever matter anymore. If she sees she can provoke a reaction out of you, she's the type who will continue.

[Tenacity]

I would let it go and block her and her spouse six ways to Sunday.

 

You don't need crazy knocking on your door. No way.

 

Thank you for your response Decorative. I respect your opinion - have read a lot of your posts - it's just hard sometimes to be objective in my own situation. You are right - I don't need this nor do I want it.

[Tenacity]

The more you would defend yourself, the more material she gets to attack and a confirmation that you are the one who won't leave him alone.

 

If you think of it...defend yourself in front of the BW? How deemed to fail it that anyway? And why does it matter to you, since you don't hold her in the highest regard anyway? If you get them out of your life, none of their opinions will ever matter anymore. If she sees she can provoke a reaction out of you, she's the type who will continue.

 

I agree. I'm not going to respond. It will just perpetuate the nonsense. Thank you!

[Tenacity]

I'm in the don't respond camp and if possible find a way to block her.

 

I also think you should try very hard to not give what she said any more head space, she was doing the things that a lot of bs's and ow's do, the competition thing, he loves me more, blah, blah, blah. If you respond you will get sucked into it too. It's over.........block her, try not to dwell on what she said. It's not important to you now and hey that is a wonderful thing!

 

PS.........if the BS in my situation were to contact me now, I would not respond and we parted on good terms, but that part of my life is closed, over, done.

 

Thank you LadyGrey.

 

I look back on my original post and I did give it too much head space. The last thing I want is to get sucked into this more. Whatever she says... the end result is right, he is with her and not me and it was his choice.

 

Ex-MM told me once (long ago, when we were together) that his W makes him stand on the rug after coming in the house from work every day, and sniffs him from head to toe before he comes in. That should have been a pretty good red flag for something to me, but it wasn't at the time. Now it is unbelievable to me, and laughable.

 

God help me if I ever end up in a R with a guy I feel the need to sniff every day for evidence of infidelity.

[Decorative]

Stand on the rug? Is she part bloodhound?

 

I am sorry. I just snorted when I read that.

 

Yeah. Run swiftly away from that mess !!!

[Tenacity]

Stand on the rug? Is she part bloodhound?

 

I am sorry. I just snorted when I read that.

 

Yeah. Run swiftly away from that mess !!!

 

Back then I justified it as being about her paranoia, which is how he made it out (mostly because he volunteered that detail as part of his discussion as to how unreasonable she was). But she didn't invent that and even then I saw the red flag - chose to ignore it.

[Spark1111]

Back then I justified it as being about her paranoia, which is how he made it out (mostly because he volunteered that detail as part of his discussion as to how unreasonable she was). But she didn't invent that and even then I saw the red flag - chose to ignore it.

 

How sad! maybe her paranoia is due to the fact that you weren't the first dalliance in the course of his marriage. maybe her deep insecurity to compete with you stems from a lifetime of suspecting his unfaithfulness, and perceiving his love as some small sacrifice after a lifetime of grief and gas lighting on his part.

 

Agree to ignore her as it won't ease her pain or truly reassure her of his love.

 

She sounds soooo beaten down after a life time with this man...and to me, that is sad.

 

 

I can only wonder why.

 

your only job now is how did you get involved in this mess; with him, and by extension, with her?

 

neither one is a prize Tenacity, and you seem smarter than this dysfunction.

 

how did you get here? as a former journalist, the truth ALWAYS lies somewhere in the middle.

 

She is not solely responsible for her mis-guided delusions, and he is not blameless here either.

[2sunny]

Id vote for aging something - but VERY LITTLE in order to send a clear message...

 

Example:

 

I sent you the email to allow you to understand I DON'T WANT TO HEAR FROM HIM - yet he continues to contact me.

 

IF I have ANY further contact I will file a restraining order.

 

 

 

That allows BOTH of them to understand that HE KEEPS crossing YOURboundary and YOU WILL enforce consequences.

