I'm devastated.........

November 29, 2012

The obvious one.

The one where you lied to your wife?

November 29, 2012

I came to this site looking for answers for something I have never had to deal with before. What I found was a lot of judgmental people and name callers. I am not a saint I am a liar and a cheater. I don't deny that. So is the OW and so is my wife.

If I could go back and undue what I have done I would but I cant. I can attempt to fix things.

Your wife is a cheater and a liar? I'm confused. You're talking about the earlier phone calls? Fair enough.

The real issue here is fixing your marriage. If she's throwing herself into the kids, you need to address that and get it more balanced. Have some real discussions - in front of a MC - about what that does to the marriage.

Read His Needs Her Needs together.

Edited November 29, 2012 by turnera

November 29, 2012

FWIW, I don't care what you choose to do.

What I am offering you is simple advice.

Choose what you want to do.

Let your wife make her own 'informed' choice as well.

Let the OW make HER own 'informed' choice too.

No judgement, no anger at all on my part.

Simple advice...give everyone the information they need to make their own 'informed choices'...make yours...see where things go from there.

What's wrong with that?

November 29, 2012

Your wife is not a cheater or a liar as far as you know. Why bundle her with you and the OW?

I'm a fOW by the way. You don't need to like what you here, and you don't need to agree with everything. I for example am a believer of not confessing the affair if you are staying and comminting to the M. Other people believe differently.

You haven't answered the question: what do you want?

It was confirmed by a friend who admitted it to her.

I don't know what I want that is the issue. I'm still dealing with the end of the affair and what is the right thing to do overall. I don't feel I can know what I want until I can think straight.

November 29, 2012

FWIW, I don't care what you choose to do.

What I am offering you is simple advice.

Choose what you want to do.

Let your wife make her own 'informed' choice as well.

Let the OW make HER own 'informed' choice too.

No judgement, no anger at all on my part.

Simple advice...give everyone the information they need to make their own 'informed choices'...make yours...see where things go from there.

What's wrong with that?

Nothing. You are correct.

November 29, 2012

It was confirmed by a friend who admitted it to her.
I don't know what I want that is the issue. I'm still dealing with the end of the affair and what is the right thing to do overall. I don't feel I can know what I want until I can think straight.

So you are sure she cheated on you. I'll revise my advice. Go to MC and confess the A. Tell her you have a problem with her cheating, and that you've cheated and see where it goes.

It will solve your limbo. To give you the heads up, it's likely you'll be working on the M if you do that.

To explain my change in advice...I believe that if one parts cheats and there's no suspicion, and that person fully commits to the M and not cheating again, things can be okay. When both parts cheated or if there's serial cheatig, there's too much to be swept under any rug.

How long have you been NC with your fOW?

Edited November 29, 2012 by cutedragon

November 29, 2012

I came to this site looking for answers for something I have never had to deal with before. What I found was a lot of judgmental people and name callers. I am not a saint I am a liar and a cheater. I don't deny that. So is the OW and so is my wife.

If I could go back and undue what I have done I would but I cant. I can attempt to fix things.

What did you expect was going to happen? Did you think you were going to come on to this board, tell your story, we would make you nice cup of hot tea and tell you it was all going to be OK? This board is comprised mainly BS's. What you are getting from the people on this board will pale in comparison from what you will get from your wife.

This is broken beyond what you alone can fix. It was broken before the affair started.

November 29, 2012

I disagree with most of the posters here. Give your marriage a real shot before you decide to divorce. You have kids, you made vows to your wife.

TELL HER and start being honest. That's the first step and you both can finally start being real with one another. It may just bring you closer again (after the obvious pain and craziness). You need marriage counseling....good marriage counseling, someone who really specializes in infidelity.

Too many people ignore the kids in these situations. There is a FAMILY at stake here, not just a romantic relationship. Relationships can be rebuilt if you try. Marriages take WORK. Everyone knows that, but they don't seem to honor it really. If you both put effort into your marriage you can have a good one. It's really hard though if one person is lying, sabotaging everything to the point of no return. You need brutal amazing selfless honesty. It's your only chance really, if you don't bare your soul soon, yeah...your marriage is doomed.

