Unsure - I don't think I'm relationship material......

[Emilia]

Agree with this. No double standard at play because men and women are entirely different in how they seek and obtain sex. Apples and oranges. Women have more control over sex, so generally, women who will sleep with you on the first date are showing impulsivity that can signal other bad traits, and are bad bets generally. Carefully consider and reconsider relationship prospects with these before getting involved when you get ready for a relationship.

 

Or, you can ignore the old fogies OP and use your own judgement as you usually do

[mesmerized]

Agree with this. No double standard at play because men and women are entirely different in how they seek and obtain sex. Apples and oranges. Women have more control over sex, so generally, women who will sleep with you on the first date are showing impulsivity that can signal other bad traits, and are bad bets generally. Carefully consider and reconsider relationship prospects with these before getting involved when you get ready for a relationship.

 

Lets see if you say that when it comes to paying for dates and parental rights too.

Edited November 23, 2012 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Civility & respect

[dasein]

No idea what this topic has to do with "fogies," paying for dates or parental rights.

 

If I ever meet a woman who goes around sleeping with every guy she meets who doesn't have serious emotional problems or personality disorders maybe I'll change my tune. Til then, OP, have fun with the skeezers, don't get too involved with them though.

[SmileFace]

No idea what this topic has to do with "fogies," paying for dates or parental rights.

 

If I ever meet a woman who goes around sleeping with every guy she meets who doesn't have serious emotional problems or personality disorders maybe I'll change my tune. Til then, OP, have fun with the skeezers, don't get too involved with them though.

So does he have emotional problems or an personality disorder?

 

I mean it wouldn't matter to you - since you don't date guys but I just wonder what you think.

[dasein]

Neither, he is a recent virgin who has found women who will sleep with him. Personality disorders aren't comorbid with impulsive promiscuity in men as they are in women for a reason. Only a very few men can even -be- impulsively promiscuous in the way most any woman can.

 

Men don't have control over which woman will sleep with us the way women do. We go through life flirting and hitting on women and never know when it will take. We know that having two women dtf today may lead to a 6 month dry spell tomorrow. We also know that if we aren't always approaching and trying, we will not get -any- sex at all. The experience of women in seeking and obtaining sex is completely different, apples and oranges.

[mesmerized]

No idea what this topic has to do with "fogies," paying for dates or parental rights.

 

If I ever meet a woman who goes around sleeping with every guy she meets who doesn't have serious emotional problems or personality disorders maybe I'll change my tune. Til then, OP, have fun with the skeezers, don't get too involved with them though.

 

The same "men and women are built differently" can very well be applied to those and make for a great argument.

 

Oh please, you're almost forty years old and admit you are unable to have a relationship more than 6 months and are talking about other peoples disorders? Talk about hilarious. Honey you're obviously no gem for women or you wouldn't be here at your age hating on them. This whole double standard is there simply to control female sexuality and is tied to males insecurity and weak ego.

[SmileFace]

Neither, he is a recent virgin who has found women who will sleep with him. Personality disorders aren't comorbid with impulsive promiscuity in men as they are in women for a reason. Only a very few men can even -be- impulsively promiscuous in the way most any woman can.

 

Men don't have control over which woman will sleep with us the way women do. We go through life flirting and hitting on women and never know when it will take. We know that having two women dtf today may lead to a 6 month dry spell tomorrow. We also know that if we aren't always approaching and trying, we will not get -any- sex at all. The experience of women in seeking and obtaining sex is completely different, apples and oranges.

Ok, so please do a me a favor and grab at any peice of ass that comes your way - attractive or unattractive because with your reasoning guys must **** anything that gives them a chance. So unless every guy is doing that and living up to their orange - your point is void.

[Hawakai]

Neither, he is a recent virgin who has found women who will sleep with him. Personality disorders aren't comorbid with impulsive promiscuity in men as they are in women for a reason. Only a very few men can even -be- impulsively promiscuous in the way most any woman can.

 

Men don't have control over which woman will sleep with us the way women do. We go through life flirting and hitting on women and never know when it will take. We know that having two women dtf today may lead to a 6 month dry spell tomorrow. We also know that if we aren't always approaching and trying, we will not get -any- sex at all. The experience of women in seeking and obtaining sex is completely different, apples and oranges.

 

 

And the guy has to be careful. In order to maximze his chances of getting sex/a relationship(OMG but that means he doesn't think I'm special!!) he has to divide his attention between women.