 

 

She sounds like a piece of work - but HE CHOOSES to stay. It's amazing to me that men stay with such entitled women who don't participate in a LOVING marriage.

 

I'd bet money he's searching for another woman...

[Spark1111]

Id vote for aging something - but VERY LITTLE in order to send a clear message...

 

Example:

 

I sent you the email to allow you to understand I DON'T WANT TO HEAR FROM HIM - yet he continues to contact me.

 

IF I have ANY further contact I will file a restraining order.

 

 

 

That allows BOTH of them to understand that HE KEEPS crossing YOURboundary and YOU WILL enforce consequences.

 

She sounds like a piece of work - but HE CHOOSES to stay. It's amazing to me that men stay with such entitled women who don't participate in a LOVING marriage.

 

I'd bet money he's searching for another woman...

 

I agree! His manipulation sounds like a serial cheater and his wife sounds like she is having,or has had, a series of breakdowns.

 

wait, throw intense religious beliefs into the mix-- always the perfect excuse to work on the marriage for both of them-- and you have a real fiery mix of sin and forgiveness.

 

Again, how sad!

[Tenacity]

How sad! maybe her paranoia is due to the fact that you weren't the first dalliance in the course of his marriage. maybe her deep insecurity to compete with you stems from a lifetime of suspecting his unfaithfulness, and perceiving his love as some small sacrifice after a lifetime of grief and gas lighting on his part.

 

Agree to ignore her as it won't ease her pain or truly reassure her of his love.

 

She sounds soooo beaten down after a life time with this man...and to me, that is sad.

 

 

I can only wonder why.

 

your only job now is how did you get involved in this mess; with him, and by extension, with her?

 

neither one is a prize Tenacity, and you seem smarter than this dysfunction.

 

how did you get here? as a former journalist, the truth ALWAYS lies somewhere in the middle.

 

She is not solely responsible for her mis-guided delusions, and he is not blameless here either.

 

Hi Spark.

 

Your response is dead on as usual.

 

I don't know how I got here spark. I am a smart woman but I wasted almost a decade of my life on this and I will never get it back. He is an incredibly smart man and that is a lot of why I fell... smart men are rare.

 

I do feel sorry for her and I am sorry for anything I contributed. I do think she had reason to be suspicious long before I came along.

 

I agree with you. When he first told me the story about the sniff test I was horrified but I knew that did not come about for no reason. She had reason to be suspicious (at least) before or she would not have done this. I knew it at the time and it's what I thought, but I put it out of my mind because he made it out to be about her.

[Tenacity]

I wouldn't respond unless you hear from either of them again.

At that time, if you do, I'd send an email and copy it to every email you have of theirs that states that you have purposely gone NC because you no longer wish to have contact and to please not contact you again.

I'd add that if you receive any further contact from either of them from any email address or phone number that you will consider it harassment and look into legal recourse.

 

Thank you LFH. That is exactly what I am going to do. I can't believe I thought about replying. I won't.

 

I think it was mostly about wanting to defend myself.

[Tenacity]

Id vote for aging something - but VERY LITTLE in order to send a clear message...

 

Example:

 

I sent you the email to allow you to understand I DON'T WANT TO HEAR FROM HIM - yet he continues to contact me.

 

IF I have ANY further contact I will file a restraining order.

 

 

 

That allows BOTH of them to understand that HE KEEPS crossing YOURboundary and YOU WILL enforce consequences.

 

 

She sounds like a piece of work - but HE CHOOSES to stay. It's amazing to me that men stay with such entitled women who don't participate in a LOVING marriage.

 

I'd bet money he's searching for another woman...

 

Thanks 2sunny. I agree with you totally. I think he will be searching for someone else if he isn't already. I think he has had affairs before (and this is the first time I have ever admitted that).

 

I have had mixed feelings about feeling sorry for her (some of it seems to be on her) and feeling she deserves it. But no one deserves that, and maybe that is why she is this way. No one deserves being lied to and gaslighted.