November 29, 2012

So you are sure she cheated on you. I'll revise my advice. Go to MC and confess the A. Tell her you have a problem with her cheating, and that you've cheated and see where it goes.

It will solve your limbo. To give you the heads up, it's likely you'll be working on the M if you do that.

To explain my change in advice...I believe that if one parts cheats and there's no suspicion, and that person fully commits to the M and not cheating again, things can be okay. When both parts cheated or if there's serial cheatig, there's too much to be swept under any rug.

How long have you been NC with your fOW?

Only a few days.

November 29, 2012

What did you expect was going to happen? Did you think you were going to come on to this board, tell your story, we would make you nice cup of hot tea and tell you it was all going to be OK?

I don't know... maybe he expected a little civility and understanding and compassion because he is a human being who has admitted to making mistakes? Is that really so much to ask?

OP, there are people on here who are very harsh and you do need to just ignore the posts/information that doesn't work for you.

I will not bash you over the head with useless statements such as "this is all your fault" which are not helpful whatsoever. But I do think you need to recognize how you got here.

I doubt that your W is an angel or a completely innocent victim - it sounds like she has cheated on you before. It also sounds like there has been a lot of pulling away from the marriage (for whatever reason) by both of you. It is rarely as black and white as blaming that all on one person or thing. You are both culpable in that, in letting it happen and not doing anything to restore it. I do understand though, how these things can just keep sliding over the years and you just keep accepting it as the status quo.

Having said that, your W deserves to know that you are having an A, just as you deserve her admitting to you that she had one.

Your OW went no contact because you were unwilling to live up to your statements to her about wanting to divorce and be with her. I understand that totally, being an ex-OW, as she needs to take care of herself and she is not going to hang around waiting if you are not going to be there for her.

I do understand your admission that you were not living in reality when making those promises to her, and now that it IS reality, you are realizing just what is at stake. It's not a fantasy anymore.

Honestly, you have way too much work to do on your marriage to even think about the OW right now. You don't have anything to offer her, even if you wanted to be with OW. You need to decide whether to recommit fully to your marriage, or whether to divorce. Many men in your situation (my ex-MM was one of them) go back to a marriage they don't want to be in, just to keep the status quo. That is not going to make you happy OR her happy, and will just provide fertile ground for something like this to happen again.

So... deal with your marriage - either divorce or recommit. If you decide to divorce, you still aren't in a position to be with OW in my opinion because you need to work through the logistics of the divorce, your children's needs (which should be your first priority), and then become an independent person in your own right (not dependent on a marriage or relationship with someone else). Only then can you offer anything to any other relationship.

Do not try to be a husband or partner to OW and take on responsibility for her kids right now. You already have a wife and your own kids and THESE are your priority right now. Not OW. It is likely that by the time you work through all of this, she will no longer be there. Maybe that will be for the best... but if you try to proceed with OW now, I believe that you and your family will pay for it and regret it in the end.

Good luck to you. It does take some courage to come on here and post, and accept the stinging remarks of other people. Just take what is useful and leave the rest. But most importantly, OWN your responsibility in all of this. In that, I agree with most of the other posters. You are in this position because of actions you have taken and choices you have made in the past, and now you need to take responsibility for it. I think you see that, from your post... but now it's time to put it into action.

November 29, 2012

TELL HER and start being honest. That's the first step and you both can finally start being real with one another. It may just bring you closer again (after the obvious pain and craziness). You need marriage counseling....good marriage counseling' date=' someone who really specializes in infidelity.[/quote']

So you are sure she cheated on you. I'll revise my advice. Go to MC and confess the A. Tell her you have a problem with her cheating, and that you've cheated and see where it goes.
The best advice you've been given so far. If you can explain why you wouldn't follow it, you'd get better feedback on your situation...