 

Say that you are in college and you see to hit it off with 2 girls you're attracted to, and they seem to be attracted to you, but since you are not tall nor you look like Tom Cruise you have to wait because they are testing you. You have to be approved by the female council(her friends)and you have to be consistent in your treatment of the girl. You can't show up angry one day and expect the girl to understand your emotional state. She'll push you to get attention.

 

There's also the risk of the two girls knowing each other. A buddy of mine was telling me of how he was waiting for his class to start when he saw 2 girls he was gaming talking together - or so he thought.

 

He almost had a heart attack, but it all turned out fine when he realized the red-haired chick wasn't the one he was gaming. Being a man is seriously hard work. We're expected to be the creators, innovators, to protect women and to do all of the menial work/sacrifice ourselves, but women get all the sex they want from even above average guys, and men can't even have brothels because ''prostitutes are exploited.''

 

Lmao. The human male is the most exploited entity in the universe.

[dasein]

This thread isn't about me or any half-baked assumptions you care to make about me or my life, which is quite happy at the moment. Fair warning.

[dasein]

Ok, so please do a me a favor and grab at any peice of ass that comes your way - attractive or unattractive because with your reasoning guys must **** anything that gives them a chance. So unless every guy is doing that and living up to their orange - your point is void.

 

Doesn't follow at all from what I posted. Men needing to always be seeking sex does not mean seeking it indiscriminately. It simply means that if a man wants sex, he must take proactive steps to approach women he finds attractive, seduce them, yet has no way of knowing which of the women he chooses to approach will be receptive. If he isn't proactive, unless he's in the top top echelon of men, he will get no sex at all.

 

Women don't have this particular dating issue generally. Provided a woman is not morbidly obese, she will be given lots of opportunities to have sex merely for showing up. She can sit in bed at home and call men she desires, and without lots of dialing, a man will come to her house and give her sex. If she accepts all or most of the opportunities to have sex she is given, it's likely because she is impulsive in other areas as well, and not a good bet for the long term.

 

It's not anything particularly controversial, just the facts of life. The "well he did it too" double standard many women want to go on about simply doesn't exist. There can be no double standard between two groups that are differently situated, and in seeking and obtaining sex, men and women are differently situated.

[SmileFace]

Doesn't follow at all from what I posted. Men needing to always be seeking sex does not mean seeking it indiscriminately. It simply means that if a man wants sex, he must take proactive steps to approach women he finds attractive, seduce them, yet has no way of knowing which of the women he chooses to approach will be receptive. If he isn't proactive, unless he's in the top top echelon of men, he will get no sex at all.

 

Women don't have this particular dating issue generally. Provided a woman is not morbidly obese, she will be given lots of opportunities to have sex merely for showing up. She can sit in bed at home and call men she desires, and without lots of dialing, a man will come to her house and give her sex. If she accepts all or most of the opportunities to have sex she is given, it's likely because she is impulsive in other areas as well, and not a good bet for the long term.

 

It's not anything particularly controversial, just the facts of life. The "well he did it too" double standard many women want to go on about simply doesn't exist. There can be no double standard between two groups that are differently situated, and in seeking and obtaining sex, men and women are differently situated.

 

I get what you are saying and I don't care about double standards - since it will be there either way. However a women getting someone she want's is just as a guy trying to seek sex. You can't compare a women being able to get sex easily - because so can guys. Getting the person you want is hard for men and women. Yes and may be just as hard since women have the choice to be pickier. We can agree on that? Yes I can call up a guy for sex or obtain sex easily as a female - if you know me as a poster, I have never denied this - however getting someone I want to have sex with isn't easy - so it levels out.

[dasein]

I get what you are saying and I don't care about double standards - since it will be there either way. However a women getting someone she want's is just as a guy trying to seek sex. You can't compare a women being able to get sex easily - because so can guys. Getting the person you want is hard for men and women. Yes and may be just as hard since women have the choice to be pickier. We can agree on that? Yes I can call up a guy for sex or obtain sex easily as a female - if you know me as a poster, I have never denied this - however getting someone I want to have sex with isn't easy - so it levels out.

 

No, average men can not get sex with a partner they desire as easily as average women can. The "right person" retort is a red herring. OP's past situation is a case in point. It's also why there is no PUA industry for women, who would buy it? There's no need for such. Instead, advice for women focuses on the subsequent relationship, not the getting sex part. The getting sex part is a given for women, not for men.

 

The best advice for women who are impulsively promiscuous is not "well he did it too, so there's nothing wrong with what you do" but to figure out the source of the impulsivity and address that. Same exact advice for those few men who have similar sexual opportunities to the average woman.