 

I'm afraid to send any message at this point.

[Spark1111]

The only questions you have to deal with now are how did I allow myself to get hooked and WHY?

 

Did you want to rescue him? that's about empowerment. Did his intelligence make you feel smarter, prettier, more charming? that's empowering too?

 

if you can figure out the why, you can figure out the cure for yourself.

 

if he and his wife espouse to be devoutly religious, well, that can be the great hypocrisy because he gets to sin and she HAS to forgive him. What a dysfunctional dynamic that can be!

 

And that too is sad, as those who truly believe do not manipulate their religious convictions to excuse their sociopathic behaviors, or prey upon the weak and vulnerable, or hurt, hurt, hurt others in the name of The Lord.

 

Beware of wolves in sheepskin clothing; the most insidious villains of all.

[Tenacity]

The only questions you have to deal with now are how did I allow myself to get hooked and WHY?

 

Did you want to rescue him? that's about empowerment. Did his intelligence make you feel smarter, prettier, more charming? that's empowering too?

 

if you can figure out the why, you can figure out the cure for yourself.

 

if he and his wife espouse to be devoutly religious, well, that can be the great hypocrisy because he gets to sin and she HAS to forgive him. What a dysfunctional dynamic that can be!

 

And that too is sad, as those who truly believe do not manipulate their religious convictions to excuse their sociopathic behaviors, or prey upon the weak and vulnerable, or hurt, hurt, hurt others in the name of The Lord.

 

Beware of wolves in sheepskin clothing; the most insidious villains of all.

 

Low self esteem.

 

He is a Jehovah's Witness. He had been an elder in the religion before entering into our affair. He had left the religion several years before I met him (not sure why). He took it up again after our A, and now he quotes biblical reasons for all of it.

 

I will never understand how it can be okay when you are 'taking a vacation from it' but then all of a sudden the rules are in play. And if you are taking a vacation from it, apparently all you have to do is say I'm sorry, or whatever, and just go right on.

 

He tried to talk me into the JW way once or twice... I am mainly agnostic so I was willing to give it a go... the result was that 1) they said I could not join the church since I divorced because my ex-H physically and mentally abused me (because the bible only allows divorce because of infidelity), and 2) because I am not homophobic. Oh, and 3) because as a physician I have seen a lot of lives saved because of blood transfusions! So I could not have become a JW even if I wanted to, because I was not pure enough for them. But I guess he was.

 

One would think I am an idiot. I hope I am not.

[2sunny]

The only questions you have to deal with now are how did I allow myself to get hooked and WHY?

 

Did you want to rescue him? that's about empowerment. Did his intelligence make you feel smarter, prettier, more charming? that's empowering too?

 

if you can figure out the why, you can figure out the cure for yourself.

 

if he and his wife espouse to be devoutly religious, well, that can be the great hypocrisy because he gets to sin and she HAS to forgive him. What a dysfunctional dynamic that can be!

 

And that too is sad, as those who truly believe do not manipulate their religious convictions to excuse their sociopathic behaviors, or prey upon the weak and vulnerable, or hurt, hurt, hurt others in the name of The Lord.

 

Beware of wolves in sheepskin clothing; the most insidious villains of all.

 

I'd say a better growth question might be:

 

HOW can I never allow myself to settle for so little - ever again?

 

What boundary will I set into place to be sure it never happens again?

 

That would help you define what you won't put up with!

[waterwoman]

Oh my lordy! Ignore, ignore ignore! She seems a little unhinged

[BetrayedH]

I have only read your OP.

 

Honestly, I don't see any reason to continue any contact with either of them. I think it was reasonable to make the request of both of them to stop contact. You did that.

 

She's unbalanced and so is he. I am sure it is very difficult not to set the story straight but you have tried that and that effort continues to fail. At this point, any continued contact just impacts you in a negative way.

 

Get back to your own healing. I hope you find some peace.