Mr. Lucky

November 29, 2012

It was confirmed by a friend who admitted it to her.
I don't know what I want that is the issue. I'm still dealing with the end of the affair and what is the right thing to do overall. I don't feel I can know what I want until I can think straight.

And I can't help but wonder who that "friend" was...could it happen to be the OW? Not that I expect you to admit it if it was, but if it was, I hope you realize that there is a chance that it isn't true. As my father always told me, "consider the source".

To be honest, continuing to focus on what YOU want proves just how little you care about your wife OR the OW. All you have been considering all along is what YOU want! What about what your wife wants? She didn't have a chance to decide about whether or not you should have an affair--don't you think that just MAYBE she deserves the right to decide whether or not she wants to continue being married to a cheater? C'mon, man up, stop being so selfish and do the right thing!

November 29, 2012

Frozen is right on the money here. The level of deception is amazing. I feel for your wife. And you are in 'love' with this person who can help you perpetuate this sort of lying, cheating and dishonesty? Good luck to you.

You know, one year and 2 months (almost) after my divorce, I am really beginning to see what people tell you when they say that you will wonder why you waited so long to do it. I swear, it seems like you would realize that, but the feelings behind it take a while to catch up. I mean, really, what do they have when they get each other?

And you are in 'love' with this person who can help you perpetuate this sort of lying, cheating and dishonesty?[/QUOTE]

Just what you said^^^^.

November 29, 2012

You had no implied or explicit understanding with her that you would divorce your wife and get together with her if she divorced her husband.

You must do objectively what is best for you, not for her. She made her own decisions and so should you.

She is a divorced mother of three who cheated on her husband, sounds destitute, now looking for any port in a storm.

Tell her you are willing to keep seeing her as your secret affair partner, as a FWB, but are not going to get divorced for her.

Don't be foolish and make the same mistake she did.

Even if you did decide to get divorced, it would be a huge mistake to commit to this other woman. If you get divorced you definitely want to play the field and if you do decide to remarry it would be best to try to find a woman who is not so prone to cheat on her husband as your OW obviously is.

Best advice I heard yet.

November 29, 2012

The OP's basic dilemma is that his "choice" is between two cheating women, his wife, and the OW. Some choice. He can never truly be satisfied with either or both.

If finances were no issue, divorce and finding a new woman, or women, entirely, would be the best solution. However I suspect OP doesn't want to get divorced and lose half or more of his assets.

You are assuming that his wife cheated based on what a "friend" of his wife's told him. Think about it, what "friend" could that be? Probably one who is no longer her friend...now, connect the dots!

November 29, 2012

The OP's basic dilemma is that his "choice" is between two cheating women, his wife, and the OW. Some choice. He can never truly be satisfied with either or both.

If finances were no issue, divorce and finding a new woman, or women, entirely, would be the best solution. However I suspect OP doesn't want to get divorced and lose half or more of his assets.

I don't want that to be the driving force in any decision I make. but it is a factor.

November 29, 2012

You are assuming that his wife cheated based on what a "friend" of his wife's told him. Think about it, what "friend" could that be? Probably one who is no longer her friend...now, connect the dots!

Wow.... that is a HUGE leap to make on almost no information.

November 29, 2012

Best advice I heard yet.

Except for continuing with her as the affair partner.

November 29, 2012

Wow.... that is a HUGE leap to make on almost no information.

It was not the OW.

November 29, 2012

Best advice I heard yet.

Gee I wonder why.

Oh, I know! Because spit told you to keep cheating.

November 29, 2012

It is very likely your divorced OW has gone NC with you from time to time and again this time because she has one or more other OM's she has been in similar on-again/off-again relationships with, totally unknown to you.

A woman with three kids and no financial resources isn't just going to suddenly divorce her financial support--oops I meant her "husband"--unless she has a pretty good notion of an alternative means of support.

Please don't be surprised that a woman who cheated on her husband could cheat on her OM too. For all you know she cheated on a prior OM with you, you might be OM#2 or 3 or 7,000.