 

For an average guy, the best advice IMO is, "well you got lucky with a woman who puts out easy, but if she puts out for you easily, there's a good chance she puts out for lots of guys and has baggage and issues because of that. Be careful." I stick by that and think it's good advice.

[ThaWholigan]

This debate is interesting but I'd like to point out that the level of promiscuity between the two girls is quite vast - the most recent being relatively tame in comparison to the former who took my virginity. As I had mentioned, the 2nd girl is usually more attracted to certain types of guys (preferably white also) so the regularity of her sexual encounters is significantly lower than the 1st girl who says that she likes black guys but they like her equally more because of her ass, but she dates/f*cks men of all races.

 

It should also be noted that I do not look down on either of these girls - otherwise I wouldn't have sex with them. I see no glaring personality flaws in them, they just thoroughly enjoy sex and they seem to be comfortable with it rather than pathologically f*cking men due to some kind of sexual neurosis. They do not seek a monogamous relationship and this is the primary reason why I am not dating them - the secondary being that there aren't enough compatible attributes outside of the bedroom with either. Nonetheless they are nice girls and pleasant company to be around. Or maybe it is just that they get on with somebody like me, I don't know.....

[mesmerized]

This debate is interesting but I'd like to point out that the level of promiscuity between the two girls is quite vast - the most recent being relatively tame in comparison to the former who took my virginity. As I had mentioned, the 2nd girl is usually more attracted to certain types of guys (preferably white also) so the regularity of her sexual encounters is significantly lower than the 1st girl who says that she likes black guys but they like her equally more because of her ass, but she dates/f*cks men of all races.

 

It should also be noted that I do not look down on either of these girls - otherwise I wouldn't have sex with them. I see no glaring personality flaws in them, they just thoroughly enjoy sex and they seem to be comfortable with it rather than pathologically f*cking men due to some kind of sexual neurosis. They do not seek a monogamous relationship and this is the primary reason why I am not dating them - the secondary being that there aren't enough compatible attributes outside of the bedroom with either. Nonetheless they are nice girls and pleasant company to be around. Or maybe it is just that they get on with somebody like me, I don't know.....

 

I do think they can see that you are a good person and thus trust you with their sexuality. Awesome post, as always. And you certainly are relationship material, more than any other guy on this forum, enough said.

[SmileFace]

This debate is interesting but I'd like to point out that the level of promiscuity between the two girls is quite vast - the most recent being relatively tame in comparison to the former who took my virginity. As I had mentioned, the 2nd girl is usually more attracted to certain types of guys (preferably white also) so the regularity of her sexual encounters is significantly lower than the 1st girl who says that she likes black guys but they like her equally more because of her ass, but she dates/f*cks men of all races.

 

It should also be noted that I do not look down on either of these girls - otherwise I wouldn't have sex with them. I see no glaring personality flaws in them, they just thoroughly enjoy sex and they seem to be comfortable with it rather than pathologically f*cking men due to some kind of sexual neurosis. They do not seek a monogamous relationship and this is the primary reason why I am not dating them - the secondary being that there aren't enough compatible attributes outside of the bedroom with either. Nonetheless they are nice girls and pleasant company to be around. Or maybe it is just that they get on with somebody like me, I don't know.....

 

And this is why you get laid...lol

[mesmerized]

And this is why you get laid...lol

 

Exactly. So smart and lovable.

 

youre an arrogant pumpous woman

 

That's right but only with people who deserve it.

[gaius]

Awesome post, as always. And you certainly are relationship material, more than any other guy on this forum, enough said.

Not true, but he does certainly have the talents to make a relationship work if that's what he wanted.

 

You always struck me as someone who was punishing himself a little bit Wholigan. You have the social skills and the looks to have whatever you want in life. But you take very little. Sex is good but real love from a woman (that includes sex) is incredible.

[fortyninethousand322]

Well if you were you wouldn't be so surprised if a woman wanted to sleep with you right away and label her. You would actually believe that maybe a certain high quality in you made you irresistable to her rather than she must be doing it to everybody. Men with that assumption are often insecure and hypocritical, none of which are attractive traits.

 

What's wrong with labels? Without labels I might mistakenly pour myself a glass or bleach thinking it's refreshing spring water.

 

Nothing wrong with labeling behavior. Just as long as one is consistent with the label.

 

Double standards can be beautiful. If you let them...

[MrCastle]

Well if you were you wouldn't be so surprised if a woman wanted to sleep with you right away and label her. You would actually believe that maybe a certain high quality in you made you irresistable to her rather than she must be doing it to everybody. Men with that assumption are often insecure and hypocritical, none of which are attractive traits.

 

First of all, do you know Wholigan's first girl referred to herself as a slut? It's in his virginity thread. She labeled herself, not me. Let's make that much clear.

 

I'm not going to respect somebody who refers to themselves as a slut as much I will someone who doesn't.

 

My experience shows me that girls who put out quickly are not relationship material. None of my ONS or FWB materialized into anything worth substance.

 

I swear, men can't win on here. I'm one of the few men you're going to find who actually like a girl more when she makes me wait it out a little bit and makes me work for it. I endorse that idea and suddenly I'm labeled insecure or judgmental. I'm slut shaming. If I support women who give it up easily, I'm a typical male pig--I got that right?

 

I don't understand why we can't just accept things the way the are. Why can't he just enjoy what he has and leave it at that? Why? I'm living the same life he is. Except he gets praised by women on here for wanting to pursue a relationship and I get blasted for wanting to keep things status quo.

 

How insecurity or my level of attractiveness come into play here is beyond me. I'm not shaming these women. Let them live their lives. I just believe that these kinds of women are not the kind of women I would want to date long term. I am perfectly entitled to my opinion, and in the future, try and keep my name out of your arguments with other posters.

[mesmerized]

First of all, do you know Wholigan's first girl referred to herself as a slut? It's in his virginity thread. She labeled herself, not me. Let's make that much clear.

 

I'm not going to respect somebody who refers to themselves as a slut as much I will someone who doesn't.

 

My experience shows me that girls who put out quickly are not relationship material. None of my ONS or FWB materialized into anything worth substance.

 

I swear, men can't win on here. I'm one of the few men you're going to find who actually like a girl more when she makes me wait it out a little bit and makes me work for it. I endorse that idea and suddenly I'm labeled insecure or judgmental. I'm slut shaming. If I support women who give it up easily, I'm a typical male pig--I got that right?

 

I don't understand why we can't just accept things the way the are. Why can't he just enjoy what he has and leave it at that? Why? I'm living the same life he is. Except he gets praised by women on here for wanting to pursue a relationship and I get blasted for wanting to keep things status quo.

 

How insecurity or my level of attractiveness come into play here is beyond me. I'm not shaming these women. Let them live their lives. I just believe that these kinds of women are not the kind of women I would want to date long term. I am perfectly entitled to my opinion, and in the future, try and keep my name out of your arguments with other posters.

 

No you didn't get that right. I only respect people who are not hypocritical and consistent in their arguments. You will never see me saying men have to pay either. I don't take want everything that benefit me and throw the rest, I want fairness. Maybe none of your fwb relationships went anywhere because of YOU and not them. You have mentioned many times on this forum that you do not understand relationships and do not want them. You fear commitment and monogomy. And now you claim it's the ladies fault??? Take responsibility for your actions. If you were such a great relationship material yourself, you'd at least be open to it or even seeking it instead of only looking for women who want casual.

 

Also, you are posting and commenting on a public forum, your name is going to come up in a thread you comment on. Im not quite sure why you would post here if this bothers you so much. You can always post less controversial things if you dont want anyone opposing you.

 

Wholigan gets praised because he has always been positive, respectful and secure. He also is not a hypocrite and accounts himself responsible for his life and actions instead of always blaming it on others.

Edited November 23, 2012 by mesmerized

[ascendotum]

And this is why you get laid...lol

Why because he does not look down on the girls who down to just have NSA sex with him and appreciates the fact that women like to have sex??? The majority of guys who hardly get nsa are going to be pretty appreciative of the woman kneeling down in front of them, but that wont inspire the girl to do it.

As for avg women having it no easier to get sex on demand than the avg man, I don't know where you live that you have observed that, but even if you brought in a squad of udolipixies to argue it with you, it ain't going to change reality for what I've witnessed.

[SmileFace]

Why because he does not look down on the girls who down to just have NSA sex with him and appreciates the fact that women like to have sex??? The majority of guys who hardly get nsa are going to be pretty appreciative of the woman kneeling down in front of them, but that wont inspire the girl to do it.

As for avg women having it no easier to get sex on demand than the avg man, I don't know where you live that you have observed that, but even if you brought in a squad of udolipixies to argue it with you, it ain't going to change reality for what I've witnessed.

No, because he isn't a hypocrite like most people.

 

 

And what you as man witnessed makes no difference to what I have witnessed as a women so my point stands. I never asked anyone to agree with it.