It's one thing to romanticize an affair and your affair partner to self-justify the cheating on your wife and to enliven the sex. It's quite another to actually believe those romanticized notions in the cold light of day.

Your OW is the kind of woman that you cheat with, not the kind of woman that you marry.

And by the way I wouldn't mention a word of any of this to your wife. There is no point in it. I believe your suspicions that your wife cheated on you are probably correct, it was swept under the rug, and your marriage never recovered from it. In effect your OW was a "revenge affair" on your part.

If your OW isn't willing to remain an OW to you and nothing more, go NC with her permanently and find someone else to play with, if play you must.

I'm pretty confident I was the only one. We spent most of the day communicating. I saw her often and she had kids with her most of the time. But you are right she is a cheater and did admit that she started to get into another affair the two years after she moved away with another OM and we weren't in contact with each other. I chalked it up to her unhappy marriage. I do truly believe if she can be faithful in the future if she received the intimacy she was lacking in her marriage. Trust me her husband was piece of work and was OCD so nothing she did was good enough. She went to counseling during the divorce.

November 29, 2012

Gee I wonder why.

Oh, I know! Because spit told you to keep cheating.

You missed my follow up reply.

"Except for continuing with her as the affair partner."

November 29, 2012

Even if you did decide to get divorced, it would be a huge mistake to commit to this other woman. If you get divorced you definitely want to play the field and if you do decide to remarry it would be best to try to find a woman who is not so prone to cheat on her husband as your OW obviously is.

Why is the OW not marriage material because she cheated, but the man who cheated with her and on his own wife, is entitled to find a "good woman" in the future, when he was also prone to cheating.

Seems to be a twisted double standard.

November 29, 2012

At the very least the A caused her to leave him which she needed to do anyway. So for that, it was at least one good thing that came from this. She admitted the A opened her eyes that she can experience love and affection with another human being.

I guess baggage was a harsh word to use to describe her situation. I am not thinking clearly and I am trying to concentrate on negatives of the situation as a crutch to try move on. Assuming we are really over.

I guess I was concentrating on the fact that she moved out on her own and then went and quit her job. And she had no idea that her husband would become a stalker. So at the time no, I didn't think those two things would be part of the equation when deciding to be together.

At this point I don't even know if she would entertain us being together. I have to assume she still cares for me. But who knows. She might have turned a page. I wont contact her again unless I can sort out my feelings of where I need to be. I don't feel I will really have that choice now anyway.

Don't just sit there and be complacent. Are you in love with your wife? If not, you should either try to find love with her or leave her. It's never good to stay in a marriage that you do not "want" to be in. Trust me, I understand that if you stay out of commitment, it feels like you are doing the right thing. But is it really right if you don't really want to be with that person?

You need to figure it out, as I'm sure you know, but you're not going to figure it out by thinking in circles. Try taking some actions and see how it makes you feel. It might point you in the right direction. Talk to a divorce lawyer and see how it makes you feel. It might make you realize that you really do love your wife, or it might make you feel relief about having taken one step closer in the direction which you genuinely want to go.

November 29, 2012

She didn't leave him for me directly. At the time she just knew she didn't want to be with him and take his abuse any longer. I think the affair was the catalyst yes but we never discussed that she would leave and we would run away together before that point. After she got divorced is when she wanted me to leave my situation.

It sounds like you are trying to rationalize your role in the demise of their marriage. I knew this is what my MM was doing. He always wanted me to reassure him that if I left, it was because I was going to leave no matter what. I always felt like he was trying to give himself an "out" so he would not feel guilty if I left and he did not. I think that is what you are doing. But just to be honest, I'm sure a big part of why she left was for you. Regardless of whether she would have left or not (if you never existed) after having had an affair with you she likely thought that if she made herself available that you would feel secure enough to follow suit. You sound to me like you are never sure of what you want. Don't you think you'd not be second guessing things if they were in fact what you wanted?

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