[MrCastle]

No you didn't get that right. I only respect people who are not hypocritical and consistent in their arguments. You will never see me saying men have to pay either. I don't take want everything that benefit me and throw the rest, I want fairness. Maybe none of your fwb relationships went anywhere because of YOU and not them. You have mentioned many times on this forum that you do not understand relationships and do not want them. You fear commitment and monogomy. And now you claim it's the ladies fault??? Take responsibility for your actions. If you were such a great relationship material yourself, you'd at least be open to it or even seeking it instead of only looking for women who want casual.

 

Also, you are posting and commenting on a public forum, your name is going to come up in a thread you comment on. Im not quite sure why you would post here if this bothers you so much. You can always post less controversial things if you dont want anyone opposing you.

 

I don't want relationships right now because I feel in my young age, it's best to have fun and focus on more important things like my career and education. I am fully aware of the level of commitment and dedication that comes with an exclusive relationship and it's not something that I'm looking for right now. I also believe most people my age who are in long term relationships end up breaking up the majority of time, so I find it to be a pointless exercise that would have a better chance of success when I'm older and ready to settle down. I'm waiting for a real spark to hit me, someone I really care about to come along and tie me down. If I don't have that spark, that serious connection, then I'm just wasting my time, and the girl I'm dating's time. I'm waiting for the real deal. I'm not looking to hop into a relationship just because society says I should. My hope is my first LTR is also my last LTR. I don't plan to settle down until I find that woman.

 

My casual relationships went nowhere because I didn't let them. You're right about that. We were just too incompatible personality wise, and I knew it would not lead to anything real down the road. A sentiment Wholigan currently shares with the two women he's dealing with now. So why not attack him for sleeping with them despite not clicking with them on a more personal level? But I digress.

 

As far as the other stuff, you were having an argument with another poster. The focus should have been on you and him, bringing my name up, especially in a particularly unflattering manner, is pretty classless in my opinion. Had I not come in here by chance, I wouldn't have seen it and wouldn't have been able to defend myself. If you have issues with me, address me directly. Don't name drop me in an argument I only saw by chance.

Edited November 23, 2012 by MrCastle

[mesmerized]

I don't want relationships right now because I feel in my young age, it's best to have fun and focus on more important things like my career and education. I am fully aware of the level of commitment and dedication that comes with an exclusive relationship and it's not something that I'm looking for right now. I also believe most people my age who are in long term relationships end up breaking up the majority of time, so I find it to be a pointless exercise that would have a better chance of success when I'm older and ready to settle down. I'm waiting for a real spark to hit me, someone I really care about to come along and tie me down. If I don't have that spark, that serious connection, then I'm just wasting my time, and the girl I'm dating's time. I'm waiting for the real deal. I'm not looking to hop into a relationship just because society says I should. My hope is my first LTR is also my last LTR. I don't plan to settle down until I find that woman.

 

My casual relationships went nowhere because I didn't let them. You're right about that. We were just too incompatible personality wise, and I knew it would not lead to anything real down the road. A sentiment Wholigan currently shares with the two women he's dealing with now. So why not attack him for sleeping with them despite not clicking with them on a more personal level? But I digress.

 

As far as the other stuff, you were having an argument with another poster. The focus should have been on you and him, bringing my name up, especially in a particularly unflattering manner, is pretty classless in my opinion. Had I not come in here by chance, I wouldn't have seen it and wouldn't have been able to defend myself. If you have issues with me, address me directly. Don't name drop me in an argument I only saw by chance.

 

How on earth can you not see the difference between you and wholigan? Having a casual relationship is not wrong, for men or women. However judging someone for doing exactly the same thing you are doing is called being hypocritical and a lot of us find it an awful trait. Its absolutely fine to say you don't want more because of certain incompatibilities but to say because they liked casual sex just like you did and that they dont deserve a relationship (While at the same time you think you do) is just...

[ThaWholigan]

You always struck me as someone who was punishing himself a little bit Wholigan. You have the social skills and the looks to have whatever you want in life. But you take very little. Sex is good but real love from a woman (that includes sex) is incredible.

 

Story of my life so far . Or at least I think all of my family and friends have said variations of the above (not referring to love & sex but general sentiment of taking little out of the lot that I could get).

 

I would imagine that sex with love is a far better prospect than what I currently have. I am happy with things as they are, and although I wish for more in life & love/sex, it's best that I am grateful for the present otherwise when I do find love, I probably would not appreciate it as much. Likewise if I hit an unexpected windfall or manage to amass a large amount of wealth, I could end up taking it for granted and wind up back where I am now, so it's best to be grateful for the now but always looking to progress.